Private maternity in London - how much does it cost???

[Elizad]

Hi
Can someone let me know costs all in for Elective CS at LINDO, PORTLAND and CHELSEA? I know it wont be exact but to get a rough idea would be so fab...each website itemises most things but there is so much I have no clue about ( bloods, scans, consultant fees)

Thanks

midwivesdeliver:

It's all very well to go after the one article I happened to quote (and if you had bothered to look carefully, you would have realised that it does have reliable sources). It's even more strange to accuse me of not having the read the article. I don't know about you, but having a PHD in Financial Mathematics I am very comfortable with statistics, although I fail to see why that is so important.

You seem to have missed the other statistics that I quoted in my last post which were from RCOG, Nice and ACOG. Here are just a few of them-

www.rcog.org.uk/womens-health/clinical-guidance/third-or-fourth-degree-tear-during-childbirth
(states majority of women do tear and that 9 in 100 experience severe tearing. Also explains the long term effects of tearing)

www.rcog.org.uk/news/national-sentinel-caesarean-section-audit-published
(states that majority of cesareans are emergency procedures carried out due to complications during labour, or due to pre-existing medical conditions)

www.nafc.org/prolapse/
( states that 50% of women who deliver vaginally experience POP, although many don't realise it and many don't seek treatment)

www.rcog.org.uk/womens-health/clinical-guidance/assisted-birth-operative-vaginal-delivery
(rate of operative births in UK)

You could also look up numerous statistics on incontinence, cerebral palsy, erb's palsy and other birth related complications from whichever source you consider "reliable".

If you really respect other views as much as you claim to respect them, then why does my mistrust in the ability of midwives bother you so much? Why did you and LaLuna get so offended and touchy in the beginning when some people expressed a preference for consultant led care? Let it go and take it in your stride.

I wouldn't pay to have one of you deliver my baby. I couldn't put it more plainly, and if you actually respect views different from your own, you will accept that and not try to change my mind by claiming to be better.

midwivesdeliver:

Seriously?
You have only seen bad, abusive practice from your female colleagues? All right then.

Anyway, this may be another thing that will put you in a tizzy, but I prefer female HCPs. All my OBs have been female, because I make sure they are. If a male midwife walked into my labour room I would ask for a change simply because I find nothing more disturbing than having strange men look at my most intimate body parts. I am sure I am not the only woman who feels this way. It doesn't have anything to do with a lack of faith in a male HCPs abilities-that isn't it at all.
Some of us just don't like it when men other than our boyfriends or husbands handle our privates. And no, we could care less if you see that sort of thing everyday or if you have developed the ability to do this dispassionately. WE don't hang it all out for strangers on a daily basis, and we have a right to request a female HCP if men in the delivery room make us uncomfortable. Add to the fact that labour involves embarrassing accidents, and I can think of nothing I would hate more than a man in the room.

nappymaestro:

Is English your native language? If it is, I don't think you will have problems deducing from my posts that I never said all pregnancies should be managed by OBs and end in CS.

Nor have I said midwives should be 'scrapped'.I just feel that everyone should have the option consultant led care if they prefer it. I don't agree with the European midwife led model, where we are forced to go to midwives whether we like it or not. I'm sure many women love midwives and I am sure midwives are well meaning, but that doesn't mean it is the right approach for everyone.

I will point out that many countries manage without midwives, but no system can function without consultants.

I'm sure other people have my POV nappymaestro , even if that is shocking to you. I just don't think many people would come right out and say it. Furthermore, preferred modes of delivery and midwifery are hardly topics people discuss over dinner or coffee breaks, so you can't exactly claim to know the opinion of every person you've met when it comes to these things.

I am not the only one to prefer consultant led care, or private care or female HCPs. There must be several other women who have similar preferences, they just maybe less vocal about them.

Midwivesdeliver:

Oh no:( You misunderstood me! I wasn't trying to imply that male midwives/OBs are perverts and rapists. It is appalling if someone has said that to you.
As I said before in my previous post, my preference for females is simply psychological. I don't doubt the sincerity or expertise of male HCPs for even one second. I just prefer females for intimate procedures, that's all. The issues are mine. Men are not uncaring bastards, nor are male HCPs out to "control" (no more than the female ones are anyway ).

Labour involves vomiting, pooping, people looking at and touching and worse still putting their hands up my you-know-what. It's embarrassing enough with a female in the room, but to me it would be mortifying to have a male witness and do all that.I didn't even want my husband to see a lot of it. These are my issues alone, it doesn't mean the male midwife is a pervert. Does that make sense?

