Older child adoption early days are hard

[Puffinwren]

Hi All,

my Husband and I have just adopted 2 siblings 4and 6. After transitions they’ve been with us a week. We were told to expect ok behaviour for a few months then a lot worse. After 3 days it’s been… tough - hourly meltdowns - older sibling hitting younger almost every time they are together (which didn’t happen in the foster placement). Sensory meltdowns etc.
We’ve been told to avoid the kids meeting another so don’t have the support network going atm but it’s exhausting
my question is- to those who adopted older. Is this level of stuff this early normal?does this get better?
Its 28 days til school starts and I don’t know how we will cope til then!

The early days are really tough OP. You are all strangers to each other and if you're anything like we were you are feeling just as scared as your little ones are and they will be feeling this from you. This sounds very similar to our early days, ours were 4, 5 and nearly 7 when we brought them home.

Like you, we thought we would get a honeymoon period however we had difficult behaviour right from the start, as it turned out it was a honeymoon period as it got a whole lot worse for a while. But take heart, we got there. We're 5 years in now and have the most amazing family, it takes time, patience, humour and a lot of hard work but you'll get there.

We found it was compassion for their situation that got us through the hard times. They had moved home, moved area, changed school and nursery and had a new mummy and daddy and they didn't ask for any of it, they were terrified and the only way they could communicate that was through their behaviour.

We read anything by Sarah Naish and found her A to Z of therapeutic parenting particularly useful as it gave short and to the point practical support for particular issues, which was all we had time to read.

I also recommend taking lots of photos , they're great to look at later on in the day to remind you that there was flashes of good times. Also, go and watch them when they are asleep, it doesn't matter how hard your day has been, wee innocent sleeping people make your heart melt.

You are 3 days in, your life has been turned upside down and so has theirs, it's such early days when it all still feels unreal. Be kind to yourselves.

Sorry to hear that life is hard for you all right now. It is very early days.

Mine were similar ages when they came home and we didn't have a honeymoon period either. It is such a period of huge change for you all that it is only to be expected really - sorry, probably not what you want to hear.

Try and get some simple routines in place - for your sanity as much as theirs. Maybe get them to help you make pictures for a visual timetable that could be prominently displayed. Ours included Yesterday, Today, Tomorrow (because they had no real sense of time and they needed to start understanding they would still be here tomorrow). We had 3 simple pictures on for each day - one before lunch, one after lunch and one after tea. It helped me hugely to focus our days, to give them stability and give us all a sense of purpose each day. We actually stuck to one main activity each week day that was on a loop cycle - we baked together every Sunday come hell or high water. We went to the library every Thursday... Perhaps something similar may help? I also found we could stretch out each part of our timetable - so on shopping days, we would all sit together at the table and they would each choose 5 things off my shopping list to draw out on their own special piece of paper that would then be their own responsibility to get off the shelf and place in the trolley. Once home they each had to unpack their own items and help put them away. It gave structure to what otherwise seemed like endless days of chaos and wild behaviour.

Do you have the space to make sure that in less structured times, they each have their own space or take turns - one doing something quiet(er) and perhaps with you at the kitchen table while the other plays with Lego in the lounge? A timer was helpful for us because the jealousy between them (and then the violence) was huge so we had to show almost over the top fairness in spending time with each. I think we started with 3 minutes each as they just couldn't manage any longer. Gradually it became 5, then 10 and even up to 30 minutes where I could spend time with one while just keeping an eye on the other playing by themselves. It really was a case of divide and conquer!

Sensory meltdowns were massive here too - keep looking out for what works to regulate and calm each of them. One of mine was regulated by pedalling a toy tractor, one by spinning in a little egg chair (IKEA). Both needed lots of exercise and activity but they spun out of control if it was too stimulating so we went on lots of long walks with picnics. I bet the bad weather is not helping at all - but if you can manage it, get them out there puddle jumping, sliding in mud, whatever works. At home, I kept a picture book in every nook and cranny so when a meltdown started I would hoist one/both onto my lap and reach for the book which I would endeavour to calmy read whilst hugging/stroking/containing/ignoring the meltdown. It didn't always help them, but it generally helped me to stay calmer and give me time to plan how to approach the situation if the book wasn't helping. Reading may not work for you, but try to find something that does, because you need that little moment of calming yourself or you will start to get overwhelmed, hypervigilant and dysregulated yourself.

