Book recommendations please?

[NotPayingAttention]

Would really appreciate the benefit of others' experience please as I'm going crosseyed googling! Being as specific as possible- my 5.5 yo DD will be going into year 1 soon. She is currently able to read really well and has learnt by recognition of familiar words rather than phonics. On a week long holiday recently she read Roald Dahl Charlie and the chocolate factory, great glass elevator and the witches, over the course of the evenings before bed. She has a great attention span and finds them very interesting, I don't have to give her much encouragement other than turning off the TV. I'm not sure she understands every single nuance but her comprehension seems at a good level with it and she also seems to understand the humour. I really want to find some (lots of) other reading material for her at this level, which is appropriate to her reading level but also her emotional maturity, which I would say is that of any other 5 year old, with maybe a slightly advanced sense of humour. Books like this seem thin on the ground?

I've seen a lot mentioning classics, but I'm not sure which ones to go for as I'll admit I'm not a big reader myself so I'm not really familiar. I tried Alice in Wonderland but I'd say that language is a bit too flowery at this stage. Can anyone make specific suggestions or point me towards guidance please?

Her school aren't really helpful and either don't seem to understand what level she's at or otherwise purposely holding her back (I don't know why they would do this though unless they think she needs to learn their way first? ie proper phonics etc but to be fair she is very eager to learn and I think she would learn it all a lot quicker than the pace they go in class if given the materials to take home). How should I approach this with her new teacher? I'm afraid of making an enemy of the school by pushing anything with them, but they actually told my husband she doesn't HAVE to read her whole Biff, Chip and Kipper book in one sitting, as if he was somehow forcing her! They don't realise she could read 3 or 4 of the books they supply in one evening and still ask for more.

I'm always willing to give her the time and sit with her to help but now I'd say her reading is almost better than my own! She really enjoys it but also enjoys variety which I'm afraid I'm not giving her and she will bore of it and I would feel awful if she abandoned reading due to my lack of thought and knowledge on the subject.

Thanks in advance for any help it's much appreciated

[sirfredfredgeorge]

I'm a bit confused by saying that she enjoyed and you're happy with The Witches, but then go on to say there's a shortage of stuff for 5 year olds. The Witches is not pitched at 5 year olds, I think it's completely fine for most 5 year olds, but then there are loads of similar books, most reviews etc. place the Witches at around age 9. The widespread death, the lack of happy ever after, the lots of peril etc. has lots of people thinking it's not appropriate for 5 year olds.

If you're happy with the Witches, any pre-puberty stories will be fine I'd say, so all of David Walliams and so much more - why not just take her to the library and let her choose what she likes? I really don't think there's a shortage at all.

[NotPayingAttention]

Hi sirfred, okay I guess I tripped up on that one with my turn of phrase. I'm sure there are lots of books available at the level at which I describe. I just can't seem to find them. I admit I am not well read and am having trouble with guidance for my daughter hence asking the question.

I've just spoken to her about the Witches. She has told me she really liked the book and although there are some scary characters she didn't find the book overall scary. I do know what you mean its a bit racy and Dahl's characters can be a bit cruel sometimes but its not bothering her, so that's fine by me.

However some of the books I've skimmed through and bought for older tween-age children have themes that are maybe uninteresting or confusing and therefore offputting to a 5 year old, as their life experience and social/emotional needs are different if you see what I mean? I would think she could manage to read Harry Potter, but the social and emotional challenges and interactions of the characters would be a bit beyond her. I hope this makes more sense? Chapter books of novel length for children tend to be aimed at that level emotionally, or at least this is the brick wall i keep coming up against.
Maybe it's just that Dahl was writing in a more innocent time when 9 year olds were still treated like the pre pubescents that they are, rather than as teenagers and that's the kind of thing I'm looking for more of?

I'm all for library visits but it's a bit overwhelming sometimes, for both me and my daughter, as there is a lot to wade through. I'm just asking for a bit of experience amongst people who are likely to have come across this situation before.

Thanks for the Walliams suggestion she's just been given one of them by the grandparents, I've never read any of his longer books so I'll give it a quick skim before letting her at it.

