Kitten not using litter tray- confinement training not going well either- Please help :-(

[CattyCatCat]

We got two new kittens a week and a half ago. They are both male, 16 weeks old (not neutered yet as they are indoor cats) , lovely little things and we adore them.

For the first week they both appeared to be using the litter tray well (we use World Best clumping litter in a hooded tray). Last weekend one of them did a wee on the hard floor and then a separate pile of poo. Later he scratched and did a pee on the carpet (all cleaned up with specialist cat products to remove odour). I went out and bought two more litter trays (another hooded and one open) and filled both with paper litter. All was well for a day. Then the same cat returned to weeing on the carpet started,numerous times. He weed on hard floor too. Sometime he even went to the litter tray, sniffed it then walked away to wee elsewhere.

Following advice online we decided to try to use confinement training to re-litter train the one kitten. He has now been in the bathroom for 3 days with a bed, food bowls, toys and litter tray. The first two days, he used the tray well. This morning, he did a wee on the bathroom floor. I don't know what to do next. I am going to neuter him but this seems to be a wee problem rather than spraying (he squats to wee on the floor and the puddles are large).

Has anyone got any advice at all, please? I am desperate! We keep the litter trays very clean though he had done a poo in the tray this morning before he weed on the floor (it was 7am just as I got up). Problem is with two cats, even with multiple trays it is possible that one will poo in both so you can't guarantee a poo free tray overnight and when you are out, iykwim.

What next for the confinement training, do we just continue and hope it improves? Online advice suggests two weeks confinement for re-training. We mss him and although we are spending lots of time visiting him in the bathroom I feel horrible that he is in a room on his own.

Thank you for reading.

[CattyCatCat]

I should also add that prior to arriving with us they were using paper litter (hence me trying it at the first sign of trouble). Also, our house is open plan downstairs so it is unfortunately impossible to contain them in the kitchen. This is a real shame as obviously wee and poo on the carpet is a bigger deal than on hard floor and I can't just deny access to carpeted areas.

[CattyCatCat]

Just been to give him lunch and have a play and he has used his tray for a poo. Feeling a bit happier. Just wish he would wee in the tray consistently too.

[chockbic]

Perhaps he will when it becomes a habit to him.

Or try another type of litter.

[CattyCatCat]

Thanks for your response, Chock. Hopefully you are right, it is only day 3 of training and the wee on the floor this morning was the only accident so far. I guess I was hoping the poor boy would catch on quickly and not need to be shut up for two weeks. I guess the long game may be key here.

I tend to think the litter is not the issue given he has already rejected two types and to be fair to the worlds best brand, it is about the best there is for keeping the tray as clean as possible, iykwim, and he seems to dislike a dirty tray.

Does anyone have a view on whether I should neuter him during or after the confinement training 2 weeks? I am inclined to think as soon as possible but am very willing to take advice.

Thanks.

[chockbic]

As long as he has reached minimum weight, its safe to be neutered.

Consider sooner than later. You don't want to deal with spraying.

[CattyCatCat]

Yes, he is a good size. I think I will get him booked in for next week. I really appreciate your responses, Chock. It feels very lonely dealing with this lively kitten on my own. He is the sweetest little thing and I am desperate for it all to work out well.

[CattyCatCat]

Lovely not lively, though he is pretty lively too

[CattyCatCat]

A wee in the tray!

Bumping for anyone with confinement training experience.

[chockbic]

Yay!

Sympathies oh congrats with the kitten

[RubbishMantra]

No experience with confinement training, but I agree with you re. getting him neutered. When too young to spray, but with hormones kicking in, some mark territory by "puddling".

Have you taken the swingy doors off the covered litter trays? If you haven't, then do so. Then re-instate them once he's used to using it.

[CattyCatCat]

Morning Chock and Rubbish,

Well the kitten used his tray really well all last night and so far today. That's the good news. The bad news is that the other kitten pooed on the floor this morning! So now he is up in the bathroom with his brother. I feel less bad now they are together at least. They are booked for the vet next week. Am positive that I'll crack this. They just need time to get use to the idea that the litter is the only place that they should go.

Rubbish, I think you are spot on with the puddling theory. The 'wee' kitten was mostly doing it at room edges and corners so I can believe it was territorial. We don't have flaps on the hooded trays, I took them off already, but thanks for the suggestion. It all helps.

[code]

I'm sure neutering will help. Where did you get them from op, what did the breeder/rescue say about their litter habits?

[CattyCatCat]

They were litter trained by the breeder before we got them, Code. Not really sure what has gone wrong. They were good at first with us, no accidents at all. Am determined to sort it out though and yes, I really hope you are right, neuturing can only help so fingers crossed I'll be all sorted with them in a week or two.

