To not have lent ex this money?

[notagainnellie]

We have been separated for 2 years following his infidelity. I was wohp but he chose to leave and has said he considers me the main parent as I did all the 'thinking' and would never want to 'take them from me'.

We share custody about 30/40% to him. He is pretty hard up and I don't know how much work he is getting atm (temps as cover supervisor and does some online stuff too, but we don't speak much anymore really). I got a debt collection letter to my (marital) home a few months ago addressed to him and, following advice, gave them his new address. He has always been a nightmare with money and I am paying off credit cards that 'we' ran up, though he was always the bigger spender.

Today he was supposed to drop ds1 with me (strike day for me an ds!) after dropping ds2 at school. He brought them both round 15 minutes before school and asked me for £200 til the end of the month. I said no. He threw their bags at me, said he couldn't look after them then (supposed to have them tonight and pick them up from school and keep for an hour tomorrow) and would have to leave his car here as it had no petrol. I was too shocked to really react and concentrated on getting ds2 to school. When we got back the car had gone.

He has had no money from me since he moved out, but has worked asfaik. Recently got a small flat, has visited friends in Italy twice since the split, paying for flights and turning down temping work. He often takes the kids out to eat, which is expensive and I rarely do it, despite being on a good income. I think his card must have got declined this morning as he said nothing to me when we swapped ds yesterday and was pleasant. He is so careless with money.

We have agreed through a mediator that he will not ask for spousal maintenance, I will continue to pay for pretty much all dc stuff (he only pays for the food they eat with him and any activities), I can raise 17.5K against the mortgage and will give him 14k (will settle marital debts with the rest). There is only about 40k equity, and if we sold, baring in mind he would never get a mortgage, he would not be much better off than the 14k - could be worse off if prices do fall and it goes for less.

I could afford to give him £200 but I don't want to set a precedent and don't believe I would ever see it back. I have taken on extra exam marking this year as I am worried about paying for the divorce, (mediator alone cost enough) and I want to be able to give the dc a good summer.

I just wish I could give him the 14k tomorrow, but I suppose we need to wait for a judge to sign off on it and the divorce is taking ages to come through as a copy of the cert has to come from USA and it's proving difficult.

Sorry this is incoherent and long - he has spun me into anxiety – again.

[microscope]

why on earth did you do all that? he's never going to grow up if you keep bailing him out.

[EveOnline2016]

I think he just had children in the first place as a get out of work card.

[TreadSoftlyOnMyDreams]

Sorry - I think that it was a silly thing to do also.

Have you calculated on line how much he would need to give to you if you become the main carer?
You've made an arrangement for care via a mediator which was a timeconsuming and expensive process. I think you need to face up to the fact that you are going to need a tough conversation about complying with or else revisiting that agreement. It's not an option for him to flake off his obligations without financial consequences. His £14k is going to amount to precisely squat if you have to keep paying for emergency childcare at £20 a hour, per child?..............

[t4gnut]

What Scary said - you are now enabling his behaviour. It's not a criticism but you've probably been doing it for years. If you spend your life metaphorically picking up after him he'll never learn to do it himself.

He is a grown up and a parent. You have to be tough and tell him straight what his responsibilities are.

[bibliomania]

It will be cheaper in the long-run to sort out alternative childcare.

[Scarydinosaurs]

I'm sorry but you are now an architect of your own unhappiness if you continue to enable him.

I'm sorry if this sounds harsh- but you are creating this problem by condoning his irresponsibility. You are teaching your children all the wrong lessons about independence, the role of a mother, and the role of a wife/partner/ex-partner.

To see change in how you feel, you have to change your own behaviour. However hard you find it.

[notagainnellie]

Well I ended up texting him and asking if he wanted me to take the dc to his with a meal. I also offered to collect them in the morning and take them to my childminder, rather than him dropping them at school as he normally would when they stay overnight with him to save his petrol.

He said yes, so I had to do an hour round trip yesterday during rush hour (he didn't reply to me until 4pm) and this morning before going to work myself. He took the bag of food off me and said nothing and this morning the dc had only had a slice of toast each.

I can't keep doing that. He chose to move back to the city to be near his friends when we split. It's only 20 mins away, but the times I would need to take them would always coincide with rush hour, so it's a big chunk of my time when I could be getting stuff done in the time he has them.

I had been relying on the time he has them to do my exam marking, and I also have a couple of end of term 'dos', leaving parties etc and he is my only local source of childcare. I don't know what to do.

I'm so sick of feeling anxious as a result of his actions and sick of being the sensible one while he takes no responsibility for anything. Don't know where to go from here.

[purplefox]

Don't do it, once it starts it will never stop and once he can see he can use the "well I'm not having the DC if you dont" card it will happen more and more.
My ex used to do this, he "needed" £100 to bring DS back to me, then another £100 to come back pick him up again a few days later, knowing at 8am and needed to be at work in 30 minutes I'd have no way to find alternative childcare. He lived a £7 train ride away, but of course me offering to pay for the train fares wasn't enough.

