to argue with MIL about breastfeeding?

[avoidingarguments]

I have had two babies who I breastfed for 1 year each, I fed on demand. I am now pregnant with my 3rd. I mentioned to MIL I was dreading the initial 6 week period where the baby just wants to feed all the time, and she said my first two were very strange for wanting to do that, and this time hopefully I will have a normal baby who feeds every 4 hours. I should of just smiled and nodded, that is what I normally do in these situations, but I am 8 months pregnant and things like this get under my skin at the moment as I know what I am doing with my own children. My reply was that it is normal for breastfed babies to feed an awful lot in the first 6 weeks, and she said no it is not all other babies feed every 4 hours they should not be feeding all the time. I answered that the 4 hourly routine is outdated now and that the nhs say babies should be fed on demand. She got really angry and said the 4 hourly routine was invented because it worked and it worked for all her 5 children and she has bought up 5 children so she knows what she is doing and the nhs and midwives don't know anything. It actually got very heated and I know this time she will be round visiting telling my DH I am over feeding my children and babies only need 6 feeds a day (luckily my DH ignores her!). I know I am hormonal at the moment as I am 8 months gone but I wish I had just smiled and nodded at her and feel like I should not have caused an argument, I normally keep my views to myself but to be honest am sick of all her outdated advice. She will also be phoning me telling me to give the baby water or it will dehydrate I imagine as that is what she did with the last two, even phoning my DH at work on a very hot day before!! AIBU to have got involved in an argument, I should have just smiled and nodded and ignored shouldn't I?

I feel really bad tonight as I do not like arguments, and am now dreading all the comments at family events about my strange over feeding babies as all others in her family seem to do 4 hourly bottle feeds. She breastfed for a couple of weeks 4 hourly but said she was such a busy lady her milk was not good quality, I said that was because she fed 4 hourly and that just made the argument worse :( why oh why did I not just smile and nod :(

[2rebecca]

The desire of relatives to feed babies is a bit odd, it's not that interesting. It's a shame it doesn't last until the kids are weaning and toddlers and feeding turns into a palaver, they aren't all queuing up desperate to feed the child then!

[BegoniaBampot]

Prettyplease - good for you, you sound like a strong mum, know it's often harder for teenage mums to BF.

[prettypleasewithsugarontop]

I was a teenage mum, and bf my DD1 for 16mth and DD2 until she was 9mth. My family used to get all funny.with it. Its not as iff i was whipping my boob out and waving it in their faces, i had a cover etc. They used to moan that they wanted to feed baby (two babies with v. v. strong feelings against bottles, so expressing wasnt an option) that baby was too big my DDs were both above the 99th percentile and following their own lines, and hell i didnt think you could have too big a baby with a DH at 6ft 2 lol. i was bottlefed as was my mum so i think.it was a bit of a shock to them that i did, but i loved it still miss it 5yrs on

[2rebecca]

I don't argue with people I disagree with when I know I'm right and have no intention of changing my mind. I firmly state my opinion and tell them I'm doing things my way and change the subject. It takes 2 to have an argument, if you refuse to discuss the subject then she'll just look like a loon ranting on her own.
I wouldn't let her go on about the boiled water again either
"I know they gave boiled water when your children were babies but they don't now so please don't mention it again to me as I'm not going to keep arguing with you and this isn't helping our relationship. You have to accept that I am breastfeeding and using the current guidelines"
It sounds as though you visit quite alot though, maybe cut back to once every few weeks as you don't seem to like each other.

[storynanny]

It doesn't matter if your MIL is right or wrong about anything, it's your baby not hers so take no notice. Our job as MIL is to support our DIL to do it their way whatever our personal opinion is.
I'd like to write a book about MIL sayings, I think the most common one would be " you're surely not giving him/her more milk are you?"

[CecilyP]

BegoniaBampot I wish they were pulling my leg! They really do feed their 3 month olds chocolate, mr whippy icecream etc, I have seen it with my own eyes many times. One little boy in the family got told off for trying to give a 4 month old at a family birthday a walkers crisp, the mum said no he is only allowed skips, monster munch, wotsits or quavers they are the crisps that are suitable for babies.

You couldn't make it up. With all there great knowledge of babies, perhaps you could ask them what crisps were suitable before skips, monster munch, wotsits or quavers came on the market. But it isn't really funny; while cooled boiled water won't do a baby any harm, this is positively dangerous - all these snacks contain far too much salt to be given to a baby.

