I'm all for repeal, I don't think DP is.

[OhCalamity]

I'm a bit stunned really.

I agree with the citizens assembly recommendations. I don't see how we can allow for 'deserving' cases for termination without opening those floodgates that the PLC are always rabbeting on about. In short, my stance is that I trust women. I trust that when they get an unexpected positive test, they will make the right decision for them. I trust that not a single woman I know who's had a crisis pregnancy, a devastating 20wk scan that they've chosen their path in life with a lot of thought and soul searching. I trust that she will with the guidance of her doctor, make the right decision. It may not be the decision I would make, but she will make the one right for her.

I asked DP tonight how he would be voting. We had a spirited discussion, I suppose you'd call it, and he referenced a lot of pro-life rhetoric that I'd come to recognise. I don't think he's fully pro-life, but he certainly is struggling with the idea that repealing the 8th will mean that women will have abortions for [in his mind] spurious or frivolous reasons.He believes that life should be given a chance. And then he said that the way he votes is really not my business and he was a bit defensive when he said it.

For context, we had had 5 mc's, 1 dc. I'm mid forties, not on contraception since 2009. I've been thinking about getting the coil but when I broached it, I clumsily picked the worst time possible to bring it up and he asked me could we talk about it another time. I don't need to ask his permission or anything, but family planning is a joint discussion, and we've always agreed on what contraception we would use, and we agreed when we would stop using contraception so this is a conversation he should be involved in too. But I think he's secretly hoping for that miracle pregnancy that I somehow carry to term. We had never contemplated having an only child. Before TTC we wanted more than one- maybe about three. I've adjusted to the idea of having an only child now, I'm not sure he's there yet.

But it's shook me. I thought that I could trust him to make the right decision if I was ever in a situation like Savita, or like the poor woman on life support, or if we had a FFA and my MH wouldn't be strong enough to carry to term.

I've had 2 glasses of wine so I may be skewed in my thinking right now, but I'm disappointed in him. I'm disappointed that despite him knowing that probably thanks to the 8th one of our miscarried babies might have survived, he's still likely going to vote to save the 8th.

I'm not even sure what I'm asking here really sorry.

[LonginesPrime]

And then he said that the way he votes is really not my business

Well, he's right in that his vote is his to cast however he sees fit and that he doesn't need to take your views into account when he's voting.

However, it's obviously relevant to you to the extent that it's important to you that you both share certain.values.

I think the coil situation is a bit odd as it sounds like you've said you want to have a coil fitted and he's put off the conversation, meaning that you don't get to have a coil until he wants to talk about it. So he's basically vetoed your decision to get a coil.

[HannahGlasgowGal]

His vote is your business, as it's an issue that directly affects you and your body and not his body

[LonginesPrime]

Yes, but that's more of an issue about whether men should be allowed to vote on this in the first place. On the basis men do get a vote (and I totally see why they do, as unfortunate as it is in this particular referendum), each one is free to do what he wants with it.

Obviously, how he votes might affect their relationship, which is up to the OP, but the vote itself is not something the OP should expect to control.

[Marmaladeorange]

I’m quite surprised this hasn’t come up sooner in your relationship. I couldn’t be with a man who didn’t believe in my right to bodily autonomy.

[OhCalamity]

Hannah that's it really in a nutshell. I do respect voting autonomy. I would respect him if he was voting to save the 8th, but I also feel that as my next of kin, and as a co-parent, I deserve to know how he would decide on my health care. And in that respect, what his views on abortion are and the way he would vote on abortion is therefore very much my fucking business - to use his own words. And as you point out Longines, this does affect our relationship, as this is the man I'm having contraceptive-free sex with. I feel I have a right to know what page he is on even if it's not the same one as me.

Marmalade he's always led me to believe that he's pro-choice. I think he actually was up until Citizens Assembly's recommendations of unrestricted up to 12 weeks was mooted in the last few months. I think that's when he changed his mind.

Regarding the coil, my timing could not have been shittier to discuss it. He's always deferred to my preferences during our ttc and fertility treatments and trusted my judgement and research so the coil chat would have gone the same way - that I'd explain why I wanted to get it and he would tell me that he trusted my decision and was happy with it. He's always trusted my bodily autonomy. But talking about getting the coil means us talking about us closing the door officially on ever having another baby and that's an emotional topic for us. But I stupidly picked a time when our heads were already reeling with some very tragic news and he just asked could we talk about it another time.

I imagine that he's unhappy as well at how the conversation ended. This morning I thought he was sussing me out as to whether or not I'm pissed off with him. I'm not but I think he knows that I do want some more answers. So I'd say we will have a calmer, soberer conversation in the next few days like we usually do.

[Eighttimeseight]

I'll vote to repeal but my husband is undecided... it doesn't bother me really - he has his reasons.

It's such a grey area - I can understand why people feel differently about it.

[TheVeryThing]

This is a very difficult issue and obviously fraught with emotion for you.
However, I would have serious questions about my relationship if my Dh was not pro-choice.
He honestly feels it's none of his business and feels uncomfortable even having a vote on what choices women can make about their own bodies.
I would ask your dp if he accepts that decisions around abortion are amongst the most personal and private that a woman can face, and then ask him why he should have a say in those decisions. And not just a say, but have a veto over what decision she can make.
He needs to separate his feelings about having another child from the private affairs of other people, about whom he knows nothing. It's not about him.

[LonginesPrime]

He honestly feels it's none of his business and feels uncomfortable even having a vote on what choices women can make about their own bodies.

I hope that any man who feels like this votes to repeal rather than abstaining on the basis he thinks it's none of his business. It will be their business as long as it's law so hopefully people who are neutral on the subject will see that and do something about it.

[TheVeryThing]

Obviously he is voting, Longines. Where did I suggest otherwise?

[AgentProvocateur]

I disagree with men being allowed to
Vote on this. Or anyone over childbearing age, actually. Disclaimer - I know why they have to have a vote. I just disagree with it.

[LonginesPrime]

Very, my comment was meant generally - it wasn't directed at your husband, I was just expressing my hope as I suspect there are going to be lots of men who fall into that category.

[Mumontherocks1]

I'm even nervous about the exit poll result. Tomorrow's going to be a long day. Seems like a great turnout. Fair play to anyone who travelled home to vote.

Anyone want to call the result? I think I know but I'm afraid to say it out loud in case I jinx it.

[honeyrider]

Irish Times exit poll result 68% Yes 32% No.