To think that 3 weeks wait for a GP appointment is too long

[theresnowheretohidewithachip]

Just been told that the next non-urgent appointment with any doctor in our practice (there are 5 GPs) is on 20th May. I feel exhausted, hungover and a bit dizzy and unwell and don't think it's unreasonable to wish to see a GP before then. How long do you generally have to wait for a non-urgent appointment where you go?

[Mushypeasandchipstogo]

I had exactly the same as you last weekend OP. I phoned up GP and was told no appointments available at all for last week. I told the receptionist that I was feeling very dizzy and she told me it was non urgent! Still feeling weird and giddy no point trying again on Monday as they will be shut! I should add that this was all on a premium rate number which our surgery still insists you phone up on.

[Thecircle]

I'm considering making a complaint to my gp practice but don't want to be labelled as a problem patient.

Ds is3 and has been quite badly constipated/impacted. Last Sunday he hadn't had a bowel movement for 6 days despite lactulose so I took him to ooh walk in centre. They prescribed movicol which ds has had before and advised to make an appointment with gp to discuss possible referral/long term treatment.

At our practice you can only book appointments 7 days in advance. Rang Monday to be told no appointment til the following Tuesday so to call back this Tuesday to book(as can't book more than a week in advance).

Was told the same Tuesday and Wednesday despite ringing before 9am on all three days. By Thursday ds had only had 2 small movements even with movicol and was beginning to get uncomfortable so I asked for an urgent appointment. Cue a grilling by the receptionist about ds, his poo and my administering of movicol. Was finally offered an appointment only to be handed a letter by receptionist on arrival saying "this appointment was for emergencies only, for those who are in great need of seeing a g.p. Perhaps your reason for needing an appointment could have been dealt with during a routine appointment"

Erm yes, it probably could! If you could have fecking given me one!!

Sorry for the rant

[FatalCabbage]

You aren't a problem patient if you make a calm formal complaint through the appropriate channels

That said, after my ordeal (see upthread) I complained by email. A day or two later I tried yet again to make an appointment, and unusually they first asked for my name (usually they only ask your name once they've found an appointment time to put you in) and I was given an appointment that I know to be just outside usual clinic hours so I am a bit suspicious that there was a post-it in the office saying "if Mrs Cabbage calls for an appointment with Dr XYZ, make sure she gets one!!"

I'm still waiting for their full response so we shall see, but I was very careful to be factual and refer to the practice's patient charter to show that they weren't meeting their declared obligations, rather than not meeting our "would like" list IYSWIM. I was sympathetic to the problems they are likely to face (growing patient list, finite number of doctors, reduced funding, etc) and focused on irrefutable facts. I made it "your processes either aren't being followed properly or need review" feedback to try to stay constructive.

There might have been one rather KAPOW paragraph about invisible barriers to treatment for anxiety and other mental illness though.

[ShadowFall]

Sounds like I'm pretty lucky with my GP surgery - usually if I ring up in the morning asking for an appointment, I'm offered either a same day or next day appointment, with no queries about whether it's urgent or not. They also offer same-day telephone consultations with GPs.

I've never had to wait more than 3 working days for a non-urgent appointment at this GP practice (unless I've chosen to wait for a later appointment because the earlier one offered is on an inconvenient day / time).

[Thecircle]

Thanks fatal, some helpful information there, I'll look on my practice website re charter.

Ironically last year our surgery underwent a huge refurb and the building is four times the size it was, we have more gp's than ever and more admin staff too.

I appreciate the demands placed on surgeries but I tried for four consecutive days to arrange a routine appointment without success despite phoning within 30 minutes of the surgery opening.

Using the same system earlier this year it took me 9 weeks of telephone calls to get the implant fitted

[FatalCabbage]

Yes, I think it's more productive to show that they're missing their stated aims (in my case I was able to show that their published performance figures were dodgy too).

Although in an ideal world we'd all get allocated a conveniently timed appointment as soon as we asked for one, that isn't realistic so they have to implement a best possible solution. Feedback helps them refine that solution.

Cynically I wonder whether things would improve if their performance statistics included how long patients had had to wait to book an appointment, from booking to the appointment time, and from arriving in the building to actually physically sitting down in the consultation room. Mine only publishes its figures for successful treatment, which obviously doesn't include people who gave up and went elsewhere (however inappropriately) or those who died waiting.

[Thecircle]

That's a good point, I was speaking to my aunt today who has ongoing health issues which require fairly frequent visits to gp for monitoring.

She has had the exact same issue this week and now has to ring on Tuesday for an appointment the following Tuesday.

