under what circumstances can a child be sectioned?

[geffacake]

My ds is a school refuser and is being home tutored. He has no firm dx but gets DLA. He's going to a specialist placement in Sept but his tutor and I are worried that he'll find it difficult to go. The tutor said that CAMHS have threatened to section children who won't comply in the past. Under what circumstances would a child be sectioned?

[davidsotherhalf]

your ds cannot be sectioned unless he has a mental illness and is a danger to himself and others.....take no notice of what the tutor said, nobody can be sectioned for finding things difficult.

[geffacake]

he does have mental health difficulties in that he struggles to leave the house - would that be a good enough reason?

[davidsotherhalf]

is your ds a danger to himself? is he a danger to others? if not he cannot be sectioned, my dd has social phobia

[geffacake]

no he isn't a danger - thanks for answering

[davidsotherhalf]

pm me if you need any more help,

[geffacake]

thanks I may do that!

[mariamagdalena]

helpline

[geffacake]

thanks - have spoken to them before

[debinaboat]

i would be wondering about the tutors motives for saying that to you(was it said to you or your ds?)sounds very alarming, and if someone had said that to me (very similar circumstances to you )i would have been very upset and worried. is the tutor a private one or does he/she work for the ed department, if private, get rid. if ed department talk to his/her superior.i dont think you should be bullied? manipulated?frightened?in this way.

[geffacake]

LEA tutor - said out of ds's hearing. I don't think the tutor was trying to bully/frighten me, I do think that they are very worried about getting ds back on their books again if it doesn't work out with the new placement.
The tutor has actually been really supportive during the time they have worked with my ds and I can't praise them enough for that TBH.
The tutor did apologise for saying it, as it was clear that I was very worried.But I am concerned about what would happen legally if he school refuses now for the specialist placement. The tutor said that we would be prosecuted, although we haven't been so far as he's been signed off by the GP. Will this change once he accesses the specialist placement?

[debinaboat]

my own experience of LEA regarding ds problems have made me very wary ,i dont trust any of them.that has probably clouded the way i interpeted what your tutor said to you. I have to remember that there are some good ones too. I remember the stress of trying to get my ds to go to school(he just couldnt do it) sadly our only option was to remove ds from the system and home ed. but that is not suitable for everyone.i too worried about being prosecuted and this seemed the only way to stop that fear.I hope it all works out for your ds.

[davidsotherhalf]

see gp before school placement starts.....have you heard of school phobia? my ds was diagnosed with this a few yrs ago.....hth

[geffacake]

do you mind if I ask who gave you the dx of school phobia?

[davidsotherhalf]

camhs, and ed phsyc came out to my house to see ds, and tried to get him into school over a few months, didn't work and he gave same dx as camhs.

[geffacake]

thanks - did camhs do any assessments to reach that dx?

[davidsotherhalf]

they asked lots of questions about how ds felt about school...eg: imagine putting uniform on, how do you feel, how do you feel when leaving house etc,......i would take ds to school, had to deliver him to senco, then tell deputy head he was in school (office next door to senco) by the time i got home he was waiting for me with a coffee, one day i took keys off him and told him i wouldn't be in, he borrowed a tent and camped out on the hills overlooking school, with the cows, i thought he was in school as they didn't ever tell me otherwise. this was before he got dx as i didn't know about school phobia.

[StarChartEsq]

'he borrowed a tent and camped out on the hills overlooking school'

OMG, I LOVE your ds. (Sorry to trivialise a very serious thread but what an amazing kid)

[davidsotherhalf]

ds has asd and has to plan everything, he had plans for everything, as when i asked him about the tent he replied i checked the weather forcast and it said rain lol he didn't want to get wet, the cows kept him company

[geffacake]

bless him camping out! he sounds wonderful!

[deadendsvillediva]

my ds has been signed off school by a psyc, has a home tutor and has also been dxd with school phobia and social phobia on top of his other, dxs, however I'm a bit unsure of these dxs......................sorry for the hijack.

[geffacake]

not a hijack at all My ds has also been signed off school but doesn't have a dx of school phobia - I'm wondering how to investigate that

[davidsotherhalf]

why are you unsure of dx deadendsvillediva?

[pinkorkid]

My ds was also out of school for 15 months due to school related anxiety. Has dx of ASD and ADHD has some ocd traits but no specific diagnosis of school phobia. To some extent, if mainstream school is causing/contributing to the child's anxiety and not meeting his needs, you could say that anxiety in those circumstances is a rational certainly understandable response. Helping your ds to recognise that the situation in the new school setting will be different and easier for him to cope with is going to be very important.

One thing that really helped our ds was cognitive behavioural therapy which we accessed via camhs. (Although only after quite a battle and significant delays). Anyway it helped him to be able to some extent to be aware when his reactions were appropriate to the circumstances and to work out what would help him to control feelings of anxiety eg knowing in advance what was going to happen, relaxation techniques, positive thinking. It's not a magic bullet and not every child is able to benefit from it but it did make a significant difference to him despite very entrenched fears.

[deadendsvillediva]

ds is primarily down syndrome with other medical, physical and neurological dxs. He has always been a prolific school refuser for the same reasons. Now he is just physically too big, strong and heavy for me to manhandle him there. Hence why he doesn't go to school. Some profs and I, believe another dx is missing or possibly 2 dxs, without the correct help etc for those. I feel because some of his issues, school misunderstand him and I also know they have lied about some and they also allowed him to do what he wanted rather than say they couldn't cope iyswim. Anyway ds is registered at a special school and due to some of his needs am unable to access some mainstream facilities. However, I have managed to get my ds to access these with me and eventually he now goes to a TA to do exactly the same as what I have been doing. Some days he's reluctant but there, others he's skipping in. So how can he have a phobia of school. I feel its due to the fact I am meeting his needs albeit only for an hour per day.
From what I can gather about social phobia, it is extreme shyness, lacks confidence etc I feel my ds is not shy and a child who can strip naked outside is pretty confident to me. This is my reasoning to why school phobia and social phobia are possibly the wrong dxs. Although you can correct me if I'm wrong and help me make sense of it all. Hope this makes sense anyway.

[deadendsvillediva]

geoff I have been reading a book lately about school refusal, by Mike Fortune Wood here We were also told ds needed cbt, however he is too severe learning disabled to do it.