What happens if carer of elderly FIL , ie his wife is no longer able to cope?

[kilmuir]

Back story. Both in their 70's. He was poorly in the summer and end result he has a homecarer visit once a day. He has limited mobility, some urinary incontinence and lucidity that comes and goes.
His main carer is his wife. She is partially sighted and needs a frame, very unsteady on her legs.
They have a poor relationship, he has been quite abusive in the past.
Few days ago she fell, he came downstairs, told her to get up and make tea! She stayed on floor until his home carer arrived in the morning!
He is in temporary respite care home, she is recovering in hospital.
We have been told social worker will be in touch. What can we expect to happen.

[ssd]

an assessment of their needs will be made and take it from there

[kilmuir]

Who asses their needs?

[ssd]

the social worker who is assigned to their case

[kilmuir]

Hmmm, i assume she has some input from Drs/nurses to assess their care needs. Seems odd a non medical person doing that

[CocktailQueen]

It's her job, op!

Sounds like your mum is no longer able to care for your dad (and why would she want to?) what does she want to do? What do you want to happen?

[MrsCosmopilite]

If it's like the care my elderly relatives are receiving then the social worker will assess them. The social worker will be attached to a care team (usually part of the local authority) who will then provide care.

Some care is funded, some is free - it depends on the level of care required, the frequency of visits necessary, and the amount of money your PIL's have.

I hope that your MIL was not too badly hurt by her fall. Has she had medical attention? I only ask as there was a similar incident a few years ago when my Aunt had a fall as a result of a stroke. My Uncle somehow didn't notice that she was 'unwell' and when I rang to speak to her just told me she was 'having a lie down' - which, as she was then late 70's, didn't strike me as odd. It was only when a family member rang later in the day and discovered she was 'still lying down' and went to investigate that we found out. Needless to say, she has never fully recovered from that stroke as medical attention for it was delayed by some 7 hours.

[ssd]

op, you need to get asking questions and get a bit more clued up on this, you will need to be fighting their corner here

[kilmuir]

ssd i am trying to get more clued up, i was advised to ask on here for advice. Obviously i was wrong

[MrsCosmopilite]

Sorry OP, missed that MIL was in hospital.

I think you may need to call the assigned social worker. When we had the incident I mentioned above, my Aunt was admitted to hospital for two weeks. Within two days, my Uncle had a form of breakdown and was admitted to the same hospital. Instead of doing any physiotherapy she spent all her time visiting him.

Ten years on, he's frail and bedbound. She's got mobility issues. Both are suffering memory problems. They have a series of carers who come in during the day who deal with meal preparation, washing and cleaning him (doubly incontinent), making sure he is got out of bed once a day, and light domestic duties.

Their needs were assessed by a social worker who immediately put into place a care package which is completely funded by my Aunt & Uncle. The social worker looked at where they lived, who they had that could come in to them on a daily basis, what their needs were - medically and in terms of general support. Unfortunately there is no compulsion for them to review this.

[ssd]

I didnt mean that as an insult op, I just meant sometimes the social worker isnt very clued up and will try to pass the buck and you end up being passed from pillar to post. It is very hard, but there a lot of advice on this section too.

[kilmuir]

Thanks everyone. ssd the paramedics who came to see to mil, kept saying agree to nothing! They will try and send them both home to continue as they were'.
Social worker wants to see family on tuesday. I am getting as much info as I can, at leadt so i know what should be happening, care reviews and packages etc.

[CMOTDibbler]

You, and the rest of the family need to be absolutely honest about how they are (or rather aren't) coping, about the challenges they face, and very clear on what help the family can offer.

IME they will try and discharge her as soon as possible, and with the minimum of care. At the time someone is in hospital, you are in the strongest position to access more care (unfortunatly, its the way things go) and if your MIL doesn't want/can't care for FIL anymore, then this is the time to make this very, very clear

[juneau]

Local authorities will always try to save money, because there isn't enough go to around. It sounds like you (and perhaps other family members), are well aware of your MIL and FIL's needs, so you need to be quite vocal and honest in your dealings with the SW, doctors, etc. If you feel your MIL can't cope with FIL at home any more, don't beat around the bush. Tell the SW what has been going on - that FIL is abusive, that MIL is frail and can't care for him, that FIL really needs care x times a day or that you think the best place for him would be a residential home where MIL can visit him, etc. I'm not sure that you need to get 'clued up' so much as just be clear about their needs and vocal in expressing them.

