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Please email ScotGov re school guidelines

(18 Posts)
BetsyM00 Thu 01-Feb-18 09:39:28

The Equalities & Human Rights Committee of the Scottish Government is considering investigating the guidance for supporting transgender people in Scottish schools that was recently published.

If anyone would like to write to them with their concerns about why these guidelines are problematic, the email is:

The guidelines are here:

Some concerns include:
- teachers are advised not to disclose information to parents or carers without the young person's permission.
- Transgender pupils should be allowed to choose which toilets/changing rooms they use. Children who feel uncomfortable about sharing facilities with someone of the opposite sex can wait until after the transgender child has finished or use alternative facilities such as an accessible toilet. Parents with concerns about their child sharing toilets and/or changing rooms with a pupil of the opposite sex should be reminded of the school’s ethos of inclusion, equality and respect.
- Transgender pupils should be able to compete in the sports category they feel most comfortable with, male or female.
- Parents should not be informed if their child is sharing rooms with pupils of the opposite sex on school trips.
- If a parent is ‘struggling to come to terms with their child’s identity’ teachers are advised that it ‘may be useful to approach the local authority’.

Essentially, girls are being compelled to share sex-based facilities with male young people through the threat of ostracisation (the very thing the guidelines are trying to prevent trans people from experiencing), and using adult and peer expectations that they comply.

theftbyfinding Thu 01-Feb-18 09:44:01

Not much point, they refuse to listen, just as they refused to listen over Named Person. I removed my dc from school here in Scotland. I won't have the state take control which they clearly are aiming to do.

Freshlylaidterf Thu 01-Feb-18 09:59:13

My local health authority (Scottish one) published their own schools guidance based on this document and others. There was a thread on here about it and in aibu. Particularly in relation to the 'advice' given on dealing with children with SEN. I wrote a letter to them outlines concerns similar to the ones betsymoo states above, copied in to my MP. A month later they wrote back, very politely dismissING most of the points I raised and ignoring others. They did however concede on two points namely the conflation of sex and gender saying that I was correct but this is based on other publications and is common practice (wtaf? ?). Secondly the use of the word 'stigma ' in relation to the disabled toilets would be removed in the update as it was an error, (aye right! )
Anyway don't want to put people off and I will write to human rights but just wanted people to see what we are up against but to keep at it. No reply from MP. No surprise there

Stopmakingsense Thu 01-Feb-18 10:32:16

That is good news that they are investigating. Presumably it is only Scottish voters who have any say - ie is it worth anyone else responding?

fascinated Thu 01-Feb-18 17:06:26

Hi everyone. First post since re-registering, been lurking and reading all this stuff with concern. I actually contacted my local council (Scotland), Equalities Officer, about these guidelines before Christmas and they said they were going to be "launched" at some point "soon". I was considering following up but have not had the headspace as yet to do it properly. Keep hoping they will simply be abandoned. Clear breach of duty to consult, scope far too wide (such pupils cannot possibly surely have started the GRC process, too young [need to research this]; non-binary ought not to be included as not a protected char. anyway), failure to have sufficient, or any, regard to the interests of other (esp. female pupils) in terms of impact, esp in light of the PSE Duty... , failure to invoke the same-sex spaces exemption is Wednesbury unreasonable; Safeguarding concerns, promoting harmful practices (breast binding for instance)..the list goes on. My strategy would be to word it in such a way as to hint that adopting them in their current form would open them to a judicial review or other legal challenge [need to check details - been a while] ...rather than attacking the ideology as such (much as I would LOVE to do so). Any legal bods around to kick about ideas with?

@BetsyM00 - that's good news if the Committee will be looking at it...How did you find out about that?

Freshlylaidterf Thu 01-Feb-18 17:49:19

Just writing now. Thanks fascinated
and Betsymoo for advice

mummybear701 Thu 01-Feb-18 23:30:09

"Discrimination case law has established that transgender people who
have started living in accordance with their gender identity must not be banned from using the
facilities matching their gender identity"

What are those cases? Why are they not referenced? Have judges actually stated this, without caveat?

Mrsmiguelcervantes Fri 02-Feb-18 07:58:08

It’s definitely worth writing - seems like there might be a chink of hope here...

Freshlylaidterf Sat 03-Feb-18 20:17:39

Have written. Also to my MP but I wont hold my breath for his reply.

Sillydoggy Mon 05-Feb-18 14:17:33

I have just finished emailing them. The guidance has been written from the point of view of trans people totally ignoring girls except to put them and their parents in their place. Can you tell I am a bit cross?
Thank you for highlighting this email address.

fascinated Wed 07-Feb-18 00:42:34

Happy to discuss wording with anyone who needs help - PM me. Need to know you are genuine.

(Red carnations, anyone? Ridiculous that we are reduced to that, eh?!)

Freshlylaidterf Mon 12-Feb-18 14:56:53


Freshlylaidterf Mon 12-Feb-18 15:38:19

My MSP has just replied to the letter I referred to in my Thu 01-Feb-18 09:59:13 post on this thread. He said he has written to the health authority to ensure they received my email but also that if I am not happy with their response then he will take up my concerns on my behalf. This is more than I was expecting and gives me hope, so I have written back to the health authority outlining the issues which I felt they didnt address and copied MSP in. I also mentioned that the equalities and human rights committee are considering looking at the guidance for supporting transgender people in Scottish schools that was recently published. The NHS guide references this.
Thanks again Betsymoo and hope to see some of you on Wednesday.

fascinated Sat 31-Mar-18 11:43:34

Does anyone know if the EHRC are actually looking at the guidance?

Bejazzled Sat 31-Mar-18 11:50:11

That Guidance booklet landed on my desk at work too. I think it is appalling. Because of where I work I cannot say anything.

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