To be terrified of moving to China

[TiffanyBonj]

DH and I have been together for 13 years, he's Chinese but has lived in England for 15+ years, we have two DC's 9 and 7, who can poorly speak Mandarin but not read or write anything.

DH is an only child with Elderly parents, for the past few years, his parents have become a real worry for him, they're all alone in a big city, a lot of their friends have either moved away to live with relatives or have sadly passed on.

Last summer I finally agreed to move to China and have the in laws live with us, so they'll always have company or extra help. They don't speak English and I don't speak a word of Mandarin, although I've been taking lessons the past few months.

Everything has been going smoothly so far, DH and I managed to secure work for when we move, the kids have been accepted into an International school, we've got a property to live in, all that's left is to book the tickets but I'm completely and utterly petrified.

I don't even know why, the mere thought of getting flight tickets and moving, makes me sick, I didn't feel like this before but now I'm so bloody scared, it's too late to back out but I can't help feeling like this, I don't know what to do.

[namechangeparents]

Your in-laws are lucky to have a daughter in law like you who is prepared to uproot her whole life to make sure they are taken care of

This.

I am very impressed and humbled, I could not be that unselfish.

[MrsDoylesTeaParty]

I felt the same as you OP before I moved to the Middle East. It was scary and huge and overwhelming! But I just told myself to just get on the plane and take one day at a time. Once I got there (my inlaws lived there and DP had gone over a few months earlier) I was too busy and absorbed in the surroundings to feel worried anymore. It was such an adventure and I felt settled after a few months. I was only there 3 years which is a small portion of my life but it makes up most of my memories! It will change you (in a good way) Technology will enable you to keep many links to the UK.
I have a few friends who went to live in China and have kept extending their visa because they love it. The only negative I ever hear about is the humidity but they must be used to it now as they never mention it!

[mimishimmi]

Pimsleur ... it's awesome! All four phases though. And Melnyk's podcasts.

[CiderwithBuda]

Please don't worry about expats being wealthy. Some will. Some won't. Some will be on huge financial packages but equally as many won't. When we lived in Bangkok we were on a crap package and some of us used to say that in our next life we wanted to come back as an oil company expat wife!

Same every where else we have been. We always ended up with friends who were not as well off as us and some who were far better off. A mix of people who just lived in the expat bubble and lots who did the expat thing but embraced the local stuff too.

It will take time but you will find your feet. It takes a good 18 months to feel settled I always found.

[thefemalegeek]

OP, really glad you are in reading mode. It will definitely help you to process your thoughts and prepare for your adventure. Robin Pascoe has written several books about the expat experience, although from the perspective of a typical trailing spouse, which doesn't completely tally with your situation. The book of hers that I found really useful and wish I had read before leaving the UK is called "Homeward Bound". It might seem daft to read about coming back when you haven't left yet, but it gets to the heart of all the issues involved in leaving your home country and (maybe?) returning one day.

[NotCitrus]

There's a FutureLearn free course that's just started on Intercultural Communication, run by a Shanghai university - I highly recommend it to anyone but might be particularly helpful to you - Chinese vs 'Western' culture was a case study in the first week.

Mah-Jongg is essentially Rummy with tiles and betting. I'm told every family has their own slightly different rules so just go with what FIL tells you!

Have you ever been an expat before? Expect to be seriously miserable about 5-6 weeks in (like uni students), then maybe have a break, then it gets better. Lots of good advice here.

[TiffanyBonj]

Bought a few book online and I've been seriously reading up, definitely going to go in with 0 expectations and my eyes as wide as they can be.

DH has said he's sorting out a VPN, I've honestly given it no thought, but I'm so glad he has.

@CityChick, In laws have a full time carer that looks after them, she thankfully speaks a decent amount of English and she will 100% be staying on. In laws themselves are pretty decent, MIL doesn't really try to speak to me on the phone when she calls, but then I've never gone out of my way to speak to her either, FIL, is pretty funny, he's always trying to communicate in English even though he only knows about 5 words. Living with them is going to be the biggest challenge, but I'll be working most of the day, so even if they're super horrid, which I doubt, I don't have to spend 24 hours with them.

We've got a CM lined up but that's it for extra help, apart from the carer, I didn't realise most ex-pats were super well off, that makes me slightly nervous. Food quality is a bit of a worry, read an article about poor quality baby milk causing deaths, which freaked me out a little, I think I'll be shopping at M&S for the first few weeks.

I think I'll be tempted to stick to the ex-pat bubble, but according to DH, FIL can't wait to play Mahjong, I've looked it up, I don't understand a thing about it.

I think what I'm most excited about, is getting the DC's to learn Mandarin.

I'm not as scared as I was, when I first started this thread, so thanks for replying to my post everyone

[citychick]

It is nice to make friends locally. But it's usually the ones married to westerners. IME if I chat to a local, and here many speak English fairly well, it's all very lovely, oh you must come round for a Hot Pot, so nice to meet you.

