AIBU to think women should be able to access abortion clinics without intimidation and harassment?

[betty62]

I live in Ealing, London and there is a Marie Stopes clinic nearby. Every day there is a' vigil' of anti-abortionists outside with pictures of embryos, plastic foetuses, religious texts and inaccurate leaflets which tell the women things such as they are more likely to get breast cancer if they have an abortion and that they are more likely to abuse any other children that they have or will have in the future. Some of the vigilers stand at the entrance to the clinic trying to force their leaflets on the clinic users, or follow them down the road when they leave, calling them 'mum' . Regardless of whether someone agrees with abortion or not, I don't think the women who are trying to access a legal service should be subject to intimidation and harassment. If you agree, and live or work in Ealing, please sign this petition that is asking the council to implement a buffer zone directly outside of the clinic.

ealing.cmis.uk.com/ealing/ePetitions/tabid/96/ID/38/This-petition-calls-for-Ealing-Council-to-end-the-persistent-presence-of-the-anti-abortion-vigil-outside-the-Marie-Stopes-Reproductive-Centre-on-Mattock-Lane-Ealing.aspx

[Elendon]

uglyflowers can I give you some That must have been a very scary time for you.

But when you said They have just NO idea how vulnerable these women are. I disagree. I think they know exactly how vulnerable the women are. That's what makes these 'protests' all the more disgusting.

[LurkingHusband]

Following my suggestion that a protest outside a church, mosque or synagogue might be treated differently by the hypocritical authorities, it's also worth noting that as far as I recall, the legal textbook definition of "assault" is something like "any action intended to cause another person to fear for their safety" (as a policeman once told me: "I once arrested someone for making a knife motion across their throat, and they were found guilty").

I wonder how close - or even past - assault the actions of these protesters is ?

The apparent lack of concern of the authorities - be it police, or locally elected officials speaks volumes.

[Bloomed]

Would be interesting to give them a taste of their own medicine, spend some time taking photos of these protestors as they harass. And of course bring my own placard of support to those entering the clinic.

[uglyflowers]

Signed it. As someone with an abusive childhood who got pregnant to an arsehole then had to scrape up the money to fly to a different country to save myself via an abortion, these people sicken me. They have just NO idea how vulnerable these women are.

[BoreOfWhabylon]

Signed the national one.

[stitchglitched]

These women are also entitled to medical confidentiality. I've read about protestors taking photographs before. They have no right to harrass and cause alarm to people who are simply trying to access healthcare. If it was about abortion law they would protest elsewhere. They are trying to intimidate individual women into not having a legal medical procedure. It's disgusting.

[betty62]

Viking the right to free speech does not give someone a right to harass someone that they disagree with. Of course the antis have a right to protest, no one has suggested otherwise, but if as part of that protest they are causing harassment, alarm or distress to the clinic users then their protests should take place somewhere else. If you look at the wording of the petition you will see that it asks for them to be kept a distance of at least 100 metres away. That shows that their right to protest is acknowledged.

[Notreallyarsed]

No you can't, but how are they making the women trying to access the services inside the building feel? No woman is going to be dancing in there, happily looking forward to what is coming. It's a traumatic experience for the women being treated as it is, and it's bloody cruel to make it any worse.

[VikingVolva]

If they are harassing people, get the police involved.

If however they are protesting (not approaching individuals to harass them) then they have the right to free speech (and being opposed to abortion is not a form of hate speech, so would not be proscribed)

I don't think you can arrange a society on "free speech only when you agree with me" basis.

[BarbarianMum]

I have now read and signed this petition. I am generally uneasy about buffer zones at protests though and think they should be applied sparingly and in a case by case basis.

[CherryChasingDotMuncher]

Harassment is not peaceful protesting. If people were protesting a road being built would you think it peaceful to intimidate the highway workers?

Not that it's remotely comparable to people seeking life saving medical attention

[Notreallyarsed]

But it's a peaceful protest. Free speech and all that. You don't have to agree with them (I don't agree with them) but that's not a valid reason to ask them not to do it.

