To ask what a decent guy is like?

[BlueJayBear]

In the past week, I have realised that what I thought was me realising I'm in a simply unsatisfying relationship that we were never compatible for etc, was actually an emotionally abusive one - and actually from fairly early days.

I'm leaving him - and soon - but this revelation has hit me. I've started reading around the subject and it seems that his is a classic profile, and has had a huge impact on me. It also seems that I've probably never had a healthy relationship.

I'm going to have to get some proper help when I've moved out and things start to settle because frankly, I have no idea how I will ever trust a guy again.

So I was wondering - if there was a profile for 'Normal, Loving Type' a la these 'abuser profiles' - what would it look like?

[BarbarianMum]

BuggerOff me too ! (re the abusive father/ lovely partner thing) My dsis and I have both married good guys - we both had years of training in what we didn't want, I guess. Pity our mums had to suffer.

[notagiraffe]

Not rtft, but here's stuff that I think are signs of a nice and normal man:

He wants the best for you. He supports you succeeding at the things you want to do, and doesn't take the mickey or make negative remarks (eg if you're overweight and take up running or have lousy school record but decide to go back to college)
He is on your side if people are bitchy.
He makes an effort to get to know and like your friends and family.
He celebrates good times with you: birthdays, Christmas, goals reached etc
He doesn't think women should look or behave in a certain way. He understands we're all individuals.
He does his fair share around the house and with the DC.
He doesn't have one rule for himself and another for you (eg. he's not endlessly off to lads weekends away because he works 'hard and deserves it,' while you're stuck home 24/7 with tiny DC who don't sleep through
When you're ill he makes soup
When you're shattered he runs you a bath
When you've had a rough day he pours wine/brews tea and hugs you

My DH has Asperger's and a lot of this stuff doesn't come naturally to him, so I had to explain over and over why it was important. But he wanted to learn and he does try. And he adores me and the DC. And is tirelessly kind and romantic. That's the bottom line, I think. You just know when they want the best for you.

[KindDogsTail]

Well done for getting out and I so hope you will find someone you can trust in the future.

Counselling for yourself will probably help a lot. There need to be natural boundaries, a sense of self and others. It is quite possible you have had a difficult childhood where these things weren't present and where the only role models you had were treating each other badly - and possible treating you badly too, or perhaps one of them was kind but smothering, leaving you with a confused sense of where you ended and they began.

[BlueJayBear]

Bertie that link is really insightful, thanks for sharing.

Weirdly, I had a freak out the other day as he texted me and used my name. The freak out was because, in the 6+ years we've been together, he's never called me by my name.

[BertieBotts]

This is a pretty good summary:
www.hiddenhurt.co.uk/Mr_wrong_and_Mr_right.html

I think it's also important to look at what a good man is like when things go wrong or you are having a bad day. It's easy to look at the good bits, and think that the bad parts of an abusive partner are normal reactions to stress, but they're not. When a supportive partner is having a bad day they don't take it out on you. They might look to you for support (they should!) but they won't treat you badly because of it. If they are angry with you about something they will approach that constructively. They tell you what the problem is (even if it takes them some time to do so) because they want you to fix it, not because they want you to feel bad. They might deal with anger in different ways but they won't make you feel intimidated, threatened or fearful.

But yes, I think the biggest thing is just feeling like you're equals and that they consider you a partner in the true sense of the word. This was the hardest thing to get my head around and now I'm on the other side, it's hard to get my head around how I could have thought relationships could exist without this! It's just absolutely zero tolerance now, I couldn't cope with a relationship without it.

[NoMorePercyPigs]

I am in same boat as you Blue although not as far along as I can't bring myself round to the idea of leaving yet - even though I know that's what I would tell anyone else to do

So no real advice but just wanted to say you aren't alone

I think what scares me and worries me is my DH has lots of these 'nice' characteristics that posters are mentioning on this thread, it makes me doubt myself. But then it's so at odds with the other side of him.

[WhooooAmI24601]

I don't think there's a definite type. A huge amount of it for me was that I had stopped being a dick when I met (now) DH, so he was just the right fit for me. Had I met him a few years earlier we'd never have got together let alone been married with children.

