All natural birth?

[TerribleTwosPhase]

Ok first time posting on AIBU so putting my hard hat on for this one...
Do you genuinely believe that having a baby with no pain relief/intervention or anything makes it a superior birth to someone who hasn't?
Before I had DD I was quite relaxed about my birth plan, didn't want any pain relief or anything if I could manage it, but wasn't against it. In the end after 3 days of labour with a back to back baby and not progressing I had to have an epidural. Fine that's what needed to happen to safely deliver my baby, and as my body was starting to have issues it was the safest way of processing for us both if I needed an emergency c section. I have no issues with this and understand it's just what had to happen, not my ideal birth but we are both happy and healthy so that's all that matters.
Woman on my Facebook has just announced her babies birth with the line " total natural birth, I am a lioness!"
AIBU to think that this is a bit ridiculous, be proud of yourself fair enough, but do we really need to make people feel bad about how they gave birth? Do you secretly feel better about yourself knowing you done it with no pain relief?
I'm really not trying to be goady here please don't take it like that, but does the fact that everything went textbook for someone mean it's more noteworthy than for someone who didn't? I see so many women on here who are disappointed with their birth experiences and I think things like this surely can't help?

[LetsDoThisAgain]

@TerribleTwosPhase

"Woman on my Facebook has just announced her babies birth with the line " total natural birth, I am a lioness!""

You are only BU, IF you don't screenshot it and send it to the Sanctimommy FB group.

[HJ82]

@TerribleTwosPhase I think it comes down to what that pain relief entails? It's not like taking a panadol! There are risks with epidural and I think many women don't want a birth that's medically led. Being on your back numb from the waste down with your legs in stirrups is very unnatural for the birthing process. Not to mention tough on your spine. Can also lead to slower labour and ultimately in a lot of cases a distressed baby. And no one WANTS an emergency c-section. I think we have to be open to all eventualities but wanting a medical free birth isn't because you're better than the next woman. It's simply because you want to TRY and do it the way every mammal does and often does it quickly and most cases safer I guess.

[gleefullymine]

I had a natural birth. By natural I mean vaginal, and to be honest, c sections are so commonplace now they are pretty natural too, in my opinion!

I was refused all pain relief as nobody believed I was in labour. I was told my induction couldn't possibly be working that fast (30 minutes later after being told I'm 0cm). I begged for pain relief and was given none. It was awful. I'm traumatised by it and don't feel like a lioness. If I am I'm a fairly broken one at that.

I left my abusive ex and am now raising my son as a single mum. THAT makes me feel much more badass and then personally I don't think it matters how your baby comes in to the world, in the grand scheme of things.

Saying that, I do think women are entitled to feel empowered by their method of childbirth. If she felt like a lioness then brilliant, why would you want her to feel any other way?

[Sashkin]

If somebody has the good fortune to have a straightforward labour, good for them! No point in having unnecessary interventions.

But if you have a complicated delivery, take whatever gets you the best outcome. I had people (well actually just my now-ex yoga teacher) criticising me for having a c-section and saying “I should have tried” - I had vasa praevia, if I’d “tried”, DS would be dead. That wouldn’t make me a lioness, it would make me a fucking reckless selfish monster.

mice and ferrets also give birth without pain relief

[BasiliskStare]

Well I refer you back to my lovely GP - just make sure the baby gets out as best you can. ( Basilisk - Professor of the very Obvious here - ask me anything)

[PCohle]

But I do think criticising women for having a "natural" birth is bad, just as I think criticising women for having interventions is bad.

How is that in any way hypocritical? Because I didn't mention it often enough on a thread that is literally about the latter?

[doIreallyneedto]

I felt I handled the whole experience better which contributed to being able to have the birth I hoped for.

It's fantastic when it works out, regardless of the type of birth you were hoping for.

[doIreallyneedto]

@Myheartbelongston - gets worse, I was pregnant on number 3 when she was six months old!

And did you stop there or have you a football team now

just do what works for you and go in with an open mind.

I agree with that, definitely.

[doIreallyneedto]

@PCohle - yet you have tagged me in no less than 5 comments criticising me for, what, not saying so earlier? Not saying it often enough?

Nope. Simply calling you out on your hypocrisy.

[tomhazard]

My first birth was a bit arduous, epidural and ventouse with a tear and stitches.
Second time I was much calmer, knew what was coming, and delivered DC2 with gas and air only, no intervention and no tearing. Tbh I was really chuffed with myself about how this went, I felt I handled the whole experience better which contributed to being able to have the birth I hoped for. But, I 100% don't judge any other mother for how their baby arrived, I literally don't care as long as they and their baby are healthy.

[Myheartbelongsto]

@doireallyneedto - gets worse, I was pregnant on number 3 when she was six months old!

i had the epidural on my first baby which made labour very difficult, had 10 stitches and he wouldn't feed.

