To think prisoners shouldn't be allowed to smoke?

[angelos02]

In the new today it said there is a pilot about to be done in some prisons to not allow prisoners to smoke. I think this is fair. People that haven't broken the law can't smoke at work, in pubs, cafes, shops etc so why should criminals be allowed?

[DipMeInChocolate]

If they're paying tax and duty on their cigs. Sure why not?

[EST0106]

What catsup said, I also work in a prison. Pregnant PO don't have prisoner contact, prisoners can only smoke in their cell, I.e. equivalent of their 'home', PO's don't tend to spend a lot of time in prisoners cells, unless they want a cheeky fag IME!
Stopping prisoners smoking full stop, which is what is proposed (including outside) would be extremely hard to enforce and likely to lead to significant unrest. I don't think the risks of second hand smoke make this a proportionate proposal.

[zatyaballerina]

yanbu, it's horribly unfair to prison officers and non smoking inmates to be exposed to the health consequences of breathing in second hand smoke. It's not allowed inside nursing homes, hospitals or hospices all of which are homes to people, why should criminals be any different and those who have to live with and work with them have less rights?

Criminals will be a lot less likely to do the crime if doing the time is actually punishment for them. It would be a good deterrent.

[morethanpotatoprints]

*MrsDeVere

a poo in front of big Mike, lmao.

[zatyaballerina]

Ah but once they're in there...

[Casanunda]

Those amongst you that believe prisons are like 'holiday camps' really ought to get some first hand experience of them to make an informed decision. Might I suggest a spell as a Prison Visitor (less harsh than getting yourself banged up or applying to be a Prison officer!) so you can see what REALLY goes on behind bars? It's very easy to bandy opinions around blithely about punishment and rehabilitation - go and experience a taste of it. It WILL open your eyes

[cumfy]

Never really understood why there would be any supply of tobacco whatever in prisons.

It's a nutty idea.

[wanderings]

'criminals are not generally known for their forward thinking and good decision making' (I paraphrase).

As said by Mr McKay in the film "Porridge":
"Rob now, think later, that's the criminal's motto."

Another observation by Jeffrey Archer was: drug testing in prisons was brought in by Anne Widdecombe. Why? Because she thought it would be a good political idea. Here is what she didn't know, but what the prisoners did:

Cannabis remains in the body (and can be detected by a drugs test) for 28 days. Heroin, on the other hand, can be totally flushed out of the body in 24 hours by drinking loads of water. Result? Prisoners who might only have been on cannabis when they go in are addicted to heroin (much more dangerous) in no time at all. Drugs are readily available in prison; indeed it's known for dealers in prison to make more money than they do out.

So, Anne Widdecombe's decision might have seemed like a good idea to her, but from her ivory tower she knew little about the unintended consequences.

[Chesntoots]

I'm sure if they bring this in me and my colleagues will be spending many a happy hour kitted up...
I don't smoke and some cells make me want to gag, but bringing a ban in without proper thought and process will not go well.
Non smokers are not supposed to be padded up with smokers.
As soon as an officer declares that she is pregnant she is no longer allowed prisoner contact.

[wanderings]

In another book about prisoners' accounts of life inside: one woman in prison told of an officer saying to a crowded wing of about 80 prisoners:

"Sorry, your visits today have been cancelled, because we are understaffed."

You need only imagine what the next hour was like.

[WilsonFrickett]

I think most of the people with the 'bang 'em up and take their fags' mentality really don't understand the basic premise of UK prisons. I know there are POs on here who will know better than me, but there are a lot more prisoners than prison officers. For a prison to function at all there has to be co-operation - just like in a high school, which is something maybe more people can relate to?

If 300 16 yos don't want to be taught, the sheer force of numbers will quickly overwhelm the teaching staff. It's the same in a prison - except doors can be locked and people can't get out.

We don't like to acknowledge this - we like to think of people being punished but prisons are as much about taking people off the streets (unfortunately) as they are punishing and rehabilitating. They already have the potential to be powderkegs. Take away the nicotine (and up the heroin) and it has the potential to not be very pretty.