With regard to meeting others, I know where the advice is coming from to keep away for now (and do agree with it in principle) but to be honest, your sanity and your need for some friendship and support has to come first or you will simply collapse. Maybe meet for a play in the park or for a picnic? Perhaps avoid other people's houses or people coming to yours for a bit while they settle. Make sure you anyone you are with refers them back to you for any 'job' ... 'Oh, you need a drink? Let me take you back to Mummy and she'll get one for you' rather than them jumping in to help.

Personally, I also think it's good for traumatised children to see someone taking care of you as parents as well. Modelling that caring role. My Dad came and mowed our lawn every week for our first summer (it would never have been done otherwise, too much else going on!) He did it when we weren't there at first but he would always leave a note stuck to the back door to say he'd been thinking of us and came over to help. A friend came round one evening a week for the first year to cook for me. She arrived with all the ingredients, cooked, washed up and went home (often while I slept in exhaustion on the sofa). My children knew she was coming to cook for me and it showed them I needed looking after too and it showed me accepting help and nurture.

Are there things people could do for you to help 'around the edges'?

Sorry, that's an awful lot of suggestions!

I hope your social worker is being supportive and that you are being kind to yourselves as well. It's all so new for all of you, children and parents, and it is a massive task to parent two strangers (who are being clear about their own distress at the situation).

It is tough, but it does get easier the more you all get to know each other.

My two were the same ages, and my god it was hard going. They needed to be physically attached to me at all times, I literally couldn’t cross the kitchen to get a spoon without a meltdown in stereo.

Things that helped we’re having lots of things the three of us could do together - messy play, going for a walk, ball games in the garden. Lots of time on the trampoline (very regulating) at the park (also very regulating).

Setting up different activities didn’t work at all because they couldn’t tolerate one having my attention without the other being involved. There was a lot of violence from my older to my younger - she didn’t understand there was enough (food, toys, love, attention) to go round and was used to competing for everything.

A visual timetable helped, again with morning, lunch (with their choice of lunch on the board) and afternoon. Regular bed time and getting up times, strict bedtime routine and fixed meal times.

We also had an hour of tv in the afternoon - they were past the napping stage but needed down time so cuddled up on the sofa with a snack helped them not be overwhelmed. We also had lots of music - singing and dancing were good for regulating too. They love water so swimming, baths, water play all helped with sensory input.

If I’m honest I ignored the “keep people away” advice, I introduced them to two people that would be present in their lives within two weeks. I needed support simply put, they now have really lovely relationships with those two people.

It’s hard - you’re all adjusting to change, which involves huge amounts of loss for all of you, you’re all strangers to each other and you’re all terrified. Compassion for the children is important but compassion for yourself is almost more so, you can’t connect with these little people if you’re busy thinking you should be better, more able, more competent, happier.

Early days is so so hard!I would also recommend visual day plan,we got one from Amazon,and any regulation stuff you can put into their lives the better,we have trampoline and swings in the garden and monkey bars( it's not quite monkey bars but pull up bars with trapezey swing thing) in her bedroom.
Also agree a cebebbies down time together and regular time is helpful,good comfort TV something they live and is familiar,or bluey maybe as that's lovely,sit together and eat snacks/toast And drink with a straw maybe.
Our DD has responded well to list of family rules up on the Wall we worked it together and then when she hits for example we can point clearly to it,she can't read but it's like a visual thing if expected behaviour,no hitting,no spitting etc etc.
Also adoption UK have early days meet ups on zoom which may be helpful to you to talk to others going through same thing.
It's definitely incredibly hard.very early days so hope things improve for you soon (although equally know it's a long thing!)key is your reaction to things so do tag team to make sure you both get some peace so you can manage the behaviour with calm etc.

I'm also going to say it's only been a week - there are lots of helpful suggestions here but it may be too early yet, the first few weeks were literally getting to know each other and getting through the day. Learning what they like to eat (which may not be what the foster carers tell you they like to eat), learning which are their favourite cuddly toys, the clothes that they like etc. While lots of suggestions can be helpful, don't feel under pressure because you haven't got all their stuff unpacked, or can't source a visual timetable, or don't have capacity for whatever. Literally get to know your kids, spend time with them doing whatever you have capacity to do, build in a bit down time even if that does mean a bit of tv or screen time, don't worry about the state of the house (I remember one memorable day having 16 changes of clothes due to toiletting issues, loading the washing machine was taking me half an hour at a time because the kids wouldn't let me move from their side and weren't for helping me, understandably - the house looked like someone had picked it up and shook it - just as the kids sw arrived to check in with me).

My two were very developmentally delayed and regressed in transition so I'd suggest treating them as much younger children for a while, low expectations, lots of help regulating their emotions, lots of supervision and support, lots of younger games and tv. With older children there often isn't a honeymoon period - or the initial presentation is actually the very best they can manage and will slip further at some point. I'd second the A-Z of therapeutic parenting for dealing with things in the moment.