I don't think you were remotely unreasonable getting involved in an argument if she just goes on and on and won't be told. Your behaviour is normal - nothing to do with hormones. I would be more tempted to take her views at face value and question and question till she ties herself in knots - but that is just me.

If you want to read an interesting book about the history of childcare, try to get hold of Dream Babies: Childcare advice from John Locke to Gina Ford by Christina Hardyment. It might help you detach a bit.

[CecilyP]

When did four hour feeds become outdated? Serious question because in 2011 a midwife told me to feed every four hours as did a nurse and Hv. After two weeks of screaming I fed more often and it turns out my baby was starving. It make me cry even now thinking of her being starved on the opinions of medical staff who said she was crying at stomachache of overfeeding!

I don't know exactly, but DS was born in 1987 and they were already outdated then. Even when 4 hourly feeding was the norm, 3 hourly feeding was recommended for very tiny babies. Even Doctor Spock in the 1960's, after a few pages of feeding routines, mentioned that some mothers fed on demand - and that was alright too.

[avoidingarguments]

Yes I think I will just try and get some rest these last couple of weeks and try and laugh to myself in her head when she starts her advice, at least we only visit once or twice a week for a couple of hours and some weeks not at all if she is busy, it is just the family events I find hard as they are a large family there are quite a lot of 60th birthdays, 30th birthday etc etc but I can't really avoid them or I would be cutting DH off from his family, at least he sticks up for me when we are there but he ends up getting a bashing from everyone as well. All his relatives just think we are weird for breast feeding and not using a dummy, they think we have no idea what we are doing as 4 hourly feeds and dummies in between is what they say everyone else does. I have no problem with what they do as it is up to each family to decide what works for them and what they are happy with, but as I do not preach to them I cannot stand them preaching to me, and I get told the World Health Organisation, NHS, Midwives etc talk a load of rubbish. At least my DH tells me to just ignore her and follow current NHS advice. As this is a summer baby I can see the cool boiled water is going to feature heavily every time we go to visit though. Oh the joys of parenting, the baby is easy to care for compared to putting up with the relatives lol.

[ithaka]

My MIL was obsessed with giving my BF baby cooled boiled water, or she would die of thirst. My MIL didn't BF, but checked with her mother, who did and this great authority informed her breastmilk was food, but they also needed to drink. MIL explained all this to me in the most patronising of tones.

I explained this was incorrect - breastmilk was all baby needed. But she wouldn't let it go - cooled boiled water, cooled boiled water - every time we saw her.

I asked my mum for advice. Her view was that baby wouldn't touch cooled boiled water and would spit it out, so just let MIL faff about with kettle and teaspoon (we didn't have any bottles) to shut her up. So I did. I prefer the path of least resistance with irritating inlaws. DH & I still joke about cooled boiled water.

[Katienana]

I was told at least every 3-4 hours, ie wake up to feed. Only needed to do that a few times! Was told to feed on demand as well (ds is 6m).

[katkit1]

Sleepyhead - is it wrong that I'm day dreaming about 10 nights of sleep and a nurse looking after my baby - ooh lovely. Just day dreaming though

[Emilythornesbff]

OP
YANBU.
oxfordbags thank you. Another thread where I don't have to think about how to word my response because you've said it so well.
Plasticlentalweaver* I was thinking the same thing. The conversation mum andieces had about weaning

I should have smiled and nodded.

I wonder what I'll be like as a mil (if ever blessed)

[HorryIsUpduffed]

I was told 3-5h in hospital in 2011 but that was "at least that often". It is a reasonable average for a new parent to keep in her head - in a 24h period there will generally be at least six feeds.

Trouble is, it is sometimes delivered as "make him wait at least four hours between feeds"...

[anonymosity]

you didn't need to smile and nod, for what its worth. Its your baby and your routine and you're the expert on your kids.
FFS you're 8 months pregnant, it was highly irresponsible of her to get into a heated discussion with you about anything.
I hope you get some rest now and have a good birth.

[sleepyhead]

LilQueenie, my experience is that a hell of a lot of HCPs (and I include GPs, Paediatricians, nurses, health care assistants, HVs in this) base their infant feeding advice on their own personal experience and that of family and friends.

When you know how little formal education HCPs actually get in infant feeding - I believe it's still a few hours for doctors, as students, you stop being surprised by this.

When I was having major bf problems with ds1 my GP at least admitted that he didn't know a thing about it, but the HV gave me loads of "advice" which contradicted the bf counsellor at the hospital. I don't believe a word of that advice was something she'd ever seen written down, possibly what her own mother had told her though.

