To think that if you're going to start an advert 'Breast feeding is best for your baby' you shouldn't turn out to be selling formula?

[SomeGuy]

I'm sure I'm not.

(This is an advert for Aptamil follow-on.)

Obviously it's not as bad as the ad with the bloke who says he's doing night-feeds for his baby (who obviously is over six months, oh yes), but still....

Are there any milk adverts that aren't actually secretly shilling for infant formula?

(Like the Aptamil follow-on milk advert 'Aptamil 3' - conveniently almost identical in name to 'Aptamil 1' and 'Aptamil 2', both of which are illegal to advertise in the UK.)

[thisisyesterday]

no, not unreasonable. come join us at baby milk action and help do something about it!

[SomeGuy]

I submitted a complaint to the ASA about one of these ads once - it was rejected.

The formula companies have learned what they can get away with, and are well-practised at pushing the boundaries.

[ineedalifelaundry]

Yanbu. I hate that ad. The way it says "if you decide to move on from breast feeding" as if that means progressing to something better or more advanced. Iyswim.

[CharCharGabor]

I agree, it is blatant and disgusting.

[SomeGuy]

Yes, the next step from breastfeeding should be this: www.mysupermarket.co.uk/Images/ExternalImages/ProductsDetailed/38/005938.jpg?ts=633353103760

These products serve absolutely no purpose whatsoever, other than to provide a legal means for cross-promoting infant milk brands that they aren't allowed to advertise.

Does anyone know how much follow on milk is sold, relative to the infant stuff?

[Ninks]

DS has the toddler milk at night - is still BF during the day but buying the little bottles means I don't have to get out of bed. DH justs opens and pours.

They are 51p each. He has between three or four, it's probably akin to him having a ten-a-day smoking habit budget-wise.

I really object to the Cow and Gate ad with the laughing babies, it's really making a statement against BF and the last baby shown is tiny, no way is he six months old!

[SomeGuy]

I could never find 250ml bottles of whole UHT milk in the supermarket. Not sure why.

500ml bottles of UHT are still cheaper than 200ml bottles of Cow & Gate though, even if you throw the rest away.

[Ninks]

Had a look on the Sainsbury's site, there isn't much in it price-wise between normal and follow-on, a penny or two. But obviously if people are buying it they'll be more likely to buy "stage 3" rather than cows milk at a year old so the whole she-bang is profit.

[Ninks]

Blimey SomeGuy, thanks, that's great news! As you can tell, I'm not really a fan of formula companies and their various subterfuges and they'll get no more money from me

[BertieBotts]

The cow and gate one with the laughing babies, I made annoyed noises at it the other day and DP asked me "How is it different from breastmilk, anyway?"

[valhala]

I have no problem with such ads - I do have a problem with adults who are legally capable of bringing up children being subjected to censorship when it comes to whether or not a company can advertise formula milk.

The style of the ad referred to has only been presented as it has because of the Nanny State's continued interference in how we raise our families. The markwting ploy is admittedly devious, some may say clever, but I have no issue with it cocking a snook at such decision makers.

I do however appreciate that on MN mine is probably a minority view and I expect to get shouted down but can only repeat that this is purely my own view and not one I expect anyone else to be converted to. I a sure that someone here will be able to give me some figures off of the top of their head about the percentages of mothers who b/f compared to those who bottle feed, which, as an aside, I'd be interested to hear, as I truthfully have no idea of the ratio.

[PortBlacksandResident]

Well if we do choose or need formula it is because we is stupid innit? And likely to still be giving our DCs formula long after they can have cows milk .

[SomeGuy]

I have no problem with such ads - I do have a problem with adults who are legally capable of bringing up children being subjected to censorship when it comes to whether or not a company can advertise formula milk.

The style of the ad referred to has only been presented as it has because of the Nanny State's continued interference in how we raise our families

It really doesn't work like that.

My son was born in Asia. There is no regulation/censorship of baby milk or how it was distributed.