"Oh and my children will be learning English from your DS! And that's great for us!"

Always a sting in the tail...Cultural sharing. Pfft. (most of the time)

I tend to leave new friendships like that in the playground, and keep them there. But am always happy to engage each time I see them.

We live a relatively local life. We don't have a car. BUT. I am about the only western mum who waits at the bus stop. The rest, incl locals are all hopping into their 4x4's and speeding off to the club. Expat bubble. It exists. And the wealthy locals who can afford it, join it. And love it.

[MrsTerryPratchett]

You can have the best of both worlds though, Tea. When I was a kid I had local friends, spoke the language fluently (this wasn't China) and was really immersed. My parents were less and more so at different times.

I do think that some people spend vastly too much time with other foreigners. We had English neighbours who didn't learn the language at all, were miserable and moaned about everything all the time.

[HazyMazy]

I lived in central Beijing and the cost of my home (paid for by the co my DH worked for) was 9,000 dollars a month. So OP problaby not able to live in the Central area but I don't know Shanghai.
But I had some fun lessons in Mandarin from a little lady who couldn't speak English and other expats learned it (younger ones than me) so that is definitely where to start.There will be a big ex pat community. Great that DCs are in International Schools. The cities are big and noisy but ime no dislike of foreigners. Chinese v friendly.
LIke any big city tons to do and see - great opportunities, perhaps OP can teach English until a better job comes along?

[Bumshkawahwah]

It's not a case of only living in a expat bubble, Teacaddy - actually I'm sure she can have the best of both worlds. But coming from the UK, never having lived in China, with very different food , not speaking the language etc etc, I'd think it'd be a comfort to be able to seek out other foreigners. As her children are going to international school, she's going to be meeting expats anyway. I'm certainly not saying she should only be friends with other foreigners but it's pretty nice to have the option to get help and advice from people who will understand culture shock and settling-in issued

I don't know where you live/have lived in China...western expat or not, I'd hardly
call my life 'highly sanitised'...I think there is a limit to how sanitised you can actually make your life here.

[CaoNiMa]

OP, I've lived in Shanghai for nearly 10 years. It's brilliant! Feel free to PM me.

[Teacaddy]

As the OP is married to a Chinese man and will be living with her Chinese ILS, it's surely debatable whether she will want, or have the option of, only inhabiting the highly sanitised, Westernised expat bubble so many posters seem to be defaulting to...

[Bumshkawahwah]

I live in China at the moment and have been here for the last 3.5 years. Shanghai has an amazing expat scene (some of my friendships used to live there...I am actually in the South). Foreigners tend to stick together and are very friendly and welcoming. Honestly, you can have an instant social life if you want that. For me, it's been one of the best things about living here. I've been an expat for many years and in my experience, the more 'different', the country, the more the expats band together and support each other. Also a nice things about China is, you can be as weird as you like, dress however you want, and no-one gives a toss. I have seen some weird shit - a woman in platform shoes made to look like cerise pink poodle heads carrying a dog dressed in a tuxedo was today's treat for the eyes - but it's quite nice to not be judged. Ooh, and they are building a Disneyland in Shanghai!

On the downside...it can actually be quite expensive to live in the bigger cities, food quality is very, very variable. There are endless stories about dodgy food , noodles made from plastic, overuse of pesticides in fruit and veg. Having said that, Shanghai does have a Marks and Spencer . People are seriously pushy - it is dog eat dog when you are out and about. The pollution is awful. Really, really awful. The firewall is a giant pain - FB, Instagram, Youtube, Google are all blocked. You must organise a VPN before you go! Because of the firewall, the Internet is really slow and many, many sites are inaccessible.

I could go on and on...I have been perfectly happy here in China, and I will guarantee you can be too! Please feel free to PM me if I can help, or answer any questions.

[citychick]

Hi there OP. It is indeed a huge move and you have every right to be terrified!

DH, DS and myself live in Asia. I had many questions before we left and still find some of them unanswered, even now. This is our second time is Asia, so not all new to us, but certainly new to DS.

You have a few boxes ticked, but here are a few things i'd be asking DH and myself...

Will you be enjoying an expat life or a local life?
As you are not Chinese, how would you cope with a local life, whilst making friends with those enjoying the expat experience?
Lots of expats will be very comfortable financially,have drivers, rents paid, clubs to go to etc etc. How would you feel about your female contemporaries living a more luxurious life than yourself? Unless of course if you are to be living an abfab life then this doesn't matter!
What I am trying to say is that, whilst there is always going to be someone better off than you, in an expat environment it's really in your face, because there are fewer people, iyswim.
Or, looking at it another way, I felt we had to be moving 4000 miles for something as good as or better than what we had in the UK.
(of course not every expat is stinking rich, I am aware of that!)

