to ask middle-lane sitters why they do it?

[Gentleness]

I'm not starting this thread to criticise or belittle at all, so please don't flame me. The audi thread just got me thinking about my constant mental battle to assume the best of other drivers. I have to, as I'm naturally a harsh critic and I don't like it in myself. But while I can think someone speeding is trying to get to their sick child, or someone dithering has had a bad scare, I struggle to understand the drivers who sit in the middle line on motorways. So, tell me why so I can train my brain to be kind!

[StuntNun]

But Horatio I'm talking about somebody unexpectedly braking rather than continuing at a steady speed.

[HoratiaWinwood]

Still, if I'm "steadily" gaining on somebody in lane 2, I will have pulled out to lane two or three before their braking would cause me to have to reduce my speed by 20mph.

[chris481]

A couple of people have said that it's not their job to make space for people joining the motorway (for example by changing to the middle lane.)

I always slow or change lanes to allow people in, and depending on the exact circumstances, think you might be selfish and relatively dangerous if you don't.

Someone from your camp wrote to a motoring columnist, looking for support, and were told that though the law was on their side, in reality common sense says that the driver on the main road has a better view and more options, so should be the one who goes out of his way to facilitate the merger.

[gymmummy64]

austenozzy I totally agree with your description - that's how I drive. Really not what some people are saying though

[Bumply]

I find the inner city section of the M8 disturbing where you can leave/join the motorway from the right most lane. Just plain wrong.

[gymmummy64]

austenozzy I totally agree with your description - that's how I drive. Really not what some people are saying though

[Sparklingbrook]

Thanks chris so we can be nice and move over?

[ivykaty44]

chris481 and you can not see that by slowing and changing lanes you may be acting in a dangerous way depending on the traffic on the motorway, the traffic joining the motorway - but you always do this.
I explained earlier why I would rather motorist didn't facilitate another motorist joining and why I don't like it myself when joining a motorway - if you change speed it is dangerous as i already judged your speed and am ready to join, change your speed and it makes it harder to know when you are going to pass. How do I know if you are going to facilitate or not? Better if no driver facilitates then everyone knows where they stand, if you have half doing one thing and half doing another it is confusing and confusion causes accidents.

I would rather live than have a flipping nice driver who killed me or my passengers or all of us

[ChocolateCakePlease]

chris481 yes thank you! That is what i keep saying too - that it is very selfish and quite bloodyminded to have the attitude of "the law says i don't have to move over or give way so won't."

When i learned to drive my instuctor even taught me to either pull over to the next lane or slow abit to allow others to join the carriageway as it's common sense and a nice thing to do.

Some people treat it like someone is pulling out in front of you from a side road which it is not, it is someone merging onto a fast carriageway so not the same thing.

Don't get me started on merge in lanes either! I would say the majority of drivers of have no idea how a merge in works either. Again it's not "pushing in" it's merging to form one lane.

[Sparklingbrook]

Yes it's suppose to work like a zip when two lanes merge into one Chocolate. It doesn't because none of the selfish buggers ever let anyone in. God forbid they should let a car in in front of them.

[Gentleness]

Don't you just read the road and respond accordingly when someone is joining and you are in the inside lane? So if they are travelling at roughly the same speed as you and you've got a decent gap ahead they could slot into, you stay where you are, possibly slowing a little or flashing to show your intent. If they are neck and neck with you for example, or if there are more than one car joining AND it is safe to move over then it helps maintain the flow of traffic to move over. And it is courteous too, but mainly it helps keep the flow of traffic safe for everyone. Like using the middle and outer lanes wisely to overtake 1 or several cars at an appropriate speed.

[ChocolateCakePlease]

I have had it from both sides of the field with merging. My way of thinking is when the road is at the point of going from two lanes to one, the car, which ever lane it is in, that is slightly more forward than the other is the one who goes ahead into the merge and it should work like a zip.

However, the amount of drivers who don't do this is insane! I have been on the inside lane and let the driver to my right ahead and then go to merge in after them only to find the next car to my right thinks they can squeeze in too if they stay close enough to the car infront. Likewise when i have been in the rightside lane and let the car to my left go ahead as they are slightly more forward only to then have the car behind them sqeeze in too or even speed up so i can't "push in" because i am in the right lane.

You should never speed up to overtake/undertake when a merge in turn is ahead because there should be a natural merge in point for each car. Some drivers are either impatient or bloodyminded.

[ChocolateCakePlease]

Gentleness i am talking about drivers who can see cars approaching from the slip and stay sitting in the inside lane (with a clear outside lane) and watch as all the cars try to filter on around them or have to slow down to a speed that will be dangerous to enter onto a fast carriageway (usually whilst they think if they look straight ahead they will be invisable.)