[t4gnut]

Absolutely right.

This may sound unkind but he's had many many years of avoiding growing up. He's got to stay at home working when he feels like it, pursuing his adolescent dream of being a writer and in a band, doing what he wants when he wants (including it seems chasing other women). As part of that it seems he's incapable (being kind - arguably irresponsible) of managing money properly.

Now he has to grow up and take responsibility for his own actions - and that might just mean working even when he doesn't feel like it and buying food instead of beer and fags.

[notagainnellie]

I do have some sympathy with a nrp who end up having the children almost half the time yet presumably can't claim any kind of benefits or even child benefit to supplement his low income.

So do I, but then I remember that the money he spends on feeding them a few meals a fortnight probably pales into insignificance compared to what he spends on tobacco and socialising. He rang from Weatherspons where he was having breakfast the other day to ask me to take ds1 to the cricket match he was supposed to be taking him to as he had only just ordered his meal and would be late! Now breakfast out for me is a major treat, and I simply wouldn't do it if I was in the situation he is. I know it's up to him how he spends his money, but I don't want mine pissed away as well.

[notagainnellie]

Yes, Pearlman, but he doesn't want to have the responsibility of residency of the dc (he loves them, but likes being able to hand them back), and guilt stopped him trying to get any money off me. I suppose his sense of guilt is ebbing away now.

[Babyroobs]

I do have some sympathy with a nrp who end up having the children almost half the time yet presumably can't claim any kind of benefits or even child benefit to supplement his low income. Presumably he spent many years being a sahd and this has affected his chances of securing permanent well paid work. However when I read about the tips to Italy etc it does sound as though he isn't great with money and would be reluctant to lend him money for that reason. If I thought my kids were going to go without whilst they were with him, then I would help or just not let them go.

[Scarydinosaurs]

I'm more convinced than ever that you should not lend him the money!

He absolutely does not need £200 to have children overnight. He is a liar and an emotiona manipulator. I'm not saying he is a bad person but he's not a very nice one.

[Stormtreader]

" I was stressed because I had all these plates spinning and he was stressed because all his plates had smashed."

Well yes, if you sit back waiting for someone else to step in and spin the plates for you then theyre going to smash :p

[Clutterbugsmum]

I wouldn't be even considering giving him any money even until all the joint debt is cleared. Either this £200 or any money from the house.

Surely if you have the children 60/70% of the time, then he should be paying child maintenance to YOU, and you should not be even considering giving him spousal maintenance. Dear god my mum was married to my dad for 30 yrs and wasn't entitled to spousal maintenance.

[Topseyt]

Pearlman, I think OP is considering extending her mortgage in order to raise the £17.5k. From that she plans to pay £14k to her ex as a settlement and use the rest to pay off credit card debts he (largely) ran up.

I don't read it as the house having been sold at all, though I am prepared to stand corrected.

[MammaTJ]

Ah, he spotted weakness last week with the mediator, so decided to try it on!

So clear!

Do not give him money!

[notagainnellie]

Pearlman I think it only counts officially when he has them over night, so probably less than that. He has them 4 nights a fortnight and a couple of just days as well. I bought them extra stuff to take to his, so all he has to provide is whatever meals they eat with him. The house is not going to be sold but I am borrowing to 'buy him out', if that's the right term. I don't think I 'owe' it as such, as our agreement isn't official yet. I would love to do it as soon as possible, but we can't divorce yet as the cert is missing and a copy has to come from USA.

[Topseyt]

He doesn't seem interested in earning for himself, and added to that he sounds utterly clueless with money. My BIL has always been like that (in amongst a host of other problems) Lend him nothing.

Will he have the sense to invest his £14k somehow when the time comes? More likely he will fritter it away because money burns a hole in his pocket.

[notagainnellie]

I know Matilda. It will add £90 to my mortgage, which should be fine but is obviously not great. But I know he is entitled to something and I don't want him playing the martyr card in the future. I just know that he will blow it and use it as an excuse not to work for a bit and then be back in this position again.

I was actually in tears at the mediator session last week as he said he had never asked me for anything (was true then!) and the mediator said we were both good people and used an analogy about how I was stressed because I had all these plates spinning and he was stressed because all his plates had smashed. I sat there with tears running down my face feeling sorry for him, and less than a week later he does this .

[MatildaTheCat]

He's run out of money until the end of the month? That's bad. He's going to have to find a way to raise some money and no way should it be you who lends it.

I would insist he has the DC even if you have to provide food for them because this is all about taking responsibility.

Unfortunately that £14k will be pissed away with nothing to show for it which will sting.

[bibliomania]

Any sign of weakness, whether giving money or allowing him to see the dcs at your place, will teach him that this is a successful strategy. If you reward it, you'll get more of it.

[t4gnut]

Under no circumstances do anything to legitimate his behaviour - he has made his choices and he needs to man up and grow up. If he throws a temper tantrum over not getting his way that is on him. You are not responsible for his behaviour.