To expect the NHS to pay for me to breast feed

[pamplem0usse]

OK so not quite:
10 week old DS has a cows milk allergy. He's EBF so the only solution currently is for me to cut out all dairy from my diet. I'm already a pescatarian.
Dairy free alternatives seem to be really expensive.... AIBU to think I should be able to be prescribed some of these given (a) the amount of money I'm saving them on hypoallergenic formula and (b) since I'm likely to save them significant amounts of cash by helping prevent further allergies develop....

[clemetteattlee]

There is a massive problem of diagnosis because they often present in the same way don't they (DS was very poorly) and yet paediatricians can be sceptical. And as it is often a diagnosis of exclusion intolerance and allergy are often confused and conflated. With a baby as young as in the OP the statistics suggest it is more likely to be intolerance (which is horrible at the time but can be "overcome") rather than allergy (which can sometimes also be overcome depending on the immune response and the allergen).

[FlangelinaBallerina]

Ducks the abusive post has now been deleted, but she was calling me stupid. I don't care, but what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. If my rude post goes, so does hers.

I have explained more than once now why the argument that people are saving the NHS money by not doing various risky things is not analagous to OP's or indeed relevant to discussion. Quint wasn't even the first person I said that too, it was Absy, which rather dumps on your suggestion that I'm somehow pointing Quint out. You evidently couldn't be bothered to look upthread to find my one remaining explanation as to why the 'I'm saving the NHS money by not doing X risky thing' doesn't work. I'll repost it:

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FlangelinaBallerinaFri 23-Nov-12 13:39:18


Absy, your analogy attempt is a failure. This is because the things you list won't automatically cost the NHS money. It is quite possible that a person could skydive every day then have a bottle of wine and 20 cigarettes when they land, and still suffer no health effects whatsoever. There is a correlation between engaging in these behaviours and costing the NHS money, but it is not inevitable or automatic. Whereas if OP stops bf, the automatic consequence will be the NHS paying for hypoallergenic formula, or for treatment when DS gets ill because of unsuitable formula. It is inevitable. A totally different situation to the one you describe.

I get that people think OP is taking the piss, but can we all try really hard not to be fucking stupid please?
-----------

The other has been deleted, but I said the same thing to Quint. Her choosing not to smoke bears no resemblance at all to OP, because OP is choosing to do something healthy rather than refraining from doing something unhealthy. I may have missed anyone else making the same poor analogy. If so, please do apply to them and anyone who has agreed with the poor analogies all the things I said to Quint that have been deleted and to Absy that haven't, if it makes you feel less like there's been a raving injustice.

[saintlyjimjams]

They can't always get it prescribed. Depends on the reason for being gluten free (mine never were although ds1 was prescribed soya formula). Tbh the gluten free alternatives are grim you're better off just eating non gluten containing foods.

I think I managed to prevent ds3 becoming severely autistic - the NHS and SS must owe me a fortune :shops for pad with swimming pool:

[ShellyBoobs]

...because OP is choosing to do something healthy rather than refraining from doing something unhealthy...

I chose to run, cylce and go to the gym. That's choosing to do something healthy. Why shouldn't I have my gym membership paid for, or a bike bought, or some running shoes?

[OHforDUCKScake]

I see what you're saying now flange I do.

I have to say though, I could be bothered to look upthread. Countless times in fact. I obviously missed that one post.

[ScottLass]

Whilst I don't necessarily agree with you that the NHS should contribute to a dairy-free diet for you, I do empathise as I am currently breastfeeding my cmpi DS (and he is also on solids too!). It can be expensive, but it doesn't have to be if you plan well IMO.

I try to buy soya milk when it is on offer as I do find that it is the one thing that is more expensive. I would say that dairy-free cream, margarine and yoghurts are comparable to their dairy counterparts in terms of cost. Yes, the free-from range is expensive and I do buy muffins etc from there but to be honest I think it would be cheaper to make them myself and they don't taste amazing anyway! There is a great thread on the allergy board about surprise dairy-free finds - things like own-brand Bourbon creams and Hobnobs - I eat these biscuits and they don't cost anymore iyswim. I'd be happy to help you think through some dairy-free substitutions that don't cost the earth if you want to say what you feel is expensive?

[CouthyMowEatingBraiiiiinz]

CMPI may be grown out of, and milder CMPA may be grown out of, but there is a very low likelyhood that my DS3's anaphylactic reaction to the smallest traces of CMP will be grown out of.

All a food challenge would do is send him into anaphylaxis, same as the skin prick tests do.

[OrbisNonSufficit]

YABU. I went dairy free for a few years (not allergic to dairy, but it can exacerbate other allergies) and I don't understand how it's expensive? Just don't use milk or eat things with dairy in them, you don't have to buy substitute products. But then I don't like cake or milky coffee etc so maybe it was easier for me as a result. As a side note, if you do get the NHS to pay can I please get paid for not being overweight / not smoking / eating healthy food / etc? I must be saving the NHS a fortune.

