To wonder how people afford to smoke?

[paintingbutterflies]

I know addictions are just awful. But so many people seem to be struggling with money and smoke. I wonder where the money comes from. Do people just go without basic things?

[Macncheesewithbacon]

My mum is 65 and was born in a slum. Her earliest memories are being sent out to search for money - I. Drains, grids, at the bottom of the canal anywhere. The money would be washed and taken to neighbours for single cigarettes. It's nothing new. Children with patents who are addicts suffer.

[satsumasunrise]

Blimey Mac that's like something out of a Dickens' novel, your poor mum!

[PencilsInSpace]

YANBU to wonder this.

Raising the cost of tobacco has been a huge part of tobacco control policy for decades now. It's helped lower the smoking rate enormously over those years. More recently though it has made very little difference, despite the increasingly exorbitant rises in tobacco tax.

Pretty much all the people who could be persuaded to quit because of rising costs have now quit. The smokers who are left are the most heavily addicted who can't simply quit because the cost is eating into essential expenditure.

As prevalence falls, smoking is becoming increasingly concentrated among poor people and people with MH issues. They generally smoke more heavily and started smoking younger than wealthier, more mentally well people. Smoking is the biggest cause of health inequalities today and the single largest contributor to the 10-20 year drop in life expectancy for people with MH issues.

Smokers cut their costs by buying the cheapest brand (not all are £10/pack), stocking up on trips abroad, switching to roll ups, buying from the bloke down the market or down the pub. Still, the poorest smokers cannot afford to smoke. They don't quit though, despite trying. They just end up not only addicted to fags but also malnourished and unable to afford to keep themselves properly warm and clean. Smoking costs contribute to debt and so inevitably on occasion, homelessness.

While tobacco price hikes have been an extremely useful tool for decades to lower smoking rates, I now strongly believe that they are doing more harm than good and are causing tobacco to become as harmful as some class A drugs. I think the way forward from here is harm reduction, not ever more punishment and stigma.

Prevalence graph is from CRUK using ONS data.

I've only read the OP. I'm sure the next 7 pages are mostly the usual shite.

[BastardBernie]

Smokers children go without and smokers don't save for pensions because we know we are going to die prematurely?
For fuck sake, what absurd comments.
We are all going to die, half of the population by some sort of cancer (which is created by mutations in DNA; meaning a non smoker is is still odds on to develop it)
Jesus Christ you people are nuts on here sometimes 😄

[MumIsRunningAMarathon]

mac bottom of the canal? wow

[Seeyamonday]

I smoke, my husband smokes, no one goes without anything, I like nice clothes, my husband likes a pint, my kids are all grown up, we both work and can spend our money how we see fit thank you!!

[paintingbutterflies]

Lu if you feel the thread or I are goady then report it.

Poor people are disproportinately more likely to smoke and it is intended factually. Others have given links that explain this.

I found pencils and senators posts very interesting.

[supermoon100]

I do think it's a bit sad to smoke if you have kids

[PencilsInSpace]

Everybody who feels deprived because their parent's smoked and they didn't get all the lovely things they wanted in childhood should look at the first graph I posted above and reassess how reasonable their outrage is. Smoking used to be as cheap as chips - literally. It might have been the case that your parents were actually just poor, depending on how old you are.

I can confirm that vaping is a fuckton cheaper these days. I think I spend about £2.50 a week. Best of all it doesn't come with a 50% chance of premature death and doesn't harm those around you.

And it is actually nicer than smoking once you've found a kit and juice that suits you. I say this as someone who started smoking age 12 and smoked 15-20 a day for over 3 decades.

[Justnowthisone]

Mumsnet is like this

Smoking thread
Breastfeeding vs bottle feeding war thread
Dog hating thread
Smoking thread
Dog bites child PTS now thread
Breastfeeding versus bottle thread

At any given point in time there must be any one of these.

It is true, that I can say. Sad!

[IdaDown]

It's not just the £ cost but also your health cost.

i compare my DM (mid 60's) to DH's parents (late 80's).

My DM has smoked since 15. Has COPD, reoccurring chest infections, can't walk any great (or small) distance.

DH's parents are getting frail now, arthritic but are still fairly active. very much around for the grandkids.

I always wonder to myself how many chief execs and board members of tobacco companies smoke...

[lozzylizzy]

My sister smokes but she very rarely drinks and then its only one or a couple on a special occasion.

Its her vice which we enjoy and that is that. We all have them whether its food, alcohol, cigarettes, shopping etc

[cushioncovers]

Smoking might have been cheaper in the past but wages were so much lower so surely it was all proportional?

[SenatorBunghole]

Everybody who feels deprived because their parent's smoked and they didn't get all the lovely things they wanted in childhood should look at the first graph I posted above and reassess how reasonable their outrage is. Smoking used to be as cheap as chips - literally. It might have been the case that your parents were actually just poor, depending on how old you are.

You are perhaps not getting that some children would've liked a few more chips during their childhood...

However you slice it, it's money that wasn't available to spend on anything else, and of course the families that were 'actually just poor' are going to notice that. Personally I was more bothered about being forced to breathe it in, as I said, but you dismissing people's upset at money not being better used elsewhere, just because they were poor, is not a good look.

[SenatorBunghole]

Smoking might have been cheaper in the past but wages were so much lower so surely it was all proportional?

It used to cost a lot less as a percentage of the average household income, iyswim. It wasn't proportional. The cost has gone up a lot more than the rate of inflation. But that's still a poor argument, because it's never been free and there've always been families and children who didn't have much.

