AIBU to use a 'naughty chair'?

[Iceyard]

DS1 is about to turn 2 and I know he'll soon need a lot of reinforcing... Wondering if a 'naughty chair'/'reflection corner' is unreasonable? If so, what do you do? Thank you, E x

[DisappointedOne]

Absolutely, slut. Gentle parenting doesn't mean permissive.

[Slutbucket]

I believe in positivity but children are not always going to face positivity they are going to receive negative feedback at some point. As parents we need to give feedback and provide boundaries. If not we can get children who are not very resilient and entitled. Surely a balance is required?

[lenibose]

I think taking time to explain/reason/empathise is all fine. But you can't say 'he's too young to understand discipline' and in the same breath say 'he will understand reason/empathy/sensible conversation' especially in the middle of a tantrum. Either they get it or they don't. In my opinion, they sort of get the logic but not quite but are often too overwrought to get it. Also, they need to know that often there is not enough time to negotiate/explain/reason. And sometimes you just have to do stuff because you have to. That's a valuable life lesson as well.

I have read that link. That sounds like she was far too authoritarian. Why would you put your kid into timeout because they squabbled over rice?

[Muskateersmummy]

I agree on the saying sorry thing too.

[DisappointedOne]

Agree with PP. I'm determined that DD will only say sorry when she really means it, and not just to move on from whatever's happened. My sister is a complete cow and thinks that a quick "sorry" will fix everything.

[witsender]

Whenever I hear 'well behaved 2 yr old' my mind boggles a bit. That is barely out of babyhood! Can 2 yr olds be badly behaved? Really? The behaviours you look down on in others are quite standard, especially for children otherwise overwhelmed...by being out of the home for long periods etc...it is all about how you manage them. And in my experience of older children, the parents who do take the time to explain, reason and empathise with their children when they are overwhelmed with emotion (tantrumming) or otherwise behaving negatively have better results in the long term. Because their children feel listened to, and have avoid certain behaviours because it is the 'right thing to do', and not just because mum says so and will put me in an arbitrary spot for an arbitrary time on my own.

We have always kind of done time ins, I explain that I can't let them do xyz, why not etc. If they are overwhelmed and cross about it I sit nearby, speak calmly, tell them to talk to me about it when they are ready

If on the rare occasion they do something undesirable I tell them why it is undesirable, how it has made me and others feel etc.

[Muskateersmummy]

I'm all for gentle parenting like disappointed. It works for us, she rarely tantrums either... However, different strokes for different folks, we used naughty step for a short while until we discovered being more gentle worked better for us.

I do agree that reading about other techniques can never hurt, but I do believe no one technique works for all children in all situations.

[Pipsqueak23]

I know I am doing the right thing for us because I have a well behaved two year old who is very good at sharing, is well mannered, very rarely (once in a blue moon) has a tantrum and I often receive comments on how well behaved he is. He is still full of his cheeky personality but knows the limits.

I very rarely have to use timeout but When I say I use time out this means he is sat ( not in any particular spot, just away from the situation) for 2 min ( a minute for each year) to allow him time to realise what he has done is not acceptable, I then explain why it is not acceptable after the two minutes and have him apologize. I can tell from my child that the majority of time he has an understanding of what has been explained to him.

I am not strict and do not put my child in time out for every slight but I will use time out if I feel it is required.

Time out is reserved for 'bad behaviour such as snatching ( and refusing to give it back, hurting someone, throwing things etc)

I see too many parents who try to reason with their child/ or ignoring 'bad behaviour' and then you end up with a lot of bratty children who don't listen to their parent and expect to get what they want, when they want and are not bothered if that means upsetting/hurting someone else to get it.

[DisappointedOne]

This article is about a mum that dropped her strict parent style for 1 week, and tried gentle parenting instead. Her experience is pretty interesting whichever side of the fence you sit on.

www.romper.com/p/i-tried-gentle-parenting-for-a-week-heres-what-happened-4679

[DisappointedOne]

DisappointedOne No I didn't read the article. I don't need to as I am doing what works for me and my DS.