Are you seeing your and the kids social workers? I had both mine and the kids social worker visiting weekly (so a visit each per week) for the first 4 weeks and then fortnightly visits for the next 4 weeks which pretty moving to monthly visits before the adoption order was granted. Those visits were invaluable to me because it meant I saw another adult at home, who knew the children and could tell me the changes they saw weekly (when I thought I was in Groundhog Day hell), I didn't need to phone and ask for help because they would turn up and listen (and unpick) the things I was finding difficult and had really helpful suggestions or simply a reminder that it was very early days. If you don't already, have some informal meetings booked in for support.

Nothing can prepare you for these early days - they aren't one's you'll necessarily look back on with fondness. My DD is 12 now, she was 6 when she arrived. Yesterday we were looking at videos of her very early days here and remembering that little scrap of a child and seeing how small, how very young she was made me wonder anew how the hell we got through those days and weeks. But she's now a confident 12 year old, off to high school this year and doing so much better than anyone could have anticipated. Hang in there.

Thanks all - it is encouraging to know this isn’t unusual- lots of the early days advice feels aimed at younger kids so good to hear some different stuff

Our oldee LO was only 3, but the first month or so was absolute madness and I felt like I couldn't tell anyone. He hit so hard (and aimed for the face), ripped my nose piecing out, meltdown after meltdown, barely slept... and we had literally just become parents and could hardly keep a coherent sentence in our heads some days. Then his little brother joined a month later, and it was just... constant. Hitting kicking, biting, the lot. Some days I was basically a bouncer.

I agree routine is important- if you can spare half an hour, write it out for yourself, but keep it low stakes and remember you are all not only learning about each other but you are learning what it takes to get kids out the house and going. However, other stuff that helped us in the early days were:

Throwing beanbags to replace the cars lobbed at us

Reducing the amount of toys and stuff on how or available to be thrown hit or jumped on

looking up safer restraints and speaking woth our social workers about how to use them.

Basically living outside at our local park (we had 2 Park visits a day, minimum for the first two months)

Screen time was completely up for grabs whenever we needed it to regulate. We gave them both old phones with bbc iplayer installed and they watched hours of Mr tumble and paw patrol

Going back to basics with food for the kids. They ate the same thing at the same time for months because they knew it would be predictable and it reduced stress for everybody

Sleeping was tough for us, so we had a night on night off system

Reach out to your local children's homestart or sure start centre, library, playgroups etc. Honestly, ours were great, and ran stay and plays for kids up to 5 and some for older kids as well even furing summer, and more to the point they were specifically accepting of or kids even though they were a bit wild and hit anything in sight. We went to loads in our first weeks together, they called me mum, which made me cry a bit, but it made me feel like mum too.

Divide and conquer where you can- get ine busy and regulate the other. I also keep mine physically separate if they are aggressive, and have the jnfrastructure set up for it (2 stickers on my car for them to touch whilst I get the other into the car so they can race but not touch the same one, they sit in the same place at the table far away from each other etc)

Also think about your house set up. We eventually said they were only allowed in the same room as us - so now we basically come downstairs before breakfast and nobody goes upstairs in the day, we bring down whatever we need and then they never go upstairs in the day whoch prevents them hurting each other in a different room. Or maybe they need a bit more space- could they hill in their own rooms? I found I was kind of smothering the eldest, which meant he was stressed with me. When inreduced my communicating with him, it really helped.

Sensory play stuff helped ours- play doh and flour mixed with pasta on the floor kept ours regulated for over an hour on one of the very early days when he was constantly hitting his brother.

Get a robot vacuum cleaner if they are messy. Honestly the best thing I have ever done. Clearing up rice from sensory play is much easier when you know your lil robot friend is there to help you

However, overall, you are not far in, and basically i would say do what it takes to survive. Have your basic 2-3 word rules, repeat them often whilst affirming yourself and steamroller through it. Reduce your expectations if what will be achieved and remember the only thing you have to achieve for the next month is keeping everyone sane and alive. If that means you go to the park every day, do it. We drove to different parks every day, made a list on Google maps and tried them all out and rated them. But that was all we did. Literally the whole day whilst I repeated to myself and to him: hitting is not allowed. Ita pur job to keep all our family safe. Hitting is not allowed.

We really didn't want anyone round us in the early days because we we didn't want anybody seeing us in the state we were in, but of you can stand it, rope someone else in to help bring food or do laundry or whatever.

