School keeps taking away my daughter's shoe

[Dryrobeandnoknickers]

This week my Year 7 dd's school is running some baseline tests for them and on Friday we received a message from the school to let us know about these tests and ask that they bring in some headphones.

Neither dd or I own any headphones that would work with the laptop and I completely forgot to borrow some over the weekend.

On Monday during the first test she explained to the invigilator that she didn't have any, but luckily they had spares. She was told that she could borrow them in exchange for one of her shoes so "that she didn't steal them". This happened for several of the tests so she had to sit in the hall for several hours without a shoe and feels like she was being treated like a thief, and that it was humiliating.

She has now borrowed a pair of headphones for the rest of the week from a family member but chatting with some other parents this seems like a commonly used approach at the school.

I asked the school for their side of it and have just received a response saying "in the past we have loaned headphones to students and they have forgotten to return them and this has cost the school a substantial amount of money to replace them. We feel we have taken a light-hearted approach to loaning headphones to students who have forgotten to bring their own into school."

I'm pretty annoyed about how this was handled - my daughter felt it was degrading and that it not pitched in a light-hearted way but she was treated as though she might be a thief.

If I asked a colleague at the school I work at if I could borrow a pair of headphones and they asked me to give them my shoe in exchange I'd feel pretty frustrated about being treated like that too.

AIBU and this just how things work at secondary school and I'm being too precious and naïve about how to manage these things?



I know that its not the biggest of issues in the greater scheme of things but it has really grated on me and I really want to raise it with the school. Surely they'll get more out of the kids by treating them in a respectful way (which their behaviour policy states they should) and if/when there are any issues and they don't treat the school property with respect then they should be given a consequence and the parents should pay to replace them. Why not simply count out the 10 sets of headphones at the start of the test then count them back in at the end?

AIBU to challenge them on how they do this? I'm guessing an email from me isn't likely to change things but really feel I should say my piece.

[Mostlylurkingiam]

It's light-hearted but also you are making a very big deal about headphones, you can pick them up at garages/pound shops super cheap, not like it is highly specialised equipment 😂

[ZealAndArdour]

I think it’s being taken rather seriously.

*by you and your daughter.

[ZealAndArdour]

I think it’s being taken rather seriously.

Our organisation exchanges the staff members car keys for whatever piece of equipment they need to borrow during their shift, be it an access card, a telephone headset, a stethoscope, a neonatal SPO2 monitor.

Miraculously, it solved the problem of equipment needing to be constantly replaced because it was going walkabouts, either deliberately or accidental being packed away with the clinicians own belongings.

[Macaronichee]

Maybe wearing one shoe yourself will remind you to borrow or buy some headphones. Great approach from the school. School diaries and phones would soon be forgotten but not shoes. Maybe your daughter was over-emphasising her sense of 'humiliation' to make her mother feel bad for forgetting the headphones?

[EarringsandLipstick]

In response to those who have said I’m a shit mum, I’m not.

You absolutely are not a shit mum, your posts were very balanced & I'm sorry that you had to read nasty comments like that.

Hope your contact with the school goes ok 💐

[HelpNeedCoolUsername8]

@Camblewick very true 🙂

[middleager]

@lazylinguist

Nope, don't like this policy, seems regressive.

I'm curious as to what's regressive about it. It's quite a recent thing, I think. I can't imagine really old-school type teachers using it - they would more likely insist you kept your shoes on, neatly laced up and polished to a high shine!

Regressive to single children out like this.

I was humiliated in front of a class in the 1980s. Also totally unnecessary.

[Camblewick]

Truce?

@HelpNeedCoolUsername8 Of course, it's so hard to read tone sometimes isn't it. 😊💐

[lazylinguist]

Nope, don't like this policy, seems regressive.

I'm curious as to what's regressive about it. It's quite a recent thing, I think. I can't imagine really old-school type teachers using it - they would more likely insist you kept your shoes on, neatly laced up and polished to a high shine!

