So that'll be a big fat NO then, ds1!! AIBU?

[Greensleeves]

DS1 is 16 (just) and has just asked us - in full expectation of us saying yes - whether his girlfriend can come and stay with us from 23rd to 27th December! Apparently her parents think it's a fine idea

DS1 is a mature 16, but bloody hell. He's currently only just doing full days at school again and having therapy with CAMHS for self-harming and suicidal thoughts, he's vulnerable and volatile, and the girlfriend has severe anorexia and has attempted suicide several times. He has high-functioning autism as well. It's been a tough couple of months all round.

I'm not the happiest about this relationship, tbh - especially since DS1's birthday party, where he had sex for the first time with this girlfriend, with us IN THE NEXT ROOM, by the time we realised they were shut in his bedroom together and banged on the door to tell them to get back downstairs, it had already happened. Girlfriend was also the only guest to sneak in her own alcohol and get horribly drunk (not dangerously so, and dh and I were on hand and looked after her) so she's a bit wild. We were supervising the party and tightly controlling access to alcohol, but they'd been planning their "first time" for weeks apparently and got away with it. Finding the condom wrapper on his bedroom floor was a low point (although I am glad he used one).

AIBU to be reeling that the two of them thought this would fly? And to feel helpless that he's now upset/volatile/I'm going to be worried all night about him cutting himself because we said no? He's been calmer, happier and more stable this week and I'm scared of upsetting his equilibrium, but this is an insane request, surely? He was genuinely surprised we refused outright; his first response to me saying "but you have your friend XXX over for the Boxing Day buffet!".

Sorry, it's a ramble. At the end of my rope with ds1, he seems to have undergone a personality transplant over the past couple of months.

[Runningishard]

Good advice plaid. There was an issue in his school (not involving him or his gf) in a similar vein so they’re both very aware.

[TigerMummy1]

I typed a massive post and lost it, so might do this in two goes! OP you are doing fabulously well at supporting DS without alienating him. Obviously this situation is far from ideal but I think your instinct to support them and make the best of the situation is right. They obviously love each other, and for all the downsides of the relationship, as a recovered anorexic I can say that relationships between people with severe mental health problems can also be incredibly mutually supportive in a good way, and perhaps your best way forward would be to encourage this.
Christmas for anorexics and anyone with them is usually a living hell. But your son will miss her, so coming to stay afterwards might give them something to look fwd to.
A couple of things ime you need to talk with DS about before that:

1. He eats in front of her, normally. For both their sakes. Explain to him that the best thing he can do for her is to normalise eating. Non negotiable.
   
2. if she is staying with you, she needs to eat something. Supporting/persuading her to stick to her mealplan is probably unrealistic but find out what her "nonscary" foods are (fatfree yoghurt, veg sticks etc) and have them in.
   Good luck... it is such a difficult situation but you sound like a great mum and you're doing a great job!

[plaidlife]

running just make sure that he has no naked photographs of her, I know someone who had underage sex and consensual photographs, neither parents objected at the time to the sexual relationship. Kids broke up and boy was convicted of having indecent images of a dc. It has caused all sorts of problems over the years. The consent rules protect both parties.

[Runningishard]

OP you are clearly prepared to be open minded about this notwithstanding your reservations, which is a credit to you given everything you’ve had to contend with. I’d just let her come and they can both be secure in your care. My son is 15 and now sexually active (in my house) with his girlfriend. I can’t stop them having sex so rather it be in a safe environment. You sound like a great mum, I hope they both continue to get better x

[yorkshireyummymummy]

