To have REALLY shouted at this woman

[BMW6]

Was walking home along busy main road with my dog (on lead).
See another dog approaching (staffie) 30 odd feet away, on a lead BUT lead is in the hand of a small child (5/6 yo). Mother of child walking behind about 15 feet.

I knew what was going to happen and I bet you do too.

Yep, the other dog clocked mine and belted towards us, pulled child over and lead out of childs hand, of course.

I had to stop her dog attacking mine whilst the stupid bitch ran over to grab her dog. Child crying (fell onto grass so hope more scared than hurt)

I cannot recall exactly what I said to her, but was along the lines of what kind of fool is she to let a small child "control" a dog - esp a staffie.



Sorry to staffie lovers, but I have seen too many staffie attacks and am terrified of them attacking my westie cross, he's been attacked 3 times.

[absentmindeddooooodles]

I do understand the comment " especially a staffy"

Around here they are definatley status dogs. They are strong and muscly and can look intimidating.

I know a few absoloutley gorgepus ones. The nicest, most loving and well behaved dogs I have ever met.

But that does not change the fact that they can be vicious. Lile any dog. The thing is because of the strength and history ( around here) of being used as fighting dogs, you just never know.

I have a gsd. Shes still under a year, very bouncy nippy and exciteable. For that reason alone I never let her off the lead if there is anyone around. Alot of people have preconceptions about gsd as they are trained to be attack dogs, and I wouldnt want to scare anyone.

I know shes not vicious. She gets over wxcited and nips a bit, never hard, never hurts at all, but I dont let her play with ds, and wont until she stops this.

Ive had dogs all my life.......my mum still has our lovely belgian shepars cross ones. The most gentle animals you could imagine. But I would never ever say that I knew 100% they would never hurt everyone. They are dogs. They are un predictable regardless of how much you know and trust them.

And anyway......they have fuck off big teeth, claws, can run fast and are strong ( some breeds) .....why risk it??????

The woman was a total tit to be letting a 5yo walk a staffie or any dog. Hold the lead together or attach another one no probs. That poor child could have been really hurt.

[usuallyright]

staffies are mostly lovely, but they're also very strong dogs capable of causing incredible damage if they have a moment of madness. Which can happen with any dog. But the nature of the breed means that staffies DO need to be watched more carefully. It's perfectly reasonable to be wary around such a breed. Staffies owners who take issue with this are frankly baffling in their naïveté/denial.

[loobywench]

Did anyone watch wonder of dogs the other night? Staffys were said to make the best family dogs and more people are bitten by Labradors every year! I have a staffy and she is great but I always put her on a lead when other dogs are around when we go on walks. She was attacked by a staffy cross in her own garden when it pushed its head through the bars and grabbed her cheek! She has also been attacked by an alsation.

[shewhowines]

It may be the owners fault, but that doesn't alter the fact, that statistics show a greater chance of being attacked by a staffie. I can see why people think it unfair that all staffies are being tarnished by the same brush, but their reputation is there for a reason...

[sparechange]

usuallyright I'm a staffie owner who is going to take issue with your comment that staffies need to be watched more than other breeds
They aren't more unpredictable than other breeds, they aren't more prone to mood swings or more protective and therefore likely to attack

It is utter bullshit views like yours that mean that so many of them are languishing in rescues while many more aggressive breeds are snapped up as family pets by naive people who have little or no knowledge of either the breed profile or dog behavior.

As many people have pointed out, the Kennel club only suggests 2 breeds of dog for families with children - Labradors and staffies. If they really needed to be 'watched more closely', do you really think the UK authority on breeds would make that suggestion?
And do you also think everyone who has any other breed in a family is being irresponsible for owning the 'wrong' dog?
I've got one of each, by the way, and they are both watched with equal care

[CatAmongThePigeons]

The adult owners have a duty of care to the dog, to train it as well as possible and to ensure it is safe when out.

When we had a dog, DS1 always wanted to hold the lead. He did sometimes but I had a tight grip, it was in quiet areas with no one around and he was never allowed to hold it alone.

