AIBU to think that I need to start a thread about the Birmingham dialect?

[threeelephants]

I'm so annoyed lately at all of the threads belittling my accent/dialect. I'd like to describe it as snobbery but I actually feel it goes beyond that.

In Birmingham we say mom, not mum. It has been this way for at least a hundred years. It is not 'Amercanism', in fact it was us who took the word over there. Mum is a slang word, it isn't 'the correct term' in anyway-if you want to have a dig at me saying mom then you'd better be calling yours mother!

We eat nougat and pronounce it nugat (not nugget, like some of you seem to think). We also eat marshmellows...tbh I'd never noticed there was supposed to be an a in there!

We pronounce tooth with the shorter oo sound (like in book, look, foot etc).

We are not uneducated, nor are we all bloody working class!

And while we're here, dinner is a hot meal, doesn't matter what time of day you eat it, lunch is a cold meal in the middle of the day, tea is a simple meal at the end of the day and supper is a biscuit before bed.

The Birmingham accent/dialect is the closest in existence to how Chaucer/Shakespeare would have spoken. Which makes us more correct than most of you.

[onemorecupofcoffeefortheroad]

There is no ‘correct’ accent - who is to say that a Brummie accent is more ‘correct’ than say a Yorkshire accent. Just because Shakespeare may or may not have had a Brummie accent doesn’t mean that we should prescribe this as the correct way to speak. It just means he had a brunmie accent.

Attitudes to language change over time - at one time you only ever heard broadcasters speak in RP as this was considered prestigious and an indicator of social class - now it sounds ridiculously old fashioned and associated with a bygone era.

These attitudes to accent are based on social prejudices - what’s considered prestigous and what’s not - they have nothing to do with any linguistic criteria.

[MissionItsPossible]

Haven’t RTFT but can I use it to bring up something about MN? How come when a topic comes up it always comes up in batches? Has anyone else noticed this? Using this thread as an example there have been three or four snidey threads on the Birmingham accent in the last few days. There were also a few threads made within days of another about workmen using toilets and threads created in the same day made about other topics too. Not calling it fake but seems like agendas are being purposely pushed to create arguments sonetimes. I’m guessing it’s to create enough discussion to warrant basing writing an easy article about it for newspapers?

[Starryskiesinthesky]

Is it not just that reading one thread makes someone think of something related and so they start a new thread?

I'm not keen on brummie accents but wouldn't start a post about them!

[SwarmOfCats]

I’m from Birmingham. My kids have pretty strong accents and Brummie nativities are a thing of joy.

I say marshmallow, and dinner is in the evening. It is ‘mom’ for most people I know, though. OP, you’re way too upset about this and some of the things you’ve said are sweeping generalisations anyway!

Birmingham and the Black Country are entirely different...but there are some crossovers. Black Country translator is quite fun: cybermetrics.wlv.ac.uk/blackcountrytranslation.php

[RoryAndLogan]

I don't like the accent much, but that's just personal taste.

If you have soup for lunch, do you let it cool down before eating?

[Oooeeeerrrrrindeed]

I live close to Birmingham. Actually nearer Stratford where the accent is different. I am not from the area so have neither accent. They are hugely different.

[NightCzar]

Perhaps, OP, you could advertise your Brummie accent coaching to the cast if Peaky Blinders. Their accents seem to move around the country at whim. I think it must have been one of the hardest locations for them to have chosen, in terms of actors needing to sound authentic.

[BalloonSlayer]

I have heard the thing about Shakespeare and the Brummie accent before. Apparently some of the "rhyming couplets" (with which he ends each act) which don't seem to rhyme, actually do when you say them in a Brummie accent.

[DontCallMeCharlotte]

As someone upthread said, you may well pronounce it "Mom" but it doesn't need a different spelling or you'd be writing everything differently. In the north it's generally pronounced "Moom" but still spelt Mum. (Apart from the Mams of course ).

[carryondoctor]

Sorry but I can't bear a brummie accent. It actually sets my teeth on edge. It's just got the edge on scouse for "slit my ears off now". And Wolverhampton/other areas with the same sort of accent - I was reading "Anita and Me" the other week, and the Wolverhampton dialect was really grating on me. You could (theoretically!) drive up the motorway from London blindfolded and stop for petrol anywhere random and know instantly that you were in the orbit of Birmingham.

But who cares a flying feck what I think? I'm sure my mix of Buckinghamshire and Mancunian wouldn't sound so great to the OP or lots of other people! Everyone's entitled to their opinion

[cortex10]

I grew up in the heart of the Black Country and was quite unaware of the reaction of others to the accent - until I went to university. Early 80s, freshers week and managed to dislocate my knee ( not the first time ). Lying in some pain on the floor waiting for medical assistance when another student came along and asked if I was OK. ‘it’s ow-kay arve dun it before - it’ll be betta when they push it back in plaerce’ I groaned. ‘Oh I say’ he replied ‘ where exactly do you come from? Are you a really a student???’.

[lorelairoryemily]

*Actually lots of us are of Irish descent, so we talk at 100 mph when Charlotte g to family/friends
*

Yea because every single Irish person talks at high speed.
Maybe if you're sick of people making comments about your accent you should refrain from making stupid comments like that one

[lorelairoryemily]

Fucking autocorrect chatting obviously not Charlotte!

[bookmum08]

Shakespeare was from Stratford upon Avon where the locals have a slight Brumnie accent (I lived there for three years).
"Oh my life" as people would say!!

[bookmum08]

Brummie!
Not Brumnie!
(although I like the sound of brumnie - I might have to make up a meaning for it!!)

[StripySocksAndDocs]

NightCzar I think the guy that wrote Peaky Blinders said as much. It's a very unexposed accent (on TV I think he meant). Where it was supposed to be (Crossroads' Benny for example) didn't give a realistic representation. People seem to forget that within Birmingham i itself accents vary (like everywhere else).

Shakespeare works quite well in a Wexford accent too. RP doesn't always do justice to the rhymes and witticism of the arrangements.

[EduCated]

YANBU, bab. People do seem to get their knickers in a twist about the Birmingham accent, and how awful and terrible and wrong it is

[EastMidsMummy]

Accents are great, Birmingham included. Variety is the spice of life. Our UK dialects are one of the joys of the nation.

But "marshmellow" isn't a dialect or accent thing. It's just an error.

[EduCated]

At what point does something stop being ‘incorrect’ and become an accent/dialect, though? How can you claim with certainty that that is the case?

Also new Snobs serves food. I’m not sure how I feel about this.

[EduCated]

And if we really want to get the discussion going, how does one pronounce Alvechurch, and does the National Rail lady say it correctly?

[EastMidsMummy]

"Marshmellow" is a transcription error, not an accent shift. (Brummies don't say fellow for fallow or merrow for marrow.)

It could become dialect if it became the standard local form, but it's not. It's a common error across many dialects and accents.

[Roussette]

Stripysocks

Incidentally Snobs was a brilliant nightclub in Birmingham. I believe it's moved now though

My DH used to run Snobs way before I met him!! This was back in the 70s (we're old!) He comes out with all sorts of stories of his days there, drinking with Noddy Holder etc.

[Sockwomble]

I've got a mom and I'm her babby.

[SleepingStandingUp]

Oh and a forward roll is a gambol!
Surely this isn't up for dispute?? What do other people call it?

Mom here too, always confused me as a child that there weren't any cards for what I call my mom. Even if I occasionally pronounce it mum it's spelt mom.

[StripySocksAndDocs]

SleightOfMind: Stripy you’ve completely blown your autocorrect’s tiny, tiny mind!

Eeek!! What did I do?!