[Caroian]

There are literally hundreds of fabulous books available for this age range, especially if your daughter was not phased by The Wiches. Either your local library or a local bookshop are good places to start. But to start you off:

More Roald Dahl - The Magic Finger, The BFG, Matilda, George's Marvellous Medicine etc etc
The Worst Witch by Jill Murphy
My Naughty Little Sister by Dorothy Edwards
Enid Blyton - especially Far Away Tree, Wishing Chair, Secret Seven etc seem popular with similar aged girls
Jill Tomlinson's Animal Tales
Many of the Dick King Smith books are great
Isla Fisher's Marge in Charge Series
Pippi Longstocking
The 13 Storey Treehouse series
Mrs Pepperpot stories

[lizzybennett1926]

The worst witch series was loved by both my son and daughter at a similar age.
Enid Blyton is always good especially The Faraway Tree.
Beast Quest
The Rainbow Fairies series
The Secret Garden

[Caroian]

Came back to add:
Winnie the Pooh
Paddington Bear
Flat Stanley
Any of the Jeremy Strong books - The Hundred Mile an Hour Dog is great.

Can you tell that I love children's books?!

[sirfredfredgeorge]

For me, I'd say please not any anachronistic sexist racist crap like Enid Blyton, (much of Dahl is a bit dodgy there too, but it's not as bad) but that is why I wanted you to just choose yourself. I don't think we can advise as books which are suitable, depends so much on your own value judgements. Lots of (completely normal non-racist/sexist) people think EB is fine, I don't, I think it's completely inappropriate for anyone, the younger the child the less suitable.

Suitability at young ages is so much about opinion of the parent. For me, the only exclusions are things which would beyond comprehension - so anything that relies on post puberty feelings of attraction, or requires pre-knowledge that the individual kid doesn't have, e.g. Animal Farm is out not because of the violence but because there's no life experience to understand. But even then I wouldn't explicitly deny if DD asked to read, I'd simply say you're unlikely to get much out of it because...

There are lots of books between Biff and Chip and Pre-teen, ask your librarian which shelves they're on, it's unlikely to be a massive section, and those sections won't be full of the love and sex situations that in-puberty pre-teens want to read about.

Choosing books to read is part of the enjoyment of reading, reading what others choose is not, and it's something a librarian can help with, as they actually have the child in front of them to talk about stuff, demystifying the library is probably a good thing to do for both of you!

[brilliotic]

The Charlie & the Chocolate Factory books are quite different to The Witches, IMO, the former likely to be with 7+ books or even with 5+ (as it is often read to young children), the latter more likely 9+ as PP said, not due to 'difficulty' but rather because of the scariness etc.

With DS I had to be rather careful as he found quite a lot of things quite scary and if anything like that slipped through my vetting, he would be put off reading for a while which was a shame. But there are so many books out there that if your child can read well and has stamina and isn't easily scared, you're kind of spoilt for choice. What you really need to discover is what kinds of books your daughter enjoys. And not worry too much about books being 'too easy' - as long as she enjoys them and asks for more!

Eg DS is into adventure stories with monsters (it is not monsters that he finds scary, but rather the suspense of deliberate wrong-doing and being caught). So many Roald Dahl books were a bit scary (due to naughty main characters) as well as David Walliams. But give him a three-headed venom-spewing monster with raking claws and three inch teeth that is seemingly impossible to kill, and he's unfazed...

DS really enjoyed Beast Quest, Secret Agent Jack Stalwart, Time Hunters, but also The Secret Rescuers (marketed at girls), and sporty fantasy stories such as Flying Fergus, and Frankie's Magic Football (a very easy read) and occasionally Holly Webb type stories ('Harry the Homeless Puppy' and similar), and Olga da Polga. Also Astrid Lindgren e.g. Noisy Village series.

You can also try her on poetry and on non-fiction. It really is a matter of finding books that she enjoys, not everything you give her will captivate her, in time you will learn which 'genres' she likes and can look for more specific recommendations.

If you want to get her into Harry Potter eventually, you could start with Oliver Moon books now, or Mister Majeika.

Also on any bookshop page e.g. TheBookPeople books will often have an age indication, I've found that from 9+ they will include books where the main characters are teenagers and romance is on the table, but anything below 9+ you should be safe. And check out 'Children's Books' here on MN. Armed with that kind of info, re-visit your library and pick up a selection of books, it doesn't matter if she ends up not reading all of them!