I’m still laughing at @Asthenia questioning my calling the girlfriend conniving and sly.
Have you ever met an anorexic asthenia?
They are incredibly conniving, sly, manipulative liars in my opinion. It’s a mental health illness which will make them do and say anything in order to get what they want.
I’m incredibly concerned for the OPs son because he simply won’t have the mental strength needed to support this girl.
His feelings are utterly legitimate- I can’t bear it when people dismiss a 16 year olds feelings ( if a child of three is believed when they say I love you to their mummy or daddy why do people reject the fact that a 16 year old might be in love?? Love is not an exclusive emotion for the over 25s!!) and so whenever the OP talks to him it must be obvious that she understands and respects their love. It may be young love, but it’s still love!
I don’t like the way your son won’t eat in front of her - he needs to be told that she is ill and therefore does not get to make the rules. He should eat in front of her to promote healthy eating habits. I also think it’s incredibly rude, not to say lax parenting , that her parents are happy not to have her at home for 5 days over Christmas . Why would you expect someone you don’t know to look after your sick child at Christmas!! Seems a bit of CF-ism is creeping in here!
I understand previous posters saying that you should read up on eating disorders but Christ - do they not realise that you have more than enough on your plate already??! Sorry OP, but she is NOT your responsibility- your son is. I would be reading up on how to help a child in a co dependant relationship. You might be the nicest person in the UK and be willing to help her- I’m not the nicest person or even in the top 50%, therefore my only concern would be my own child.

I still feel you are in a sticky unenviable situation.
Keep your boy on your side as much as you can - talk talk talk to him. My DH is autistic so I know just how you feel with the black/white, lack of emotion /overwhelming emotions . It’s bloody hard work living with a high functioning autistic person never mind all of the other crap you have!
Could you sit down with girlfriend and tell her that since you both love your son you assume you both want what’s best for him- and the thing he doesn’t need is an eating disorder and consequently you understand that she’s intelligent enough to know that she must encourage him to eat normally . Because that’s what love is - putting the other person first. Trust me, I really think that you will have to be somewhat manipulative too. I know it’s not nice but hells bells, I would try and manipulate lucifer himself in order to protect my child.

You are doing great. You are trying your utter best to understand, you are being caring but not a walkover and you are making sure the lines of communication stay open. Keep talking. I really don’t think I could be as calm as you seem- but you really are being an amazing mummy.

[ReanimatedSGB]

I think it might be useful to make contact with her parents and see what you make of them - do they appear supportive or neglectful - or burnt out by dealing with their DD's mental health problems?
If you get the impression that they are either not coping or that there is a potential safeguarding issue (eg an abuser in the home) you might be able to get some professional help on her behalf.

[Jimjamjong]

Personally I think it's a bit harsh to refuse to have her. I think you should have her around, rearrange sleeping arrangements so your DS1 has his room with his girlfriend only but don't change your eating arrangements or usual Christmas celebrations. He will be an adult in 2 years time, he has to prepare for that and that includes having his girlfriend over and taking responsibility for her.

[Haffdonga]

I am not an expert in anorexia (and genuinely happy to be told I'm wrong by people who are) but my gut feeling is that the people around an anorexic person shouldn't change their own healthy eating patterns to accommodate an anorexic's wishes.

It sounds dangerous for your vulnerable ds that he is agreeing not to eat in front of her, especially if they are planning to spend long days at a time together. That's starting to make him behave as if food for him is a guilty secret, skip meals himself etc. Likewise I would not attempt to change your own family's meal habits to accommodate her. If she wants to stay with your family, she has to accept that you will be having meals together at new year.

I'm not suggesting your ds or your family should try to push her to eat or join you at meal times but she has to know that coming to your house there will be regular family mealtimes and your ds will be eating with his family. If she can't handle seeing ds or other people eating then she's really not well enough to be staying with you.

Would your ds accept that it's in his gf's best interests that food in your family is kept 'normalised' and for him to model a healthy eating habit for her?

[LIZS]

Is gf over 16? I would be very wary of hosting a vulnerable girl with ED for any length of time without clearer insight, let alone throwing your emotionally fragile ds1 into the mix. In fact it sounds like a potentially codependent and volatile relationship. How did they meet? Say no to ds1, your house , your rules and there is no space for her. I think you also need to speak to her parents and make it clear that you cannot entertain her overnight but perhaps a day.

[AnonyMousee]

Christmas isn't as important to some as others, I don't think my mother would have had a problem with this because we are very low key, low pressure when it comes to the holidays.
Could you speak to the girlfriends parents? Just to discuss with them if they are 100% okay with this as you're surprised they don't want their 16 year old around over Christmas?

[thaegumathteth]

I’m sorry you’re in this situation OP. You’re absolutely right not to dismiss the validity of the relationship just because of his age. I have been with dh since I was a teenager and I think it has surprised people BUT we were in a much more stable calm situation. I can’t see something like what your son and his girlfriend has lasting because it sounds so fraught with stress but you are right not to assume that or to try and make it end. You need to be able to be there for him to pick up the pieces afterwards and if he thinks you’re pleased or relieved he won’t allow you to do that.

