Strategies needed for dealing with almost 7 year old ds's rudeness please!

[IlanaK]

He is generally a really nice and well behaved boy. He plays extremely well with his younger brother and for the most part does as asked.

However, he can be so rude sometimes. I don't mean rude as in swearing or anything. I think I mean disrespectful - things like talking back to us, making rude/cross faces at us when he doesn't like what we say, general arguing with us. He can be really stubborn.

Now, I know that in the scheme of things, the above doesn't sound like much, but it is a few times a day, everyday and nothing we do seems to make any difference.

So, any strategies gratfeully received.

[kategarden]

Can't help - but it sounds very familiar

[lackaDAISYcal]

I think they all go through this at this age, and is about influencing their own world more than anything. You could always try giving him more choices? We try to get DS more involved in the decision making and he's less inclined to be rude about everything (if he helps decide what's for tea and helps cook it, he can't not eat it!)

We also have a reward chart which echos the schools behaviour principles. He gets two warnings, then a time out, then if he continues, he gets a yellow card on his reward chart. Three yellow make a red, which is an automatic cancellation of whatever family treat we have planned for the weekend. We have yet to cancel anything since starting this a few weeks ago, but prior to that we were always cancelling things as punsihment for his stroppiness.

Good Luck with it.

[lackaDAISYcal]

reading that back it all sounds a bit draconian; it's not really, and he responds well to it.

no yellow cards in the week is an extra special treat as well!

[IlanaK]

We have a job chart that he does each day and that works fine. It does not have behaviour on it though. We generally send him to stand by the front door when he is rude. It is not time out exactly as he can come out as soon as he is calm and can say sorry. But he is so stubborn, he will often choose to stay there for a very long time.

[PosieParker]

I have the same with my six year old, I tackle it head on and usually stick to a firm explanation and how unnacceptable this is. Then when we're all snuggly ready for bed (they're all!!) I have a quiet word about feelings and how and why we're rude, when the bravado is down he's very sweet. Then it may not be so bad for a few days. If he's really rude and unpleasant then he gets sent to he front door (more boring than the stairs) to think about what he's said and then return and talk very breifly about it.
And smile!!

[lackaDAISYcal]

yes, try not to let it show that you are bothered. If they know they are winding you up it's more likely to continue. If we ignore DS he doesn't like it one bit as he knows he can't "win" and then he stops his nonsense.

[IlanaK]

Yes, it does wind me up and he knows it. We are as stubborn as each other really and that is part of the problem.

[tangarine]

IlanaK

I could have written your OP. You sound just like me and my DS2. We've been doing the traffic light thing too, as that's what they do at school, and as he gets 50p pocket money a week he loses 10p a day if he's been rude/badly behaved (though he can "earn" it back by being extra good the next day).

Let's hope they grow out of it (though I don't remember PFB DS1 being like this at all!)

[IlanaK]

I am not sure what you mean about the traffic light thing. He is home schooled so not up on school discipline. However, I like the idea of a traffic light type thing where he can "see" my anger/frustration levels going up with the colours of the lights. On the other hand, I do already give him warnings, but it rarely stops him.

[lackaDAISYcal]

ilanak, you sound just like me and my DS; he's definately his mother's son!

at his school, they all start the week in the golden zone on a big wall chart. They have five basic rules "the golden rules" which cover pretty much everything really. If they are breaking a rule, they get one warning, then another warning. If they don't stop it, they get a two minute time out to think about their behaviur. If after this they do it again, they get a yellow card, and their name is moved into the yellow zone. Three yellows gets them into the red zone, or there are some things that arte an automatic red; namely violence, racism, bullying.

At the end of the week, they have Golden Time; 40 minutes of free play last thing on a Friday. Yellow cards mean they lose ten minutes of this free play and have to keep working while everyone else is playing. A "three yellow" red card means no free play at all. an automatic red card is no free play plus half an hours lunchtime detention.

It sounds complicated, but it really works. when they started the scheme last year, my poor DS was in the red zone every week, mainly for being gobby and answering back. Now, the most he gets is a single yellow and that's enough to wake him up a bit.

We similarly have 5 rules at home, but have one for eating his tea in good time and without a fuss (he can take an hour to eat after whinging about how horrible it is) for example. We only started this at home a few weeks ago and already life is much more pleasant!

I assume the traffic light thing is similar, but with green/amber/red rather than red and yellow cards.

[IlanaK]

Thanks, that was really useful. Could you explain how you do it at home please? My son responds really well to "rules". He always does his school work better if there is a list of what he has to do. He also does his daily jobs without complaint as they are "rules". So he may respond well to this sort of thing.

[lackaDAISYcal]

We have a star chart (the blue one like this) so we have the rules where tasks would usually be slotted in. I cut out some red and yellow cirles and stuck velcro to the back of them to use on the chart. If he manages the day OK he gets a gold star for each rule, or if not either a yellow or a red (only needed one of those so far)

As you're home schooling, maybe you can get him involved in making a chart along those lines. that will maybe help give him "ownership" of the chart and more willing to co-operate?

[tangarine]

Hi IlanaK,

lackaDAISYcal has described pretty much the traffic light system we use. We start every day on green (regardless of the previous day's behaviour). If he's starting to be cheeky/answer back/stubborn I tell him he's turning amber, then if he continues he goes on to amber. We've never got to red, as amber is usually enough of a wake up call, and he works his way back to green (we usually agree what this means - e.g. tidying up/being quiet for 5 minutes/saying sorry to DS1 etc etc. He will sometimes ask "what am I on?", usually to check that I've noticed how good he's been .

[IlanaK]

Thanks to both of you. What do you do if he reaches red?

[lackaDAISYcal]

red here means no family treat ie cinema/fishing/soft play; whatever we have planned for that weekend!

We were thinking of introducing pocket money to give him some control over finacnes rather than teh constant "I want" "can I have" that we get, but not sure if 6 isn't just a little too young for pocket money!

[IlanaK]

We do pocket money. My son gets 10p a day for tidying up (and he does do it well). He gets 50p a week if he gets a star everyday on his chart for doing his daily jobs (things like making his bed, setting the table, doing the work on his list, reading to his brother, etc). So he does save up to buy things. Perhaps I could link the trafiic light thing into that.

[HonoriaGlossop]

rude/cross faces are a mechanism used by him because as a child he's powerless, and he is releasing frustation that way. I wouldn't worry about it and wouldn't try to control this. I would stop talking to him though and tell him that I would talk again when he could stop being silly.

Talking/arguing back, likewise it's just human nature trying to assert itself - we wouldn't have survived as a species if we had no instinct to fight our corner. He can't make you argue with him - don't give him that power. You are the adult, you're in charge whether he is arguing or not.

I think at this age it's really important to not give orders but to talk together and make plans and decided as a team etc etc. Obviously safety issues are different but basically the rest can be sorted between you as a team, most of the time IMO. And if you want politeness you always have to dole it out, as kids reflect back straight away. And kids this age are also extremely sensitive to double standards - if you allow yourself to be somewhat rude, so will they.