[SugarPlumTree]

I agree that you will have to be very firm with this. What outcome do you want from this meeting, what in your opinion is the ideal way forward from here ?

There are some key phrases that Social Services respond to - 'vulnerable adult' , 'danger to self', 'Carer breakdown' 'do not consider him to have capacity' are all some.

[Moreisnnogedag]

Make an appt to go in and speak to the sister on the ward. Your mil is a vulnerable adult and there are huge safeguarding issues here. Your FIL left her on the floor and didn't attempt to get help - that means your mil is not safe to be returned home. Unless she has told the nurses/doctors this they will aim to get her home.

[kilmuir]

Seeing financial person from social services tomorrow. They have less than 24k and do not own a property. Is there a minimum amount a month that my mother in law can be expected to live on?

[MrsCosmopilite]

I can't remember the exact amount but if people have between something like 14K and 23K in savings then they are billed at a discounted rate for their care package.
The packages are worked out according to the needs of the person (in this case possibly both MIL and FIL), and then how many hours per week that package entails.
My relatives are in the higher bracket and also own their own home. I'm not sure what they'd be being charged if circumstances were different.

[kilmuir]

We have been told £75 pounds a week is ample to cover food and any extras.
We have met FIL social worker. My Dh told her that MIL not prepared to be his carer any more. She is too vulnerable, most recent being fact he left her on floor and went back upstairs, and also physically she is partially sighted, only managing to get around with a frame now so going up 3 flights of stairs to see to him is out of the question.
Social worker said that he is quite within his rights to go home with a care package in place if he wishes. Yes of course he is, but my husband has siad mother in law will not be there.
Are we being mean?

[SugarPlumTree]

No, I think sometimes you have to do things which don't seem palatable but need doing to avert total crisis. I had to say I was withdrawing my care for my Mother as I has a duty of care to my children who were suffering as a result of me trying to care for her and it wasn't in their best interests for me to continue, plus my GP said it was affecting my health.

How was it left with the SW and what is the ideal outcome in this situation ?

[BelleateSebastian]

It's a minefield and I have just been through it with inlaws too.

Your FIl will need to be agreeable to going into a care home (unless a deprivation of liberty order is in place or is deemed mentally incompetent).

A financial assessment will take place and an amount your PIL's will have to contribute will be determined they are ruthless! - they take 97% of their income left after mortgage, water and council tax is deducted.

They then say 'you will pay 97% of your income and we will fund the rest' BUT this is to a home that takes the 'social service' rate which is just under £500, if a home charges more than that (which 9/10 do!) then a third party top is required from family or friends!

Good luck :0

[marmaladegranny]

No, no, no you are not being mean! There is more than one person and the Hospital in this equation and you need to consider your MIL's, your and the rest of family's needs.
Hospitals are always keen to send people who are well enough home to avoid bed blocking.
There is lots of very good information on line about care packages, paying for them and the spouse's position - try Age UK or good old google.
Good luck, fight MIL's corner and remember, there are some excellent social workers out there (no, I'm not one - just a wife who was in a similar position to your MIL finance-wise which our social worker helped with). Make sure you get SW's full name and contact telephone number plus email if available and contact her every time you have a problem - she should be fighting your corner so work with her.

[Needmoresleep]

Do they rent from a Social Landlord/Council It might be worth talking to them as well, explaining your MiL is having to move out because of DV and asking about options. I don't know too much about it but you would not want her to cease being considered a tenant. And they will have access to more suitable housing options via various transfer schemes.
They should have clear procedures about what to do when someone is at risk because of their partner.
Or speak to Shelter.

[drudgetrudy]

Dig your heels in hard while they are in hospital-it is not being mean it is ensuring mil gets the support she needs. Look up POVA (protection of vulnerable adults) Social services have a duty to protect your MIL.