Cross!!! DS (3) was badly bitten by another boy last week...

[calebsmummy]

....and now he has gone from loving nursery to being tearful about it.

The boy bit him through his fleece on the side and broke the skin and left nasty bruising which has only gone down in the last day (this was 6 days ago) The mark still looks nasty...the boy must have some sharp teeth on him!

Normal procedures have been followed and I don't have a problem with how the nursery have handled it, but the mother of the child knows who he bit and hasn't bothered to approach me to apologise at all. I would be mortified if my child had hurt another that seriously and would make a point of apologising. Would anyone else?

So now I have a little boy who was so upset this morning because I lift share with my neighbour and he just wanted me to collect him. he hasn't been worried about it before , in fact he has always loved going to/from school with my neighbour and his friend.

Saying that, I must go and collect him now, make sure I am first in the queue (and give evil galres to the mother of 'Gnasher' ....not that I will..)

[southeastastralplain]

i can sympathise with you jakeandbensmummy, my son's biting habits was the thing that brought me to mn in the first place. he is now 5 and getting better. with my son it was the frustration of not being able to vocalise his feelings and so he just bit or hit out as a first reaction. i did use star charts for quite a while and changed some of his diet which is working. (although now he still has his moments!). my ds(13) is the most placid even tempered boy who wouldn't hit even as a defence, they are so different yet brought up exactly the same.

[jakeandbensmummy]

This is a subject very close to my heart. My ds2 has been biting since 9months old (he's now 21 months). He has bitten out of anger, frustration, boredom, you name it.
I am a bit upset about the 'nice' and 'not nice' labels that have been bandied around on this thread. He is otherwise a very good child, from a caring, supportive and 'professional' household.
Everytime he does it, I am utterly devastated. I immediately remove him from the situation, give him time out, make a fuss of the bitten child and apologise profusely to the offended child's mother. He is then brought back, shown the child's wound (and some of them have been bad), told it is not nice, it hurts etc. and told to apologise. He then has no tv, treats or otherwise for the rest of the day.
I have done this consistently for 12 months now and it doesn't seem to be getting any better.
Please don't be too swift to judge the children or their mothers - none of us are perfect, only trying our best to be good mummies and daddies to our offspring. I hope I am a good person, I hope I do the right things when this happens. Any suggestions welcomed!
A very, very wry smile to those of you who seem to have adopted a slightly superior attitude (my child has never...etc, etc) You do not know what is around the corner and today's angel may well be tomorrow's devil - pride comes before a fall remember!!

[calebsmummy]

Fair point, Amaretto, I can see that would work well, but she hasn't done that either.

[Amaretto]

calebsmummy, I don't think that giving some apologies FOR your child is teaching them anything except that some else is taking responsability for it. If I was to do anything, I would have my ds apologizing again in front of me and the mum.
Re leading by example, if I actually knew the mum, I would enquire how well is the child and show compasion for him. I would do it in front of my ds to show him the consequence of what he did and how to handle the repercusion. However, I am not responsible for what he did, he is. (That implies of course that I am teaching him not to bite etc.. in other circunstances than hte creche environment)

[calebsmummy]

It's not the biting which is a huge issue, it's the manners like evilannie says. I haven't come across any biters in the 12 years I have been a mother and I know a lot of children, but obviously I am aware it does happen. And thats just it, it does happen, it doesn't mean you are an awful parent but apologising for your childs behaviour when it is as bad as the boy who bit DS surely should be natural.

As beckybrastraps says, she apologised ( I think the book of shame is going a tad far, poor you!) but she apologised because her child had hurt another (albeit his best friend) Just normal basic manners! BTW BBS, your son sounds lovely and his relationship with his bf sounds like DS and his 'buddy' next door.

Do you think there are muzzles for persistent biters?

[beckybraAAARGHstraps]

Ds has a little scar from a vigorous sword-fighting incident. He calls it his duelling scar...

[evilanniedividedin2byalargeaxe]

I don't think the biting is to do with upbringing, as so many kids do it anyway, but I think how you deal with it is, I would always want to apologise as I wouldn't be able to face the other mum, I'd feel awful.

Sword fighting, how civilised, they can challenge each other to duels in gentlemanly fashion!

[beckybraAAARGHstraps]

DOubt it was revenge. They were 'best friends' which in reality meant they always wanted to play with the same toy at the same time. Cue frustration and violence

They grew out of the biting. They sword fight now!

I agree that it is common in younf children. Not an ongoing problem necessarily, but the odd bite. And I think assumptions about upbringing are way off. But then, as I've admitted to the book of shame, I would say that wouldn't I?

[ditzymum]

My 6 year old ds went through a phase of biting when he was about 2 and I remember he bit my friends dd quite hard when she came round to play. I was mortified and couldn't apologise enough. My friend phoned me the next day and said she'd taken her dd to the docs to have a tetanus jab and was quite rude when I pointed out that he was just a little boy, not a rabid dog!! Talk about overreacting - that was the end of that friendship!!

[evilanniedividedin2byalargeaxe]

Tiggiwinkle, I can't recall any of mine being bitten. They've had other stuff happen but not biting.