[comingintomyown]

Add it to the list of other talentless driving habits you see constantly displayed by people who simply should not be behind the wheel of a car

[Goldmandra]

Slip roads are designed to give drivers plenty of time to observe the traffic and work out the appropriate speed for dropping into a gap.

With a little anticipation nobody should need to suddenly slow down to make a gap regardless of whether the other drivers are choosing to make way for them.

I move into the second lane if both lanes are clear and I have plenty of time to indicate that this is my intention before doing so. This gives the driver on the slip road the opportunity to plan with that in mind. I don't shoot over at the last second to make room for a driver who hasn't adjusted their speed to allow them to filter into a gap. That would be dangerous.

[sudaname]

I hate it when people do this. Motorways are made so dangerous by people who havent got a clue how they work. When lane rules are followed properly they are safer than most A roads, B roads, country lanes or whatever.

I also absolutely hate it when people wont let you on the bloody motorway in the first place , so bloody dangerous , as you end up having to slow down or practically stop before joining fast moving traffic.

Oh god and dont even start me off on people who wont let you join a line of traffic because you have the audacity to be joining it from a filter lane. The ones who sit there staring determinedly ahead, lips pursed, driving bumper to bumper with the car in front as if to say 'No you dont - youre not pushing in front of me'.

Get a life you saddo s grip - it's a road, not a bastard supermarket checkout queue.

[complexnumber]

But then, if you are moaning about the person in front of you being in the middle lane, surely that means you are in the middle lane yourself?

So why do you have so much more right to be there than the person in front of you?

Lot of self righteous entitlement on this thread imo

[FlouncingMintyy]

Yes, lots of self righteous entitlement and a lot of people working themselves up into a lather about a minor thing which can hardly impact on their lives in a major way. It really doesn't pay to be driven absolutely mad by other people on motorways ... its distracting, bad for the blood pressure and probably makes you several notches less safe as a driver .

[austenozzy]

complexnumber - no, that's just what the OP was talking about - empty/quiet motorway, you're driving in lane one at a faster speed than some oblivious clod sitting in lane two at 60, so you either move across three lanes and back again, or undertake. They're making a three (or more) lane motorway into a single carriageway where cars of various speeds have to merge to go around one person.

Nothing to do with entitlement or self-righteousness; everything to do with oblivious drivers making motorways more dangerous than they need to be.

[NopeStillNothing]

What a ridiculous comment complex
Nobody is suggesting that the middle lane should never be used by anyone, that would make it a bit pointless.

[drjohnsonscat]

agree with complexnumber and flouncing. There is a lot of "get out of my way, I'm a better driver than you" on this thread which, imho, always makes people bad drivers.

FWIW I've never been on an empty motorway (London). I've certainly not come across middle lane drivers being a big problem - if they are there they are usually there for a reason (left lane full of HGVs doing 55, slip road coming up, whatever). I'm much more concerned about the reckoners on the road who want to travel at their speed regardless of everyone else.

[CarlingBlackMabel]

So if the motorway is almost empty or quiet, how is it an issue to move over an extra lane?

And to even contemplate undertaking as an option is hardly a good solution to middle laners.

And if moving into the third lane to overtake a middle laner is dangerous because the third lane is full of people driving bumper to bumper at 90mph (as I have seen on the M6) who is it, exactly, being dangerous?

I'm not defending lazy middle laning, but the reaction to it seems rather OTT. It needn't be dangerous - people's reactions can make it so.

[AllDirections]

The reactions are not OTT at all. If you've never driven on a non-busy motorway then I can understand people not understanding about the middle lane problem. If you're on a motorway that's chocca then you'll probably stay in the same lane but for other people not understanding why it's a problem, it's very, very concerning that you don't understand why it's so important to only use the overtaking lanes for overtaking.

[sudaname]

Yes completely agree Alldirections - it is a system, a very effective ,safe one for managing traffic, if used properly.

No-ones condoning undertaking, just saying it's one of only two ways to get past the middle lane hogger. Both ways are an unnecessary risk and the only other option is to drive slower than them and stay behind them in the inside lane - so in some cases doing 50mph or less all the way on your journey or till they exit the motorway.

None of these options are ideal or how it is supposed to work and yes l agree one would be potentially dangerous and another entails the extra unnecessary risk of having to go across three lanes.

What they all have in common however is that the situation to which they are the unsatisfactory solutions is directly caused by middle lane hoggers.

[FlouncingMintyy]

If you are sitting behind a middle lane hogger doing less than 70 when the left lane is completely clear then flash your headlights at them several times. This usually works. They will pull into the left lane and you can pull into the left lane as soon as it is safe to do so. Don't get het up about it!