You mentioned not being able to access support networks, but even of it just to meet another frown up at a park as if you were strangers can help you feel regulated because your kids probably don't know them yet. A possibility worth considering if they ca deal with the subterfuge.

Basically, take care of yourself, respect your own hard boundaries and lower expectations of whatbyou and your children can achieve. Anything additional is bonus!

Oo another thing our DD responded well to was having a physical action to accompany the rule,so everytime we repeated 'no hitting' we did an action,she would do this when repeating it herself so I think helpful.like a makaton thing.

@Torvy and others how are things now? When did things change?

I haven’t much to add, just looked after yourself and reach out to others if you need to. It can be very isolating as not everyone will understand what you are going through.

@Puffinwren

My adopted son moved in when he was 8,11 years ago.
5 weeks ago my 12 year old foster child moved in.

The early days are so hard - I'm shattered!

You've had a lot of great advice already so I'll try not to repeat it - really my key things are
Pick your battles - my adopted son is very tidy, my foster child's bedroom looks like a tornado has been through it. It drives me mad - but I'm letting it go, he tidies it once a week.
Food - don't make it a battle ground, at this point it's just important that they eat, not get their 5 a day. The only veg My foster child will only eat is brocoli which he dunks in tomato ketchup. I let him get on with it
Routine- with little ones really important, predictabilty helps to make them feel safe.
Go out - every day, fresh air, run off some energy
Trampoline or trampette - bouncing is good
Swimming - skin to skin contact is really good for bonding.
Meeting people - if you need to meet up with people do so. I met friends and their kids after 2 days. As long as its not big groups and they respect the boundaries you put in place.

@121Sarah121 asks when do things get better
My adopted son is 19, even if I say so myself he is a fantastic young man. He is working in Tesco where he is well regarded. He has carried on his volunteer work from Duke of Edinburgh, they all love him. He has found his way to a church where he is very popular. He has strong long standing friendships. He has learnt to drive and with help from me has his first car. He is off to uni in September.

The intervening years have seen their ups and downs, at times he has driven me to my limits, he has been aggressive, argumentative and disruptive. The first year was rough. His early teens were hellish. Lockdown was very hard on him and so on me.
There was no one point when things changed as such. Different things fell into place at different times.
Therapy helped him deal with the emotional stuff that drove the anger and confusion. Dealing with the emotional stuff then gave us the space to focus on the ASD and learning strategies to help him deal with life.
Lockdown whilst hard led him to a church, where he found a community and so it's seems a personal faith.
Maintaining his friendships has been important, one has been with him through school, college and now in the same store. He has a sense of belonging.
Scouts, etc developed his independence and confidence.
I let the apron strings out incredibly slowly, which caused issues initially but built trust. On his 18th he announced he was going to the pub and was shocked that I didn't object - but by this point I knew I could trust him.
The last 11 years have not been easy, a lot of hard work has gone into it, not just me but all the people around us and most importantly by him
I think you have to see adoption as a long term thing, for most of us things fall into place over time.

@Ted27 i think you sum that up nicely. The reason I ask is we are a few years in now and our journey has been turbulent but the changes over the past few months have been incredible. There are still challenges but I feel we will get there together. I think there has been a cognitive leap which has really helped him make sense of the world.

I think back to our early days. It was like having a toddler on steroids for a few years. Everything we dealt with was an extreme version of what other kids at the age and stage were dealing with but the trauma and anxiety lead to more extreme behaviours. I think that’s what I found hardest because people didn’t get it and minimised the everything both his difficulties and the impact in his family.

now he is older, things are good but there wasn’t a lightbulb moment of we can do this but more like we can deal with this crisis/behaviour/need today if that makes sense.

I hope for everyone else, things get easier and wish you and your family all the best @Puffinwren

@121Sarah121

Toddler on steroids describes my 12 year old exactly!!

Just to update to say whilst still hard we’ve doing a little better. Lots of one on one time- two park trips a day and in-laws cleaning the house. Long road ahead but good to know hard is “normal!”

@121Sarah121 we found ourselves on a more even keel a month or two- we still don't live a "normal" life, but we got better at predicting the outbursts and triggers for both us and the kids and we feel better. Life got better when we took quite decisive action for the highest priority stuff- so for example the safer handling restraints if he was hitting or kicking, without fail or doubt made a huge difference immediately- once we decided to do it, we felt more in control, then within a week or two the behaviour reduced to a level where PACE was effective. 8 months on, we can use PACE most of the time, but in those early days it was too dangerous even with a 3 year old. He was hurting himself and others, and you could see he was just terrified afterwards that he had messed it all up. In a way, it doesn't matter what happened in foster care, even if they weren't doing it then they are doing it with you. So you have to deal with it as best you can because you can't recreate FC. The mistake we made fpr a long time was trying to get a very traumatised child to explain what we could do to change his behaviour when the real answer was very little. All we could do was be there and sit with him making sure he didn't damage himself or us.