Side note: I didn't realise proteins can pass unchanged from the bloodstream into breast milk, now I do. Every day's a school day!

[LDNmummy]

"when DS was dairy and soya free I never bought coconut yoghurt LDNmummy. For puddings he had custard made with bird's eye custard powder and oat milk with fruit stirred in. I sometimes also stirred fruit into Oatly cream. I also made rice pudding, jelly with fruit and certain flavours of the old fashioned blancmange are dairy and soya free. None of those are expensive.

You don't NEED coconut yoghurt, there are plenty of low cost alternatives."

Trixy I was talking about a yogurt substitute specifically because I had talked in my previous post about her having a low level of good bacteria to ward of health problems such as thrush. Not a pudding substitute but a substitute for dairy products that carry the right bacteria to balance out her healthy flora. She has a lot of flair ups which I am trying to balance out with vitamins and freeze dried bacteria.

I'm also dealing with a toddler who is VERY fussy with what she eats and who wouldn't eat any of the things you have mentioned. Its hard enough to get her to drink milk. She will however eat yogurt. In fact its probably the only soft textured food she will eat. She wouldn't even eat pureed foods as a baby.

We usually give her oat milk but we can only get it at the larger supermarket so have been giving her rice milk this week as its the only non soya/ dairy milk available right now.

I think people who have opted to have a dairy free lifestyle don't realise just how much food produce is off limits if you have an actual allergy to milk.

[LDNmummy]

I actually didn't stop drinking normal milk completely before my daughter started eating solids. I still had it in tea and small portions to see if getting it through BM would help her build a tolerance.

I think in her case this actually worked.

[LDNmummy]

Also, it is expensive when a baby is dairy free, not an adult. There is a big difference I find if you are an adult because the range of foods you can/ will eat is much broader.

[BalloonSlayer]

This thread is making me feel frustrated with all the "well just don't buy dairy then, don't bother with substitutes, then it's not expensive" comments.

Most people in this country eat similar diets. They eat cereal with milk on, drink tea or coffee with milk in, have a sandwich for lunch and a hot dinner in the evening. Once or twice a week - or more often - they might have a bit of cake, or some chocolate. Maybe once a week they get a takeaway pizza, and when it's hot they treat themselves and the children to an ice cream.

I do not accept that if you are suddenly told you have to stop eating dairy because you are breastfeeding an allergic DC, that if you buy dairy substitutes so you can eat something approximating the food you used to be able to eat - which the rest of your family are still enjoying - is somehow being self-indulgent.

I've got 3 DCs - one allergic to milk, 2 not. If I took the advice on this thread I would let the two non allergic DCs have an ice cream but give the allergic one a bourbon biscuit. Or make the whole family eat bourbon biscuits on a hot summer day. Actually I have done just that, many a time. The times we have gone out with a pack of bourbons and not let any of them have an ice cream as there's nothing for DS1 and it's not fair.

But also I do think that my allergic DS should be able to have an "ice cream" so I do buy expensive substitutes, so he can have something that every other kid he knows has. I can afford it - lucky me. But still I get annoyed at the price. And I moan about the price. Which is all the OP was doing really.

And I don't expect to get given it for free, and I don't think the OP was either. She was just venting.

So NER.

[messtins]

YAB (a bit) U. I had to be dairy and soya free for over a year to BF DS2 who is intolerant. It's no more expensive - you don't need to buy "free from" foods, just shop around for brands that don't contain dairy. Calcium supplements if you need them are really cheap.
We got access to an NHS dietician and my DS had prescribed supplements, I wasn't cheeky enough to ask them to buy food for us...
I can see your point when celiacs get food on prescription though, hence you are only (a bit) U.
You could extend your point to say all BF mothers should be paid because they are saving the NHS money - it will never happen - you need to take the knowledge that you are doing the best for your child as all the thanks you'll get.

[CouthyMowEatingBraiiiiinz]

Balloonslayer - I just make my own ice lollies for all of them! Fresh fruit juice makes excellent lollies.

I was a dairy-aholic before I had to go dairy free for DS3. Now I barely eat it. Except for chocolate once a month now.

[CouthyMowEatingBraiiiiinz]

Calippo ice lollies are dairy free too.

[CouthyMowEatingBraiiiiinz]

And, as I have already mentioned, my cholesterol level has plummeted to very low since I stopped eating dairy.

[saintlyjimjams]

I just bought different stuff when out for whichever child wasn't eating gluten/cow's milk. As long as they could have something I found they didn't care. Used to carry something they liked around with me.

[OrbisNonSufficit]

balloonslayer I have to disagree. It's just food, it's not a death sentence to have to eat something different to everyone else. I'm allergic to a LOT of things (incl additives/preservatives in food) and you just get on with it. Yes, I break out in hives if I eat uncured pork products because it has E250 in it. Yes, I get horrible asthma when I am anywhere near a cat or where a cat has been, or I'm around dust or mould (which is everywhere in old damp housing stock). But life goes on, people adapt to their circumstances. I don't moan about it I just eat things that don't upset me and if I happen to be visiting a friend who has a cat I take a lot of ventolin. C'est la vie.