How did they meet? Could you invite her and her parents round for dinner?

[Ttcfirsttime]

Wow, certainly a very complicated situation. I agree with offering the New Year’s Eve and making food less prominent then. I also like someone else’s suggestion of offering a night or 2 this month so you can also get to know her more one on one and with less pressure of a holiday. Learning about ED would definitely be ideal, especially if you’re concerned your son might go this route, as you may learn to help him before it gets to that point. Her parents or dad may well be abusive and she may be seeking somewhere safe and enjoy being in a warm and loving family home. I know it’s a lot for you to take on; but by letting her stay you may actually help her mental health by giving her respite from an abusive home (not over Xmas as you have good reasons for this).

[KatKit16]

I would say yes to the days but she has to go home for the evening.

[Theoscargoesto]

And just read more of the thread (sorry). SHe's clearly using food as a weapon, and for your son to be bargaining with her and not eating in front of her is not healthy for either of them. Please just be aware that eating disorders are the most manipulative, damaging illness I have come across and in the final analysis, your son is your responsibility, not her. If she doesn't have support around her at home , if her life is lacking something fundamental, you probably aren't going to change that, and it's for her and her family to resolve (or not). You have a really difficult situation on your hands and I truly wish you the best with it.

[JanetLovesJason]

Maybe her parent’s said it’s fine because they think that way it might fizzle out, whereas if they take a firm line it could go full blown Romeo and Juliet forbidden love style.

Could you stall and say something like “We’ll see, I’ll think about it” to diffuse things a bit?

[Theoscargoesto]

I hope this doesn't derail your thread, OP, and I can empathise with the difficulties you have been having with DS. For reasons that follow, I know what it's like to have a child whose personality seems to have changed. I also know what it's like to feel that, whatever decisions you make about that child's welfare, they have you over a barrel in some way. It will not be your responsibility if DS harms himself once you have made your decision, but I know it won't feel that way to you and I wish you all the best with your son.

The reason for my post (and the potential derail) is that I have had a severely anorexic DD. I am really surprised that the GF drinks alcohol, I know mine wouldn't touch it: all those calories.

In addition, please don't underestimate what it's like to be anorexic over Christmas, and furthermore to have an anorexic around at this time. Second, I would not have wanted my severely anorexic DD to be in anyone else's charge when she was very unwell. It wouldn't have been fair for them to feel responsible for her eating, and I needed to know that she was eating. Not eating (and in my DD's case, exercising), were dangerous: it's not fair for you to have that responsibility. And it's onerous, it really is, if she's as ill as you think.

I wonder what her parents are expecting of you, if anything. Will you be expected to ensure she eats? What will be 'enough' for her to eat? How will you handle it if she doesn't eat? What will you do should she become really unwell: how will you be able to assess that?

In some ways, that seems to me to be more important than if they are sexually active: they can be that over the period without her staying with you.

[Purpleartichoke]

Nye would be a good solution. It’s a lower pressure holiday, just one night, fewer guests, you are up late to supervise. I would plan your normal food, but Maybe make sure the mix includes some things she might be more comfortable eating. Obviously it depends on the person, but if she is someone who will eat lighter food to keep up appearances then maybe some small bites of fruit and veggies. She might nibble on grapes and sip sparkling water if they were available.

[Greensleeves]

I think the point about Christmas revolving around food and the sharing of food is a really good one - Christmas dinner would be horrendous for her in our house and we aren't ED experts so we probably wouldn't have the skills to make it doable for her.

I think it's something I need to learn more about if they are going to be together for a while - I want our home to be somewhere she can come and feel comfortable and accepted, and we are quite keen on our food and sharing treats etc. If she is going to come for NYE I will have to think about how to handle that. Maybe put food out in the other room for people to help themselves to and not have it as a major focus

Sallycinnamon I hear what you're saying, I also think the relationship is a powder keg and has the potential to be disastrous. But he's 16 and knows his own mind, and he loves this girl very much. I don't think there is a way for me to forcibly break that attachment, and I don't think it would be right if I did. As a group of adult mums, we may think "it's two lovestruck kids", but to DS1 that's not how it is at all. He's very prickly about being patronised or belittled because of his age, he strains against the restrictions on his freedom that being still a teenager entails, and if he got a whiff of the idea that I think his feelings for his girlfriend are skin-deep because he's only 16, I would lose the trust and communication that I have with him at the moment - and I need it, because I need to know when he is self-harming or considering it, when he is depressed, when something happens at school that he needs to talk about. I'm walking a tightrope.

