Behaviour of friend's toddler at my house

[lilyleelee]

This weekend an old friend and her husband came to stay at my house with her 2-month old baby (an angel) and 2 and a half-year old girl (not so much of an angel).
I don't have children, so I'm not sure when children start understanding 'rules' and 'right and wrong'.
From the moment they arrived, the toddler was touching everything -- taking fridge magnets off the fridge, dropping and breaking them; picking up my mobile phone and pushing all the buttons; picking up a doorstop and pulling buttons off of it. I didn't say anything, because I was waiting for my friends to do that, but they never said a word. My husband did take an item off the toddler on the last morning, telling her she couldn't have it, which resulted in tears and whingeing.
I didn't really speak up (though I wanted to) because I felt it would be rude/unkind to tell off their daughter. I also kind of feel it should be the parents' job, not mine, to supervise her behaviour. I didn't want to cause bad feeling between me and my old and dear friend, but equally I now feel annoyed and would be reluctant to have them in my house again.
I realise that toddlers are into everything, but what about when those things aren't theirs, and they damage them?

[FireOverBabylon]

I think your friends are BU in two ways:

a) she didn't warn you to move stuff. I have a 3 year old have told my sister before we arrived for Christmas to kneel on the floor, with her legs straight up from her knees (so not sitting on her heels iyswim) and anything she could reach could be reached by a toddler. I'm happy to parent him properly, but please try not to put mobile phones, fragile ornaments, nail scissors within reach

b) not telling their child "no" when she was reaching for a phone etc. Fridge magnets DS has taken off and put back on. I wouldn't expect them to break so easily as yours have, but certainly she shouldn't be pulling buttons off the door prop, and I'd offer to mend it if my child did this.

Surely it's basic good manners to warn people what they're letting themselves in for, if they're not familiar with toddlers?

[iwantanafternoonnap]

I have a DS very into everything and just saying no once, twice 500 times just does not work and I know other people who have toddlers who are told no once and they listen. It is very different for every child and sometimes parents are just too knackered to constantly say no and follow their child around. I used to politely ask if I could move things out the way and close doors to reduce DS ability to wander. It was either that or leave as it just would not have been relaxing for anyone.

In fact I flatly refuse to go visit some friends because they have that much knick knack stuff lying around and are of the school of 'just say no to DS he should listen' Very stressful for me and really annoying to hear crap like that from people with no kids tbh who don't get that not all children listen no matter how many times you ask.

[AmberSocks]

normal behaviour of most 2 yr olds.dont be scared to say "no we dont touch this its my special "insert precious object here" most parents wouldnt mind you telling her what is andist ok to touch.

[saintlyjimjams]

maddening it's relatively simple to keep an eye on one child, becomes a bit harder with 2 or 3.

[fififrog]

Rather than concentrate on what went wrong, why not just give friend benefit of the doubt as almost certainly the little girl is affected by new sibling, almost certainly parents are shattered, and look to another visit. It is possible your friend felt comfortable enough with you to think you would say what was/wasn't ok to play with. I agree I would try to keep an eye on DD's inquisitive fingers myself but the new baby is a mitigating circumstance.

If you're really good friends don't let this visit get in the way. Next time, I'd say in advance "last time little girl was really into everything, is she still like that because if so I'll try to move my breakables out of the way but maybe you could keep an eye on her too?" And tell them the gates are for their own kids safety and the dogs need to be kept away from the kids. They should be willing to listen to those very reasonable demands. Don't feel afraid to ask the child not to play with certain things (but do so nicely!)

It sounds like you made a great effort with the sticker book, unfortunately toddlers can be of the persuasion where they get super bored really easily - mine is one - and it's unlikely you would be able to amass enough things of interest. It sounds like you don't minds kids though? We had friends to stay with their 2yr old before ours was even thought of and I was a bit shocked at first where his probing fingers took him (and also that his parents let him wander roun the house - but now I understand!) but in the end we had a great time as he found my teddy bear from when I was a kid and an old phone in a box of junk and he seemed happier having a couple of things that were kind of contraband but allowed.

Best of all, I'd randomly decided to make pasta - total genius! He came and helped and the two of us were busy for hours. We had a great time!

Funny, he was into the fridge magnets too, particularly two like turtles, and next time they stayed was about 2 years later and he said to me "why do you only have one turtle now?" Amazing!

[saintlyjimjams]

It might not happen again OP. I can usually tell which friends can cope with ds1 and which can't and stopped going to ones who can't - too stressful all round.

If they do come again (if you're happy to have them) then I'd move everything precious out of reach. It's likely to be WORSE next time though if the baby is more mobile. As you noticed 2 month old babies are on the whole pretty easy house guests. If they weren't that clued up on following one mobile child around they won't be keeping track of two.

[LoopDeLoops]

'Can we all come down and stay for the weekend?' Really? She really asked this? Sounds unlikely for the parents of a newborn and toddler.

[lilyleelee]

Loop: Yes, she really did ask that.

[maddening]

Saintly - why is the 2 month old crawling already? Sorry must have missed that - and there were 2 parents there but they must have had to keep their eyes on the miraculously mobile 2 month old.

If I was on my own with 2 children I might have enlisted extra help from the host - eg could you watch dc2 while I stop dc1 climbing the shelves but to comletely not discipline your own dc while it is destroying the home of a friend who has welcomed you in is plain rude.

[saintlyjimjams]

I didn't say the 2 month old was crawling. I said if they visit again the 2 month old will be more mobile next visit.

