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AIBU?

Is my boss BU, or am I?

38 replies

RubyWho · 06/11/2016 08:29

Hello,

Long time lurker, but have been around a while, not a bridge dweller etc.

I started a new job about two months ago. Same industry I've always worked in, but a significant promotion from my previous role.

The issue I have is with my boss, and his form for asking me to sort things out which are impossible (it's all very Devil Wears Prada). One of the things involves arranging formal meetings in an organisation which never has free meeting rooms to book (there aren't any), and involving people who have packed schedules/are on leave.
If I point out that this is proving impossible to sort, he cuts me off and says "you sort it".
I can't sort it. This is the fifth morning in a row I've woken up with extreme anxiety about it. He seems to think I can, for whatever reason, magic rooms, and free schedules, out of now where.

The actual detail of my work, which isn't booking rooms, is fine and I have the experience to complete it. It's just this.
Additional details: we don't have a union rep, I'm not part of a union, haven't passed my probation.
I'm planning to meet with him tomorrow and say I've tried but what he wants is impossible, what would HE do so I know what to do next time?

Can I be sacked for failing at this? Although not an actual failure, it is in his eyes.
The anxiety and stress is starting to make me really ill (I have an anxiety disorder anyway)
Is this normal boss behaviour or is he BU?
Previous bosses have expected the same but did at least accept "i can't force someone to cancel everything in their schedule" with good grace...

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mammybops · 06/11/2016 11:37

I've had a few bosses like this.

My approach has always been:

  1. Acknowledge why the exact solution they've asked for isn't possible
  2. Outline best case solution with time/cost/compliance implications
  3. Outline alternative solutions as per point 2
  4. Tell them it's their decision which option to use but you will complete all the actions required
  5. Follow up the decision on email


With compliance/governance issues we tend to place the responsibility to attend on the recipients making clear if they do not or fail to book onto an alternative session it will be seen as a governance failure from them personally which may have future role/contract implications.

Good luck!
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blueshoes · 06/11/2016 11:06

Since you say your boss is otherwise lovely, he probably just thinks this is admin and wants you to 'sort it out' i.e present him with options rather than expect you to do the impossible.

If you need to call a meeting at short notice with many people with busy schedules, then it requires a LOT of legwork. You can feel better that you already have future meetings booked in the schedule but this one will be time-consuming and you will have to accept that and take it on the chin. It is a one-off.

I am sure he knows it is a difficult task. It is your chance to shine with your boss, not to say it is impossible to do. Since you are still on probation, it is a suicide mission for you to say you cannot do it and push the problem back onto him. Even if he is unreasonable, you sound senior enough that he would expect you to present solutions (with varying levels of closeness to optimal). You have already sussed out many of them. Now just organise your research - see him for 5 mins and get his thoughts.

In terms of availability, you need to call the most important participants or their secretaries to check their true availability, as another poster said. You will have to explain how important this (first) meeting is and can they move things around if necessary. I have had people dial in from holiday locations before. At the same time, ask for a range of dates/times from them. See if you can map out another date where the other important participants can do. If there is one, one option is for your boss and chair to move to that date.

The location thing is easily sorted - re: external location. That should not be an issue.

If this is the first meeting for a new governance structure that you were brought in to implement, do not underestimate the need to get people's buy-in. This regular meeting is just one of the things they would rather not do but you are changing their behaviours. Convince them why this meeting is important, speak to them in advance, put your name/voice in front of them. Tell them a little about your role whilst you are at it. Create a personal connection and some chit chat. It is amazing how a little social personal grease will make it easier for you to open doors in the future.

For the meeting itself, make sure it is well set up (check IT, slides, set up dial ins in advance), has an agenda, materials circulated in soft copy ahead of time and hard copies and refreshments at the meeting. Have a little informal chat to your boss ahead of it how he wants it run, who opens it and speaks and when. It will not run to clockwork (which is the nature of meetings) but at least you can sound reasonably slick as a team at the start.

Good luck. I am feeling excited for you!

PS I was hired into a newly created role at my current employer to create governance and change behaviours and so speak with some hard earned experience.

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notapizzaeater · 06/11/2016 11:04

Can you not just invite them to the meeting - stressing how important it is and let them tell him why they can't come ? I had a meeting request come through last week when I was already booked for something else but this one was more important so I shuffled the other one.

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Sunshineonacloudyday · 06/11/2016 10:59

Can you not set up a meeting room outside of the work office. A meeting room in a hotel?