Free speech as PP have said, comes with responsibility. To intimidate (because that's what they're going) a woman seeking a termination is horrific. They have no idea what circumstances brought each individual to that place, no idea what each woman is going through, and have no right, NO right to judge. It's judgemental, smug and offensive.

[CherryChasingDotMuncher]

That's bloody awful about the rosary beads. Not usually into vigilante justice bug I can't say I'd shed a tear if one of those poor women gave them swift punch in the face.

[SoNouveau]

Women and girls need to be protected emotionally and physically when they are so vulnerable.
They don't need counselling or advice from these people, they get that inside the building they're going to.
I agree it's a difficult call for other protests though, needs a lot of thought.

[NoLoveofMine]

BarbarianMum firstly, some protests can have buffer zones implemented and secondly this is direct harassment of women, often vulnerable, always making difficult decisions for reasons which the protesters have no care or concern. I also don't think following women trying to thrust rosary beads at them "for the child you're killing", calling them "mum", staring at them as they walk in and out, placards with false imagery etc is much of a "peaceful protest".

[betty62]

Barbarian this really isn't about trying restrict anyone's right to protest, this is about stopping the harassment of the people using the clinic. For example, the people who stand directly at the entrance carry pink and blue rosary beads. I didn't quite get the significance of that until someone who had used the clinic told me that as she went in they asked her which colour rosary she would like for the child she was about to kill. That is not a peaceful protest, that is action intended to cause distress and so is clearly harassment (and viciously cruel)

[NoLoveofMine]

Personally I thought the ones beside the entrance were too damn close, while the ones who were by the tree opposite the entrance were at least a little more polite

I think it's all part of the intimidation. When I've been past there are always the ones at the entrance with the ones on the small green opposite staring directly at the entrance. Since they're all there together, the ones at the entrance are to directly harass women attending the clinic and the ones opposite are pointedly looking straight at them as they enter and leave. Not to mention their horrendous signs and imagery.

[BarbarianMum]

So no pickets outside the businesses on strike? No road protesters at the proposed site of a bypass, no tree protesters by the actual trees under threat? Want to protest against battery farming but no pics of hens in cages and not by the supermarket? No women at Greenham Common?

[CherryChasingDotMuncher]

Barbarian it's not a peaceful protests, and I believe when someone is having a medical procedure that the should be a no-go zone. How would you feel about animal rights protestors standing outside treatment centres where cancer sufferers are going in to?

[BarbarianMum]

So should there be a buffer zones between all peaceful protests and the thing they are protesting about then? Or only in this case? I don't like these people, i don't agree with them and i hate seeing them by clinics but as a general principle, that makes me nervous.

[SoNouveau]

Maybe we can get this thread back on track.
It's awful these people target clinics, they do have a right to protest as does everyone else but they shouldn't be allowed to target women when they're at their most vulnerable.
A buffer zone of about a mile would be most helpful but that won't happen, they should also be prohibited from trying to engage with people going in and out of the clinic and from displaying imagery that is likely to cause distress.

Please sign everyone.

[PossibiliTea]

Signed

[Majora]

(Born female and have had a baby, I just don't identify as male I should have. I have a uterus and would like to be sterilised but it's not gonna happen due to my age.)

[Majora]

The post which originally mentioned trans men was perfectly understandable and mentioned them only in passing. The comments on it have been unnecessarily unkind. Yes, trans men can get pregnant as they will have been born biologically female so yes, they will also be targeted by the people "protesting" and have every right to complain about it.

Thanks - I was just including something about myself. And I'm not FtM, but that just really complicates things more and I don't want people to start attacking me over my gender identity either, but it's important to note that trans men (FtM, people who identify as male but have a uterus and can get pregnant just as much as a woman with the same kit in her body) can get pregnant, need abortion access and get attacked for it. It happened to me.

The point is, these people are gross and are scaring vulnerable people away from getting abortions.

[MephistophelesApprentice]

Signed. I live in Ealing and walk past the clinic almost every weekend. Personally I thought the ones beside the entrance were too damn close, while the ones who were by the tree opposite the entrance were at least a little more polite, but if they've been harassing people that's unacceptable and that deserves total exclusion.