What to do with the other ashes...

[jmg1]

My aunty sent a card for my dd's birthday today and enclosed a letter for me to explain that she has collected my late Mother's and my late sister's ashes, they both died last year. My Mother wanted the ashes to be scattered on the Malvern Hills. I know my Mother and sister would have appreciated it if I took my children along.

The problem is that I do not know what to say to my children they are 2, 4 and 5 years old, do I explain what we are doing or simply take them and say we are going for a walk and explain what we did when they are older?

[WedgiesMum]

When we scattered my Dad's ashes I took along my two. DD was too young to know what was going on (6 months), but DS was 2.5 and could see what was happening. We had already talked about Grandad dying and what it meant, so then we just expanded on this a bit and said that this was one of Grandads favourite places and he wanted to be there for ever.

How have they dealt with the deaths? They will obviously see what you are doing and it only seems fair to explain what you are doing in a way they can understand otherwise they may get the wrong end of the stick. We go back and visit the spot where my Dad was scattered occasionally and DS (now 5) loves to talk to his Grandad and seems to feel close to him there.

HTH

[coppertop]

I know it's not something you would probably want to think about too often personally but could you perhaps make a kind of Memory Book of the day? You could add a photo of the place you scattered the ashes and maybe write a description of what happened. Your children would then be able to look through the book when they are older and better able to understand, without it being quite so painful for you to go through it all over again with them.

[jmg1]

wedgiesmum, my lovely partner - their Mother died 7 weeks before my sister and during the shock and turmoil caused by that sudden death I did not speak at length to my children about the death of my Mother and sister. I said they had died, but what became clear was that the kids were concerned that if someone got ill they would die, (saying things like is everyone's mummy going to die etc, therefore I focused on explaining that just because someone gets ill it doen't necessarily mean they will die and I am going to be here for a long time and I am going to look after you all.

[jampot]

Hi JMG, I don't think we've "spoken" before. My mum was buried not cremated and we didn't take my dd (4.5 at the time) and ds (1 at the time) because I didn't feel ellie would have been able to deal with it. I've seen some of your postings and would just like to say that you sound like a great dad and I bet your kids are so proud of you.

[jmg1]

Not a bad idea ct.

I guess I can't get my head round explaining to my children that my Mother, sister and their Mother have been cremated and the ashes are what remain. I may be wrong but perhaps this is something to explain when thay are much older. Obviously they look at things in a different way. While I was in the playground just now with my son he suddenly said 'my Mummy is dead', no emotion, no other comments and then he just carried on talking about the flowers and trees!

[bundle]

jmg1 have you seen the Mog book, where the cat dies? i was reading it to my girls last night & it's a really lovely gentle tale about someone not being there any more. a memory book would be lovely for the older ones to make sense of it and something to keep for the little one.

[tealady]

What a hard decision for you to have to make. My gut reaction is that you are right and they are a little young to deal with the process of cremation etc - and may find the idea of the ashes upsetting.

How do you feel about having them with you? Would it help you or would it be more of a pressure? I am concerned that you are not giving yourself chance to deal with your own grief. Your Mother and sister would understand any decision you make that is in the best interest of your family so I don't think you should feel under pressure to take the kids unless you are happy to do so.It is very important that you look after your own emotional needs so that you are strong enough to look after the children's needs.

If you do want to take them is there someone else who could come with you and help look after the kids?.

Poor you - what a hard time you are having. Take care.

[Piffleoffagus]

WE took my dads ashes and scattered them in the Lake District, we took photos of the spot adn of us all on the day, and we occasionally revisit. my youngest brother was a little young to comprehend, but he now visits on the day Dad died every year, while it may mean little to them just now, in years to come it will be somthing for them to know and keep close.
Take care xx

[bundle]

Goodbye Mog

[Janh]

jmg, could you get round the cremation thing (until they're older - I know exactly what you mean about trying to explain that to small children) by saying something like, "this is special dust we kept from grandma's/auntie's houses and they wanted us to bring it here, because we can't go to their houses any more but we can come back here to remember them"?

Agree with bundle about the Mog book - I read it in the bookshop the other day - I have no reason to buy it but think I will anyway, because it's one of the loveliest "dying" books I've ever read and made me smile more than cry.

[bundle]

janh, you're right, it's so gentle and I smiled much more than I felt a bit sniffy.

[coppertop]

I have a friend whose dp died when their dd was 5yrs old. He killed himself via a drugs overdose. Their dd was very matter-of-fact about her father dying. When she saw her father's memorial bench she would say, "That's my dad's bench. He's dead" and then carry on playing happily. Even with the books written especially for children she didn't really understand what death meant. My friend was so concerned about her dd's apparent lack of feeling when mentioning death that she took her to see a bereavement counsellor. To be honest, it really didn't make much difference. She's now 8yrs old and sometimes mentions her dad - usually to say something like "Dad liked that, didn't he?" or "Dad had one of those."