[HelpNeedCoolUsername8]

[quote Camblewick]@HelpNeedCoolUsername8 Wow, why so tetchy? I wasn't rude to you at all in my post, people tend to contribute to lots of other posts on a forum, it's just conversation.

Such a shame so many people can't just have a reasonable discussion on here now.[/quote]
Oops sorry, I think we’ve had a little misunderstanding. I thought you were trying to imply that I was obviously not a fun teacher like you are, which seemed a little uncalled for when I was commenting on school policy not individual teaching style. To be fair, I may well have a softer approach as I’m primary not secondary. Also, think my post must have sounded a bit grumpier than I meant it. Didn’t mean to offend you. Maybe we both read into each other’s posts a harsher tone than was intended. Truce?

[Camblewick]

@HelpNeedCoolUsername8 Wow, why so tetchy? I wasn't rude to you at all in my post, people tend to contribute to lots of other posts on a forum, it's just conversation.

Such a shame so many people can't just have a reasonable discussion on here now.

[HelpNeedCoolUsername8]

@Camblewick

That’s why I think it’s inappropriate and would be ashamed to work in a school where this was the policy.

*@HelpNeedCoolUsername8* well so would I. If that were an actual school policy I would find that utterly ridiculous. However, on the occasions that I've done it, it's been with pupils with whom I have a great relationship and I know them well. Of course it depends on the child, I would think that's fairly obvious. I wouldn't dream of suggesting it with a more sensitive child, nor have I ever insisted or demanded that a child give me their shoe. We all build relationships with our children in different ways, I like to have fun with mine and they also absolutely know there the line is that they shouldn't cross. I imagine you have a different style of teaching than I do and that's fine.

I was referring to the OP’s query about their school where it sounds like a blanket policy of taking shoes has been applied, and at least one child has definitely found it uncomfortable. No idea who you are, wasn’t commenting on your individual teaching style, imagine what you like about my teaching style but I don’t think it’s relevant here 🤷‍♀️

[middleager]

Nope, don't like this policy, seems regressive, though gaining much hilarity on here, strangely.

[Balonzette]

It IS funny and light hearted. And has the added bonus of encouraging the (probably few) people who are offended by it to remember to bring in their headphones.

[Camblewick]

@DdraigGoch

How does the school library cope if someone wishes to take out more than two books? What other items of clothing get used as deposits?

Or do they just use the boring, conventional method of swiping a card?

I know you're not considering the two situations as comparable, because that would be ridiculous ...

[lazylinguist]

How does the school library cope if someone wishes to take out more than two books? What other items of clothing get used as deposits?

Totally different. Students are supposed to take books out of the library, so you have to have a system that records who's taken which book(s) once they've left the library. Whereas a student borrowing headphones or a calculator is supposed to give them back before leaving the room. Besides, are you suggesting a swipe system in every classroom with umpteen categories of things students might borrow?

[DdraigGoch]

How does the school library cope if someone wishes to take out more than two books? What other items of clothing get used as deposits?

Or do they just use the boring, conventional method of swiping a card?

[lazylinguist]

I mentioned this thread to my dc. They were pretty sceptical at the idea that kids would find this humiliating or think it was being implied they would deliberately steal an item from the teacher. They said some teachers do it, some don't, and nobody seems remotely bothered.

[Camblewick]

That’s why I think it’s inappropriate and would be ashamed to work in a school where this was the policy.

@HelpNeedCoolUsername8 well so would I. If that were an actual school policy I would find that utterly ridiculous. However, on the occasions that I've done it, it's been with pupils with whom I have a great relationship and I know them well. Of course it depends on the child, I would think that's fairly obvious. I wouldn't dream of suggesting it with a more sensitive child, nor have I ever insisted or demanded that a child give me their shoe. We all build relationships with our children in different ways, I like to have fun with mine and they also absolutely know there the line is that they shouldn't cross. I imagine you have a different style of teaching than I do and that's fine.

[HelpNeedCoolUsername8]

@LordOfTheThings

I don't think you're a shit mum at all OP. I don't disagree with the schools approach either, but like with anything, it depends how it's done. If it's done in a way that the child feels part of the 'joke' and not the butt of it, then that's fair enough. Not if it's done in a way to humiliate a child though.

