to listen to Jamie Oliver on Radio 4 and want to throw things...........

[catinabox]

He's not really doing himself any favours is he?

[Nancy66]

Expat - that's fair enough, thanks.

Twisty - yes, buses can be expensive but when you take into account the local shop that's charging you £2 for a loaf of bread or £1 for a pint of milk it probably evens out

[Crowler]

There is no way that lack of access to good groceries or shops can account for the way that huge numbers of kids are eating in this country.

I live in walking distance to North End Rd which has a fairly famous daily fruit and vegetable market, as well as scores of diverse African/middle eastern/asian shops that have fresh everything - and the Iceland, set in the middle of all of this, is always heaving. It's a typical Iceland customer base, and they are buying frozen rice, frozen potatoes, vegetables, pies - everything frozen. Queues so hideous I rarely get through one, I almost always defect.

People who can't shop through isolation are not really the reason that this country is in the midst of an epidemic.

[Hamwidgeandcheps]

He's just saying uncomfortable truths. The health and nutrition of your children should've your top priority. For a lot of families it isn't, despite the excuses. Parents make a conscious choice to feed their kids crap.

So flame me.

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

What are the people in deprived areas whingeing about then, if Ocado deliver!

[YouTheCat]

A lot of people in poverty can't afford to do an online food shop because of ridiculous 'ghost' payments that send them overdrawn and the fact that you have to spend over a certain amount in the first place.

[TheOriginalSteamingNit]

Again: when you're skint, you very rarely make the economies of scale possible by doing weekly/monthly shops. You shop day to day. This is why there are savings plans for Christmas shopping (farepak?) - because you can't just go in December and do it all at once, any more than you can go and do a big shop in a supermarket every Saturday and spend £80-100: even if that would save you money in the longer term!

[IceBeing]

It's cheaper to eat crap than home cooked food made with fresh ingredients. FACT.

For a family of 4 you need to be able to spend at least 35 quid a week on food to avoid mwave meal hell, and about 45 quid a week to get fresh ingredients for cooking.

If JO and his supermarket sponsors actually want to help (rather than just mouthing off) they should sell fresh ingredients cheaper. FACT.

[PeanutButterMmm]

I don't always buy the i don't have the time arguement when it comes to cooking because so many people have plenty of time for other things such as MN, Facebook, the internet in general.

Some people enjoy cooking and it's a pleasure, some don't like it and find it a chore and some are inbetween. However, surely every parent has a responsibilty to prepare and feed their children the best food they can afford, even if it means you go without some luxury items or downgrade in something elsewhere. Is that not what Jamie is saying?

Friday16 was right i saying trollies are filled to the brim full of shite in supermarkets (apparently stacks of crisps, chocolate bars and fizzy drinks are essential items) and if you took them out of the trolly and put in proper ingriedients to make meals with the bill would be the same if not cheeaper. The junk is okay sometimes but not if people are forfeiting decent healthy food in order to buy it. Healthy food is cheaper to buy then junk.

Most people have the internet nowadays, on the internet is thousands of recipes of all kinds, youtube and the like do videos on how to cook certain dishes, delia started a FREE cookery course online, the library has free books on cooking, some childrens centres run courses on cooking/healthy eating etc. It's everywhere and it's about helping yourselves with the resources out there instead of using the same old lines of "i can't afford to eat healthy food" and have no time when actually if you can afford to eat expensiveunhealthyfood then you could afford to eat healthy food also. I agree schools should be doing decent cooking lessons also to help things.

[lottieandmia]

I thought the same MrsDeVere. And yes it's so true that if you're broke you have to shop day to day.

[catinabox]

But are there really people who live on estates that are so isolated that they don't have a supermarket within a 30 minute walk? that there's not a bus they can catch to a shopping centre or market?

Yes there are. And if there was a supermarket within a 30 minute walk how practical would it be for a parent with young children to make this trip and carry a load of heavy stuff home? Yes possible but bloody demoralising in the rain when people are driving past in their nice warm cars. I wouldn't want to face that regularly.

Briliant post friday you are right, it is complex. There are studies on food deserts and the findings are very much that they contribute to poor health, and food poverty. The government actually stated this in a study undertaken about tesco growth. (Please god don't anyone make me find this!)

But what you say about sainsburys etc in your local area, that is a fair comment but if you live a long way from the supermarket, dont have transport buying fresh produce is not going to be cost effective if you are doing a fortnightly shop when the money comes in. Also sainsburys are REALLY expensive!