Tragically 2 of the dd's uncles also died not long afterwards. Again she seemed to take it all in her stride. She hasn't been told anything about the circumstances of her father's death and I think that even now she would struggle to understand something like cremation. Perhaps this is the kind of thing to bring up when your children ask you about it rather than you trying to find a way to explain cremation and ashes in a child-friendly way.

[jmg1]

In the last couple of days I have realised I have not even dealt with the death of my Mother and sister, I have been focusing on looking after the kids and the death of my DP/their Mother. This makes me feel guilty but I think it is some sort of sub conscious survival instinct. I am finding the thought of dealing with their ashes quite disturbing, like it is making me realise they are gone forever but I haven't given them enough thought, don't even know if this makes sense.

[lars]

jmg, firstly I would like to say I'm so sorry to hear of your lost. I too have to decide if I will take my two children along regarding the ashes of my father.
I don't know what to say to you as I feel very sad about this. My children did not go to my father's funeral and I feel this is way of them saying goodbye, but i'm still unsure.
LarsXX

[Janh]

jmg, I don't think anybody could deal full on with what happened to you and still function.

Keeping things ticking over for the kids' sake is the most important thing. It sounds as if your subconscious is doing a good job of keeping you focussed and sane - just letting little bits through as and when. Don't feel guilty, for heaven's sake, I'm sure they would all understand perfectly what you're doing and why.

[DelGirl]

JMG1 - think you are doing a fantastic job and seem, from other threads, to be able to retain a sense of humour, definitely not an easy task. I lost my husband 2 years ago, then less than 11 months later, lost his baby (ivf) and another one just 3 weeks ago. I think your subconscious can only cope with one thing at a time. If you thought about everything you have gone through all at once, my goodness I can only just begin to imagine, you would no doubt sink. From my experience, I have to try and block out what has happened and if necessary only focus on one thing at a time because the enormity of it all is overwhelming. Please don't be hard on yourself. I know only too well the feelings of guilt one has but you really shouldn't feel any guilt whatsoever. I'm sure they would understand. With regard to your children, I'm not sure I can offer any advice, sorry, but I think at the ages they are I would be inclined not to take them to be honest but thats only my opinion. Take care.

[Fio2]

jmg just wanted to say hoe sorry I am for you loses. It must have been an awful year for you not just losing one but three people whom you loved. I wish you all the strength for the future.

In respect of the children, I would explain to them what is happening and what you are going to do. I took my own daughter to my sisters funeral, she was 2. She didnt understand but my sister thought the world of her and would have wanted her to be there. Other people thought it was innappropriate but it wasnt their funeral, it was my sisters. I think they should be a part of the scattering of the ashes and I also think it teaches children about death. It shouldnt be taboo it should be explained to the best of our knowledge to them. You may also find that having your children with you gives you strength to deal with the situation, but you must mourn yourself.

[littlemissbossy]

hi jmg1.I'm very sorry to hear that you have also lost your mother and sister. I personally, wouldn't take the children for the scattering of their ashes. Children are very accepting of situations, almost in a matter of fact way, aren't they? My oldest dss used to tell people in the supermarket that his mummy was dead, complete with big smile on his face, while they looked on in horror!! Your children are a little young to understand what ashes are and also, as you are probably going to find the experience naturally difficult yourself, they may be upset to see you upset DYKWIM? Could you not revisit the place with the children after the event, on a nice day, take a picnic, etc. An idea someone gave me for my dss's was to take a balloon with a message from the children tied on and let it go, a sort of hello to the people you have lost. It could turn out to be theraputic for all of you. HTH Lmb

[Janstar]

jmg, I have tears in my eyes here, how much is one person supposed to take? I really am so sorry all this has happened in such a short time, well done on coping. I love janh's idea about the special dust. That way you can include your kids (which they might value when they're older), but without upsetting them or starting off a round of interminable questions that you just won't feel like answering at that moment.

[jmg1]

I took the children to my DP/their Mother's funeral, then to my sister's funeral. By the time my Mother died I was so run down, had a bad cold since D/P had died, couldn't sleep, now had tonsillitis and a really painful ear infection which has left me with tinnitus in one ear 24/7. I think if it wasn't my Mother's funeral I would hardly have made it out of bed that day. I drove to the Midlands for the funeral but I just couldn't take the children, 3 funerals in 3 months too much for me, too much for them and not fair for them.
I might take the children and not go into much detail about what we are doing. So far I have answered their questions in a basic straight forward manor. If I get upset and they ask I will tell them, I have done this all along it is my way. My son and I did plenty of crying together after the death of DP, it seemed to hit him more than the girls, they were only age 1 and 2 at the time.
The special dust story is a good idea. It is a beautiful spot and they love going for walks with me and the dogs. I think we should do it soon!
Thanks to everyone for your posts, it is upsetting but I think it helps one come to a decision which is probably better then leaving it any longer.

[coppertop]

jmg

I hope it all goes as well for you as it possibly can.