FWIW, there were men in the OT during my CS for DD1. They were nothing but respectful and kind, and I am grateful to all of them for taking care of me the way they did.

I realise I am opinionated, and I have never been timid about expressing my views. They do often shock and offend people and I am sorry if I offended you. But it really is just a preference based on my individual priorities, it doesn't need to affect anyone else.

I think the website must be out of date: you can see the Portland's pool about 10 seconds into this clip.

Larry:

I just read that you think that overseeing a "normal birth" is a waste of a consultant's 7+ year training. I find this a bit perplexing- it's a part of their job technically to oversee and assist ANY kind of birth.

I don't know if you're aware that in countries like Canada, USA, India, China, Brazil, Italy, Singapore, South Africa, Japan and many it is obstetricians who take care of pregnant women and their deliveries. Whatever your private view of any of these countries, I doubt any of the OBs there think they are wasting their training.

OP, I think it's great if you can afford to go private. These were my reasons,

1. I could choose the HCP who would take care of me for the 40 odd weeks, and I wouldn't have to see a different person every time.

1. My OB worked with two more consultants and I met them both prior to the birth. They each knew my history and preferences. I was assured that one of them would deliver my baby if my consultant was delivering someone else at the time. So I was secure in the fact that someone I knew and trusted and someone who was aware of my preferences would deliver my child.

1. I had more of a say in everything. Since I was paying I could ask for a lot of things without being given reasons like "hospital policy".

1. I felt less judged. I said I didn't want to breastfeed, I wasn't pushed. I said I didn't want to attempt rooming in, and I was given the freedom to sleep while baby was in the nursery. I asked for a CS, I wasn't judged.

1. My husband could stay with me and mum could visit any time.

6 I had my own, clean bathroom. This to me, is priceless. I would have paid if only for this! I saw my cousin struggle with early labour on a ward. She had to go poo every half hour and the loo wasn't exactly close by. In addition to which, it wasn't always free. An en suite was a blessing post natally as well.

1. I felt I had more say in what was done to me. I went into labour before my planned CS date and before my consultant could get there the one on call suggested a trial of labour and maybe forceps if it got too late for a CS. I flat out refused and the CS was done without question. In an NHS hospital, this could have been a potential battle. I also refused suppository pain relief and asked for oral medication instead.

1. I had a paediatrician of my choice look the baby over and answer my questions to my satisfaction.

1. I asked for and got only females performing intimate procedures like catheterisation, checking my pad etc.

10. I spent my pregnancy without living in constant worry about being given a nasty or incompetent midwife/consultant on call (obviously all aren't like that, but some are and I would have been worried sick about landing up with them) When strangers deliver your child you have no guarantee of their experience and expertise. I didn't worry about being sent home while in labour because there weren't enough beds in the labour ward. I didn't worry about having procedures performed on me without my express consent. I didn't worry about dealing with a newborn in a noisy ward without anyone to assist me. Oh and I didn't worry about giving birth in a corridor or being left with poor post-natal care.

I don't think about how much all this cost. To me it was priceless.

Peace,

A CEO of a company oversees all the staff under him. I think that people would be surprised to see the CEO of Shell working behind the till in a petrol station. That is the relationship of a consultant to the midwives under him (not that I am implying midwifery is not in itself very skilled). He delegates. And, as to all those countries you are talking about, I have no idea about Italy but in the others, you are talking about a private healthcare system. I cannot see someone in a favella in Brazil getting obstetric antenatal care nor someone in a township in S.A. They would get (at best) basic care from a community midwife.

I agree with you re continuity of care. That is why we had a private midwife throughout my wife's two pregnancies. She was a fantastic midwife and, if she had any concerns at all, would refer us to an ob. OTOH, we just saw no need for excessive scanning or an obstetrician to personally draw blood or do urine tests.

Private rooms are available post natally at many NHS hospitals. Some of these (e.g at St Thomas's) seem very comfortable.

As for the cost, "priceless" is a big word. What did you have to sacrifice for your private birth? Did you have to give up private education for your child, for instance? Or holidays for a few years? I have continuously stated that a private birth can be a good option if £20k is trivial to you but, if you have to make substantial sacrifices to pay it, I would think twice about it.

Larry:

No, £20,000 was not trivial to me. I'm not Posh Spice;) But then again, my health, the delivery of my child or my piece of mind weren't trivial either.