I do a round trip of 25 miles to go to the ethnic supermarkets every now and again as i love the variety and the cost is tiny in comparison. I batch cook stuff and stick it in the freezer and stock up on spices and stuff. It's a nice afternoon out too. BUT I am middle class and have money and a car and food is fun for me and not a big issue of resourses.

I think that is also a massive factor. How we feel about food. If you are hungry and scared you can't provide enough of it, there is little choice, the relationship with it is very different.

[IceBeing]

(apparently stacks of crisps, chocolate bars and fizzy drinks are essential items) and if you took them out of the trolly and put in proper ingriedients to make meals with the bill would be the same if not cheeaper.

This simply isn't true. Price per calorie on the things you list is very very much lower than for 'proper ingredients'

lentils are twice as expensive as chocolate biscuits per calorie.

[Crowler]

Ocado has a 40 pound minimum spend, 25 on Co-Op. You may or may not be charged for delivery, depending on which slot you pick.
What ghost payments are you speaking of?

[HungryGeorge]

catinabox Mon 02-Sep-13 10:18:37

Going on about people in poverty wearing designer clothes and having electronic gadgets.....

and he has JUST said something along the lines of ' it hasn't been easy for me the last few years, i know people think i'm rich'

He hasn't got a blimming clue about poverty..he shouldn't pretend he has...



so his 'apology' on the webchat last week was bollocks then if he's still spouting the same shite. Not listened to him though.. will go read the thread now :o

[PeanutButterMmm]

IceBeing you can't write something is a "fact" when it's not. "Crap" as you put it is a very expensive way to eat. When you build up a store cupboard of certain ingredients over time (i don't mean in one shop and i don't mean Jamies products) you can make homecooked proper meals very cheaply.

[Penniepitstop]

Jamie Oliver employs 5000 people, that's a lot of responsibility. Yes, he probably is loaded but then again you need a lot of money coming in each month to pay 5000 salaries, i wouldn't want that stress. I agree with everything he says and good for him for having the guts to say it.

[lottieandmia]

'However, surely every parent has a responsibilty to prepare and feed their children the best food they can afford, even if it means you go without some luxury items or downgrade in something elsewhere. Is that not what Jamie is saying?'

He may think this. In an ideal world it would be great if this was the case in every family. But it's a complex issue and he is not well placed to spout off about things like this when he sells expensive fish fingers marketed at people who have the money to afford more choice about what they eat. And then to cast judgment on families who live a life he has no clue about. Most people in his position would realise that it's not appropriate to blab every thought in his head to the nation.

[YouTheCat]

Ghost payments are when they take a payment at the point of ordering and then take the actual payment when it is delivered (as the amounts may differ due to special offers etc).

The ghost payment is credited back to the account but it can take days to register and if you are on a tight budget that can be enough to send you into overdraft and incur charges.

[LRDMaguliYaPomochTebeSRaboti]

FWIW, cat, I don't think where I live is particularly isolated at all, but when I think about it, no, there isn't a free bus to any of the big supermarkets from here, and the nearest shop in town is a 3.30 bus ride away (and isn't so good for deals as it's a Tesco Metro not a big one). If you walked it'd be well over 30 minutes, probably more like an hour there and back. Other than that there's a couple of little corner shops, a M&S food at the petrol station and a Waitrose mini at the other petrol station (both charge more in these than at the regular shop).

There's council housing just over the road from me.

The bus takes me into town in 10-15 minutes so I'd never thought of it as being isolated at all, and I've got a city postcode. But when I think about it, it'd actually be quite tricky to get quickly and cheaply to the sort of supermarket where you could stock up at a decent price.

[IceBeing]

peanut it is a FACT that you can eat crap cheaper.

As only one example - this week you could buy 3kg worth of ready meals in Iceland for under £5. You cannot make that cheaper.

This thread was devoted to the exercise of working this kind of thing out and the answer is that you can eat enough for a family of 4 for about 26 quid a week eating ready made crap.

If you can beat that with a home cooking recipe collection then go to it! But many many people on the thread tried and failed.

[PeanutButterMmm]

A bag of lentils will last over a number of meals, a pack of chocolate biscuits A) Isn't part of a meal and B) Would not last 5 minutes.

Say you pay £1 for a pack of biscuits and £1.50 for a bag of lentils. "But the lentils are more expensive" you might say - well the lentils will go far and last a lot longer, the biscuits won't.

[IceBeing]

peanut you wrote that it is cheaper to home cook as if it was a FACT. You are the one writing things as facts that are totally incorrect.