Violin exams, when and what?!?!

[PinotAndPlaydough]

Dd has been learning violin for a year, she has 1:1 lessons and loves it. She happily practices 5-10 minutes every day and often picks it up just to play pieces she enjoys for fun.

Anyway she’s started asking about exams, I’ll check with her teacher after half term but I was wondering if anyone could give me a rough idea of what she will have to be able to do.

I’m the least musical person in the world, teacher says her sight reading is very good and if means anything to people in the know she’s now on 3rd finger on a & d (literally no idea what this means ) and is one of two children in the string band at school who are second violin (apparently there’s is one 1st violin and then some others who play but aren’t 1st or 2nd, again I don’t know what this means, just trying to give an idea of where she’s at).

She genuinely loves it so much and I think wants to have something to show for this hence the interest in the exams.

[folkmamma]

It's great that she is keen and is practicing regularly! Good start! Have a chat with the teacher to say she is interested in exams - sounds like she is a little way off yet (I would have thought she'll need at least 3, poss even 4 fingers on all 4 strings in 1st position) but teacher may be happy to pick up the pace if she knows she's keen to start working towards something. I haven't seen any of the prep test material so this could be a possibility. And ABRSM also do music medals which follow a slightly different syllabus and offer a nice reward on the way or alongside the traditional exams. Good luck!!

[thirdfiddle]

Sounds like a great start, specially that she's practising regularly, playing for fun AND sight reading! I've heard people say 2 years to grade 1 is normal/good progress, and sounds like your DD could be on that sort of track.

Normally teacher will say when it's time to think of an exam, some can get a bit shirty if they think parents are pushing for exams too soon. Just so you know to phrase your enquiry carefully! Nothing wrong with a child wanting to know how they're getting on though.

I checked some old grade 1 music we have around and folk is spot on, will want to be using fingers 1-3 and ideally 4 too and all four strings. In case not obvious the strings are G (the fat one) D, A and E (the thinnest one), and fingers is talking about which fingers of her left hand she's using to stop them. And if it wasn't obvious, how about getting DD to give you a lesson in how violins work - might be fun for both

Re school orchestra - normally orchestras have 1st violins, second violins then violas. Children's orchestras and schools often have lots of violins and no violas, so instead they'll have 1st, 2nd and 3rd violin sections. I'm just a little jealous you have a school orchestra available at all!

[horseymum]

Sounds like she is making really good progress. If you want to get more informed about exams, the abrsm website has loads of info, including what the criteria are for each section, ie pieces, sight-reading, scales. There are also whole exams you can watch and mark to see what happens and how the examiners mark them. I think violin seems to take a long while to get to grade one compared to some other instruments as there is so much going on eg fingers in different places, bowing, tuning etc . There is a very helpful music thread on here you could join with beginners and very advanced players ( don't be intimidated, everyone is happy to share advice and experience).

[GaraMedouar]

Probably would take her a couple of years to take grade 1 (ABRSM). Depends on her age though. My DD started lessons at age 4 in reception and took grade 1 summer year 2, so she was 6 very nearly 7. She then took grade2 the following summer, so age 7 nearly 8.
I'd speak to the teacher but no harm buying the scale book. There aren't many at grade 1 level. D and A one octave and G two octaves. Plus arpeggios. So she will need to be able to play all 4 fingers on all 4 strings really (although could get away with not using 4th finger. My DD is into grade 3 and still often plays open strings instead of 4th finger.
Playing in an orchestra is great for sight reading practise, counting, listening etc.
She also needs to play 3 pieces, with accompaniment. The new ABRSM syllabus for violin starts 2020 so if you get a grade 1 book she can have a look through and see what she fancies.
But speak to the teacher and she can advise. It's great she's so keen though.
The only downside with doing the exams is that you have to focus on the pieces and it can get a bit boring doing the same over and over. My DS1 did violin too and he took the exams when he was slightly above the grade so he got good marks which is nice and didn't have to slog for too long on the pieces. DS2 struggled more on the exams because he wanted to take them a bit too early, as he was so competitive with his brother!