For me the defining factor about DH which makes me know (hope) that he's a good bloke, one who wouldn't shit on our family, is that he treats everyone respectfully. It doesn't matter if it's the window cleaner, a child's mate come to tea, a CEO of a company he's entertaining, everyone is the same. He grew up hugely privileged and could have turned out an utter bellend. But he's good through and through and has nothing but kind words for and about everyone. He has flaws but, ultimately, is such a good man that they're outweighed.

A few years ago a partner in his company attempted to do him out of tens of thousands of pounds and it all got quite nasty with solicitors and whatnot involved. Through it all, DH behaved with dignity while I silently wished the rains of hell fire on the guy. DH was furious, of course, but at a recent event to do with his business he came across the ex partner. I was there, too, and watched with baited breath to see if DH would finally erupt and massacre the bellend for attempting to do so much damage to his business. DH walked past, acknowledged him and kept his head high while the man tried to make conversation. I wanted to take my shoe off and beat the guy to death with it. DH smiled and laughed and the guy was clearly uncomfortable and left early. I've never known anyone quite like DH for keeping his cool when I'd be losing my shit. That's a good man.

[JellyBelli]

I recommend the book The gift Of Fear by Gavin de Becker. In it he explains the concept of pre incident indicators and calculating probabilities.
For example, if you see more than 3 PINS for violence, the probability of a violent episode happening within 7 days goes up to over 90%.

There are ways to spot the compliance tests that some abusers use, to see how compliant you are, while they are still masking their real intent.
I take people at face value until I see a compliance test or other issue.

[MrsDesireeCarthorse]

You've almost answered your own question. A decent guy has decency. He has it the same way you would, although you may be very different people and decent men come in all varieties. A few qualities of a decent person - kind, trustworthy, loyal, has integrity and a heart.

I think decency can be very under-rated, or mistakenly seen as boring. It's a very quiet virtue for all its strength.

[Dutch1e]

• He makes kind jokes instead of cruel ones.
  
• He sends you to bed when you're sick and doesn't behave as if he can't work a washing machine or care for your children
  
• If you make a massive gaff you want to call him, not hide it from him
  
• A argument is when you both want to hear how to make the other person feel better, or when you just get it off your chest and trust that it will be OK
  
• You both try really hard to give each other a sleep-in or a night out with friends
  
• As said earlier, he speaks respectfully about exes
  
• You like him (not just love him, that's the easy bit)
  
• He likes you and you feel it

[TorchesTorches]

Agree with Eolian about being treated like a princess being a red flag for me. I think it's about mutual respect and trust, not one person being on a pedestal or being special in some way. Its both putting each other first, but in a low key, day to day way (ie making the other person a cup of tea).

[minipie]

Fab post by Reality here

[minipie]

I would say a lot is about how you feel around them

• You don't feel nervous about voicing your opinion or disagreeing with him
  

• You don't feel embarrassed about the way he treats you or feel the need to make excuses for him
  

• You feel better when he is around, rather than better when he's not
  

• You feel you can be yourself rather than having to pretend
  

• You feel equal to him

[Prawnofthepatriarchy]

A good partner "sees" you, really sees you: as a fully rounded human being, as an equal with tastes and interests of your own. In a committed relationship, a nice man will never give you cause for fear or distrust. The qualities I look for are kindness, integrity and humour. Kindness is by far the most important quality in anyone.

There are plenty of good men around. However people tend to repeat patterns. If you find yourself attracting bastard after bastard, best go into counselling to examine "unlearning" bad patterns. It's not your fault, but it is your responsibility, iyswim.

[IDreamOfPeace]

OP, sorry you've been part of an abusive relationship. I hope things get better for you and you find a man who treats you how you want and deserve to be

A 'decent' man is many things to many women, but I would describe one like this:

He respects you, your wishes, opinions and loved ones.
He never orders you around, tells you what to do, or demands anything of you.
He never tries to control what you wear, where you go, what you spend or who you see.
He would never insult you or belittle you.
He would never threaten you in any way shape or form.
He will never blackmail you or guilt you into things.
If you disagree on something then he'll discuss it with you rather than argue over it or shout at you about it.
He's loyal.
He tells you he cares for you/ loves you every day.
He asks you every day how you are and how your day has been, because he cares.
He compliments you.
He values everything you do for him and tries to do the same for you in return.
He works hard to make you smile every day, even if it's doing silly things that seem trivial.

