should we sacrifice...?

[hex]

worksurface and cupboards to have large French windows?

We're renovating our kitchen and can't have both. If we go with the windows, then we'll have 2x50cm and 1 x 60cm work surface, and of course, underneath cupboards. Is this enough for a family of four? Or should we have standard back door and loads of cupboards and preparation space?

[PrettyCandles]

Deffo the second, IMO.

Compromise with an ordinary (doubleglazed) door and a large window.

[skirmish]

doesn't sound like a lot of work surface - is there a table in the kitchen?

also, cannot imagine a kitchen without a window!

[hex]

We will have a small sash window as well as french doors if we chose this option...and I hope to have a table near the cooker which we can eat off. I dream of having the kitchen opened up to the garden (hence the doors) though in reality I wonder how often this would happen

[Pannacotta]

How about going for the doors and getting a butchers block trolley on wheels which you can use as food prep space when cooking (and move aside when not in use)?
Also I think IKEA or Magnet do pull or slide out worktop shelves (IYSWIM) to add extra worktop space.
Think its fab to have a kitchen opening out onto the garden.

[PrettyCandles]

We have sliding patio doors in the eating area of our kitchen. At first I thought 'Brilliant! We can leave the doors open, children can come in and out, lots of fresh air' but the way it actually works out is that we're forever sliding them almost shut: too breezey. And too heavy for the children to open and shut by themselves. I would prefer an ordinary hinged door plus window.

[hex]

that's really interesting Prettycandles...we live NE England so it's not exactly warm most of the year either...but don't yr doors give the impression of 'openness' even when closed cause they're mostly glass?

[lljkk]

I managed (also a family of four, and we prep lots of vegetables every day for tea) in a kitchen with that little amount of workspace. You can make it work. Had to put microwave in corridor, though.

But I'm unsure why you can't have windows over workspace. Agree that doors with wind blowing through may be impractical.

[Mumpbump]

Having a similarly limited area of worksurface at the minute myself, I would sacrifice the windows. We're actually going to move our kitchen around so we have more - we have 1x50cm, 1x40 cm and a corner area which extends a little bit and it's really tiny. Should end us with the 50cm worksurface being 150cm, hopefully!

[PrettyCandles]

Mmm, sort of. But only part of the day. Our kitchen faces SW and is a sun-trap, so even in the winter we find we have to draw the curtains if it is sunny, so we lose the 'open' feel of the patio doors.

[hippipotami]

I am biased, as we have french doors going out onto our patio. It is one of hte things I love about our kitchen, and many friends list it as one of the nicest things in the house.
Re worktop space, I am lucky in that I have a total of nearly 4metres of worktop including a breakfast bar. But no space for a table.

If you have space for a table, then go for the french doors as it will make the kitchen such a nice room to be in!

[hex]

this sounds like a stupid question but..those with french doors, when they open out, do they fold right back 180 degrees or just angled at 90 degrees. The reason I ask is that if we did go for this, one adjacent wall would stop them going back 180 degrees..

Also are there different qualities of French doors...who makes the best? Good or bad experiences anyone?

[LIZS]

ours stop at about 115 o ! iyswim

[BrownSuga]

our doors went to 90 but then i took the metal arm out of the top of the door so i could push them back to 180. so shouldn't matter about your wall.

[Quattrocento]

French windows every time. Every single time. What are you going to do with the cupboards other than fill them with stuff?

But then I am obsessive about light and have installed lots of french windows in our house.

[heifer]

french door are a real bonus... love mine, but not sure I could do withouth the workspace either.

Could do without cupboard space (do you have an utility room?) but would struggle to do without workspace.

Think I would still go with french doors...

[ShinyHappyPeopleHoldingHands]

You could have hooked to hang pans etc on to compensate for cupboard space.. and/or plate rack on the wall..

[maisym]

go for the windows - do you have space for a kitchen table? - you could use this as well for preparation

[hex]

I'm starting to be convinced that only 160cm work surfaces might be manageable and to have French windows. We will have a kitchen table to prepare stuff plus a window over the sink. If I look at the 2 metres of work surface we have now, most of it's got junk on it (letters, crap, etc)so it'd force me to be more organised.

The cupbd space might be a bit of an issue but one of the reasons we're also short on surface/cupbd space is cause I want a door from the kitchen to utility room. Some stuff could go in there I gues tho it's not that big and I've already planned to put laundry, ironing stuff, washing machine and drier, outdoor boots, recycling, bleach, etc, etc (oh dear...wondering now whether I'll be able to get in there!)

[hex]

okay so next question is:

where do we buy them from - and are they easy to install or would you get someone to do it?

[maisym]

depends on yur diy skills - I'd have a builder do the job!

[LIZS]

Also bear in mind if you ever sell the house you'll need a FENSA certificate, which only approved installers can provide.

[hex]

what's FENZA - this is really useful info

[IsabelWatchingItRainInMacondo]

If you decide to get the doors, check twice they are double glazed, it will be more expensive but having a single glazed option would render the kitchen a bit unusable... (too cold).

If the space you mention in the opening post is totally free of other appliances, I think it might be a bit tight, but still OK if you have the 2x50 between the cooker and the sinc and the other with 60 between the cooker and the fridge. (so you can have 2 persons working at each side)

I'm not really up for trying to use all the space available in a kitchen, particularly where tiny corner cabinets are concerned, too much worksurface space lost for a tiny extra storage space.

HTH

[IsabelWatchingItRainInMacondo]

Where to get it from depend solely in your budget, obviously made to order kitchens of prime quality would cost enough to get a small house, but if you are looking for one that is sturdy enough but still in the cheap side, get one from IKEA.

I know a kitchen designer who has worked for very famous people but as she obviously doesn't have the same budget than her clients she opted for the sturdy cabinets of an IKEA one and spend the rest of the budget in some other expensive floritures not available from them.