If other people have a different view, then they are entitled to it and can choose to raise their DC however they wish, but I will continue to do what works for us.

How do you ever know if you're doing the right thing if you don't even consider alternatives?

[DisappointedOne]

I can honestly say, hand on heart, that my 5 year old has never had a tantrum. Ever. Nor has she ever been anywhere near a naughty step or chair. We're very much gentle parents.

Must just be her nature.

[lenibose]

I concur with Pipsqueak23. I am a stricter parent than most but now that he's in preschool, I can see that he is significantly better behaved than his peers. The other day someone had a tantrum because his gingerbread man broke in half. The kid is 4. He was lying on the pavement and kicking his legs and screaming. And his mother was trying to reason with him. This is just madness.

I have seen children hitting their parents and their parents trying to 'explain' why this is wrong. And I have heard children indulging in ridiculous behaviour that is dismissed as 'oh he's a bit spirited', oh 'kids will be kids eh?' I am not a perfect parent by any means. I could probably loosen up a lot. I am also aware that I have a more compliant kid than most. BUT every single day I see parents excusing disgraceful behaviour on the ground that 'he (and it is often a he- our sexist society tolerates more bad behaviour from little boys) is just a kid.' There is no good age to set boundaries and enforce some rules. You don't have to be a tyrant to do it. But you also don't need to let your kid run rings around you.

PS There was a thread yesterday where a kid was refusing to let her Mum into the room (after a huge tantrum). DH was playing good cop and cuddling her. Every time Mum came into the room she would shout and scream 'noooo Mummy go away Mummy.' And what did Mummy do? She retreated upstairs because her kid was getting upset by her presence..! In what world does a 2 year old dictate which room in my house I can enter? This is genuinely bonkers.

[Pipsqueak23]

DisappointedOne No I didn't read the article. I don't need to as I am doing what works for me and my DS.

If other people have a different view, then they are entitled to it and can choose to raise their DC however they wish, but I will continue to do what works for us.

I have a happy, healthy child who appreciates the boundaries I have set. He is polite and well behaved (the majority of the time) and I have to deal with very few tantrums.

[KondosSecretJunkRoom]

Well, I do use the naughty corner for the serious stuff, scrapping with one another or being persistently unkind, so it's an option I'm happy to use with older children in those situations when it's best to create some space around them and let them cool down.

I wouldn't use it for a 2 yo. Positive reinforcement, ignoring, distracting and just picking them up and moving them are more effective tools.

I just don't see why anyone would do that with a small child. Except, I suppose, if you are producing a TV. program and what you are looking for is a visually entertaining way to signpost the moment when a parent lays down the law and emerges as an "effective" disciplinarian. Thus creating a replicable format of problem-action-resolve that can be regurgitated until their audience dies of boredom.

[popperdoodles]

Removing a child from a situation which for whatever reason they are finding difficult eg not being able to be gentle or unable to share, being rude etc is very effective. Gives everyone a chance to calm and stops a situation from escalating
On the other hand sending a child to sit in a place labeled as for naughty people is just humiliating. It's all in how it's done.
Consequences need to be real and have meaning in my opinion. So ifthey are being unpleasant they are removed because their friends will be hurt and sad or whatever. The point should be about teaching them not punishment. Tell them what they should do rather than focus on what they shouldn't do. Being positive doesn't mean being fluffy and permissive.

Good luck. It's a bumpy ride and nothing will work 100% of the time because children are not little robots.

