To be so angry with nursery

[Rockingaround]

Hi all,
Not sure what to do, I only know that I'm so angry but not sure if I'm overreacting.

DS just turned 4 last weekend. I picked DS from his nursery (within primary school) yesterday. He started in September after being at pre school, his session is 8.45-11.45. His former and current teachers have said he's a really good boy, good at listening and following the rules etc

Anyway, at pick-up he was balling his eyes out, snotty, gasping - in a right state, in all honesty I have never seen him this upset.

One of the nursery staff said " We were making biscuits and none of the children ate a smartie except for DS so Miss X has decided he is not allowed a biscuit because of it".

After DS had calmed down he told me he'd eaten a smartie. They told him he wasn't allowed to eat it but he carried on making his biscuit. Only at the end of the session when they were filling out the biscuits did they say he wasn't allowed to take his home because he'd eaten a smartie. I asked if they'd warned him that would happen if he ate a smartie and he said no.

I couldn't speak to them at that moment as I was so angry, I'm thinking g of writing a letter....? What would you do?

I'm doing his birthday party today but I'll check back in later. Thank you

[Blondeshavemorefun]

Glad you had a chat op and feel happier

Sounds like she agrees she over reacted - and I don't think she is the ogre many have made her out to be

But like womble I wonder if your ds has ever been told off and how he reacts ?

[CarShare]

It sounds like the conversation was productive and the OP found the opportunity to advocate for her son worthwhile. I disagree she was simply humouring the OP. If she was, and is unable to have a sensible conversation with a concerned parent, that reflects badly on her- not the OP.

[petitpois55]

Well said Wombat One of the things I was uncomfortable with was the name calling and general demonising of the TA on this thread. Calling her mean spiteful, not fit to work with children etc is IMO over the top and hysterical. It can lead to a climate of fear and harassment aimed at individuals, as we've seen recently with the situation in the U.S with the class play.
I still think the staff member handled the situation correctly, and from what the OP related

in the conversation she had with her it sounds to me like she thought she was doing the right thing, and was simply humouring the OP. I'm glad Miss X didn't back down.

[Bettercallsaul1]

Well said, Wombat! You are definitely the peacemaker on this thread - and you make a lot of excellent points.

[Aeroflotgirl]

Letting a very young child bake his cookie and saying he can't have it at the end, seems too harsh and not good at all.

[ChocolateWombat]

Well, I'm glad you feel it was worth going in and it's all went much better than expected.
You say you were surprised when she agreed with you over something.....don't be surprised. You are actually on the same side and trying to achieve the same thing. Teachers don't always dig their heels in and insist every single thing they did was right or couldn't have been done differently.

I agree that children at this age often cry when they are in trouble - their reaction is sometimes to seem devastated by a reproving comment, whatever the tone or however it is said. Their devastation isn't always a sign that they have been harshly treated. And most of us have seen this reaction at home, huge huge upset, when we pick them up on something and they are in trouble.....because they do t like being in trouble and they like having their own way....it's how they are. OP says her son hasn't been in trouble before. Not quite sure what this means, but hopefully it doesn't mean he's never been told 'no' before or picked up on behaviour, or never seen consequences of actions before. And by this, I don't mean harsh horrible words or scolding or long drawn out punishments, but a constructive and firm word when required. It's the children who have never had boundaries or been picked up and followed through with, regarding behaviour at home, that particularly respond poorly to being picked up on things at school. This little lad is so small, that I'm sure his response to being in trouble was entirely normal and not a response to never having had any kind of boundaries or consequences before....but it is an issue with some children.
And one other thing that this makes me think of too, is how did OP react to events in front of her son? My approach has always been to sympathise with child, to remind them gently of what they did wrong,mbut to avoid direct criticism of the teacher in front of them (even if I feel it and need to go in and have a word) because they need to know that we support the teacher and that when they are in school again, the teachers position hasn't been undermined by our parental criticism.

All of this is a learning experience is put it....it's children learning how to manage in a group situation and where there are rules. It's a learning experience for parents who are having to let go and allow someone else's rules to be in place, rather than their own.

[ChaircatMiaow]

Well done OP. You stayed calm and handled the situation very well. Hats off to you

[Aeroflotgirl]

I bet she was sat there in the staff room scoffing those smarties.,I hate the way government and education expect very young children to be like mini adults.

[Aeroflotgirl]

She really does not know much about child development, and that children develop at different rates, some 4 year olds might have good impulse control, others might not. It's a smartie ffs, not an entire tray of cookies. Hell even some adults have bad impulse control like me and Maltesers.

[Aeroflotgirl]

Well done op, she sounds like she's on some kind of a power trip, and really does not know much about child development as she would think! He's a preschooler fgs, not a 14 year old. I remember when I was 13 at school, I ate half the cake mixture, I still baked my cake and kept it fgs! He's 4 not 14!