Yes we sacrificed a few holidays, but if my husband had actually put a vacation before my antenatal care and delivery I'd be furious. We had to cut back on a lot of other things, but that was a choice I made. It depends on your priorities doesn't it? Private education was not something to consider at that point. It doesn't start untand several years later and there is enough time to save up a bit. Moreover, school fees goes from salary not savings. I had no intention of being a SAHM and we were both working, so perhaps that helped a bit.

And your CEO example doesn't convince me at all. The countries I mentioned have basically OB led care. In India for example, there is concept of midwives. Even in the rural areas, you have doctors. And no, not all these countries have private healthcare. Canada doesn't for instance, and others ave a mix of both public and private care.

You seem to be against private care simply because of the cost. But for me, these are the kind of things one saves up for. I'd be disappointed in my partner if he denied me and our child better care because he was more worried about a holiday or his savings. Savings can be rebuilt and holidays aren't as important as having a baby. Perhaps you had different priorities, in which case it's fine.

As for the private rooms, they are NOT always available. If they are occupied by emergency cases, you'll have to make do with the ward. This has happened to someone I know.

My husband kept giving me long lectures about the cost as well, but I made it clear that I wasn't going to risk the uncertainty that comes with NHS. Thankfully, I had my own savings which I used to help pay for my delivery.

Could I have forgiven myself if I had ended up giving birth in a corridor or waiting room? No.
I'm certain that had I given birth at our NHS hospital, I would have ended up with an operative vaginal birth which I am completely against. For me that money was worth it just to avoid having to consent to procedures I didn't want at all and which are known to be risky in the wrong hands.
I was secure in the knowledge that nobody was putting my safety at risk because they were exhausted or trying to save their trust some money or just doing things according to "policy". I was also familiar with the credentials of the person delivering my child. It wasn't a random stranger who hadn't even bothered to introduce himself.

I've already listed what all I got with private care. I can't put a price tag on that, but those are just my priorities. If you think it's a waste of money, that's your lookout. I think it was the best money I ever spent.

And by the by- working at the till is not part of a CEO's responsibility or training.
However, overseeing ANY kind of delivery is part of an OB's training and responsibilities. The things that he/she isn't required to do are things like fitting catheters, IV's, or cleaning bed pans etc.

On the NHS, the OBs don't oversee deliveries, or do pap smears(the nurse does that) or take care of antenatal appointments, or prescribe BC ( we go to GPs for that), which are all basically essential parts of their responsibilities in most other parts of the world.

I respect mw and the care they give. I guess this is the best way for 90% of uncomplicated births. Last time I was pg with DD1 she (DD) paid with her life for the hands-off approach of my MW. I kept telling anyone who would listen - her (community MW), sonographer, consultant (1 v rushed and useless NHS appointment) that I experience strange sensation in my vagina like the baby is kicking actually inside the vagina, that I am too bothered with dull constant period pains. All told me that "this if fine", that these are all "normal pg symptoms", "poor you, it will all be worth when the baby is born". And not one sod looked inside.

DD1 was born at 24 weeks, abroad (I was proclaimed fit to travel and I dismissed myself as over-reacting mum-to-be as I needed to finish my work), alone and in the foreign private hospital (great facilities, but I had to pay and claim from the insurance over 50K GBP). My little girl was born with great apgar score but due to prematurity was placed strainght away in a SCBU for 23 days, then she died. This gaping hole in my heart will be there forever.

It turned out I had an incompetent cervix, which allowed GBS to come in and disintegrate placenta over some time. "This is just one of those unfortunate events in life" - this is from the NHS consultant I have seen once in 24 weeks and who was told in length about my concerns.

This time I am not taking any risks. I am under private consultant who is seeing me 3-weekly and whos direct line I have for all concerns.

Sorry, one important point I wanted to make but failed is that producing a child does not start and end with the birth itself. There are numerous things that can potentially go wrong for a v small minority of people and arguing "shit happens" and "next time should be different" is just not valid at all.

In my case we are amazing lucky having conceived naturally at 38 and 39 after years of failed IVFs, financial sacrifices and emotional rollercoasters. I realize now that I was taken through the NHS sausage factory without any regards for my personal circumstances and paying attention to my concerns. I wish I spotted it earlier - it all would be so different now.

bemybebe - I am speechless and profoundly saddened. What a horrible thing to have happened- I am so sorry. I hope that you made a complaint.