You say you'll be around to help the PIL's. Just how much help will you be expected to give? Do they already have live in/ live out help? How will you feel if the help they may already have has been dismissed by the time you get there?
How on earth are you going to communicate with them if you don't speak the language?
Do you expect to have domestic help when you get there?
There is definitely a social scene in the expat environment, but if you have kids, and you want to go out, you need someone home to bbysit. Will the GPs do this if there is no domestic help? For most expat families, especially in mainland China, domestic help is part of the package. What's in your package? (not a euphemism!)

A friend of mine (white British) is married to a Chinese chap. They live close by his parents and have Dim Sum each Sunday all together. They speak English, but refuse to and so she spends most Sundays at the table playing with her mobile phone as her Chinese isn't good enough to keep up with the conversation. How would you feel about that?

I don't think you are insane doing this, not at all. However, it's easy to shut down a life in the UK (practical bits anyway), but from my experience it takes a lot longer to start up again. you need patience. And you will be spending money no end at first. You need to throw money at everything short term.

I sound all doom and gloom, and I don't mean to be. I love living in Asia. You just need to get as many things ironed out as you can.
Good luck and I am occasionally on the Living overseas board, so might pop over and speak to you there.

Best of luck!

[ClaudiaWankleman]

Hi Tiffany, I used to live in China (I am white British) and had quite a local life (attended university there) so I can offer advice about the expat bubble vs reality, as well as maybe answer some questions that you wouldn't want to ask your DP. Feel free to ask questions here/ via PM.

I can definitely say that it'll be a challenge - there will be things you hate and things that you love. Approach this with eyes wide open and you will enjoy yourself.

[PollyCazaletWannabe]

Hi Tiffany! I live in Shanghai with my DP- moved from the UK last August. Would be happy to answer any questions you may have if you want to PM me :)

[CiderwithBuda]

You can also have fab holidays. We have lived in both Bangkok and Vietnam and travelled all over Asia and also went to Australia and New Zealand.

Bangkok was our first expat experience and we used the time to see as much of Asia as possible. Then when we were returning to the uk we travelled for 3 months through Australia, New Zealand, Hawaii and the US. Basically travelled back the wrong way round! It was pre children so easier but you can still travel around Asia.

Hope you are feeling more positive about it today.

[FrancesNiadova]

Tiffany my friend is a teacher & she taught at one of the big international schools in Beijing. She LOVED it & didn't want to leave.
She said that there's a big xpat community out there that's really supportive.
You'll have a great time & if your dcs grow up bilingual in English & Mandarin, they're made for life.

[mimishimmi]

Pimsleur digital lessons supplemented by the Melnyk podcasts are fantastic. They really helped when we travelled through China (there are four phases of thirty half-hour lessons each).

[Hirosleaftunnel]

This is a huge opportunity for your children OP. China and Asia really is the future for young people in terms of opportunity and learning about a positive, can do attitude towards life and work. I also think that with your elderly PILS already there it won't be the huge shock that it is for most ex pats as your DH will have a ready made network. I think once your Mando gets more fluent things will be easier. Also if you are missing the UK you can always pop down to HK which is nearly as good with M&s etc! I have found the Chinese to be extremely welcoming, friendly and positive people. We are here permenantly and it is difficult sometimes because we have no family are roots here. Also remember that you won't need to cook, clean or anything like that so happy days! I love China (human rights aside) and hopefully you will too.

[LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett]

My friends who went on secondments to Shanghai had to be dragged back. They loved it. It's a massive culture shock, but actually it will bring you all closer as a family, your DCs will experience their dad's 'home' culture, you're doing a wonderful thing for the ILs... It will be amazing.

All that said, it is totally, totally natural to be bricking it.

[WildImaginings]

Meant to add to my previous post- I never went to Shanghai, but I had friends who were posted there. They absolutely loved it, and they said the expat community was fantastic.

[Oohparcel]

I lived in Shanghai with small kids for two years. The expat community is big and very friendly. You can get by with very little Mandarin. You will meet people through school. I suggest you join shanghai mamas (shanghaimamas.org) - great advice and a great way to meet people. They used to have coffee mornings and set you up with a buddy. I made lots of friends. Good luck!

[WildImaginings]

I lived in China (returned a couple of years ago) and I absolutely loved it. I went over there as a lone female traveller, and left with a huge group of friends who I still keep in touch with.

As some previous posters have said, the trick is to go in with your eyes open. I read up a lot before I went there, and as such, I wasn't too shocked by some of the um...unique aspects of China!

I stayed in Beijing for a month, but I spent the majority of my time in Sichuan province. I loved the local food and the local people, and if you ever do fancy a taste of home, there are plenty of expat pubs and restaurants. I found myself throwing myself into the local cuisine though, and I absolutely loved it!

Make sure you have a reliable VPN sorted before you go, as it's a nightmare otherwise to access even mainstream sites. Astrill is good, and very reasonable.

I was in China for less than a year, and because I was working as an English teacher my opportunities to learn Mandarin were limited. If I'd been there longer, I would have learned. HOWEVER, this did not cause me any problems at all! Mime and interpretive dance came in useful at times, but I would recommend downloading the pleco app- it's a fantastic translation tool.