NON personal discussion about breastfeeding rates <no mud slinging allowed>

[JingleyJen]

Instead of personal stories and family circumstances I am really interested in the potential reasons why in this country are breastfeeding rates so much lower than in other countries?

Surely in other countries boobs are sexual things as well so it can't just be that.

Is it that ever downward spiral that as fewer women breastfeed that it is hidden and therefore fewer women feel comfortable with the whole thing?

I don't think it is the availability of formula

Have there been studies done on this? (sure there have but don't know where to find them)

Is the success rate of mothers who have chosen to breastfeed truly dependent on the support network around them - or are there really an increasing number of women whose milk doesn't come in - and why could that be the case?

This is NOT a thread for the wrongs and rights of breastfeeding vs formula it is more a question of how things have got to this stage.

Anyone?

[lizzytee]

Pruners, I am interested...will look both of them up for my ever expanding library!

[InTheDollshouse]

Completely agree, BabiesEverywhere. Breastfeeding has huge economic value that isn't widely recognised.

[BabiesEverywhere]

'ust just

[BabiesEverywhere]

Following on from the concept that only poor women breastfeed which I know my grandma said to me once. I feel the peceived value of breastmilk is still very low.

After all if an baby item was one of a kind, made just for your baby and hand crafted, it sounds like a valuable item.

But if I then went on to tell you it was made at home from odd bits of wool by the mum. In general it would be seen as poor less desirable item and looked down on by other mums. Yet a simlar item made by a designer at a high monetary worth would be highly valued and coverted by other mums.

I feel breastmilk currently has a poor, homemade rep, rather than the designer rep it deserves to have. Breastfeeding is not valued and a common comment heard after 6 months of nursing is 'You know you don't have to do that anymore, baby can have formula now'

I feel the worth of milk is also low as even the mothers who realise the value of breastmilk are limited by good manners when discussing feedig with other mothers. As how we feed our babies is such an emotional and guilt filled subject on all sided, it seems near impossible to talk about the positives and negatives of each respective feeding method, without some mothers feeling insulted and upset by the information/opinion of another.

Whilst many mothers still feel that formula is 'ust as good as breastmilk and don't understand that nursing is so much more than milk transfer, the breastfeeding rates are doomed to be low as there is so little worth in their eyes to breastfeeding.

I wish we did what Norway does which is publish the breastmilk produced in UK as a national resource and bump up the worth of breastmilk.

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[tiktok]

Now that rings a bell, esp the self-published bit, but I can't claim to have read it. I have a feeling that it might be about 10 years old or so?

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[tiktok]

I am interested, Pruners

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[tiktok]

On re-reading, gegs: you are not trapped between two pages, but trapped inside the house with 2 kids LOL! I thought you meant your computer screen was trapped!

[tiktok]

gegs, not being critical of you personally, but threads are a conversation, and if everyone only ever read the OP and then commented, then we'd go round in circles....I really meant you to look at the rest of the posts, because we have really done a lot (not all) of what you have talked about to death.

Tip: I set threads to give one continuous page, that way you don't get trapped between pages

Hafta admit - people only ever reading the OP is a pet hate of mine, and I am probably over-sensitive on that, sorry

[gegs73]

Thanks margoandjerry, I did say I only read the original post then skim read the rest there are 8 pages and I'm trapped inside with two of them today Just suggestions..

[margoandjerry]

I thought gegs post was perfectly sensible. She didn't claim to have all the answers - just making suggestions.

[tiktok]

gegs, read all the posts. A lot of what you suggest has been discussed already and some of it refuted, sorry!

[gegs73]

I've only read the original post but maybe its to do with womens lives being busier outside of the home now in the UK than before formula was invented. Formula does allow people with babies to do other things as Fathers can help out. More women work than pre 1960s and yes they could express breastmilk for feeds whilst the baby is being cared for elsewhere but it is alot easier to give formula.

Women do go out more and its acceptable for them to have social lives. Formula allows them to do this early on if they so wish.

Thirdly, according to MIL (in her 70s) and her Mother (in her 90s) babies were weaned earlier if they were hungry, so it was easier to breastfeed (less feeds). Anecdotal I know, but MIL was told to feed one of her sons at 6 weeks.

As for Northern European countries having higher breastfeeding rates, maybe the government is more supportive to new mothers. Maybe maternity leave is longer, maybe support is better for breastfeeding, maybe people are more likely to live near their own Mothers or kin which is often not the case in the UK.

BF is best for baby no doubt, but I think there are more factors than formula just being readily available which make our BF rates so low.

[margoandjerry]

Only read the OP and first few posts but I agree that it's an expectation that is dying out.

I think we can attempt to revive it by talking about it as if we assume new mums will plan to bf. Different from being judgemental if they don't (I mix fed for various problematic reasons so don't want anyone to feel bad at all about this) but I just think we should all work on the assumption that women will bf and provide help when they can't.

[MaeWest]

Would agree that partner support was one of the key things for me. Knowing that DH would just keep encouraging me rather than 'helping' by reaching for a bottle kept me going in the early weeks. DH wasn't bf himself as MIL was on heavy duty medication (altho she did go on to feed his younger bro for over a year). And DH didn't feel the need to give DS ebm to feel involved. One of the most fab things he did for me (and DS) was to wear DS in a sling in the evening and keep him quiet so I could get some sleep. It was just for the first 6 weeks or so, but was exactly what I needed and was a time for them to bond too.

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[Lyra75]

Hi just found this thread, and wanted to agree with the importance of partners being involved. My DH came along to the antenatal NCT breastfeeding session and found it really helpful. He also read (most of) the info on breastfeeding I gave him before DS was born. This meant that in those early days when I found it very tough he was a fantastic support. Not once did he suggest ff as an answer to a problem. When I was having a few problems in the first few weeks and wondering if I should give up, he reminded me about looking for help and cleared space and time for me to have some good discussions with BFC on the phone.

I also think FioFio's point about early visitors is important. This had been covered by our antenatal breastfeeding session and so DH was completely on board with fending people off. For those visitors who did come I would feed in bed and in between feeds DS would go downstairs with DH, whilst I slept some more. I didn't see any visitors I didn't want to for at least a month - fab!

DH and me were bottle fed, but his family and mine are very supportive and think breast feeding is great.

Now DH is quite political about breast feeding. He's always lurking over my shoulder on mumsnet and when reading threads about someone who has been given bad advice or unsupported he's often more outraged than me!