To be nosy? (Shameless post)

[StandingLikeATRex]

I'm a long time a lurker and a recent poster.

Myself and DH are young (late 20's) (trainee) professionals. We are still at the very early stage of our careers, (think work experience, cups of tea, applying for placements) he is retraining and I've been working up.
We've been chatting about buying our first home together and how much we can afford, we've realised this is not very much. It's disheartening to know that I may never be able to afford the type of home/life that I want.
We aren't from traditionally professional families (working class) and don't know too many wealthy people.
So....I'm curious to know what sorts of careers people go into (it doesn't have to be you) how long does it take to get to a comfortable salary, what do wealthy people do? And how do they become wealthy? (Haha please don't send me those earn £,000,000's at home links)

Shall I retrain as my job has a ceiling and I will never earn 6 figures, what should I do, what would give me the best chances?

I've also been asked by a family friend to give advice on university courses that lead to good jobs. none. and that got me thinking more about this.

Don't wipe the floor with me please

[nilbyname]

My DH is just shy of 6 figures and although I have a professional qualification and experience I work in a lower down ring of the ladder for work life balance.

DH works around 50-70 hours a week and is often away. He us repairable for big budgets, profit and loss in the millions and has people report into him. It's is stressful. My job whilst satisfying has very little stress and I'm there in the morning and afternoons for the kids. my career (through choice) is much less important to me and I can do all
The parenting/caring/social stuff I enjoy far more.

If we both had high powered careers we would also have a nanny and that's not for us.

We have a nice life, holidays away, meals out, nice things should we want them.

I'm in education and DH is in green futures. He did geography at uni, then travelled a lot and thought he was a hippy Eco warrior! The pounced about a bit more. He didn't start in his profession until he was 30 and went from £24k to almost 6 figures in ten years. He works really bloody hard, he is hungry for it and is constantly networking, innovating, "out there" in his field and has become a Well known and respected "thought leader" and he loves what he does.

I may up my career game in 5 years but have no burning desire to do so.

We live in the SW and have a home around the £400k mark. It's our forever home. Pension pot is ok, but we need to address that!

I've said this on the other thread, a stable home life has permitted DH and I to really pursue what we did with a loving and sometimes financial safety net from both sets of parents as we were growing up.

[emsyj]

Have PM'd you ginorwine.

[QueenLizIII]

The hardest workers in this country earn the least no doubt about it.

Yup.

Most of my friends are professionals all of us either lawyers or doctors. None of us are rich and only one that I know of owns their own flat: a tiny one bed in London which they have to work extra locums at weekends to be able to pay the mortgage comfortably.

[WhatWouldCoachBombayDo]

Surely what you want from life is more important than a salary amount?

Me and DP earn jointly about £35k, we have a small 97k 3 bedroom terrace house with garden, we have a holiday abroad each year and a 2 year old. DP is in the armed forces and I work part time in the charting sector. We both enjoy our careers.

So no, not massive earners and live a modest but comfortable lifestyle. We're happy and that's worth more than the rat run of chasing money. We're also in our mid twenties.

[WhatWouldCoachBombayDo]

*charity

[smellsofelderberries]

I have had this conversation with my DH many times. He has a good, solid career. Very high earning potential. Slightly wrenching to know that someone in his position 15-20 years ago would have afforded us very comfortable living (Ann ice little house almost anywhere in London and probably kids at public school). Our reality now is that we live in a flat in a deprived part of London, save very little every month and forget private schools, simply because wages have become so depressed compared to housing prices. Unlike our parents who could sit in the same company and get promoted every few years as a matter of course, our generation have to work smart. Hop up the ladder from company to company as promotions are so stagnant within companies. It's frustrating as buggery.

At 30 (me) and 35 (DH), we are starting to realise we have been sold a dream that doesn't exist (work hard in a good job after a good education and you'll do a little better than your parents did). We are much more skilled/earn more than our parents did at our ages, and are worse off. But thems the breaks. I want to cry when I think about what our future children could be up against

[GinIsIn]

I'm afraid I'm going to echo what smellsofelderberries just said - between us we take home £100k and it just covers our bills, travel, mortgage on our little terraced house and an ok but by no means extravagant life. Our children will not be able to go to private school, we cannot afford for me to be a SAHM, and we certainly can't afford holidays or comfortable savings.