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Sunshineonacloudyday · 06/11/2016 10:58

He doesn't sound very organised and he's your boss. Why not get the room first and then tell everyone the date. That makes more sense.

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LookMoreCloselier · 06/11/2016 10:54

If the dates are set by him then fine, just book it for those dates, it really isn't your problem that he has set the dates which look unavailable for people, bear in mind that people might have things in their calendar that are no longer going ahead, are not as important etc etc. If you can choose the time and can see their schedule then obviously where possible pick the best time overall. Wrt rooms, you will have to either go off site if there is a budget for this (in my company it is disallowed), OR contact the people who have suitable rooms booked in your company and ask them if their meeting is still going ahead/can be rescheduled as you need it for XYZ very important thing.

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RubyWho · 06/11/2016 10:24

Thanks everyone for your responses. I'll reply in full later (about to embark on a long tube journey with the DCs!)

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category12 · 06/11/2016 10:20

You're just going to have to come up with a couple of venues (plus costs) and a couple of best-availability dates. Have him agree the venue & date, send out the invites - it's on on them to accept or decline.

You cannot strong-arm people into a room and it's their responsibility to come back with alternatives/explanations if it's impossible for them to shift things round if it's that important they attend.

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Ginmakesitallok · 06/11/2016 10:19

Re the rooms - can you check with whoever has booked the room for the proposed meeting date whether they actually need it, whether you can help them find somewhere else? If not then you'll have to go external.

For folk who can't make it - do the standing orders allow for deputes? Not much you can do if they are on holiday, but if it's a meetings clash have you spoken to them directly to see if they can change things?

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FinderofNeedles · 06/11/2016 10:15

Definitely make sure you talk to other PAs about what these unavailable people are doing at the time the meeting needs to be held. Are they really unavailable? I know someone who has the weekly fire alarm test in her diary, marked 'busy' - she has no involvement in this but if you couldn't see the subject of the meeting you might think she was genuinely unavailable! I also know several people who never remove 'cancelled' meetings from their diaries. So you need to talk to people who know their actual movements: many important people will be invited to meetings they rarely attend.

Also, have you made it very clear what YOUR meeting is for? Hopefully if the importance of the meeting is clear, they will rearrange their own diaries and, for those who will be genuinely unavailable, they should delegate to someone who is free to attend to represent them. That bit's not up to you. Agree with those who say ask your boss to rank the attendees in order of importance and work from there.

I know how frustrating this is. When you can find a way through it, your boss will be well impressed!

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Trifleorbust · 06/11/2016 10:15

You need to be quite firm with people and say: this meeting is a business obligation and you may need to juggle other commitments. If you say it bluntly enough they may well fall in line. I would ask my boss for his authority to be this firm with people. Then if they still 'can't' do the times you have allocated months in advance, you need to present this as their performance issue, not yours.

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PuppyMonkey · 06/11/2016 10:15

The only thing that worked when I was in a similar org was set dates arranged really far in advance. Invites go out via outlook calendar type thing (with an accept, decline response) but with a "we expect you to attend this is extremely important" type warning.

And just book a room somewhere local to you - you'd get discount maybe if it was going to be a regular thing -and hand boss the details/costings. If he goes off on one about it, ask what alternative he could suggest.

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RubyWho · 06/11/2016 10:09

Dates are set by my boss and the chair. As long as they can do them, everyone is expected to jump to it

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PaulDacresConscience · 06/11/2016 10:05

Agree with the others - managers like this respond well to solutions. They are task focussed and get a bit of tunnel vision at times. So try presenting him with an alternative. I can't give you X but we can do Y instead.

If you use Outlook then you can use the scheduling assistant to tell you when everyone is free. Can the meeting happen off-site? If there is a Starbucks near you then they often have rooms which can be booked for private meetings.

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stonecircle · 06/11/2016 09:58

How are you looking for dates? Do you have access to staff diaries? If not, ask their PAs to give you this. Then when looking for dates you can see if an existing appointment looks like something that could be rearranged.

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Zazz101 · 06/11/2016 09:57

If it was me, I would do everything via email. Just in case you need to have proof of anything....

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RubyWho · 06/11/2016 09:50

Yes albatross; so frustrating that I could scream.

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RubyWho · 06/11/2016 09:46

Weird thing is...in other respects, my boss is lovely to me. We have to deal with a lot of sensitive issues, some I find very triggering due to my personal circumstances, and he is extremely accommodating and understanding. he knows I have very bad anxiety and that it's particularly bad at the moment, as I have disclosed my anxiety disorder to him; for information rather than for concession and he couldn't have handled it better. It makes stuff like this even worse as I know he's not an arse all the time!