Of course this works both ways and a decent woman is expected to treat any man they're with in the same way. It all comes down to respecting each other and working as a team. Your a couple after all, not one person there to serve the needs of the other.

[ShowMePotatoSalad]

KatharinaRosalie - really good post. This is so important...it's a big warning sign if the person you are with changes when you are around other people/in public as opposed to just you two/in private.

[KatharinaRosalie]

In our household, there is nothing going on behind closed doors. We treat each other the same as we would when there are other people around, the kindness and respect are not a show.

[BlueJayBear]

Thanks - this is giving me hope! I look at the guys my sisters are with - one dotes on her and is very kind and seems genuine but you never know what goes on behind closed doors.

Outwardly, my OH comes across okay - although he's never been that keen around my family... but it's the stuff that goes on out of sight that is hardest - and the most damaging.

I think the test will be looking for future red flags - and hoping they become apparent before things get serious, or before moving in. It's so hard. It's genuinely mind-blowing that there are decent guys out there.

[paulapantsdown]

Sometimes he can be a knob - and so can I! Sometimes he can be irritating/annoying/grumpy - and so can I!

A good / respectful partnership is one where you care about each other and don't deliberately hurt each other, and if you do, then you say sorry and mean it.

My DH is my partner and comrade, we don't always agree, but we have each other's back against the world. We would never put each other down in front of others, or be spiteful or mean to one another. This does not mean we don't have healthy, air clearing ding dongs now and again!

[TrueBlueYorkshire]

You could probably sum it up in four words. Easy going and caring.

[MrsTerryPratchett]

I think it's worth talking to them about their friends, relatives and past relationships. A man who talks kindly and affectionately about his DM, DSis, past girlfriends and female friends (without being overly invested in them) is normally a good bloke.

Certainly DH was taught how to be a decent human by his DM and DSis and, even with a narc DF, he is a good 'un.

[Artandco]

Most men are not like that imo. The majority rather than minority are genuine

[ShowMePotatoSalad]

An ex boyfriend of mine (who was abusive) was:

• Controlling. Told me what I could and couldn't wear, who I could see, asked me where I was all the time
  

• Overly-sensitive. Would take offense at the most minor things. I had to watch how I spoke around him as the tiniest thing would set him off. I constantly treaded on eggshells to avoid upsetting him.
  

• Hypocritical. He could speak to other women but I wasn't allowed to speak to other men.
  

• Creepy. He was such a creep - wanted to turn me into his "ideal woman"...wanted me to go and get tattoos, piercings, dye my hair, dress a certain way, just to please him and what his fantasies were. (I didn't do any of that btw).
  

• Manipulative. Used to constantly use emotional blackmail and manipulations to get me to do what he wanted.
  

My current partner is:

• Easy-going.
  

• Trusting. Doesn't constantly text or call me, doesn't ask where I am all the time.
  

• Loving. Compliments me, cuddles me, tells me he loves me without it being a control thing (ex used to say he loved me but only because he wanted to hear it back).
  

• Uncontrolling. Doesn't tell me to dress or act a certain way. Accepts me for who I am. Doesn't have an issue with me having male friends.
  

Also he wouldn't know how to manipulate me if he tried. It's just know who he is.

[Freedom2016]

The chaacteristics and behaviours that are important for me have already been mentioned

Kindness
Respect
Honesty
Loyalty
Working as a team and supporting each other

[Eolian]

I think sometimes that the nasty abusive side of some men is the flip-side of the treating you like a princess, putting you on a pedestal side. For some men, women are never equals but need putting in their place (either by being patronised and prettified or by being shouted down and abused). For me, being 'treated like a princess' would be a big red flag. It's not a normal or realistic way to be treated.

A normal loving partner is just like any other decent person (friend, family member etc). They treat you kindly and decently. And as a partner they share responsibilities and decision making. They speak in a civilised way to you, don't shout or call you names, are supportive about your problems, ambitions and efforts in life. They don't seek to undermine you or stop you doing things you enjoy or seeing people you like. They don't belittle your opinions.