Cyclists riding two or three abreast down country lanes.

[Roseforarose]

AIBU that it's a bit of a hazard. We've just come back from a journey and there was a bike rally or something. We were trailing behind for ages from the ones who refused to get in single file. Surely for everyone's safety they should be in single file? What do you all think?

[SorchaN]

I want to get where I'm going in a reasonable time

Yes, and a reasonable time is a time that is safe for all road users, including cyclists.

[MistressChalk]

UmmErr its entirely reasonable to get annoyed at any twat on the road. Roads are dangerous things. But those twats come on every vehicle, although more often that vehicle is motorised. Basic law of averages. Discussions like this will always get people's backs up because of the sheer obstinacy in some people in realising cyclists a) have every right to the road that they do b) are a living breathing person and c) are amongst the more vulnerable road users. It's easy for people to get worked up and lash out when certain people think their right to drive a car surpasses another's right to live.

Cars kill thousands of people every year and yet some drivers see cyclists as a massive threat

[UmmErrWhateves]

Mistigri ohh, that's a bit snidely to call me up on my 'almost every week' comment. Is there some sort of minimum mileage I should be doing in order to be eligible to comment on this thread
I am really old so I would prefer any thread mileage requirement to be based on my lifetimes mileage.

I'm happy to be held up by steam vehicles, tractors, livestock etc and I'm more than happy to be held up cyclists when they have to ride two abreast for safety reasons. I'm even happy to tail at a distance a single cyclist if it's a particularly narrow or windy. I get pissed of by the rude ones that hold you up for no good reason.

[lampygirl]

But your speed in whatever vehicle is dictated by the vehicle in front. Do you get rage if a bus stops in front of you and cars are coming the other way... That bus is doing 0mph...

[MistressChalk]

Impatient driver encased in a tonne of metal.
Human being on a few bars of metal.
Different.

At the end of the day your impatience and anger could cost someone their life. It won't kill you though. That's a lot more fucking important than your need to go over 10 miles an hour.

[ragged]

Vintage tractors & steam engines around here, not to mention the ponies. I can cycle past any of them.

A good walking pace = 3mph, bikes average 12mph, not really the same.

[dementedma]

Tractor 40 mph
Bike 10mph or a lot less.....
Different.

[VivaLeBeaver]

What's the problem with waiting until there's no oncoming traffic? Like you would if it was a tractor?

If the road is really wide, wide enough for two cars and a bike to pass safely then that's different and the cyclists should be single file.

I cycle several times a week. Normally on my trike, sometimes on a normal bike. There is one road in particular where it is no way safe to squeeze two cars and a bike. The road isn't that busy so any car wouldn't have to wait more than a minute of that to pass. But still they try and pass 2" from my elbow at 60mph. So I now bike 2ft out from the verge to prevent that happening.

[dementedma]

Whatever shrugs
Still object to being forced to travel at almost walking speed because of some one else's inability to move over slightly and let faster traffic pass.

[Mistigri]

"Almost every week" doesn't suggest you spend a lot of time on a bike. I used to cycle to work in London everyday and poor overtaking was a daily occurrence. It's much less common here in France, perhaps because local cycling culture promotes cycling in groups and taking up road space rather than hugging the curb.

[Mistigri]

UmmErr yes absolutely, cyclists have the right to ride two abreast but they may choose not to exercise that right.

The problem is that many cars do pass too close. When I ride with my son, I have taken to riding a particular narrow section of road two abreast, with me in the middle of the lane, because we narrowly avoided an accident last year when a driver could not wait for oncoming cars to pass before overtaking us. (Having nearly killed my son he then stopped to hurl abuse). We were riding in single file close to the curb. For obvious reasons I now ride that section of road much more defensively, making sure that I occupy enough road space to force drivers to overtake correctly. None of this would be necessary if it weren't for the minority of demented drivers who think they own the road.

[UmmErrWhateves]

Viva wouldn't you rather an 'impatient' driver was in front of you driving into the distance rather than stuck behind you getting everymore frustrated.

I cycle almost every week and I don't have issues with cars passing to close to me as they overtake. I guess it must have happened but its not a common occurance.

[GuybrushThreepwoodMP]

Erm cars don't pay 'road tax'. You are not paying to use the road. It's dependent on CO2 emissions.
You are not owing for more rights to be on the road. You are a road use with equal rights to other road users.

[MistressChalk]

slow clap dementedma all your arguments are now deemed invalid road tax indeed....

[dementedma]

Why do cyclists have the right to dictate the speed of the traffic flow? They dont pay road tax, car drivers do.
And yes, I drive a car so I dont have to crawl along. I dont speed, I observe the limits but I want to get where I'm going in a reasonable time, not at 10 miles an hour or less. If I wanted to travel at that speed.....I would ride a bike. But I don't and don't see why I should have cyclists speed limits imposed on me.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Is is my bike so I hold motorists up when im single file!

Obviously on a wide enough road they can get past me when there's no oncoming traffic. In narrow country lanes I pull over at the next gateway.

Sometimes on narrow lanes a car has to pull into the verge for me. I always thank them. But I guess they're the one taking up more than half the road width not me!

[VivaLeBeaver]

Deementedma, but the point is you would need to crawl along behind the cyclist until it's safe to overtake (ie, no oncoming traffic) whether it's single file or two abreast.