[LilQueenie]

When did four hour feeds become outdated? Serious question because in 2011 a midwife told me to feed every four hours as did a nurse and Hv. After two weeks of screaming I fed more often and it turns out my baby was starving. It make me cry even now thinking of her being starved on the opinions of medical staff who said she was crying at stomachache of overfeeding!

[Pollaidh]

Sorry, forgot. Also I was on the receiving end of official advice from multiple countries, most of which was completely contradictory (swaddle child and keep very warm vs. do not overheat your baby). Also had my mother strongly supporting bf (which she had found easy), with my MIL (both staying) telling me formula was best and I shouldn't tire myself out bf...

[Pollaidh]

I just don't bother arguing when it gets like this, it's exhausting and you can NEVER win.

Some babies naturally fall into 4 hourly patterns, mine did, but it was just luck and a large baby with a big stomach capacity I think. I guess if you have one of those you might think it's normal but that's no reason to bulldoze other people.

My mother recently commented that my sister's 1 day post-partum stomach was 'really big, mine just popped back in immediately'!! Thankfully I put her straight before she said that to my poor sister, but she still maintains that hers just 'popped back in'. Rose tinted glasses...

[thomasmad]

I had this with my mother. Unfortunately she hated breastfeeding and constantly claimed to be "worried about my health" as I had lost weight feeding my first child. I had, had a difficult pregnancy but was actually my pre-birth weight once breast feeding. I bf him for 15mths but pretended to have stopped at around 12mths. It saved so much grief!!
A couple of years later I had twins born at 28wks. Fortunately despite being very ill, I had lots of milk and managed to feed them until they were term and were safely out of SCBU.In part I am sure that their good progress was due to their e.b.m, but I have to say they also did well on formula and having a 3 yr old and two prem twins wasn't easy with little family support. I feel happy with the decisions I made r.e feeding and I know now that my mum ( also a twin mum) - we were 6 wks prem, coped in the way she knew best. ( We were taken away from her and she had no choice but to bottle feed). When I told her I was expecting twins she said "Good luck to you - I just had to get on with it, so you'll have to!! So I did!! You know what is best!!! I have to say, she often comments how well our ds have done. I have to bite my tounge not to remind her of the words of our consultant in SCBU who commented that breast milk was like "gold dust". She tackled me when I was at my most emotional and said "don't be silly you can't breastfeed, those babies need bottle feeding". I'm not pro or anti breast or formula - but I think you know best.

[Nobhead]

I saw a good phrase written on MN once when dealing with "know it all, my 30 year out dated advice is better" bollocks from MIL or DM or any other "wise" person...simply repeat this "well when you have your next baby you can do it your way" usually shuts them up.

[maddening]

if she can't accept criticism she shouldn't dole it out should she!

[avoidingarguments]

I think she just likes to feel like she is always right. That is why I normally just smile and nod. I am tired though and fed up of smiling lol.

[Dahlialover]

PS, I can see that you can end up arguing about this sort of thing if you are v pregnant and hormonal, but what is MIL's excuse?

[Dahlialover]

My grandmother told me that in her day (1939) you fed babies every 3 hours for the first six weeks, then every 4 hours after that. She spent the first six weeks in a maternity home, away from bombs.

My twins (1month early) were tube fed every 4 hours in SCBU. Sometimes it came out through their noses. They reverted to 8 times and 9 times a day (small one) when they came out and were allowed to do their own thing. Much more civilised.

I found that they went 4 hours in the morning, 5-6 hours in the afternoon, every hour in the evening, 6 hours in the night (very approximate)

[avoidingarguments]

BegoniaBampot I wish they were pulling my leg! They really do feed their 3 month olds chocolate, mr whippy icecream etc, I have seen it with my own eyes many times. One little boy in the family got told off for trying to give a 4 month old at a family birthday a walkers crisp, the mum said no he is only allowed skips, monster munch, wotsits or quavers they are the crisps that are suitable for babies.

Yes I do come from a totally different background but I have friends from all different backgrounds including similar to my DH but have never met any other people that do these type of things. They think I am a snob and over protective because I never let my babies at 3 months eat all these things. One SIL started weaning at 8 weeks :(

They say to me 'poor you it must be so hard no knowing anything about babies as there are not many in your family, we were all bought up knowing what to do by copying our mums as we helped with our brothers and sisters.

There are more things that I have not said, I usually just bite my tongue but I feel I have reached my limit with them!!