[BalloonSlayer]

I am impressed that you are so stoical, Orbis.

Nevertheless, if I was your Mum, I would be well pissed off at what you were losing out on and would be ranting about it to all and sundry.

Couthy so sorry at what your DS has to go through - much worse than my DS's allergy (which is bad enough!)

[LDNmummy]

A lot of the people who are saying "it's just food" or "it's easy to be dairy free", are looking at it from the perpective of having this diet as an adult.

In my experience, it is way different when you have a small baby or toddler who is learning to get to grips with food.

I think one of the things that makes it very difficult is also the practicality of maintaining a dairy free diet in a fast paced society. I have to deal with this issue because I live in London. Everything here moves quickly and I barely have time to cook a decent home made meal every day. That is why this society is so dependent on snack foods and ready meals.

In my mothers country we have an almost completely dairy free diet but there is a lot of time dedicated to preparing home cooked meals. Life moves substantially slower so this can be accommodated.

When I am a full time student trying to get domestic things sorted and juggling all that with raising a toddler, it is hard to keep up with maintaining a dairy free diet which means a heavier load of domestic work. It actually makes a huge difference.

Having to source dairy free substitutes for a child with allergies like my DD means making even the simplest things from scratch at home. Not a bad thing at all, but when you consider that you have to do this with even yogurt (not fixating, just an example), you come to realise what a difference it makes to have ready made substitutes available so you can save time and effort and funnel that into other daily chores.

The problem once you find these dairy free alternatives like coconut based yogurt is then the price. £5 for one small pot of yogurt is shocking when compared to the price of even the nicest dairy based yogurt.

I don't know if I am explaining my point very well but hopefully it kind of makes sense.

[LDNmummy]

Also, one of the big differences with adults and children dealing with these dietary issues is the other things that can be found in substitute foods.

For instance, when looking for dairy free foods for my DD, these foods are not really catered to children. They contain a lot of things not good for children like artificial sweeteners, which I found in almost all the substitute foods I have tried. This narrows done choices even more and means you have to get the very expensive stuff to ensure it is absolutely child appropriate.

[saintlyjimjams]

LDN - I have three children who at various times have been gluten and/or cow's milk free. It wasn't that difficult - and a damn sight easier now than it was 11 years ago (when I had to go to Chinese supermarkets to buy the flour to make the bread).

[CouthyMowEatingBraiiiiinz]

As an aside, I have found dairy/soy/nut free Jammy Dodgers. The cheapy Tesco version is made with vegetable oil.

I find that a lot of the time, value ranges are dairy free as they are made from vegetable oil rather than butter, as it is cheaper.

Tesco value digestives are dairy/soy/nut free too. Great for decorating with icing with your toddler!

[CouthyMowEatingBraiiiiinz]

It's far easier to find 'free from' things now than it was even 5 years ago, when DS1 first went GF.

[trixymalixy]

LDNmummy, I actually have been through exactly the same as you, I was dairy free from when DS was 12 weeks old as he was reacting to the proteins in my breast milk , he had his first skin prick tests at 6 months old as did my DD. I ended up bfing until they were over two as they wouldnt take the hypo formula. DS was a nightmare to wean as well, we couldn't get him to eat hardly any solids until he was about a year old, it was very frustrating. So I can empathise, and I didn't get from your post that the coconut yoghurt was for other reasons than just a pudding.

I used to buy dairy free probiotics for DS, which would be much cheaper than yoghurts at £5 a pop.

Dairy and soya free is hard, I was so delighted when DS outgrew the soya allergy.

I have to disagree though as I think it's easier for a baby to be dairy free from the start. DS has never had cheese, he's never had cow's milk or eggs, so he doesn't miss these things in the same way an adult going dairy free would after having eaten them, so I don't think you need to substitute in the same way.

It does take a bit of adjustment and a bit of research reading loads of packets to find what they can and can't eat, but it does become just normal eventually. We mostly eat dairy free as a family.

It's nice for them to be able to have ice cream etc, but I do think they just need to get used to the idea that very often they are not going to be able to eat things other people are having. My two are very stoical about it, they don't get upset that they can't have the ice cream everyone else is having and have an ice lolly instead. That's just the way life is going to be and they'll have to get used to it. Perhaps they will be less stoical as they get a bit older, I don't know.

I would also have thought that living in London, sourcing dairy free alternatives would be a lot easier than it is here in Scotland. When I was looking for rice yoghurts and ice cream for DS the postage was astronomical, whereas all the stockists listed were in London. Although it definitely has become loads easier and cheaper than it was 5 years ago to get alternatives,tesco now stocks dairy free cheese and Oatly and pure are quite often on offer.