The danger with cycling in single file is that an impatient Motorist may not wait for there to be a clear road and overtake, squeezing two cars and a cyclist together when it isn't safe to do so. Which puts the cyclist in danger. Riding two abreast prevents drivers from doing this and potentially saves lives.

But God forbid you have to "crawl along" eh?

[UmmErrWhateves]

Of course there are lots of things that cause delays on roads but cyclists riding two abreast is a totally preventable delay.
I cycle in groups and when a car comes up we drift into single file and let them pass. In some circumstances we might stay two abreast for safety reasons but at the first chance we have we slip into single file and let the cars pass. It takes no time at all and doesn't impact on our enjoyment of our ride. I much prefer to let cars pass as it's more peaceful and I think it's safer. If I fall off my bike I would prefer to do it on an empty road rather than just in front of a trailing car.
i think it's rude to needlessly hold up other road users.

[GuybrushThreepwoodMP]

No, actually cyclists do have the right.
When will car drivers realise that they don't have more rights than other road users just because they are bigger and faster?

[dementedma]

Cyclists two abreast may be the same width of a car but are nowhere like the same speed. A line of traffic crawling at less than 10 miles an hour behind a cyclist or two is really frustrating. You may choose to travel at that speed, but you dont have the right to inflict it on every one else.

[SorchaN]

Thanks NochNur. I don't agree that 'chaotic' is, as you claim, 'absolutely always used' in the way you describe. I'd readily describe my own life as chaotic: three kids, two with disabilities and everything that goes along with that, a full-time job that involves a lot of extra hours, etc, etc.

I'm sorry you were offended, and it wasn't my intention to offend you with the word 'chaotic', although I'm fairly sure that some of the words you used to characterise me, such as 'narrow-minded' and 'smug', can be considered offensive too.

I didn't say that I never get frustrated by being held up; I said that I don't understand why cyclists engender this frustration. I just don't find it frustrating, although it's a regular occurrence for me to find myself behind cyclists. I think it's because I see them as having just as much right to be on the road as I have - I also don't feel frustrated being held up by horses or other road users. I guess I can't really share your perspective because I don't share your attitude to other road users.

Oh, and I've never been half an hour early for an appointment! Unlike in Germany, roadworks pop up everywhere at a moment's notice .

[NurNochKurzDieWeltRetten]

Sorcha you wrote "I simply don't understand why trailing behind for ages is such a big problem..."

I gave an example of why it might be a problem for somebody (me, but in fact many people are in similar situations). I used words like occasionally - getting stuck behind groups of cyclists is not occasional but it being particularly frustrating or making me late is occasional.

You responded by saying my life is "chaotic". That is such a loaded and emotive term. It is absolutely always used to refer to people at crisis point who can barely cope with keeping their children clean and clothed or getting them to school most days - usually people who's lives are out of control due to addiction or abuse or destructive relationships and who can't hold down jobs and have social services involvement...

It is such an offensive thing to say based on somebody trying to explain that their schedule (like most people's even if not yours for some reason) can be tight enough to make "trailing behind for ages" frustrating occasionally.

I apologise somewhat if you were somehow not using chaotic in this loaded way - but it read very condescendingly indeed, coupled with your advice on how I should change my life, and reflection on your superior patience and planning skills.

I have said time and again it's not a big deal and feeling occassionally annoyed the cyclists don't use the cycle paths (which local to me are the ones I posted photos of) does not mean I drive impatiently.

The reason cyclists in groups riding several abreast are more frustrating in this situation than say a tractor is precisely because there's a cycle path right there, sitting empty while they slow a 100 kmph road to 10 kmph until such a time as gradually each car manages to overtake. One cyclist is never really a problem except on the very narrowest, steepest stretch of road where bends and hill crests are blind, so if you are behind a cyclist at all you cannot overtake - again there is a cycle path which would be safer for cyclists themselves but is less direct.

There are never traffic jams due to sheer weight of traffic locally - there are traffic jams caused by obstructions. Most are unavoidable. To be honest anyone who has never felt a bit frustrated being held up must be so laid back they are horizontal, and anyone who leaves in enough time for any eventuality on every journey must never combine tasks with set times into a single journey, and must spend a lot of time hanging about at all the appointments they are half an hour early for.

[Mistigri]

I think it's worth considering at this point all the times you've been held up on the roads, and whether the cause of the delay was cyclists or motor vehicles!

Cyclists cause a tiny fraction of the delays experienced by motorists, and I'm at a loss to understand why delays caused by bikes are so much worse than hold ups caused by routine heavy traffic.

[tarantula]

Most of us have had to do that dash to school to pick up a sick or injured child and had to endure the hell of getting stuck behind slow moving vehicles. You happen to have been in a car behind a bike. I happened to have been on a bike behind a huge queue of cars. It happens to all of us and is frustrating but is not the fault of the cyclists.
I often need to get from a to b quickly for appointments, school pick ups etc. same as everyone else and in order to do so I use the best routes available which in many cases happens to be the road. My aim is not to inconvenience anyone but to get where I need to go as quickly and easily as I can while obeying the rules of the roads which includes not using cycle paths that were not designed and not suited for my purpose.