[LetItGoToRuin]

I don’t have much to add regarding book recommendations – pretty much everything I’ve thought of has already been suggested.

Regarding the library feeling overwhelming, if you can find a weekly slot for a library visit you’ll soon get into a nice habit and get used to skimming books for interest and suitability. I’d second a PP’s comment about making sure not all books are a challenge: most younger children love to rattle through some easy reads as well. My DD has enjoyed plenty of the dreaded Rainbow Magic and Holly Webb animal books which are pretty cringeworthy, but that phase doesn’t last long, and I’ve always encouraged her to alternate those books with new authors. Non-fiction, poetry and joke books also go down well! My DD and I go the library every week, and we’re actually struggling to find appealing new books after a couple of years!

Regarding how to speak to the new teacher, is there an opportunity to write your DD’s home reading books in her school reading record? I’ve always done this, including adding comments about how she found the vocab, style, nuance etc. I soon realised that the school reading books were very random and, while we used them in our daily reading aloud sessions at home, the library books were much more enjoyable and appropriate. You’ll have to decide how much of a battle you’re willing to have with the teacher about books. Hopefully the Y1 teacher will be flexible, but I’d try to hang on until the first parents’ evening to have a word, if you can manage it.

I noticed your comment about your DD using word recognition rather than phonics. It’s not uncommon for early readers to find their own techniques for reading, but by the time they get to Roald Dahl it’s unlikely that it’s purely word recognition. Does your DD actually struggle with phonics, or is she just so far ahead that it doesn’t engage her? Plenty of early readers find that phonics teaching reinforces their existing reading methods.

How does your DD tackle new words? Does she break them down into sections, either out loud or in her head? Does she read out loud to you for a few minutes most days? This can reveal a great deal about how carefully she is reading. Is she reading every word, or skimming? Does she skip bits? Can she pronounce unfamiliar words in a plausible way?

[sirfredfredgeorge]

but by the time they get to Roald Dahl it’s unlikely that it’s purely word recognition

There's not a hope you can read the BFG without a good grounding of phonics I'm sure.

[MumUnderTheMoon]

I loved Judy Blume super fudge and other books in that series especially. I also loved the worst witch books and milly molly mandy books. And if Harry Potter had been around at that age I'm sure I'd have read those too.

[brilliotic]

Just browsed DS' bookshelf...
Gobbolino the Witches' Cat
(The Adventures of the Little Wooden Horse, by same author)
Fortunately the Milk... Neil Gaiman. DS keeps going back to that one, and I find it very enjoyable too.
Perhaps the 'Little House' books?
Stig of the Dump

I know what you mean SirFred about the sexist stuff in older books but have been thinking about it and am feeling a bit ambivalent. Thing is, lots of newer books are terribly sexist too. So they need equal vetting.

Perhaps you could even say that sexism in newer books is more insiduous than in old books. Because it is much more likely to 'slip in' under the radar and unnoticed. Whereas the sexism in older books is, to us, so blatant and obvious that it jumps out at us; and it is presented to a young reader in a context of 'that's how things used to be' rather than normalising the present realities.
So when reading '5 children and It' by E. Nesbit, or 'Swallows and Amazons' by A. Ransome, we do encounter sexism, alongside telegraphs and steam boats and household cooks&maids and horse-drawn carriages. The social relations incl sexism can easily be read as social relations of the time alongside the technology of the time etc.

In contrast, when we encounter sexism in modern literature, say, Harry Potter (think for example of the family structures with breadwinner dads and SAHMs that wizards as well as muggles generally exhibit), the huge numbers of books with male main characters and female sidekicks (marketed at both sexes), the equally huge number of books with female main characters that are painfully 'girly' and would never be touched by most boys, ... the sexism in modern books reflects our current society and our children's actual experiences, and normalises them. Which might be more dangerous to young minds than reading about how girls did the cooking in camp whilst the boys went exploring the island, particularly if given the opportunity to discuss with involved parents.

[brilliotic]

Oh I meant to add, if anyone is looking for refreshingly non-sexist books for children/pre-teens, look at the Accidental Pirates series. Claire Fayers. Good stuff.