I can see your point about it depending how it’s done, but I also think it depends on the child. There certainly are children who wouldn’t be bothered, but there are also those who would, whatever the tone. It’s also extremely hard to ensure every teacher gets the right “tone” if it’s a blanket approach. That’s why I think it’s inappropriate and would be ashamed to work in a school where this was the policy.

[LordOfTheThings]

I don't think you're a shit mum at all OP. I don't disagree with the schools approach either, but like with anything, it depends how it's done. If it's done in a way that the child feels part of the 'joke' and not the butt of it, then that's fair enough. Not if it's done in a way to humiliate a child though.

[LordOfTheThings]

Do schools still have stationary stores where pupils can go to buy equipment? We had one which opened at break time; you could buy pens, maths equipment (compasses etc) and things like that.

We used to but not anymore. At the start of term we were each given a box with ten pens, ten pencils, ten rulers, rubbers etc. That was all gone by day 4. You ask the children to return anything that they borrow at the end of the lesson but they don't. Everything else is equipment that I buy myself.

Someone upthread (who has clearly never been in a classroom with thirty 13 year olds) said that part of the end of lesson procedure should be counting in and borrowed equipment - if I did that I would have to stop every lesson ten minutes before the end to 'count' it all back in. I wouldn't be able to deal with the child who is struggling with the work, or upset about falling out with their friend. I wouldn't be able to deal with that incident between children that needs dealing with asap. 'Sorry Jimmy, I know you're upset because you don't understand the work, but I need to count my pencils back in so too bad'.

You'd think that parents would a) ensure their children were equipped for school and b) teach them to return something that they have borrowed rather than just keep it. They don't. 🤷

[Dryrobeandnoknickers]

@liveforsummer

As it was OP had to borrow some off a colleague in work, so there may not have been a way to get any for Monday or Tuesday in any case.

OP says^ 'and I completely forgot to borrow some over the weekend.^'

And also 'She has now borrowed a pair of headphones for the rest of the week from a family member'

You're inventing things now to try and make your point and adding drama where there was none. Surely the convo on Friday just needed to be
'Mum we need headphones on Monday'
'Ok dd we'll borrow some off uncle Ernie as ours are fancy blue tooth things that don't work with lap top'
Sunday comes and dd realises they haven't been to uncle Ernies yet so reminds mum. No nagging, no pressure, no money angst just a high school student taking a bit of responsibility for their school needs

Just to clarify, I received an email on Friday asking to provide the headphones on Monday. DD hadn’t been told so she couldn’t remind me so the responsibility sat solely with me.

No we don’t have fancy Bluetooth headphones - just 2 pairs of standard in ear headphones with a different input Jack.

I’m grateful the school let my dd borrow it however I feel there could a better way.
I’m not blaming the school, I’m questioning the approach, as a proportion of people (as highlighted is the split of responses on here) would find it unduly unsettling. This is not because they have no resilience or are moddlycoddled snowflakes. This is for very real reasons which I feel are not yet well understood by a large proportion of those who have not experienced them.

In response to those who have said I’m a shit mum, I’m not. I’m just someone who made a simple mistake and didn’t expect the school to use that tactic. My dd is a tough cookie who knows her own mind and feels strong enough to share and articulate her feelings- I’m not going to tell her what she feels is silly. I am however going to make sure she can see both sides of the situation and understands why.

Thanks for all the responses so far. I know that ultimately it is my fault she didn’t have the headphones. However, as someone who is experienced in how schools are managed and how to make them an inclusive, respectful setting I am going to contact the school. Not to have a go at them, but to discuss the situation further as I have a valid concern.

[Mamazoras]

I am absolutely mortified to see how many insensitive and unkind grown ups surround our children! This is not a way to teach a child to be responsible, it is downgrading and humiliating. Sorry for your DD.

[noblegiraffe]

We used to have a stationery store. Tory school budget cuts led to staff cuts which means that we don't anymore.