Redundancy

[DownInTheDumps1]

I work in leisure & recreational services. I have two positions with separate contracts. I am a catering assistant for 20 hours and I also work in the crèche 5 hours a week.

The crèche is closing down and my employers have offered me an additional catering shift. This shift is on a day I currently don't work and doesn't suit my own childcare needs and would cost me as it's an extra round trip a week.

As far as I'm concerned I believe the two jobs are very different (regardless of whether I have the experience, training and qualifications) and that if my crèche position is ceasing my employers should pay me redundancy. My employers have told me that if I don't accept redeployment I will not be entitled to any payment.

What do you think?

[dayinlifeof]

If an employee facing redundancy
unreasonably refuses an offer of suitable
alternative employment, the employer can
legitimately refuse to make a redundancy
payment. However, employees are entitled
to decline an offer of alternative employment
without being penalised if it differs significantly
from their previous job. The following factors
are relevant:
• job content and status pay

• hours of work

[BritInUS1]

How long have you worked there?

[DownInTheDumps1]

20 years

[flowery]

The fact that the jobs are different doesn’t make the proposed alternative unsuitable, if it is suitable for your skills and experience, which it is.

Here is some guidance on what counts as a ‘suitable alternative’ which is useful www.personneltoday.com/hr/legal-qa-redundancy-and-redeployment-what-is-a-suitable-alternative-role/

[TittyGolightly]

They’ve offered you an additional shift of the job you already do.

That’s a reasonable alternative.

[DownInTheDumps1]

Thanks for your advice, I am with a trade union. My representative says the jobs are so vastly different that they will have no alternative other than to pay redundancy. I'm feeling a bit confused now!

[DownInTheDumps1]

The other issue means I have to come into work on a day I do not currently work. This will cost me more in travel and parking. They have no idea what I do on my days off!

[TittyGolightly]

Doesn’t matter that they are different, it’s clearly a suitable role because you’re already doing it!

[TittyGolightly]

The other issue means I have to come into work on a day I do not currently work. This will cost me more in travel and parking. They have no idea what I do on my days off!

Doesn’t matter.

[imnottoofussed]

And even if they gave you redundancy it wouldn't be much I expect. Obviously I don't know your hourly rate etc but I'd guess about £1000. You get 1 weeks pay for every year of service as far as I know.

[helloflamingogo]

Have you spoken to acas?

[TittyGolightly]

And you do t ah e to accept the offer. But if you don’t you wave goodbye to any redundancy payment.

[DownInTheDumps1]

Yes, I understand what your all saying. But, my union rep says different, that's why I'm so confused!

For 20 years loyal service for a few hundred pounds seems wrong.

I will let you know the outcome.

[BubblesBuddy]

They are still wishing to retain you, but with additional hours in a role you are doing. I don’t see that they are waving goodbye to you.

Obviously it’s not an ideal situation and I have had to accept a job further away from home in the past. I would ask for travel costs and other associated costs for the day you are now being asked to work. Many employers would pay this for 2 years. You should not be out of pocket and this is what I would try and get.

The other advantage of keeping the bigger job, is your pension and their contributions. Clearly your 5 hour job is redundant but I do think an extension of your other job is reasonable. I guess they cannot offer you a crèche job if they don’t have one but have wanted to keep you. There is value in that.

[DownInTheDumps1]

Thanks bubbles. My TU rep is insisting that the 2 jobs are not comparable and it matters not if I'm qualified and doing the other job already. The jobs have to be vaguely similar and clearly they aren't. Therefore TU is insisting it's an unreasonable offer that I do not have to accept.

[PersianCatLady]

If you are so confident in your TU's advice then it makes me wonder why you would ask online.

Do you have a reason to doubt what your TU is saying?

Have they dealt with a similar situation before at all or are they just giving their best guess?

[TittyGolightly]

What does the redundancy policy say?

[PersianCatLady]

For 20 years loyal service for a few hundred pounds seems wrong
I agree it sounds low but you only worked five hours a week in that role.

[flowery]

”The jobs have to be vaguely similar ”

No they don’t. The alternative being offered has to be suitable for you. Suitable means appropriate for your skills and experience, and on broadly the same terms and conditions. Have a read of the link I posted earlier in the thread. You cannot argue it is not suitable for your skills and experience as you are currently doing the job as part of your other contract. Your only valid argument that it isn’t a suitable alternative would be if they were making you travel loads further, or wanted to pay you less, or make you work significantly more hours or fewer hours.

If you are so sure your TU is correct, then appeal and see what happens. But the law is on your employer’s side and if you refuse a suitable alternative you will lose your redundancy payment. Which of course is only a few hundred pounds as you only work a few hours a week in a low paid position.

[DownInTheDumps1]

I asked the original question only after receiving informal TU advice. My redundancy process has now formally begun and my TU are still insisting I should pursue redundancy payment.

I'm confused by all the information online, redundancy is such a mine field. So to answer I'm posting because I'm not 100% confident.

[Psychobabble123]

@Flowery is a HR professional, hopefully she will see this and be able to advise.

[DownInTheDumps1]

She has!

[Psychobabble123]

Oh haha! Sorry. She is incredibly knowledgeable, I would take what she advises to be correct.

[DownInTheDumps1]

Well I've taken my TU advice, so let's see. I'm not in a position to accept the redeployment offered anyway. It's either redundancy payment or not I suppose .

[Fatted]

Your redundancy policy should state what the criteria is for declining a position you have been offered.

I was slightly different because I was put at risk of redundancy whilst pregnant and just prior to starting maternity leave. So I was pretty much guaranteed a role to be redployed into.

I'm sure with ours that if suitable roles were available for redeployment, then if you declined you wouldn't be entitled to any redundancy payment. I can't remember how many times you were able to decline a role. Things like traveling distance and childcare were taken into consideration. I declined my first offer because of childcare and was then offered another more suitable position. Being honest, if I wasn't on mat leave, I'm not how flexible they would have been with me!