Returning to Uk after divorce

[FramboiseCoulis]

hello wise members

I am in the process of divorcing my husband. I would like to petition to leave France and return to the UK with my child, which was the original plan until 6 weeks ago when my DH dropped the bombshell that it was a no-go and he wanted out of the marriage.

I have been advised by my lawyer here to try to leave and start to prepare a dossier to try and convince a judge that my kid would be better off in the Uk (so would i!!). But a judge will decide if i stay or if i go.

Has anyone successfully left another country to return here? And if so, how did you go about persuading a judge to let you leave?

Our child was born in France, but speaks both languages perfectly and is regularly in the UK and it's not like it's the other side of the world!

Any advice gratefully received.

thank you.

[wellthatsdoneit]

Hello - didn't want your thread to go unanswered although I'm no expert on the French legal system.

Has your h said you may not relocate back to the uk with your dc? If he gives his consent then you don't need to apply for leave to remove, but do get a written agreement drawn up by a lawyer and signed by him in case he changes his mind at a later date.

If he won't give his consent then a lot of it will depend on how the French courts regard matters, whether there is a national or gender bias, what the french courts would considerr to be in the best interests of a child etc. When I was in a similar position in another eu country (not France) it would have boiled down to questions such as who was primary caregiver and would that person be able to provide (materially and emotionally), how far away the applicant wanted to move, what kind of contact the left behind parent could reasonably expect etc.

Are you in contact with other expats in France? Try also the reunite.org forum, although it tends to be people whose children have been illegally taken from them.

My advice would be to find a job to go to in the uk, set out how your dd would live and be taken care of here, and be very open to ensuring as much contact between your dc and their father as possible (using regular FaceTime/Skype calls as well as face to face visits). I would also make clear that you recognise your dc's French heritage is just as important as his English and the,onus would be on you to encourage and preserve that should you move to the uk.

[FramboiseCoulis]

Hi
Thank you so much for this. no my DH has not given us permission to leave.

I have a lot of contact with ex-pats here, there is a very strong community.

I am and always have been the main caregiver so i think that's a very important issue. I think after all's said and done, it will boil down to maintaining daily contact between our dd and my husband. If he argues he can't live without her, I guess it will seal the deal and I will just have to wait a few years until my daughter can have a say in the matter. My lawyer did say once he goes on to have other children it will either be easier to leave, ie. he'll be so focussed on the new family that he'll let us leave or a judge would not even think of splitting our dd from her half-siblings.

There are a lot of variables and we can't predict the fututre. But i will have a damn good stab and providing the ideal conditions for moving!

[helenthemadex]

having been through the french system myself its not really very clear cut, and decisions are dependent on many factors.

If your H does not want you to leave France it will be hard to get a court to agree to let you take your dd back to the UK, and it also depends quite a lot on the age of your child, and to a certain extent if h is english or French.

They are keen to ensure that a child maintains regular contact with both parents 50/50 orders (one week with mother and one week with father) are very common here. My avocat told me that the judge would not care about me at all, he would only be interested in what was best for my children.

Feel free to PM me or you could try these pages for advice and support;

www.facebook.com/groups/LadiesInFranceTogether/

www.facebook.com/groups/5881034223/

there are quite a few of us who have been in a similar position

[wellthatsdoneit]

Have you discussed it with him and he has expressly said that his dd may not relocate? If not, has he said anything about it in the past?

If he has expressly vetoed it, can he be talked round? Would he be open to mediation? My ex wouldn't - said we our wishes were too diametrically opposed and we only ended up going after he lost in court after putting me on trial for child abduction. Reunite.org also run a mediation service which specialises in the question of residence in international situations. They don't take sides and nothing said there can later be used in court (in england anyway!), but try to get the parties to discuss all the issues and reach a mutually agreed solution, rather than ending up in court or forking out thousands on lawyers to achieve the same thing. They are based in leceister but can also run mediation by way of video conference.

How old's your daughter? From my understanding the english courts will take the children's views into consideration when they are 12 or so. Not sure about france.

As I said, I don't know how the courts regard things in France, but being the primary caregiver was a key factor in the EU country where I was. But so was being able to demonstrate that I would be able to provide financially for the dc, so I would do all that you can to seek employment and all that you can to demonstrate how you would keep your dd's father involved in her life if she moved. Play up the fact that it's very close geographically. Eg if he's paris and you're london it's quicker to get there than some other parts of France! He could feasibly have her every other weekend if he wished.

Can the expat community there share any knowledge/experience with you? Can they point you in the direction of anyone who can? You won't be the first couple in france to experience this and won't be the last.

[FramboiseCoulis]

Hi everyone
Thanks for your input.
I have a few links with other ex-pats, but all our situations are different. i will check out the reunite.org site.
I think mediation is a really good idea, and we need it anyway because he doesn not want to pay the amount advised by my lawyer which is in line with regulations regarding his salary and the fact we only have one child. So i think that's our only neutral solution.
I work, i have a good, steady job so I think that would be transferrable to the UK.
In France, a judge will not ask to speak to the child until he/she is around 12 also.
If i could be sure we could leave in time for secondary school, I'd stay no problem. but i just dont' want to be 'trapped'for anothe 10 years.

the pressure is on to make a decision to go for it or not. Argh!! and i know it will cost thousands which might all go down the pan.

[helenthemadex]

a child over 8 in France has a voice, so I was told by my avocat they can have their own avocat and they would speak to the judge on their behalf to save them going into court

It does cost a lot of money to fight over child residency I know that for a fact

[KristinaFranziska]

I have a contact who deals with international divorce cases who might be able to help you/point you in the right direction. Please PM me if you would like her details.

[FramboiseCoulis]

thanks Kristina, but I have an international divorce lawyer.

[KristinaFranziska]

Wishing you the very best advice, help and luck!