[BlackeyedSusan]

... and I worked with children and it is not surprising a smartie was eaten.. ffs it was difficult enough for me as the teacher not to eat the smarties.

some schools have become very harsh.

[CarShare]

Well done OP. I get flustered with these kind of things too- it's great you made your point and stayed calm.

[BakeOffBiscuits]

That went well

Let's hope she thinks twice next time she decides to "punish" a child so harshly. Also lets hope she's madly googling "impulse control in 4year olds" because she clearly does not have a clue.

[Rockingaround]

Oh and I mentioned that in terms of the smartie, 3&4 yr olds can't be expected to have strong impulse control and that I wasn't surprised a smartie was eaten ... She replied that she had studied child development and that she disagreed ...and I duly bit my tongue

[Helloitsme87]

Haha what an overreaction from the nursery. I would have been fuming too. He's a kid. Put that stuff under their noses and they're gonna try and chance it. FYI I'm a prenachool teacher and we made chocolate biscuits. ALL my kids attempted to eat the sprinkles. It happens

[Rockingaround]

Hi all, yes I went in this morning.

Miss X said that as they were putting the biscuits in the oven DS are a smartie. She said that she is very strict because she has to be and that she has 30 other children to consider.

I said that I appreciate that, although I believe a natural consequence would've worked better, if she'd have just removed a smartie from his biscuit so he had one less, rather than confiscating what he'd made. I said that I although I appreciate he shouldn't have eaten a smartie, the punishment didn't fit the crime and that it was too harsh, my DS felt embarrassed and I felt that it was spiteful.

She replied saying she wasn't spiteful, I said the act was, even if it wasn't her intention. I also said that I felt I had to advocate for my son and I had to tell her I thought the incident was dealt with disproportionately as his mother, I needed to communicate these things in order to keep the lines of communication open.


Surprisingly she agreed she could've given him one less smartie on his biscuit and that she could see how it would appear too harsh to me. I also asked her to consider the impact it'd had on my son as he's never been in trouble before.

I felt I had to raise the issue as we were not happy; she did listen and consider my gripe, although she remained her stance that she had to manage the whole class... I felt good that I stayed calm. I obvs didn't expect her to apologise but felt I had spoken up on behalf of my son and fought his corner. It went much better than I expected.

[LuluNTutu]

My DS is the same age and I would be speaking to the teacher about this. The nursery sounds unbelievably harsh. Good luck with getting it sorted.

[Blondeshavemorefun]

What happened op? Did you talk to teacher? What was her version?

[ChocolateWombat]

Well OP, I'm glad you had calmed down by last night and were able to see that going in calmly to just see what had happened was a good idea. A fact finding mission which is calmly conducted normally delivers better results than going in critically and shouting the odds.

It would be good to hear their response. So many of these threads where the OP says eventually they will go in and find out some info and report back, never result in report backs. Seems to me that often on further investigation, the staff are able to throw light on what happened and events often weren't quite as first reported, and nowhere near as extreme or outrageous. However, after many many posters have shrieked 'unreasonable, outrageous' and sometimes demanded that people be sacked, reported to social services or other extreme actions, even before the full story has been heard, perhaps OPs feel a bit embarrassed to return and say it all turned out to be far less exciting and outrageous.

Normally what transpires is events weren't as extreme as first seemed. There has been some kind of misunderstanding. Staff did not intend to cause upset and their actions seem more reasonable once the full story is known. They happily apologise if child was upset, but also explain the reasoning behind their actions and approach to the situation....which appears much more sensible than on first glance without all the facts....and the OP and child move forward. Occasionally it appears that yes, someone was cruel and nasty to the child and occasionally further action is needed....but it is occasional, not the norm, which Inalways think is worth remembering, when as parents something happens and we want to make a knee jerk reaction. Usually best to take a deep breath, consider further and gather more info if needed, BEFORE getting outraged.

Anyway, hope for OP and son that this too turns out not to be the big deal, so many people seem to think it is.

[BakeOffBiscuits]

Did you manage to speak to anyone today Rocking?

[Bettercallsaul1]

There was a certain amount of irony (and hyperbole) in my post, petitpois55! Perhaps look at your own sense of humour before posting such unpleasant comments?

[petitpois55]

She's never recovered Better Perhaps, you need to teach her some resilience. The amount of drama queens on this thread is fucking funny.

[Bettercallsaul1]

Stony of name and stony of heart, Sobee61.

My daughter has never recovered from getting the stripes on her bee "wrong" at nursery, when she was four. She painted the ones that were supposed to be black yellow and vice versa. The (obnoxious) TA reacted as if it were deliberate vandalism!

[SooBee61]

He may have just not heard. I remember still on my first day at primary school not hearing the teacher say we were only to use 4 colours on the front of our rough books. I used lots of crayons and got my hand hit with a ruler (yes, that far back) for my pains. Never forgotten it. I hated that woman from that day - I remember her name, Miss Stone.

[WeatherwaxOrOgg]

And Gonzales, I agree and my daughter was distraught.