But really, my main objection is it serves no purpose. It's impractical and it won't have any positive impact (except that prisons won't smell of smoke).

[MalcolmTuckersMistress]

I'm really surprised by how I feel about this. I was totally against them having the vote, or ever being able to take legal action having slop out while inside, but, I think this is actually pretty unfair.

Prisons are there to rehabilitate and I think there is enough to deal with without having to deal with prisoners who are going bonkers because they can't smoke. I'm sure I hear that 4 out of 5 prisoners smoke, so that's a LOT of angry people to deal with.

[Maryann1975]

Saskia, yes service personel can go outside, but why should they? Their room is their home and believe me, some of the accomodation is so unlike home, im surprised it can even pass as accomadation fit for humans. They defend their country. They can be called on at any moment to do this. They get drug tested and will be dismissed if there are drugs in their system and for what? So prisoners are allowed to smoke in their rooms and are taking smuggled in drugs with no consequence. I am proud to be married to a military veteran, but get so annoyed that prisoners in cases like this get better treatment. (For the record, my DH and I have never smoked, so it never affected us).

[pointythings]

I think this has nothing to do with prison officer welfare and everything to do with the government posturing because they want to look tough on crime and draw attention away from UKIP. It will achieve nothing but unrest and misery for a lot of already very vulnerable people. The impact on remand prisoners alone should be enough to stop this in its tracks.

[IAmNotAMindReader]

This could go horribly wrong as inmates with no access to other means of managing nicotine withdrawal may turn to other substances to try to ease it.

[Hulababy]

I think the rule that they cannot smoke inside is fair enough.
IME all prisoners have at least 1, if not 2 or 3, exercise sessions in the yard each day - they will still be allowed to smoke then ifaik.

It is not fair on other non-smoking inmates to have to share with a smoker. It is a hazard to their health. Whilst prisons technically have smoking and non smoking cells, in reality it often happens that this cannot be kept to, due to overcrowding, and ime it is always the non smoker who has to compromise and put up with it.

it is also a workplace for staff. They should not have to have their health compromised by being in enclosed area whilst people smoke. I have done it - it isn't pleasant when there a group of smokers puffing away when you are trying to talk to them in a small room.

[Hulababy]

BTW - cells are a work place for many prison staff. They are expected to enter cells for various reasons. the cells are not just a home for a prisoner.

I also don't buy the whole "only vice" line. Alcohol may be someone's only legal vice. They are still not allowed that in prison either.

[ilovesooty]

I think pointythingsis right.

It's pretty obvious that a lot of posters have no knowledge or understanding of prison at all

If some of their wishes were implemented we would be moving toward the American
model and the potential for violence is a horrible prospect

[catsoup]

on a lighter note If smoking was banned in prison then we would have nothing to mask the smell of the actual jail such as someone not having had a wash for days on end and the smell of food crushed into the carpet and not being cleaned properly. We need the smoke!

[MrsTerryPratchett]

As someone who has worked with ex-offenders, done prison interviews, volunteered in prisons and spent a good deal of time in them, can I ask that people who haven't stop with the bollocks about 'Butlins' and 'holiday camps'.

Self-harm, suicide, bullying, MH issues, personality disorders, missing family, not seeing your children every day, assaults, lack of freedom, lack of privacy, loneliness, fear, loss of sense of self... this is the reality. Even in 'cushy' prisons.

I wouldn't want to be in prison, even with a TV and fags.

[cumfy]

Prisoners are deprived of freedom, their own clothes, alcohol, sex and their dignity.

Depriving them of tobacco is a far, far more positive, healthy and humane measure than the above.

[ilovesooty]

I'm sure the prisoners will see it that way
cumfy

And what about the ones on remand?

[AlannaPartridge]

Oh, really, Cumfy? So on top of everything else, they are forced to give up smoking whether they like it or not - just because you think it's "healthier"?

Going to prison is the punishment - not what happens once you're in there.

[lljkk]

Actually, I would really like prisons to be about rehabilitation & reform. Radical heretical impossible thoughts, I know, I know.