[sirfredfredgeorge]

the sexism in modern books reflects our current society and our children's actual experiences, and normalises them

You are of course correct, and I am much more concerned about the racism (Chinky the poor deprived foreigner working as a slave to the giant that needs rescuing by the couple of nice middle class white kids) But I think you're underplaying the sexism biases, the traditional family elements of HP is quite a bit less impactful than the fact there are women throughout in powerful positions and doing things.

And of course I think you're hugely over-doing the amount of discussion that would happen as a result, if there is discussion you can do it more easily about the actual modern society we have that is reflected in all media, than having had to first wade through all the more blatant issues in old stuff. The superficial obvious sexism and racism of EB might be discounted by a modern reader, but it also has all that same modern aspect, it's perhaps not a SAHM as they'll have staff, but there's still the remote hard working father trope.

Anyway, as I said lots of sane no more racist or sexist than other folk are happy with EB and grew up with it without becoming one, so it's not as if I think you're completely ruining children by allowing it. I just think it's a complete waste of everyones time to read something that you have to discuss it after.

[extrastrongmints]

Chris Riddell: corby flood, fergus crane, the ottoline books
Eoin Colfer : the legend of spud murphy, the legend of the worst boy in the world, the legend of captain crow's teeth.
Diana Wynne Jones: Freaky Families, Earwig and the witch
Allan Ahlberg: Jeremiah in the dark woods, It was a dark and stormy night. the Gaskitt books
Kevin Crossley-Holland: Storm
Michael Morpurgo : Conker, The butterfly lion
Jacqueline Wilson: My Brother Bernadette.
Andy Stanton: The Mr Gum books

[imsorryiasked]

Jeremy Strong are good for humour.
And the Winnie the witch series (chapter books rather than picture books)
DS loved the Spy dog series.

[missyB1]

Dick King Smith the Sophie books would be great for this age.
I second the Faraway Tree books by Blyton.

[NotPayingAttention]

Thank you so so much for your suggestions so far everyone, this is perfect and I am compiling a list! We popped to our local library the other day and it was great to have a few starting points. We'd not been for a long time, sort of put on hold since she was started on the Biff et al last September. She was loving it and the librarians were very helpful. So much easier than trying to fathom things out online so I will make time to start going again regularly.

However as stated her attention span and ability has now quickly outstripped what the school have drip fed over the last 12 months. I was a bit taken aback actually at the speed she's been consuming the novels over the hols. I need to do a bit more reading aloud with her to check up and help her get the most out of it, it's no good her just skipping over the words she doesn't understand, although having skimmed over her new Walliams' "Mr Stink", I do genuinely believe it wouldn't pose that much of a problem for her. I noticed a review calling him the new Dahl, so maybe that is what I've been looking for .

Thanks for your advice LetItGoToRuin, yes I will wait for the first parents evening and possibly take in some of the books she's been reading over the holidays just as a visual aid . I will ask about your idea with the reading journal, I guess they would want her to stick with the material they supply in order to show progress and have proof of learning? I just find it all difficult as there's not a great deal of feedback over technicalities like that and I'm not a teacher so no idea! I don't want to interfere with their processes. From reading other posts in this forum I can see it's all a bit of a minefield, up to now hopefully she isn't bored in class.

[NellyBarney]

My dd is 6 and read her way through Harry Potter over the summer (she is a very good reader but not gifted; she had previously watched all the movies, then had watched the movies again and on mute while reading the subtitles, and only then was ready to get absorbed in the books and 'get' most of the nuances). I was a bit worried about the darker aspects of the later movies/books but it was exactly that what fascinated her. We had endless discussions about why Tom Riddle turned into evil Lord Voldemort, whether Draco Malfoy had a good core after all and how he must have felt when he was coerced into plotting a murder, and about her favourite character Snape and how he was damaged and good and cruel at the same time. She really loves moral dilemmas, grey shades and tragedy. And she locks herself into her room when she reads the more romantic bits as she gets a bit embarrassed about it but obviously is very fascinated by them. Last summer, when she was 5, we read our way through the Times Chronicles. These are Biff and Chip ORT books (level 11 to 13) that combine time travel adventures with lots of history.