[5rivers7hills]

Fascinating post @PencilsInSpace- thanks for sharing

[Badcat666]

My father smoked a lot growing up but we never went without.

Granted we didn't have a lot of spare money as I came from a very large family but we were always well dressed, clean, fed and loved. My mum worked part time and dad worked all hours.

We never went aboard as the costs would have crippled anyone back in the 70s and 80s due to how big my family were but we spent our summer hols camping, sometimes for weeks on end (dad would leave to go to work on Sunday afternoon and come back late Friday night) and Christmas and birthdays our present piles would be sky high!

The house was filled with books and toys to keep us entertained. We always had new school uniform and back then you had to go to specialised uniform shops and wear blazers.

We went on weekend day trips with my older siblings if mum and dad were at work and go fishing with my dad at weekends (so mum could have the house to herself for a day!) we had a weekly pocket money and mum would always buy us a comic/ magazine on a Friday.

As I grew up and they had more cash it would be trips to Miss Selfridge for the coolest clothes and make up for me and game shops for my brother. I was so hip it hurt!

We grew our on veg at an allotment and all chipped in.

The house was busy but always clean and decorated and any painting jobs needed was due to wear and tear from many people rather than the dreaded yellow stained tobacco walls.

It never occured to me growing up that my dad was "burning our money". He didn't drink or go to the pub or working mans club. He would be at home with all his family.

He worked his arse off all his life. Why would I ever begrudge him his "ciggie money". He even managed to quit overnight when he was older for his health.

As a grown up I realise how MUCH my mum and dad sacrificed so we never went without.

My memories are filled with happy thoughts and not that dad had spent money on himself instead of buying me the latest fad thing.

I know people who can afford to spend £10 a day on coffee and lunch without blinking an eye. I have friends who have a 12 crate of booze delivered each week and ones that go on holiday twice a year..

People budget for things, as do smokers. It's what adults have to do.

A packet of tobacco, filters and papers can set you back around £12 and unless you smoke like a chimney, can last a week.

There are liable to be more poor parents who go without eating so their children can eat than poor parents who spent their money on cigarettes than food for their children.

TV programmes about the poor can be very biased as you only get to see that one person who is being filmed and so you imagine all poor smokers to act like that.

You can be rolling in cash and be a non smoker but still be a rubbish parent.

I have no idea how my parents managed but they did and all with my dad smoking. 😱

I may have not had a foreign holiday until I was 14 but by god was I loved.

[Birdsgottafly]

""But that's still a poor argument, because it's never been free and there've always been families and children who didn't have much.""

I'm nearly 50. I was watching Angela's Ashes, when it first came out, with an older relative who was born around the turn of the century. When the scene came on were the Mother was smoking, I asked if ciggies used to be cheap. She said that smoking and drinking nettle tea was cheaper than eating and they were a good appetite suppressant. So previously that's how they were used. French Women still use them as an appetite suppressant.

You can't judge previous generations. My Mother was handed her first cigarette, by an Air raid Warden, in an Air raid shelter. They were considered good for stress and health, there wasn't a reason not to smoke. A lot of Women were living under enormous pressure by the restrictions in Society and DV etc being socially acceptable. Research shows that some people's addiction levels are higher, so not easy to stop.

MNs 'sitcom' heavily featured Wine, the cause of rising Cancers in Women and that includes skin cancer, but it's accepted on here.

I've never smoked because of the cost. I wouldn't have a newish car on finance, for the same reason, or have a lot of take-outs, get my nails done, or a lot of other things that people do, I wouldn't judge them for it.

[SenatorBunghole]

I doubt many posters talking about their parents smoking in their childhood are harking back to the Angela's Ashes era though. The average age of posters on here is what, mid 30s, so it's 80s and 90s rather than bomb shelters.

And as I mentioned, my tobacco and alcohol addicted relative finds the alcohol cheaper to service.

[SuperBeagle]

No idea, but they somehow find a way to justify it.

[cushioncovers]

Bad what you described sounded like a lovely upbringing but I think the point of the thread is about families where the adults find money for cigarettes at the expense of other family members needs and wants.

[rosesandcashmere]

I smoke, shop in Waitrose, have a lovely car and three holidays a year. Everyone's circumstances are different.

[user1490465531]

A lot of women have there nails done-that to me is a complete waste of money but if that's their treat then so be it.
So whichever way you choose to treat yourself will always be deemed a waste of money in some people eyes.

[KentMum2008]

DH smokes as did i many moons ago and our children absolutely don't go without. He doesn't go to the pub with friends of an evening or weekend, we have a modest car, and (luckily) very cheap rent. We could choose to live in a bigger house, but as the current one fits our needs and circumstances, who would we? We could get a newer car but ours works just fine thanks. We aren't rich by any means, but we certainly aren't poor and we have enough leftover at the end of the month to put into savings which will enable us to buy a house outright within 10 years.

If I asked him to, he would stop. We have talked about it and he will, when he chooses to. Me pressuring him won't make it happen any faster. But he works damn hard (as do I) for what we have, and if he chooses to spend disposable income on smoking, that's his choice. I spend mine on totally unnecessary stationery and gin. DH wouldn't ask me to give either of those up for the sake of £30 a week.

The health issue is another matter entirely, but as this thread was solely about the cost I'll leave it at that.

[paintingbutterflies]

Not even that cushion - I just don't see how nowadays someone with a big family, one parent working part time and one full time, could afford to smoke and buy teenagers everything they wanted.

I get that you could once but now I don't see how, unless you have no mortgage I suppose.

I agree re wine but it isn't as expensive.