[lenibose]

You can do both. Positive reinforcement and a 'thinking corner/naughty corner' whatever. We had v simple rules with DS- no hitting, no throwing and no shouting/screaming. If he did, I picked him up, took him to the corner and sat with him. When he had finished sobbing I reminded him of why he had been moved there. A big hug and done. Very quickly he figured that it was a space for him to calm down. I remember he once threw something and marched off himself to his 'naughty corner' saying 'I threw that. That's against the rules.' I also don't pander and negotiate. Sometimes he has to do as I say. When he has done it I will explain why we had to do etc. But I do not get into long explanations with small irrational creatures. I have also confiscated toys. But you have to be really firm and not bring them out 10 mins later. Finally, enforcing rules and boundaries for me also goes hand in hand with giving him the vocabulary to express his emotions as well- that he might miss someone, that he might be sad or fed up. We haven't needed punishments for a while (he is 4) but sometimes when he says, 'oh but I want...X' and is on the verge of tears I will pick him up, remove him from there and have a word. He is now at the age when whinging is a bigger problem than actual tantrums. I give him a couple of chances to explain and for me to explain why he cannot/may not have something or needs to do something. And then I ignore. Most of the whinging involves having to walk to places. I say, 'did you sleep well? Did you eat well? Do you have strong legs? Then let's walk without whinging'. If he whines after that I just ignore and after a few minutes strike up a conversation. More whinging. Then silence for me. I will try another conversation again. They really do get this stuff very quickly.

[MrsBartlettforthewin]

oh also meant to say it works both ways lots of positive reinforcement for the behaviour we want as well. Think this is one of the reasons that we don't have to resort to time out/ removal of toys often.

[MrsBartlettforthewin]

We use count to three then a consequence which is sometimes a time out on a naughty spot or a toy being removed depends on the behaviour i.e. smashing a toy around that will result in it breaking after being warned to stop the toy is removed, hitting sibling repeatedly = naughty spot.
Seems to work with our LOs with DD just the threat of a count to three with little else more often then not results in her modifying her behaviour and DS is beginning to learn also. We make it very clear that the action is naughty NOT the child. DD is 6 and DS is almost 2.

[candykane25]

Rince ouch! My DD loves my boobies and nipples, the often repeated word in my house is Gentle!

[Muskateersmummy]

Depends on the child and how it's done. We did it for a little while with dd when she was a similar age. It was done simply to give her time to calm, and then I would go to sit with her, and talk about the situation. However we don't use it anymore, mainly because I haven't had the need to. She is now almost 4 and other methods work better for her now. For us it was only ever as a last resort and I think I used it a handful of times and then never needed to again because she responded better to me talking to her calmly, Comforting her through tantrums and encouraging her to find solutions to things that she did wrong.

I agree with the pp's who say no one strategy works for all children. It's a useful tool for some children

[Rinceoir]

She goes to nursery, loves it there. She's mostly very well behaved, just occasionally gets excited and slaps- she seems to think it's a game. With the pulling my top or pinching my nipple it's mainly when I've asked her to wait for a breastfeed and she's annoyed.

[candykane25]

Rince does your DD go to nursery at all? My DD knows what behaviour is acceptable there so when she throws something at home I say ooh what would Nursery Worker's Name say if you threw something at nursery? My DD says No. Then i say well you're not allowed to throw things at home either.
We talk about how it makes me feel and how she would feel if someone did it to her. I fake cry to show her it hurts.
It is big concepts but by discussing it I am given her the opportunity to learn.
After that it's taking away a toy or not reading a book.
And then wine.

[fusionconfusion]

The important thing is to avoid COERCION e.g. you do as I say or else, stop your crying or I'll give you something to cry about, if you shout, I'll scream, if you scream, I'll roar, if you roar, I'll lock you in a cupboard etc. It's a spiral.

The step could be coercion or it could be stress management - the step itself doesn't need to be stigmatising, it's not its form but its function that matters.

I did the step with my first in a coercive, stigmatising way. It didn't work at all and he is very rigid and inflexible with rules - I was too harsh. I didn't with the others, but they still go to the step to simmer down sometimes. All of mine are very close in age so sometimes for safety reasons you really do need to separate them, I can't physically be present to talk them all through their (conflicting) feelings all at one time.

[DisappointedOne]

Rinseoir Janet Lansbury for you too.

[DisappointedOne]

An 18 month old can do many things that require 'punishment' such as hitting, snatching toys etc.
Did you bother reading the article I posted?!