[horseymum]

Definitely wouldn't consider the exam until they can play pieces that level fluently. You hear of people starting grade pieces six months beforehand, that sounds soul destroying and suggests they are well below the level. ( This is for earlier grades, I imagine grade 8 piano pieces take a long time to learn!) Preparation for exams actually takes time away from progressing in many cases. My DD is going in at grade 5 for oboe as teacher didn't think it was useful to do earlier ones. She has done 2 and 4 on piano so knows what to expect.

[PinotAndPlaydough]

Thanks for all the advice, teacher has said she’s definitely isn’t ready yet and that she would want her to be at a level where the exam was fairly easy so it doesn’t take the joy out of learning by having to learn the same pieces on repeat.

Is there an actual point to the exams other than just being able to say “I’m at this level”?

[folkmamma]

Is there a point...? That's a very good question without a right answer! For some kids it helps provide a much needed focus / goal. Without it they struggle to find motivation. Sometimes orchestras and ensembles want players to be of a certain standard. Eg NYO will only consider players who are above distinction level at grade 8. But a letter from their teacher stating they are playing at that level may get around it. Exams are also good performance practice. And if the syllabus is covered well, at least kids end up with a fairly rounded training covering scales, aural and sight reading as well as just pieces.

Sometimes I think they are counter productive and slow down progress. Holding a kid on the same 3 pieces to fit a window of opportunity can waste time and get frustrating. My DD hasn't done an exam since G3 because although she's prepped the material, the exam just hasn't fallen at the right time and we didn't want to hold her up (she's also done lots of non-exam rep and studies). I'm not even sure she'll do G8 now.

Then you have the kids who fold under the pressure of an exam, score badly and lose all confidence....

You do get UCAS credits for higher grades.

Then there are those like me who actually used to love exams!!

Depends on the child I guess.

[thirdfiddle]

The experience of polishing a programme to performance level; feedback from someone different; an incentive to work on technical skills like scales and sight reading that might seem less exciting than learning cool new pieces; as you say, showing you are a certain level. Nothing that there aren't other ways round I think.

My offspring have piano teacher who does every exam and as a step up too. Very time consuming, I don't like it.

Violin teacher, DD and I have agreed no exams for now. Perhaps having done a couple on piano reassures DD she's not missing out! Similar to horseymum's DD's teacher; she'll do exams at some point but not all of them, and no hurry to start. She's 7 and impatient and would much rather learn one piece at a time and move on to the next piece when she's ready.

[horseymum]

I think it depends on the teacher too. DDs woodwind teacher is a professional musician, he knows what level his pupils are at and what they need at any particular time, so doesn't need the exam. Our piano teacher is an amateur musician ( lovely and a great musician) but no professional qualifications or experience so exams help her have a bit of a focus too. Mine will do some piano exams, in between they use some of the exam pieces as a helpful measure to progress- they are often nice pieces if you don't have to listen to them for six months on repeat!! Also, exams are expensive, you don't want to do them all for that reason!! I think it can be useful as an experience of preparation and pressure before they get to things like academic exams as mine have all found it quite positive so hopefully giving them confidence in the future.

[nonicknameseemsavailable]

no violin experience here - I played the piano - but just in answer to your question about is there a point to exams. well I think it depends on the person. some people love having something to work towards and enjoy having achieved something. others aren't bothered by that. I did exams when I was younger but I didn't like classical music, found many of the tunes we had to play to be quite random and I wanted to play other stuff so I stopped after grade 3. unfortunately my teacher quite oddly didn't seem to know what to do and kept trying to make me learn the exam pieces anyway so I stopped lessons and have barely played since which is a shame as actually I loved music from musicals and jazz. Jazz seemed to suit me and I enjoyed it.

[tiredmumneedssleep]

Hi!

DD8 has been learning the violin for around 3 years and is currently in Grade 3.

She's been doing one exam, skipping one, and so on. So far, she's done Preliminary and Grade 2. We'll skip the Grade 3 exam and do Grade 4 next year.