I really do detest stupid owners of dogs. I do not want your dog to run up to my pram and try to get into it, or jump up at me or my DC. It's not cute, it's threatening.

YANBU OP.

[loobywench]

sparechange

[sparechange]

shewhowines
You are missing the point a bit here.
I presume you can accept the basic premise that any dog of any breed can be untrained and mistreated and it will show aggressive behaviour? That isn't unique to staffies or mastifs or any of the other 'status' breeds

So their 'reputation' is one of being mistreated by unsuitable dog owners until the point they become aggressive. That is nothing to do with the breed, and everything to do with the fact that they are the 'in' dog for some groups.

By the same token, you can't say that German cars are more dangerous than French ones because more people are killed by BMWs speeding than by Peugeots. It means that the sort of people who are likely to speed are attracted to BMWs.

So be wary of the staffie with a chain around its neck being dragged along by a hoodlum. But be wary of the spaniel or labrador they have as well.
But you have no need to be any more wary of the staffie family pet being walked in the park than you do the labrador. There is nothing inherently dangerous about staffies nor any reason to judge a family who wants to own one as they make wonderful family pets

[Sayitdontsprayit]

I am a staffy owner and it bugs me they have a bad rep. All the staffs I know are gentle, brilliant with children and mild mannered.

Especially a staffy

A staff is bloody strong. I think it's irresponsible to allow a child to walk them, but I also find it sad you find staffs aggressive with no basis.

My staff is lovely.

I think really I just wanted to talk about my dog lol

[sparechange]

looby
There is probably a good reason your staffie keeps getting attacked... Does she have a smiley staffie face?
Dogs are always looking at each other for body language signs to work out if the other one is friendly or not.
Smiley staffie face is often misinterpreted by other dogs as snarling - boxers have the same problem.
The other dog then gets on the defensive and attacks. My old vet said it was quite common...

[catsmother]

Phoolani has hit the nail on the head with her post.

I know someone who has a staffie - who has properly trained it, who cares for it properly, and who takes the responsibility of being a dog owner very seriously (as you should do with any breed of dog). I feel perfectly safe with this dog and am very fond of it.

However, you can't deny that staffies are the dog of choice for many selfish and stupid idiots who see it as a "hard man" status possession as opposed to a living creature with specific needs. Consequently, people with that particular mindset at best fail to train it correctly - which is bad enough - but at worst, brutalise the poor animal precisely so it will be aggressive and scary. My heart sinks when I see dogs with these kind of owners - both because it doesn't bear thinking about the "methods" used to deliberately create an aggressive, snarling, snapping dog and also of course because of the potential damage it could cause to other animals, and most importantly people.

With knowing all that - and having seen it for yourself - it's therefore not unreasonable that many people have an almost Pavlovian reaction (of fear and alarm) when they spot a staffie .... you can't help it, even if you know, logically that properly trained and cared for staffies make very good family dogs indeed.

It's tragic that staffies have such a bad reputation through no fault of their own - their reputation comes from the many lowlifes who own them (until they get fed up and dump them .... I live near a large animal shelter and visit it quite often, probably 60 to 75% of dogs in there at any time are staffies, and that's been the case for at least 5 years). However, it doesn't alter the fact that however sorry you feel for the dog, it's sensible to be cautious around the breed until you know that an individual animal is as well behaved and as safe as any dog can ever be.

[usuallyright]

utterbullshit views? Really, sparechange?
That's awfully awfully defensive.
You know I'm right. That's why you're so defensive.

[usuallyright]

shewhowines, staffies owners, especially mumnsnetter staffie owners, ignore the statistics!

