Miss Dickson Wright - what a nasty vicious racist woman she is!

[vivizone]

Well she fits in very well with the DM ethos.

Disgusting person

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2233958/One-Fat-Lady-race-row-Muslim-ghetto-jibe-The-Islamic-area-Leicester-frightened-says-TV-chef.html

[Punkatheart]

I straddle two worlds...I am paleish but with a darker mother and an even darker uncle...we are all shades. So I get to experience worlds of many colours. I'm afraid my mother still hates being foreign, Mignonette...she wants to be invisible.

I have lived in Brixton many many years ago and I used to be called 'donkey' which I believe is a half-caste insult. Or I just look like a donkey, I'm not sure!

[gordyslovesheep]

Black and ethnic minority

[Frontpaw]

What's BEM? My friend used to get a lot of abuse when she lived in Sarf London - Brixton (very pale white skin, red hair, lesbian - take your pick).

[gordyslovesheep]

She is right. There are "no go" areas that have turned into ghettos where white people are made to feel uncomfortable. I have been racially abused and intimidated whilst walking in a certain part of East London as a single white female on my own.

kind of the experience for BEM people in 90% of the white dominated UK then

[Frontpaw]

For every CDW there are ten thousand people who don't think anything like her.

Sadly it's the creakiest gate that gets the oil of publicity - like the eedjits we see crying out to turn the UK into a muslim state (there are about three of them in the UK but they are very loud). They are who the likes of the DM hold up as 'representative' - sheesh!

I think things have got nastier because of the wars in the ME and recession/pissed-offness of people in general.

Regarding integration, its a toughy - if I lived abroad, I would do so because I really wanted to go, luckily not because I was persecuted, disposessed or had to build a new life. I would want to learn the language, eat the food (well, maybe not if I lived in Japan, as real Japanese food is... challenging) but I'd look pretty stupid turning up to a formal event in a kimono (tall with red hair, hmmmm). If I did things in my own way I'd not be rejecting my new home but I couldn't possibly agree with everything they do (think Spain and bullfighting - don't think they do this anymore - and the bull runs which are pretty cruel). That wouldn't make me against everything though. Taking nationality is another question mark - not so tough if you were an EU citizen with a UK passport, but if you lived in the US, its another matter I suppose.

I have met some people born in the UK who spoke very little English (Bangladeshi women in East London). I think thats a bit sad - how can you vote, work, speak to the milkman or postman, go to the doctor or hospital by yourself/with your kids, take your kids to school or to the cinema to watch the latest films if you can't communicate fully? Theres a scheme near us for women to learn English set up by a woman in her 50s who came to the UK as a teenage bride but only learned English when she realised that her teenage daughters were drifting away from her due to lack of communication. I am crap at learning languages, so in no way judge anyone who does not learn (am in awe of anyone bilingual anyway, ie most of my family - I'm the thicko!)

In the UK we don't make people integrate (not sure what that would look like?). Maybe that's because we have a long history of refugees coming to our shores - now that's something we should be bloody proud of.

[nailak]

^^I won't hold my breath, seems to be plenty of them on this thread

[mignonette]

Punkatheart

That is so sad. I grew up in a Latin American country where I was the only blonde with ringlets and blue eyed child in the whole school. I vividly feeling very different but I was never made to feel inferior. I learned the language to the point of forgetting how to speak English properly and loved the food. But I was never made to feel that I should deny my roots and that a public acknowledgement of them would be interpreted as our failure to 'assimilate'.

Is your Mother now more comfortable about her family background? I do hope so.

we have to hope that as dinosaurs like CDW die out, not too many new ones replace them.

[Punkatheart]

Sending support and sympathy to Nailak. I am the daughter of an immigrant and have seen my poor mum try and fit in to the point where she almost denies her Indian roots. She came here at a time when abuse was prolific. I had some cries of 'paki' at school too - but it made me strong and proud of my cultural roots...but yes, Nailak, it can create an us and them feeling, which is counterproductive.

I also get very angry with certain attitudes, assumptions and repeating of Daily Mailisms.

Re tradtional dress - lots of people live in foreign countries and do not adopt the national dress. So what?

[mignonette]

Yes Artful. should have been called 'Two Fat Drunks who look like they do not wash their hands after using the toilet'

[ArtfulAardvark]

Ive never really "got" the whole CDW thing though tbh - the Two Fat Ladies used to make me cringe when they were handling food wearing their jewellery and bright nail polish.

[ArtfulAardvark]

When I was younger I used to be incandescent with rage every time my grandfather used the word "blacks" but you know what its how times have changed that is how they grew up and, yes, maybe they should move with the times and moderate their language into a way that is acceptable to society in general I cut him slack because he was old and had no personal exposure to any other ethnicity because of the leafy white area he lived in.

I cannot count the amount of times DH has looked at a job to be told "Grandma doesnt speak english" despite grandma living here since the 70s - is that not equally unaccepable or is it ok because we are not talking about a white person.

I am so sick of the assumption that racism is a white thing, my Jamaican friend used to be hideously racist towards anyone asian and I have seen many a forum where asian lads have made the assumption that British girls are drunk slags.

I think it is equally unacceptable that British people live for decades in Spain without talking Spanish or making Spanish friends - if you move to another country you should have a responsibilty to integrate into the existing society not create your own.

[FunnysInLaJardin]

I'm from Leicestershire and Leicester and Loughborough have some of the most well integrated communities in the UK I would have said. Certainly DH says in West Yorks where he grew up there is far more racial tension.