The problem with a tiny baby & toddler comes if you are feeding. With 2 adults and only 2 children it should have been manageable for one to follow and one to sit and feed (ds3 was very used to be fed while chasing ds1 up and down stairs on the move) but it soon becomes not much fun for anyone really.

IME

DS1 = nightmare (still is- don't take him anywhere unless our hosts are very relaxed, or very experienced)
DS2 = was a dream - could take him anywhere
DS3 = was a nightmare - although manageable by himself or with ds2 if stalked (but only manageable with ds2 because ds2 was so unnaturally good)

Combination of all 3, or even just DS1 and DS3 - unmanageable unless hosts very relaxed. (And I never sit down in someone's house- am always following the kids around).

Depends on the child/combination of children.

[midastouch]

Normal behaviour but i wouldnt have let my DS do that in someone elses house, or my own for that matter!

[KitchenandJumble]

Normal behaviour for a 2-year-old, every bit of it. However, it does sound as though the parents were extremely hands off and not properly supervising their child. Did they at least apologise and offer to replace the items their child broke?

I also agree that redirecting is a better strategy than just saying, "No." Show the child what she can play with, don't just take away the forbidden item. Also, how did your DH interact with the child? Did he intervene gently or did he just bark, "NO!"?

[VenusRising]

You must get out of the house on their next visit. Especially as I see they have a little baby. Normal into everything behaviour from the toddler, but perhaps too lax from her parents- they could be exhausted though.

Maybe take the toddler for a walk so they have a quiet time with the new baby.

Sorry, but you sound pretty clueless about children!

[nailak]

they probably thought you didnt mind coz you didnt say anything, they are not mindreaders! if i was at your house and my ds was playing with fridge magnets and you looked on and didnt mention it then i would assume you didnt mind.

[lilyleelee]

KitchenJumble: No apologies and no offer to replace. I take on board the redirecting thing we'll definitely try that next time. I do hope there is a next time I'd like to try to find a way for this to work for all of us.

[Lottapianos]

OP it sounds like you have been very thoughtful and accommodating and your friends have been rude and thoughtless. Yes it is normal 2 year old behaviour but absolutely down to parents to ensure that the little one is not grabbing breaking or damaging your things. It's your home and I don't agree with other posters that you should have 'child proofed' it beforehand. Even 2 year olds should learn not to touch other people's things. I can't believe they left the stair gates open after you went to the trouble of installing them!

[Yfronts]

I think it's normal for a toddler to be interested in things but it's not normal for parents just ignore damaging behaviour.

DS 1, 2 and 3 might have been interested but would have respected any adult direction to leave items alone.

The parents should have asked if their child was OK to touch items

[Dominodonkey]

"they probably thought you didnt mind coz you didnt say anything, they are not mindreaders! if i was at your house and my ds was playing with fridge magnets and you looked on and didnt mention it then i would assume you didnt mind."

Really even if your child was breaking a number of items.

Unfortunately OP there are a lot of parents in this world who are selfish, oblivious to anyone else's property or both. I agree with the other posters who said redirection is a good idea but for 2 of them to sit on their arses while their child repeatedly trashed your property is terrible behaviour. It's not the child's fault but unless they intervene the poor child is going to find itself a very unwelcome guest at people's houses.

[Booboostoo]

YANBU the fault lies with the parents for thinking that taking a newborn and a toddler to a non-child friendly house could ever go smoothly. Looking after a toddler is a tough at the best of times, they naturally want to explore the world and ideally you want a toddler proof room, loads of toys, patience and time; trying to do it with a newborn and in somebody else's house is not going to work.

[piprabbit]

The child was behaving perfectly normally.
The parents, on the other hand, should take a good look at themselves and start parenting.

[fififrog]

OP I can't believe people are saying you're "clueless" - that's mean! If you've not had them or had lots of contact how on earth are you supposed to know the sort of devilry they get up to! Like I said before, to me it sounds like you made a real effort and were caught unawares. Next time you will know!

[saintlyjimjams]

I do think OP that a lot of the child's behaviour is normal - but your friends were not supervising closely enough. IME people who don't supervise closely just never do, it's impossible to make them (And if it's my house I step in).

So if you want them to stay again could you cope with the toddler picking up stuff etc if corrected? Because I don't think you can do much about that - he sounds like he gets into everything. You can correct a child yourself if no-one else is but TBH I would just move everything out of the way. It is fairly easy to toddler proof - just put everything high.

I did mean to say earlier sympathy about the dog stuff, I get really stressed when visiting kids are full on with my dog and particularly when parents don't keep them away.

[nailak]

domino if someone came to my house and did that stuff, I wouldn't mind. Lots of people wouldn't mind, my mum for example wouldn't mind the fridge magnet and doorstep, I give my kids and my friends kids my phone, and so do many other parents I know. My 2.5 year old can take the ipad/iphone and put on games or youtube or iplayer, and if there are times we need to distract him we will use this. There are also some people and parents who would mind. If you don't say you mind, then people won't know. It is a simple matter of communication with the parents, the behaviour of the child, and the parenting methods don't really come in to it.

[BratinghamPalace]

Op I have three DCs. Soon to be six, four almost five and two three days ago. It is very rare for me to visit people's houses with the DC's. I prefer to go by myself. Some friends insist and it never goes well for me. I am uneasy all the time. I watch. I try to make that unhappy compromise between tears and touching. Everything is no in other people's houses! The conversation suffers. I much prefer to go alone or invite people to mine!

[nailak]

I agree, one of the reasons I do not visit in laws often is that I cannot relax, so i prefer not to take them. Instead of talking I am just saying "no, no, no". One eid there was tears all day as sis in law gave playdough as a present, but they weren't allowed to play with it.