[stayathomegardener]

The good thing is your DS is black and white, I would keep it super simple.
No your gf can't stay whilst your grandfather is here as there is no room.

Offer them a couple of days before grandfather arrives and at New Years afterwards.

This will give them a focus to look forward to, if the first stay is a disaster you can consider cancelling the second and Christmas should be a welcome reprieve.

I wouldn't remotely worry about sex in your house, that's the least of your worries.
Good luck and look after yourself, it sounds very tough for you.

[StormTreader]

Would it be out of order to explain to him that a lot of the "Christmas family experience" is around food, and she would be expected to join in with that? Its not going to be a very pleasant atmosphere if you have a guest that disappears in horror every time the mince pies are brought out.

How would she even join in with the Christmas meal or "boxing day buffet"? Would he also be expected to not be present at any of these to support her if he already cant eat in front of her?

[Sallycinammonbangsthedruminthe]

I would say no OP ...infact I would be not having the conversation more than once...shut it down and for everyones sake I would be doing everything I can to obstruct this relationship full stop..It is not healthy for two people with obviously serious issues to be together...I worry that this relationship is affecting you all as a family..look at the stress its putting you under...You are the responsible adult here you get to decide whom you choose to have in your home ....Why should your peace of mind and your xmas be ruined and over ridden by trying to deal with problems from a couple of love struck kids? I know you want to do your best for your son and you want him happy but the issues you all face with both kids mental health are more pressing...forget her as mean as it sounds and try to get your son the help he obviously needs..thats your priority not being brow beaten by a mass of raving hormones and what is in effect a teenage romance...Please don;t top toe around your own home for the sake of keeping the peace...this relationship has disaster written all over it and I would hate for you to deal with it all when it errupts...You sound such a lovely mum and I can see how torn you are ..But we have to parent its our job and on that you get to decide...Best Wishes sent I hope your son can over come his problems.

[OwlBeThere]

you only have their word for it that her parents are ok with it to be fair. you don't know thats the case.
i'd also compromise with a couple of days after christmas instead.

[Asthenia]

Mental health problems aside, this really doesn’t sound like a particularly unusual teenage relationship. I’m 27 and a lot of the relationships my friends and I had matched this one in levels of intensity and melodrama - plus we were all sexually active and no harm came of it! My parents let my boyfriend stay for Christmas when I was 17 and it was one of the best I’ve ever had - I felt like they trusted me and felt so grown up. It was the right move on their part, I think.
In my opinion the issue here is not the relationship - teenagers are dramatic and self-absorbed and always believe they’re the only people in the world to ever have been in love, that’s all normal. But the anorexia and your son’s issues are the most worrying thing, which I understand you believe are compounded by this relationship.
Also, people calling a 16 year old girl conniving and sly? Jesus.

[diddl]

Tbh, with her ed, Christmas would be pretty fraught, wouldn't it?

You're all going to be focussing on not upsetting her.

It sounds horrific.

I can't help thinking that Christmas will be ruined if she's there or if she's not.

[lobeydosser]

What an awful quandary for you all.
i wonder whether you should try and blindside DS when you speak to him tomorrow and invite the GF over much sooner than Christmas/NY?
Ask him when they're both likely not to be too busy with school/college work and arrange for her to come over in the next couple of weeks.
It's just possible they might be more inhibited about having sex away from the hubbub of a 16th birthday party.
But more importantly it would send a really clear signal of reassurance and validation to them both that you like her and want to get to know her. Maybe encountering approval and warmth in a home that's quite different from her own will engineer an improvement in her mental well-being.
Christmas/NY are so stressful principally because of all the surrounding expectations that it might be beneficial for them to get together again much sooner.
Anything that could get them both on a more even keel would be a huge blessing.
I do hope it all works out