I used to like CDW, but that article shows her to be a prize twat

[mignonette]

To be honest I'd not talk to Clarissa Dickhead Wright if she bumbled into my neighbourhood.

Because she has a history of ignorant racist comments and her food is all stodgy, literal reproductions of a cuisine and lifestyle very much stuck in a pseudo Edwardian past.

Oh, and Giles Coren and AA Gill revere her. That is a reason in itself and a whole other thread...

[nailak]

where is this place where people can not speak english and arent interested in learning it?

I live in Newham and most people are interested in learning it, the ESOL classes have massive waiting lists.

and why would wearing traditional dress mean they arent integrated?

[ChazsBrilliantAttitude]

Larry
I was being facetious.
Welsh speakers who live in England would speak Welsh to each other not English.

[larrygrylls]

Chaz,

No they wouldn't. They are being Welsh in Wales. They are perfectly integrated. On the other hand, were there an area in London where the most heard language was Welsh, everyone went around in traditional welsh/gaelic dress and where a large number of the inhabitants could not speak English and had no interest in learning it, then that would be failing the integration test

[ChazsBrilliantAttitude]

Where I originally come from quite a few people would fail some of the integration test

Don't speak English in the street
Watch TV in another language
Don't support England at sport

Damn us Welsh we really should make an effort we've only being here for a thousands of years.

p.s. I still don't support England at Rugby despite living in England so I would fail the sports test!

[nailak]

You know what clearly plenty of people if they saw me would be suspicious and afraid and would think me to not be British or integrated, so I think ill stick to my ghetto where people don't think that of me.

I have a friend who is white and covers her husband is black, she wanted to move out of London, but the places she visited they weren't exactly made to feel welcome, so even though she hates London she is sticking to it.

It is your attitudes that creates ghettos.

[nailak]

frontpaw thanks for caring, sometimes it gets too much. With people defending the indefensible. Making it ok, accepted, praise worthy even.

And I just get fed up of repeating myself.

The point is so I am clearly British, from talking to me you know. But if I was walking down the street behind Dh then what would you assume? And your assumptions that I should adapt the culture of my host country like I am a visitor in my own land or that I can't speak English or whatever would be justified?

[nailak]

I have been racially abused too. But when I am it is the fault of immigrants for causing fear and suspicion? They have to expect it?

Even if I an not an immigrant?

I don't understand why communities with different traditions and languages would cause fear and resentment actually?

For me it is a wonderful thing, a blessing to be able to live in a community with so many languages and cultures.

I don't know why people would be afraid?

We had lots of polish immigrants, we wasn't afraid, we welcomed them, I learnt some polish, visited poland, learnt to sing stor lat and say nazdrovije.

My sis in law came at 16 with no English, over 20 years later she is a strong independent women, she has worked as a childminder, she is very active helping her community in her own way, she establishes community saving circles and stuff. She has raised children who are integrated went to uni, work etc.

[Bloodyscissors]

She is right. There are "no go" areas that have turned into ghettos where white people are made to feel uncomfortable. I have been racially abused and intimidated whilst walking in a certain part of East London as a single white female on my own.

It seems to me, especially with the latest case in which the report about paedophiles in certain communities was toned down, that some obvious truths are dismissed because of fear of offending certain communities. This is not going to end well.

[FreudiansSlipper]

larry you are so patronising. what cdw said was racist simple as that what has being pc or not go to do with it. that line is trotted out again and agian when racism rears its ugly head

her view was very much them and us, i know excatly how these people are because what excatly because they are brown, they are muslim, the are from pakistan

[larrygrylls]

Nailak,

Clearly you are British. I totally agree with you that you cannot judge people solely by the way they dress. People should be able to dress how they like within reason (I don't think anyone would allow people going around naked or carrying weapons, for instance, whatever their national or religious traditions). There is something a little strange to most people of most nationalities to the complete covering of the face. It is denying human interaction and is very much against most national cultures (except, in my view, deeply patriarchal and misogynistic ones).

But it is not so simple as you (or me, as a British Jew) feeling British. It is about how our communities behave in toto. When the immigration is too fast and uncontrolled and you have whole communities where English is a second language and that practice traditions a long way away from what is the norm in this country, it is bound to create fear and resentment. And that is leaving aside the small (ish) minority of muslims who actively detest the UK and fight against it, whilst still living here.

Although Miss Dickson Wright may be stating what is politically unacceptable to say and getting the dog whistle backlash from the politically correct, she is stating an uncomfortable truth that many feel but would never say. Well educated people like you need to work to bridge this gulf and also to stop young girls of 17/18 being brought in as "wives" (aka domestic drudges) without a word of English or any intention of ever learning it. There have been many waves of immigrants successfully assimilated into the UK but it does take work from both sides to do so.

[Frontpaw]

Applause ((()))
Thats me clapping!

[chummymummy]

I know exactly what you mean Nailak. I never questioned my 'Britishness' until it was questioned by others. All through my childhood, teens and early twenties this was never an issue. It has become one of late. It is like a real kick in the guts.

The sad thing is my kids have that innocence that I once did. They see themselves as english, and if people pass this shit down the generations then they will find themselves in the same situation we are.I had better just start scrubbing that brown right out of their skins.

I am encouraged by all the reasonable voices I hear on mumsnet. That out of a lot of people who have posted, the majority understand the basic notion that you cant judge a whole race or community based on an isolated incident. You cant tell us what to do, where to live and what to wear because we are easier to bear in small doses, and that we become dangerous and threatening when we congregate.

Focus on the positives... I keep telling myself!