I'm off for a look at the practice website now

[macdoodle]

Complaining won't help if there just aren't the GPs to see people? What exactly do you expect them to do? Personally after 20 odd patients I know no longer feel safe to practice. What do you think they're doing instead of seeing patients? Every single GP I know is working absolutely flat out.
Better write to your MP, but hey the government spin has been so successful that we all know that all GPs are lazy terrible overpaid fat cats. Flogging a dead horse is not helping, morale and recruitment is the worst I have known it in 15 years. It's going to get muchmuch worse.

[Thecircle]

Mac, I understand that gps are busy, I get that they work hard. I'm complaining about how appointments are issued.

It's impossible to book an appointment more than 7 days in advance, as I stated above I had to try for 9 weeks running to see a specific gp to have an implant fitted and had to take an emergency appointment for my son as I was physically unable to book a routine appointment, even ten days in advance.

Surely something can be done? A system which allows booking more in advance??

[maggiethemagpie]

Does your GP have a triage service? In which case you can speak to a real doctor that day, get assessed and if it's urgent they will see you pretty sharpish. If it doesn't I'd change to one that does.

[ThinkIveBeenHacked]

Go to a walk in centre?

[HolidayCriminal]

And GPs wonder why people go to A&E with minor issues. :(

[Thecircle]

No triage service, I DID got to walk in centre and was advised to see my gp within a week. I actually needed to anyway to get a longer prescription

[laura2323]

Its a 3 week minimum wait at my GP surgery too (8 GPs) but can only book appointments 2 weeks in advance, figure that one out! Emergencies only include serious breathing problems (but not my asthma....) and there is only the bog standard 10 min appointment, no urgent etc so it is apparently more "fair" for patients this way, even cannot see someone the same day for my 6month dd, though we are normally seen within 5 days. I also cannot request a certain GP unless it's the 1 female GP for "lady problems" (her words not mine! Plus her wait is much longer). We do not have our own GP, our GP is classed as the surgery at whole iyswim (on forms when asked for GP name just put the surgery name) and the practise manager is non existent and doesn't respond to emails/letter/phone calls.
Then the staff at the walk in centre wonder why they're always busy and in the end the amount of people who go to a&e are well above the norm. It's a joke. I'd change but the only other surgery that I live within the catchment area for is fully booked and apparently run on the same system.

[macdoodle]

Is no one listening to me, if 100 patients want to be seen within a week but there are only enough GPs to offer 50 appointments, there is no system which can magic 50 more appointments from fresh air.
GPs are already seeing 20 + patients in a session, we cannot safely work more or faster. And I am sorry but I have had a pay cut every year for 10 years while giving my staff rises and working harder year on year. I stay till 8 pm to finish the admin/letters/beurocracy. I cannot work any more hours and I certainly won't do for free.
exacEexactly do you suggest as a solution? You are free to move surgeries but all the surgeries local to me are in exactly the same boat.

[Groovee]

If I need to be seen I will see any doctor that day by emergency or as a call back which does a triage sort of assessment and can leave me a prescription at reception or free me an appointment.

The first appointment at the beginning on April for my GP was tomorrow! I've waited over 4 weeks. As I have chronic condition, I like to have continuity care.

[FatalCabbage]

mac we get that. But patients are going unseen who need to be seen. And presumably you see several patients every day who ought to have taken some paracetamol at home, or had a chat with the pharmacist in the chemist's.

If complaints aren't made, practices don't know and/or can't prove that they're overstretched.

[macdoodle]

We see a lot of unnecessary stuff, that has been governent driven for the last 10 years, more and more access with no means to control it. Complaining to us just takes up more time and energy and distress than we have. Do you really think we dont know it's a problem do you think I like not being able to see my palliative patients or those in need.
The problem is politics and funding. GPs receive less than 10% of the health budget but see more than 80% of the contacts. Government spin has made it our fault. Instead of theirs.
We cannot fix it we are fire fighting and drowning, complain to the government.

[macdoodle]

The government plan is to privatise general practice, see how well that worked for GP out of hours and the railways.

[Nosleeptillbedtime]

My surgery has open access where you can just turn up and be seen. Appts are normally quick too, next day or two if you don't mind who you see. It is why I have kept with that practice despit it being a bit of a slog to get to now we moved.

[FatalCabbage]

So your response to the complaint reads "We are sorry you had such a long wait; we are overstretched due to central government funding" or whatever, at which point the patient can escalate so it will be heard. But every complaint always has to start with the actual point of contact, that's how it works.

[macdoodle]

blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2014/05/02/jonathon-tomlinson-four-problems-a-typical-day-for-a-gp/

[FatalCabbage]

Actually, out of hours round here is so good people save their illness for the weekend

[macdoodle]

plus.google.com/app/basic/stream/z133s5rxlkrutxola22gf51gsmiuh35bv04

[grassroots]

Five weeks for a 'non-urgent' appointment for my son at the moment.