I wish you all the best with this pregnancy. Hope it is event free and as smooth as possible.

bemybebe:

I'm so sorry to hear this. I can't imagine the grief you must have experienced. I wish you the best of luck with this pregnancy!

Having heard several stories like yours, I was adamant that I would not risk my child's and my own safety, which is why I preferred to go private. I cannot understand how anyone would think private school, holidays eyc. are more important than a safe entry into the world.

Midwives deliver:

I knew that Canada and USA do have midwives, although not in every state. If someone prefers a midwife, she can find one almost anywhere in the world, except certain parts of Asia.
In Canada, people still mostly go to OBs. Some of them opt for midwife led care, but that isn't the norm yet. You can confirm all this easily over the Internet.

There are of course midwives and L &D RNs , but they will not look after ante natal care (unless you request it), nor will they single handedly handle the delivery(unless you request it, in which case an OB is usually required to be present somewhere in the premises).

The point is that their healthcare system is still traditionally OB-led and the women opting for midwives are smaller in number (so far). I never claimed they didn't have midwives, I was simply saying they have essentially OB-led maternity care, which is true.

The good thing is, people there have a choice. No one system is forced upon them. Although the rubbish Obamacare may change all that...

I can't say anything good about whoever invented the forceps (although I'm fairly certain it was a French obstetrician/physician who invented them), because I'm passionately against their use.

Peace,

If my younger son were able to express his point eloquently, I suspect he would beg to differ. When his baseline had sunk to around 90/100 and decels were down to 30/40, due to having a cord round his neck, he was profoundly grateful for the anderson forceps that pulled him out and the paediatricians who supplied him with oxygen to get his breathing going. My wife and I were also not unhappy about it either. Although she did not enjoy being cut and the healing process, she definitely preferred it to a dead or brain damaged baby. And, at that stage, it was the consultant obstetrician wielding them, not a midwife.

Are you deliberately being controversial with your views?

Larry:

My niece who died due to spinal cord injuries inflicted by Neville Barnes forceps and my doubly incontinent sister would also beg to differ.
As someone with a permanent mark on his face due to forceps injuries, my husband too would beg to differ.

I'm not sure if you're aware but it is always the consultant or registrar who uses forceps, not the midwife. I fail to see why you felt the need to bring that up. Consider yourself lucky that the person who used the forceps knew what he/she was doing. When strangers deliver your child, you don't know much about their experience and expertise, so it's a shot in the dark isn't it?

By the way, my daughter had a cord around her neck as well, and her heart rate was abysmally low when I went into labour prior to the date of my scheduled section. There was a consultant who said we could have a trial of forceps in theatre with me prepped for a section, but I refused and an EMCS was done within minutes. I now have a healthy, happy 4 year old who was born without any birth injuries at all. (I would not have been given this choice on the NHS btw, I would have had to consent to a trial of forceps).

I'm sure your wife preferred being cut to a dead baby, anyone would. I was cut too, except it was on my lower abdomen and I preferred it to a dead baby as well. What's the point here?

I'm not being controversial with my views. Im not the one who puts holidays before ante natal care and safety.

In many parts of the world preferring private OB led care, and refusing forceps isn't exactly considered "controversial". In fact it's the norm.

Secondly, I'm curious what you're achieving here on the childbirth section? It's more suited for HCPs and women isn't it? Since you will personally never have to consent to either forceps or a CS or live with the repercussions of poor maternity care I don't much care about your opinion on which is better.

I meant to add, that I refused forceps because the chances of baby being brain damaged are higher with the use of forceps, than with a simple lift out procedure. So your justification of forceps having saved your baby from brain damage is a bit ironic. Read the numerous threads here on forceps' risks and benefits- they are the leading cause of birth injuries.

It cost us 11k all in. (midwive lead care, mobile epidural, superb aftercare, all scans, check ups, tests at the portland, 2 years ago) I can honestly say it was the best money I've ever spent. I thoroughly enjoyed my whole pregnancy and birth as a result and the peace of mind was wonderful, I had the same 2 midwives all through my pregnancy and labour, no waiting for epidural either. I was also given pelvic floor physio the following day. There was no one else giving birth at the same time as me, I had the entire unit to myself!, my DH could stay the night, which was fantastic. I got exactly the birth I wanted (luck may have had something to do with this as well!) I do feel slightly resentful that I had to pay so much to get an experience that should be everyone's right on the nhs but that's the way things are theses days, I guess.