[sparechange]

Proof children should never, ever be allowed to walk a dog (especially one as dodgy as a shar pei - a fighting breed)

www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=PN-MjUC4f9k

[Delilahlilah]

The breed is not relevant. Nurture has a massive impact on a dog' s behaviour. They behave as they have been taught by humans. Unfortunately, some humans should have neither responsibility for dogs or children.
OP I would suggest you read up on how important your body language is to your dog in these situations too. He will pick up stress from you and it will affect his communication with any dog that approaches him. It seems a lot of times that your Dog has been on the receiving end of aggression. I am not blaming you, rather suggesting that you may be able to make changes to help avoid it in future.
other dogs will approach yours, it is natural curiosity. They may just want to play. I think your fear is playing a part here, irrespective of breeds.

[usuallyright]

and sparechange, please don't deliberately misquote me.
I didn't say staffies need to be watched more than other breeds, so why you've put that misquote/thing I did not write, in bold, is very weird. Read my post again and please don't misquote.

[usuallyright]

what I said was:
'Staffies do need to be watched more carefully"
As indeed do some other breeds. Staffies just one of them.

[sparechange]

usuallyright
I know you are utterly wrong, and I suspect I know a little bit more about statistics which is why I am able to call bullshit on your feeble point which is based on nothing more than stereotyping and I suspect, passing off the number of Daily Mail scare stories as solid fact.

I will ask you again, if staffies are risky dogs (by the virtue of needing closer supervision than other breeds) why are they one of only 2 breeds recommended by the Kennel club as suitable for being pets in families who have children?

And yes, I am defensive because it saddens me enormously that there are so many of these misunderstood dogs languishing in rescue centres up and down the country, not to mention the hundreds more who get put down every day because rescues don't dare take on any more.

And the reason there are so many is because no one wants to see beyond the absurd scare stories and mock statistics of the nature you are peddling, and therefore won't consider owning one.

[shewhowines]

spare "So their 'reputation' is one of being mistreated by unsuitable dog owners until the point they become aggressive. That is nothing to do with the breed, and everything to do with the fact that they are the 'in' dog for some groups."

Thats exactly what I said. I agreed with you. BUT thats exactly why (as someone said) i get a pavlovain reaction and and am instantly wary. I KNOW its not fair on the lovely well trained ones, but their reputation is there because of the big number that are not so well trained. It is not fair but understandable.

[NotDead]

Fo the kennel club really only recommend two breeds for families with young children or is this 'Burberry Bullshit'?

[wordfactory]

I think staffies can be lovely pets.

But they are bloody strong. A child would struggle to hold them if they set off running.

[wordfactory]

spare the reason why rescues are full fo staffies is not because of scare stories.

It's because twats buy them and can't look after them!

[noddingoff]

Stinkyminkymoo is correct. Staffies are not a hunting breed - they were originally bred to fight and kill other dogs. Which is why I'm particularly careful about avoiding them when I'm out walking my pup, unless I happen to know that particular Staff.
When I'm vaccinating pups, I tell everyone about the importance of socialisation with people and other dogs, recall etc.
I spend more time emphasising the importance of recall to the owners of huskies, beagles and some others; the importance of discouraging mouthiness and getting the pup to accept close handling to all terrier owners and any pup that has already shown adverse tendencies in this regard; and the importance of early socialisation with other dogs to Staffie owners.
I think nurture is hugely important but you cannot totally disregard nature either. I think it's very unreasonable to let a child walk any dog that is big enough to pull it over, unless the dog has been proven to be rock steady in all sorts if situations AND the parent is walking within grabbing distance of the lead so that they can gain control quickly if necessary.

[Toadinthehole]

My PILs are very much dog people, and at various times in the past have owned a Staffie, a rottweiler, and various other dogs, all of which they have trained and looked after very carefully. Before anyone wonders, they live in a country where having a big dog isn't a status symbol. They say:

a) Staffies are by temperament friendly towards humans
b) they are hostile to other dogs.

There is simply no way they would let a young child walk a Staffie, because of the temperaments of that breed and because there is no way a young child could control a dog with its strength.

FWIW I thought Staffies were bred to bait bulls. They certainly are, in origin, fighting dogs rather than hunters. Their own Staffie pretty much yanked my arm off on a number of occasions.

Lovely dogs though.

[NotDead]

my grandad smoked 40 cigarettes a day and lived to 100.