Other stuff takes longer or we haven't solved through changing the childrens behaviour but rather ours, and that has taken longer. So things like spitting we haven't resolved completely but we have reduced through using PACE or Sarah Naish's A-z strategies. Their behaviour isn't where we want it to be (they are still very volatile in uncertain situations, make loud noises in public if they are feeling anxious or react strongly if the mood takes them) but we have strategies for managing it better that we have worked out work for us and our triggers. We worked out we really dont like the kids making a scene in front of family and friends, but we dont care about the general public, so we work to that. For example, one kid can be bribed (sorry, positively reinforced!) to stay quiet in a wedding ceremony, the other can't, so he is not taken into it in the first place but stays outside whilst it is happening, stuff like that.

I would also say your support network is vital because you need other eyes on kids too. One of them needed a nap that the FC didn't have scheduled so we didn't think about the fact he was tired for a month until a friend dropped something off and was like oh he's so tired isn't it time for his nap? He's only two, how long has he been awake now? And the penny dropped. The other was absolutely draining and refused to share any attention, angry and aggy all the time, but the moment we put him into nursery he was happy as a clam because it was routine and he had friends thatbhe could properly play with. But those things took weeks and months for us to learn and work out, and I suspect we will continue to learn with every new experience.

On the other hand, once we thought we had nailed something, like serving the right dinner, or singing the right song, they became bored of it or it made them stress so we switched it up, but returned later on. Hence the mashups of reggae, dad rock and sea shanty playlists for our pre dinner routine- some days one thing works, some days another does. Music really helps ours and sets a mood, which is something that we didn't really do before.

The frustrating part of the process is that I am such a better parent now than I was 8 months ago, but I wouldn't be if I hadn't parented them. Don't beat yourself up about it, things improve as you find your way. Unfortunately kids aren't textbook and neither are we, and you have to make it work for you and your family, and the only thing that helps that is time and practice. Social workers were really helpful in helping us prioritise what is right for our kids at each stage in the process- so bedtimes had to be nailed, eating was not so important etc.

I forgot to say that you do need to make sure you are drawing on as many formal support networks as you can- now is the time to seek CAMHS support, counselling stuff, GP referrals if they haven't been done. Even stuff like poor behaviour can be linked to sleep because of medical issues like enlarged tonsils or sleep apnea might not have been picked up in FC so get things checked out when you can, because it also feels better when other people see that there is a problem.

@Puffinwren I'm glad things are feeling brighter. Write down what it was that helped so that if it happens again you have a visual liat of strategies to try! The very early days are such a far cry from idyllic parenthood that I wanted to scream everytime someone told me how cute he was or how happy he seemed because the only reason we were out the house was because he had lobbed another brio train track at my head and we both needed to cool off by walking to the local shops to buy yet another loaf of bloody bread as i soothed myself that it wasn't that bad and it was perfectly fine to be wandering the streets clutching an icepack to my head because i lost a battle with a 3 year old. Everybody can warn you but nothing can properly prepare you for how it really, truly feels to have a child or children in your house who are having some incredibly tough times, be so desperate to love and care for them but be so unable to take away their pain, terror or anger and it is so justified for them in the situation, but how terrifying it feels to think that you might be making everything worse or at least not making it better. It will get better, it will improve, but don't be afraid to say that some things are just not for right now. Like brio train tracks, put anything that isn't the basics of survival in a box somewhere high and only get it down when things feel calmer and more settled. Most other stuff can wait!

Sending you lots of positive vibes, and I hope the days just keep getting better!

How's it going now Puffinwren? I hope you are all starting to get to know each other a little more and life is settling a bit.

Thanks having a bit more settled now though still up and down

That's a positive step. I hope thise settled periods increase both in frequency and in duration.

What are your plans for school?

We had a pre-school and a school age. But what i would have liked to have done with the school age was take her out for some 1 on 1 time. I think that would have helped a lot.

Thus I'd be thinking of arranging with school for some flexibility at least until half term if you think it would be helpful.

Hiya-both going to school but younger is staggered start anyway. School are happy to be very flexible so going to see how they go- school have also said I can go in with the older one sometimes (I work in there a bit at times) oldest has liked school a lot in the past and missed other kids so will see!