[MammouthTask]

Just wanted to add one thing following a comment from a PP saying that the ones who made it are the one who chose their career and then stuck at it and worked hard.

DH did did exactely that. He is now at a managerial position (sounds good doen't it?) earning £40k a year.
I didn't do that at all. I had a similar degree, was made redundant, children blabla and decided to retrain when I was in my mid 30s. I now have 'started all again' but I'm actualy earning the same hourly wage than DH (less money because I'm choosing not to as many hours).

I do think that when it comes to money, the first thing to do is a budget though. With that, then you can actually really evaluate where you are going, how to invest/save money/buy a property to do up etc... You can have a look at your goals and see how you can achieve them.
Just going from 'work harder/longer hours and hope for the best' wouldn't be my first choice.

I agree with smell about the dream we have been sold, the fact it's harder now for people to settle down, buy a house etc.. Than even 15 years ago. That it's not because you have the nicest, most flashy degree that you will earn very good money.

But we also have been sold the idea that we need always more and more. Consumerism pushes us to think we always need/want more. It's worth remembering this is not makes one happy.

[EllsTeeth]

All so true smellsofelderberries. Had the same conversation with my DH. Most of my friends are professionals and only a very few can afford the lifestyle our parents had.

[Ifeelyourpain2]

I think location comes into it heavily, a lot of the six figure salaries are in London where you get considerably more for a comparable position.

My husband works in IT in the banking sector. He started off as a graduate for a small company 14 years ago when he was 21, a few years ago he became a director and now earns a very generous 6 figure salary.

We have a house worth almost a million with a small mortgage that we expect to pay off in the near future, but the house we have would probably cost less than half of what it did if we were further North. At the same time, if we lived up north I'd expect my husbands salary to be probably half of what it is now.

I realise this doesn't give you exactly what you're after, sorry, but I think being realistic with expectations in salary where you're living is important. You could move down to London and earn more, but your cost of living will rise accordingly.

[MammouthTask]

Also I would look at what money means to you. Is it status, safety, self esteem etc...?

For me money is safety. There is a point in earnings (between me and DH) where I feel safe/ Once we've reached that level, I don't feel the need the have more iyswim. Of course, more is nice but it isn't essential anymore.

Fenella you are a case in point for me. You are earning about twice as much as we are but your life seems harder than what we have. That's what budgeting does for me: looking at costs, all of them, and deciding if maybe living in another part of the country (cheaper) isn't the right thing to do to have a better life, even if on paper you earn less money.
A friend of mine did the opposite, moved from where I live to London. Wages increased a lot BUT disposable income and quality of life actually went down. Yes they are close to London with all their advantages. But do they ever go there? Not more often than we do. Her conclusion was that, actually it wasn't worth it.

[Caipira]

DH studied electrical engineering and radio-frequency/telecommunications engineering. His first job was a bog standard graduate job for a telephone company, within a year he was with Samsung, optimising networks and earning six figures. He left 3 years ago and as a senior engineer he had an average salary of 15k (US$) a month. He occasionally dips back in taking contracts here and there. The jobs usually only involve optimising and updating the networks and are required by most countries world wide so the work involves a lot of travel and no grounding. There are very few engineers in this area, most of them know each other and very few are British, so it's worth people training in this. The basic requirements that I can tell is you need to be a geek.

[Crazycatladyloz82]

Legal sector. About 5 years to earn what would be deemed as a lot of money but for the endless stress and shit sometimes it doesn't feel a lot (yes I know I can leave but I am indoctrinated to the abuse now and would feel completely confused if colleagues were nice to me and not trying to get everyone under a bus). I haven't had a holiday ever where I haven't had to work, I work weekends and check my BB incessantly at night as I have been bollocked before for not replying to an email sent at gone 10pm. It is easy to say that money isn't everything but it isn't. Do a job you enjoy that provides you what you need (not what you want) and that is a good starting point.

[StandingLikeATRex]

Every single post has given me something to think about if only I had the time to aknowledge each one separately.

holly that is likely close to the true picture- a lot of money is inherited/debt etc.

Yes exactly my point Smellsof and Mammouth and Ells we were sold a dream, we will never have the opportunities past generations had and will probably never make the same money on our houses either.

I definitely wouldn't say it is a sense of entitlement, it's more a sense of realisation. And as pp's have also said - there is nothing wrong with wanting the best life possible.