[Tiggiwinkle]

I would say you are very unusual never to have come across yong children biting before now calebsmum. It is extremely common in nursery children-whatever their "upbringing".

[evilanniedividedin2byalargeaxe]

beckybraAAARGHstraps, if ds bit the boy that bit him the week previously, was it a kind of revenge??!! We need a little emoticon with fangs to use in these posts!

[beckybraAAARGHstraps]

Blimey. My ds bit another boy at nursery once. I had to sign the "book of shame", and was not told who he had bitten, although of course he told me. I did apologise. The other mother said it as fine, and in fact the child who had bitten my ds the week before was her ds.

And my son is 'nice' BTW.

And he didn't learn it by example. I have never bitten anyone else while he's been watching.

[evilanniedividedin2byalargeaxe]

I meant the apologising is basic manners.

[southeastastralplain]

it's not as simple as their parents don't teach them basic manners, there are lots of reasons children hit/bite

[evilanniedividedin2byalargeaxe]

Don't you hate having to make up excuses for other people's kids? DD1 has been bullied twice by 2 separate kids, and when she was asking me in such a heartrending way "why are they doing it?" I had to make up some old rubbish rather than say what I wanted "because she is MEAN and her parents have let her get away with it"!!

I hope ds carries on enjoying nursery.

[calebsmummy]

Evilannie, I know what you mean. It's a sad fact that some people don't teach their child basic manners. It comes naturally here and I expect it. I would be loath to have a child back if they weren't polite. DS1 friends thankfully are all very lovely polite young men and at 12 nowadays you don't always find that.

[calebsmummy]

I have a 12 yr old DS and a 21 month old DS too. Have never had a problem like this with DS1, perhaps he only mixed with nice children. If he was ever hurt on playdates the other child would apologise as would any child now playing with the younger ones.

I have many friends with small children (and larger ones) and none have ever behaved like this. Yes we get the occasional hit/slap/push, but nothing serious. And of course the hitter is made to apologise. They have to learn that it is acceptable to go around clouting whoever they please. And biting, well I have to say it's not something I have encountered until now. My DS's have never bitten and none of our friends children ever have either. But if they had, I would apologise.

Children learn by example. This mother should set it. But hey, she won't and like someone has said I will let it go. I don't harp on about it in front of Ds as I am all too aware that he would play on it. I did say that perhaps it was because this boy was a bit younger and didn't understand that you shouldn't bite (on the day it happened) but he turned around and said 'But D (younger bro) doesn't bite me' Too true!

[evilanniedividedin2byalargeaxe]

calebsmummy, is he your first one? I hate to tell you this, but I have realised as my girls have got older that what I consider a normal standard of behaviour, (eg apologising if you're naughty, please and thank you etc) are not the norm, and have had my eyes opened when recently getting into the playdate arena with dds!

Like Greensleeves and others, I would have apologised (so would dd) and been mortified, other parents do not seem to take responsibilty for this, or indeed think it's important.

[mrsflowerpot]

Your poor ds - bites are horrid. DS was bitten on his first day at school, and the bruising was , even though I don't think it was a particularly viscious bite.

I think the other mum should have acknowledged what happened, shown some concern and checked how your ds was the next day, if nothing else. But she didn't, and it's a week on so she's not going to. I think you need to let go of it, or it will make you tense around the nursery and in turn make your ds tense and won't help him get through the not wanting to go. If you are really happy with the way they dealt with it then you need to focus on that. Hope he forgets all about it soon.

[calebsmummy]

Exactly Greensleeves!

[calebsmummy]

Se does know I am approachable, it's a very small nursery. It wasn't a little nip (I expected to find just teeth marks) it was a full on clamp down and not let go on my poor little man.

I think she should have come over with her child and apologised, not down on her knees begging for forgiveness, just a simple 'I'm sorry this happened'It kind of teaches the children that this is the right thing to do, doesn't it?

There was no fight, this child launched himself on top of DS at story time.

I am happy that the nursery have followed procedures and are keeping an eye on said child.

If it were my child who had bitten and caused such an injury, Ammeretto, then I would apologise. The child has been made to apologise by the nursery staff, but at the end of the day it still would have been my child who had hurt another so yes, I would say sorry.

[Greensleeves]

I would apologise, no question. Although I have had my children bitten/thumped/scratched and received no apology. I appreciate that it's every parent's worst nightmare to have their child be the one doing the biting etc, I don't make judgements about their parenting or their child's personality - all children go though less attractive phases. But it offends me when the child's mother fails to apologise. It's just about good manners and taking responsibility for your child.

[anniebear]

I would see no reason why she couldn't apologise

These things are always going to happen, but that bite sounds a little extreme

I would be mortified if it were me and would have apologised

[Amaretto]

calebsmummy, the problem is that SHE doesn't know whether you are approachable or not...
In her place, I would actually expect the nursery to deal it :

• ensuring that they intervene when there is fight between children BEFORE it gets out of hands like tis
• by having proper discipline measures (And you seem to be happy with it)
• by spending the time necessary whith your son so that he feels confident to go back to nursery again.

I do understand when you say that you will be mortified if your son was bitting another child but remember it's your son not you who is would have bitten someone. So who do you think should apologize your son or you?