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Albadross · 06/11/2016 09:45

I was going to suggest a call too. My old boss used to keep saying "speak to other PAs - they must have a special way to book rooms". There wasn't. There was one system, no secret clubs.

Isn't it annoying that you have present people like this with solutions just to pander to their inflexibility. Maybe they just need to learn to be less of an arse!

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RubyWho · 06/11/2016 09:40

More answers.

Trying not to out myself here.

It's a new governance structure which has not previously been in place. Myself (and my three direct reports, none of this relates to their job though so falls on me) were recruited to oversee and implement a formal structure in the organisation.
We knew these meetings would be coming up but my manager only finalised the dates maybe ten days ago? The next three we have set in stone at various points in the future.
No predecessor unfortunately, role was specifically created for me. The previous secretary to events like this would very often put their foot down, say it couldn't be done and leave it to my boss to sort. They're still in the company as they occupy a role outside of my department. Boss has said the attitude of "there's no room, it can't be done" is not good enough.

Apologies for drip feeding and is confusing. Shit like this takes up so much of my time at work that I can't get on with my actual job, which I was trained to do and which I am good at!!! We both need assistants but I don't think this will happen for another year or so.

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happypoobum · 06/11/2016 09:36

I think you have already had some good advice here.

As your boss has already told you to look into hiring rooms I think you should do that (just some quick email investigations and a couple of phone calls) and present him with the costs. If you go back to him asking for a budget it looks a bit lame, like you should have asked him when he suggested it.

I agree that you need to set up a schedule, up to a year in advance, asking people to prioritise these meetings. Can subs be sent? Ask boss if that is an option so that the meetings are quorate and meet governance issues.

If you have an email trail of what you have done then he will have to accept that it isn't working. Maybe the people you are asking to attend would be more likely to acquiesce if the invitation came from his email address rather than yours?

I am sure it's not you - don't let this affect your anxiety, it's honestly not worth it. You may even find that he accepts what you say, so don't lose sleep over it. Flowers

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stonecircle · 06/11/2016 09:30

Also agree you need to offer a range of solutions. If they are governance meetings why aren't they set a year in advance?

Ask him if you can set dates for regular meetings to avoid this happening in the future. Better to cancel a meeting nearer the time if it's not needed than try and find dates and a venue at short notice.

Start exploring external venues now!!!! Don't wait for him to give you a budget. If you've already sussed venues out, next time he asks you you can quickly ring them to see which are available. Just tell him what the cost will be and ask him if he'll authorise it.

Don't worry about getting everyone there. Find a date most people can do and set it. Work out who the most important people are - external members and the most senior staff?

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user1471545174 · 06/11/2016 09:19

Ugh, people like this are just ludicrous. Where a situation is actually impossible, like when someone is going to be on holiday, explain the reality calmly and ask him who would be a good alternate for that person. Stay very calm and don't let him push your buttons. Have a reasoned answer and explanation. Stand your ground if he is really being awful; bullies look for people to back down as evidence of their unfitness to live. If you keep a good front he will at least have to respect that.

If this work isn't part of your actual job can you ask HR why he doesn't have an assistant to handle his logistical work?

I'd be taking notes already, I'm afraid, and looking for something else if it is already making you ill. I've been there more than once so Flowers

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rubybleu · 06/11/2016 09:17

Ask him to prioritise attendees.

I do a bit of project management in my role but my secretary handles my diary. If I ever ask her to set up a meeting of more than 3-4 people, I tell her who is essential, who is nice to have & who can be substituted in (e.g. deputy rather than head of department) to make it clear who to prioritise.

If you are setting up governance meetings surely these are planned 6-12 months in advance?

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DinosaursRoar · 06/11/2016 09:16

Agree with people like this you give them solutions, not problems, or you make it clear you are on top of it, so Monday, you ask to see your boss, explain you are finding it hard to get the group together with short notice, so how regularly do these meetings need to be booked in, every X number of weeks? You will start coordinating January/February/march meetings now, as it'll be easier to cancel the time in their schedules/meeting rooms closer to the date than fit stuff in. Make it look like you have acknowledged the problem and are finding a long term solution, in the short term you are "paying" for your predecessor's failure to do this, but from 2017 onwards this will be fine....

Your boss might wait until they need the meeting to schedule it, no reason for you to.

Agree in the meantime, give them options like "I can get x,y, and z at a meeting on Wednesday or a,b and z on Thursday, which would you prefer? I don't have the authority to cancel leave, it will have to come from you if that's happening."

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