[APlaceOnTheCouch]

we will never have the opportunities past generations
I'm not sure that's entirely correct. It depends on where you take your 'past generations' benchmark from ie how wealthy a background you actually came from. There are opportunities now that there weren't twenty years ago. For example, the internet has made it possible to easily pick up international consultancy as a freelancer. Cheap flights have made travel more accessible.
I'm not saying there aren't challenges but there are also opportunities too. They may just be in different places or different sectors from previously.

[GinIsIn]

Mammoth - exactly! We unfortunately both work in a London specific industry so can't really work elsewhere but in order to be able to afford a house at all we've had to move over an hour's commute away, and it all feels only just affordable.

[MammouthTask]

Just came across that that blog post on changing career direction and thought about you.

Not saying this is what you should do but the point about thinking of your relationship to money and paid (employed) work is worth looking at.

[adagio]

Really good advice on this thread. Totally echo the long (unpaid) hours, weekends and evenings, plus willingness to learn, travel, and good at networking to help identify and cultivate opportunities.

This plus a good dose of luck and realistic budgeting can give you a good lifestyle. We didn't have holidays, never went out or on holiday and only had a drink (wine or beer) once a month for quite a few years. This allowed us to save and buy our house, then move to a bigger house. Now in late 30's, 2 kids under 5 and got a decent job to go back to after mat leave.

It feels like I know a few to many people who are militant about their hours/what breaks they are owed/spend all their holiday days within the first half of their holiday year. These guys haven't done so well.

[sofato5miles]

My DH went to a rough comp in Scotland, and has uneducated parents who were working on but not inheriting the family farm. He then went to a decent enough uni but got a 3rd in actuarial maths. However, he worked summer placements etc and has a very natural aptitude for management and strategy.
He is extremely level headed and kind. He now earns high 6 figures and was at that point in his early 30s. 15 years later we are about to sell up and live in a warm climate and send our children to a local international school for a fraction of the UK private cost. It means that they will enter the UK uni market without a school label and we will get years in the sun.
There has been an incredible amount of luck, but his ability to remain flexible about location and to work in a very trying environment and remain grounded stood him out from others. I admire him, more for his personality, than his earning.

[Orda1]

Money's worth nothing if you don't save it though. Money for property I mean. Save all you can for as long as you need to.

[PanGalaticGargleBlaster]

^I'm sorry but you are being ridiculous. You don't select a course at university because it will mean loadsa money. Good grief.
Whatever happened to education for its own^

Why is it ridiculous?

Surely it is wise to go to uni and study something that is at least vaguely vocational and offers you the opportunity of earning a decent salary. These days if you are going to graduate with a ton of debt I would opt for a STEM subject over an arts or humanities degree!

[UnderTheGreenwoodTree]

It's not ridiculous. OP asked a totally reasonable question.

Unfortunately, it seems people are not allowed to be either over-aspirational nor under. God forbid you might be over-aspirational and work for a pile in the country, god forbid you may need to rely on benefits.

OP - I answered you earlier upthread. My dh earns 6 figures, I could never have hoped to. I was never even that interested in money, I spent my time at Uni being hippy-ish and fairly beautiful - I somehow married a bloke with actual prospects and ambition - it was never a plan, I was lucky. I could equally have ended up on some hippy commune somewhere. Honestly. I think he was lucky with his career as well.

Try to think about what makes you feel happy and fulfilled. That's the best life you can hope hope for - but really - REALLY - it is the people that you love that is important - more so than the pile in the country.

[crikey81]

I went from 22k to 90k in a year just by changing jobs so it's not impossible. This was age 34 so there's time for you yet

[TheVirginQueen]

I don't see what's so ''good grief'' about picking a course that will lead to a well paid job.
what's the point having a degree in Marine Biology and then going on to do Payroll so you can get a job. (just an example).

[Lovelydiscusfish]

I am a teacher (in management; well paid I feel). Dh is self-employed (antiques trade) - does well. Our combine income is comfortably three figures, but not excessive. No family hand-outs here (though good luck to those who get them). I bought my first house (with ex-h) when 0 per cent mortgages were still the norm (I read that they are coming back in?) and built up equity from there.
We are lucky to live in a beautiful, large, period four bedroom home. We made a bit of money on our last house, by extending it, and moved from an expensive part of the country to a relatively cheap part.
Your 1 mil. house dream may not be realised - but a really nice home and lifestyle might be, through lots of good luck, and some hard work.