[CattyCatCat]

Update- both cats can out of bathroom on Sunday (the 'wee' cat had done two weeks in there, the 'poo cat' had done 9 or so days.
All good till this morning. Poo cat seems to be cured. Behaving and usi g litter perfectly. This morning though I found a patch of wee on carpet where 'wee' cat had been known to go. I've cleaned it with citrus cat cleaner.
Really stuck to know what to do next. Don't want to put cat back in bathroom and can't shut it out of carpeted area as we are open plan layout.

Has anyone got any ideas, please. I have a Feliway dissuade plugged in and two litter trays with a litter they like. I can't really put a litter tray in the room with the carpet (that wee cat has soiled on) as it is our living room and there is nowhere to put it away from toys or furniture, iykwim.

Both kittens were neutered last week.

[cozietoesie]

It can take a couple of weeks for hormones to die down after neutering so I'd persevere for a little bit. Any chance of putting an extra tray in somewhere though?

[CattyCatCat]

Thanks for the reply, Cozie. Hopefully things will improve with time, as you say. The soiling is always room edge (floor though, not wall) and I feel it could be urine puddling for marking purposes as much as just straightforward weeing outside the tray. We are going to persevere, we really adore him and he is so perfect in every way other than the inappropriate soiling.

I know it would be wise to put a litter tray in the carpeted part but unfortunately there is nowhere 'acceptable' to put it. My husband is just not up for it and to be fair, the litter tracks when they leave the box so it would end up around sofas and toys so really not a good long term solution for us.

I don't think taking up carpet would help as he has previously soiled hard floor (room edge again). Gah. Just want him to be a good boy! I would love to give them the run of the house but obviously don't dare at the moment.

[cozietoesie]

Out of interest - how do they seem to get on with each other? (I'm wondering whether there might be some dissatisfaction/rivalry, particularly on the part of 'wee' kitten. Litter mates will usually get on fine but it's not necessarily a certainty.)

[CattyCatCat]

They get on with each other really well but we do have one other cat who I would say the wee kitten does have rivalry with. They play fight alot together but are very similar personality wise, you could well be onto something there, good point. All cats are indoor cats though so can't keep them from seeing each other if go know what I mean.

[CattyCatCat]

Thanks for the help, by the way. It does help to talk it through.

[cozietoesie]

Right. So as they're all indoor cats, how many litter trays do you have in total?

[CattyCatCat]

We have two at the moment. We plan to add another to the upstairs bathroom once we let the cats out around the house. The problem is that whilst they are confined to the downstairs we can only put them in the kitchen/diner part and we have the two currently in that area. We have more downstairs rooms but can't let them in there as the door stopping g the. Getting upstairs is off the kitchen/diner/lounge, iyswim.

Would it be crazy to just let then all out around the house, add an extra tray and hope for the best? Might reduce rivalry of they have more space. But we would shut them back downstairs at night as otherwise the would wake us all up (and I think it is overnight that the weeing has occurred this last time anyway). All the upstairs (bar bathroom ) is carpeted.

[CattyCatCat]

Please excuse iPhone mistakes in text :-)

[CattyCatCat]

My concern I suppose with letting them everywhere is wee on beds (nightmare!) or on carpet and to be honest you can't tell it is there unless you feel all over with your hand for wetness. I might not realise wee cat is being bad upstairs if he went under beds etc.

[cozietoesie]

Well I think you definitely need another tray or two. The general rule is one per cat plus one (within reason) and two between three isn't enough. Have a good think about it.

Your description of the peeing struck a chord with me in that its location sounds rather like attempted spraying and if you have three males, I'd suspect that there's some jostling for position/rivalry going on. (I recall that Seniorboy started doing just that - at an advanced age and when he'd been many years neutered - when he was in this house with The Lodger whom he despised and detested. As soon as The Lodger left for new pastures, he stopped it completely. (After having one Yah Boo Sucks last luxurious pee spray all over the place where The Lodger's tray had been.))

Things may calm down after a short time and once the hormones have died down completely but it might also be worth considering what activities they can do in the house on the principle that if they're bored, bad thoughts might be more likely to be at the forefront of their minds. (Or in Weeing Kitten's mind at least.) Do they have games they can play/things they do with you etc?

[CattyCatCat]

That's a really helpful post, Cozie. Thank you.

I think you have probably made me decide that letting them out around the house would be a good thing to try. I can then add another two trays and they will have more interest and more space. I could try letting them have the run of the house at night with bedroom doors closed.

At first I think I will only let them in my room and the landing/ bathroom as smaller area is easier to check for wee.

They have lots of toys (like mice, balls etc), a cat tree and scratch posts but I will try to look for more things like those maze things where you chase the ball around with a paw.

I notice that they all watch each other going in and out of the litter trays. If I spread another two around the house they will have more privacy.