How much one to one support can they get in nursery without a statement?

[nappyaddict]

We were originally under the impression you could get up to the full 12.5 hours. Now we have been told he can only have 200 minutes (1 full session and 50 minutes of another session) because he doesn't have a statement yet. Is this right?

[daisy5678]

It's different in different areas - check your local website. Sorry can't help more!

[Marne]

I'm not sure but dd2 gets 1 hour per 3 hour session, we were told she could have more but they felt an hour was enough for now.

Dd's portage worker sorted dd's 1:1 and funding out for us.

[lou031205]

DD1 (Hants)initially had 'standard' funding, which funded 1.5 hours per 2.5 hour session. But they gave her full 1:1.

When money was tight, they struggled so put her down to 1.5 hours 1:1, but it went wrong.

The Area Inco applied for 'enhanced' funding, so they get extra money, so she still gets full 1:1.

I would say it depends on 'why'. If it is safety, what does their risk assessment do when he doesn't have full 1:1? They can't put him/others at risk.

[lou031205]

Oh, and apply for that statement - sooner the better.

[lou031205]

Sorry, never said, DD1 goes 14hrs per week.

[grumpyoldeeyore]

you need to ask the lea for details of the funding they delegate to nursery or which nursery can access without a statement and the criteria etc - our lea will give 50% of funded hours or 75% of funded hours to voluntary / private nurseries depending on how many areas of the curriculum your child is delayed and by what degree they are behind BUT if the nursery is part of a school they will get their own bigger delegated budget (based on deprivation index so schools in rough parts of town get the most) and SOME more enlightened schools may put in more 1:1 eg 100% of funded hours. We have a local school which does this - uses own money to put in 1:1 shows this makes a difference to the child and then use this evidence to apply for a statement.

[hairyclaireyfairy]

No statement until school, but full 1-1 for all the hours at nursery. Think it was accessed ans paid for by early yearsbut could be wrong it was a while ago now.

[bubblagirl]

my ds at nursery was seen by the specialist nursery teacher and team who funded him 1.5 hrs out of a 2.5 hrs a day with no statement the statement we didnt do until school someone came to assess him at nursery and allocated them hours cant remember how we pushed for it now but it wasnt that hard the nursery just had to ask for extra funding and reason ds was assessed and hrs were allocated

[nappyaddict]

lou this is the thing. he is very agressive - pinches, bites, pulls hair etc and is also clumsy, unbalanaced and has weak motor skills compared to his peers. I am worried that without more 1:1 it puts both himself and others at risk

[bubblagirl]

can the senco request more hours giving these reasons then maybe someone will come assess and grade him for extra hours i guess asking the senco for advise on how to obtain more hours may help its in there best benefit also as well as his to explore further options

[nappyaddict]

The thing is I think they have to pay for it up until so many hours and then the LEA top it up. I know once he's in full time school anything up to 15 hours the school have to pay for and then if they have over 15 hours the LEA pay the extra, so presumably it works similar in nursery?

[bubblagirl]

they can get the full hours from the term after there 3rd b day they just need to be observed and awarded the right band to receive it my ds was awarded straight away 1.5 out of 2.5 day as he had no other problems such as aggression but the other child was awarded full 12.5hrs both were observed first

[nappyaddict]

and neither had a statement in place at that time?

[bubblagirl]

no no statements we were recommended to start that process when starting school as the early yrs team were easier than school LEA something along them times we didnt start statement process until ds was heading towards 4 we did it x mas before his 4th b day in april to make sure we had plenty of time for amendments lucky we did

i remember the senco saying to me we are going to ask for extra hours etc someone is coming to assess him and then from there he was given by the early yrs team 1.5 a day out of 2.5 a specialist pre school teacher that came in every 3 weeks to amke sure things were in place and being acted apon and also came to me at home every 6 weeks to update me

[bubblagirl]

specialist pre school teacher is still with us and we say goodbye wed as school will now take over with there equivalent of specialist teacher as well as the senco being there

ask your nursery senco about funding extra hours and also phone your local early years team and ask advise maybe it was good as pre school took over and i didnt have the hassle until statement for school

[nappyaddict]

We are already dealing with the specialist early years service and they said they don't have the budget to give him more than 1 session and 50 minutes. Presumably if he had a statement which said he needed more they would have to give it him, although where they would find the money from I don't know. However it takes 6 months for a statement so it is unlikely that will come through before Easter.

[lou031205]

Their budget is irrelevant, though. If they are acknowledging that he has additional needs that put other children at risk, those needs don't disappear after 1 session and 50 minutes. If he needs 1:1 to ensure other children don't get hurt, then they need to fund 1:1.

In your shoes, I would consider the following:

1. Write to the LEA requesting statutory assessment.
   
2. Write to early years service and specifically raise safety concerns - ask what measures they are taking to minimise risk to all children, including your DS.
   
3. (If you don't know) ask what stage your DS is at - Early years action/action plus & ask for Ed psych to observe.
   
   Is your DS being assessed at all? Do you know why he is agressive? Does he have an IEP?

[nappyaddict]

He had a MDA for 4 weeks and we are currently awaiting to see the Ed Psych so she and the consultant can decide whether there is any diagnosis to be made.

Early years' answer is to put him in a special needs nursery just over 2 miles away. My concerns are:

1. He would have to go on transport and be on the minibus for 8am which makes it a long day for him when he is only 3.
   
   
2. No point of contact with the school except for a phone number and parent's evenings.
   
   
3. He went to the hospital nursery for his MDA for 5 weeks, then to his mainstream nursery. If he moves to the specialist nursery and then they decide he is not bad enough to go special school for Reception he will have to move back to his current mainstream school. I think this is far too much disruption for him in one year.
   
   
4. When I asked if he could go to a specialist playgroup for 2-4 year olds I was told it wouldn't be beneficial as he's not as bad as the children there and he wouldn't progress as well. If that was the case then, won't the same apply for the specialist nursery?
   
   
5. We were told at the specialist nursery there's a lot of children like him with behavioural issues - pinching, biting etc. When he went to the MDA I did notice he picked up some of the quirks and odd behaviours off the other children. My concern is that he will see other children being agressive as well at the specialist nursery and do it more.
   
   What is the difference between early years action and action plus?
   
   Is the statutory assessment about getting a statement because his early years one to one has already set the ball rolling to get him a statement.

[lou031205]

It sounds as if he is on EYA+ - the difference is whether outside agencies are involved, which they are.

Tricky about the SN nursery. I suppose the ultimate question is what they do there that they can't do at his current one? DD1 goes to mainstream nursery, but has 1:1 at all times, a visual timetable, sand timer for encouraging her to stay at activities, special jobs to do to distract her from running around during tidy up time, a small speech and language group called 'Chatterbox', OT targets. Portage and the NHS OT visit termly to oversee the intervention. All small, low-tech things, but together make such a difference.