2nd and 3rd children i had just the gas and air. 1 great delivery and 1 not so great. just do what works for you and go in with an open mind.

[PCohle]

We are in complete agreement (on this point at least) yet you have tagged me in no less than 5 comments criticising me for, what, not saying so earlier? Not saying it often enough? Not saying it in response to the specific comment you had in mind (despite two separate posters having already called out the comment)?

I've also apologised but apparently you didn't like that either. 🤷‍♀️ Seriously, are you ok hun?

[doIreallyneedto]

@Myheartbelongsto - I'm more proud of the fact that I had my second baby 10 months after my first.

Wow. That's impressive.

[doIreallyneedto]

@PCohle - I'm also sorry that you think my apology was disingenuous.

If you apply some of your amazing logic, you will have no difficulty in seeing why I came to that conclusion.

As we've argued about at some length now I don't think it's "twisting" anything to look at the clear implications of someone's words.

Except the implications are only clear when you apply the warped logic that speaking in support of one action or activity is critical of someone who takes a different action or participates in a different activity.

It is the equivalent of me taking about the exercise I've started doing and decided that is inherently critical of anyone who doesn't exercise.

[droningtraffic]

Jesus Christ, some of you could have a fight in an empty room.

No birth is 'better'.

Bollox about being a martyr is shitty as is all the original 'lioness' bollox.

All, bollox.

Why are people arguing about who had what medical outcome?

[Myheartbelongsto]

I'm more proud of the fact that I had my second baby 10 months after my first.

[PCohle]

I think many of the comments made by people about the benefits of drug free birth are impliedly critical of women who have interventions, yes. The example given is the OP is one.

As we've argued about at some length now I don't think it's "twisting" anything to look at the clear implications of someone's words.

As I've said several times, I also think that criticising women for having a natural birth is unacceptable. I'm sorry you somehow think I haven't made that point often enough or in relation to the posts to you think I should have.

I'm also sorry that you think my apology was disingenuous. You seem very determined to disagree with me.

[doIreallyneedto]

@PCohle - I'm terribly sorry that in this thread, the OP of which asks; "Do you genuinely believe that having a baby with no pain relief/intervention or anything makes it a superior birth to someone who hasn't" that this is the issue I have chosen to focus on.

Actually no, that isn't what you have chosen to focus on. What you have focused on is twisting the words of people who have spoken about the benefits of a drug-free birth and tried to make their comments out to be critical of those who follow a different path.

I'm also sorry that you are unhappy with the posts on this thread that I have chosen to respond to. I didn't realise that you felt you needed my support so much.

You are being completely disingenuous now.

[PCohle]

I really don't know how I could make my views any clearer than I already have. "I think posts criticising women for having intervention free births are also unnecessary and potentially hurtful."

I'm terribly sorry that in this thread, the OP of which asks; "Do you genuinely believe that having a baby with no pain relief/intervention or anything makes it a superior birth to someone who hasn't" that this is the issue I have chosen to focus on. I'm also sorry that you are unhappy with the posts on this thread that I have chosen to respond to. I didn't realise that you felt you needed my support so much.

[doIreallyneedto]

@PCohle - You and other posters seem to being to fine job making that point without my assistance.

But despite having pretty much full agreement by every one on this thread that negative comments about women who use meds during birth are unacceptable, you feel that you should assist them in making that point?

Pretty selective on your support.

[PCohle]

*be doing

[PCohle]

I think posts criticising women for having intervention free births are also unnecessary and potentially hurtful. You and other posters seem to being to fine job making that point without my assistance.

In real life I see far far fewer of those sort of posts than I do comments that thoughtlessly imply a "natural" delivery is superior. Which is after all why the OP started the thread.

[TowerRavenSeven]

Lioness is so cringeworthy. I had the sense to know that I needed meds and when they weren’t working that I needed more! When ds was about 6 months I had a midwife ask me if I had ds natural. I gave her the McDonalds look (eyes glazed over) and told her yeah he was natural he came out of me. Shut her up very quickly.

[doIreallyneedto]

@PCohle -By the time I saw it other posters, like yourself, had jumped all over it. I'm not a big fan of unnecessary pile ons.

Really? Many of those types of posts had no comments about them and were called out by nobody. There were many posts about martyrs or we're not living in the 19 century, or asking would we have surgery without drugs etc. I, and others, have only called out a few of them.

And I certainly don't think asking a poster why they think it is OK to make a derogatory comment about others' choices is "jumping all over it"

[PCohle]

By the time I saw it other posters, like yourself, had jumped all over it. I'm not a big fan of unnecessary pile ons.

I certainly don't think women choosing not to use pain relief are martyrs, there are plenty of perfectly valid reasons for not wanting various forms of pain relief. As I've said, my first delivery was a fairly "natural" birth (I tried gas and air initially but disliked it).

I didn't realise you were waiting with baited breath for my thoughts on every post on the thread ...