As a result, though there were a few posters saying 'Breastfeeding is best' in the hospital, provided I think by the UN, the bigger influence was that of Nestlé and their infant powders.

As soon as my son was born (by C Section), he was taken off by the nurses/midwives to be given a bottle. That was the hospital's policy, influenced by an unregulated industry. No Nanny State there. And these aren't random TV viewers, but healthcare professionals.

By the time we got him home any chance of successfully establishing breastfeeding was basically gone. The result of which was hundreds of pounds spent on milk powders, frequent illness due to the heat and hygiene issues of a hot country, including a trip back to the hospital where we were advised that the milk powder we were buying was for poor people and we should buy a more expensive one.

The baby milk industry interfered with how I raise my family, and continues to do so to millions of others, indifferent to the health problems it causes.

So much for the nanny state.

[thisisyesterday]

the thing is, if you NEED formula then they don't need to advertise it surely?
if ther eis a genuine need then people would go and buy it anyway.

there wasn't a genuine need though, they created it.
all over the world millions of children are dying because they are being fed infant formula

THAT is why regulations are in place to stop the advertising of it. it undermines breastfeeding and is unnecessary (see above point about need)

it's very easy for you, valhala, to sit there and say oh we shouldn't be censored, we can make our own decisions but sadly not everyone can. and your baby, though at risk of being ill from formula, is not likely to die from it. however for millions of babies across the globe that is the case.

add to this the fact that follow-on milks were only created so that manufacturers could advertise their products and you're really onto a losing streak.

[groundhogs]

I couldn't BF, i tried - goddammit, but it just didn't work, so I had to reluctantly go on to formula.

Then we left the UK and went to the godforsaken hole I've been in the last 3 years.

We are now back home, and DS 4 in dec, has just switched to cows milk. Sure he could have been put on to cows milk, earlier, but I just wouldn't trust the quality of the local milk, cos everything else that is remotely processed there is usually unsafe.

So after the raised eyebrows and pitying faces at not being able to breastfeed, now am I supposed to feel that I've let him down?....

Oh FGS, the boy is thriving, is sharp as a tack and taller than kids almost 2yrs older. What did I do wrong??

I think all mums ideally 'want' to BF, but it doesn't work out for all of us. I don't think people ARE necessarily being down on BF in favour of Formula, anymore than many seem to be judgemental of those who don't.

Swings and Roundabouts.

BTW, I know a girl in the US who MAKES her own formula.... anyone tried that???

[PortBlacksandResident]

"all over the world millions of children are dying because they are being fed infant formula"

thisis - how?

I'm genuinely asking here...

[trellism]

DH was driven to outrage by both the Aptamil advert and the Cow and Gate one. He dislikes the tacit suggestion that one should only breastfeed for six months.

I was under the impression that follow on milk was invented in order to circumvent the ban on advertising, is that right?

I also don't think that people who use formula are stupid (if you use it, you use it, so what?), but I do think that formula companies are dishonest when they advertise follow on milk in this way.

The nanny state clearly isn't doing a particularly good job when the regulations are so easy to get around.

[Ninks]

groundhogs I don't think anyone is saying that there's anything wrong with follow-on in itself. I gave it to DD until she was three because it said on the package that it had extra vitamins and because the handy cartons didn't need to be heated.

My son is BF but also has bottles of toddler milk. I certainly don't think they're bad for him.

Sounds like you made a good decision for your DS and too right you shouldn't feel you've let him down!

[brettgirl2]

I think they are on about in the third world where they can't sterilise bottles etc

[SomeGuy]

all over the world millions of children are dying because they are being fed infant formula

Babies die because their mothers feed them formula but don't have access to clean water to prepare it (very common). Or because they don't have adequate sterilisation facilities, or don't realise that they are needed. Or because they don't have enough money to pay for the formula and dilute it too much.

Or because their babies are far more likely to get diarrhea (for the reasons above and also because infant formula lacks antibodies) and they don't have the money/access to medical care.

[differentID]

Port, they are being fed in countries where water is not clean, let alone sterile.
They cannot adequately clean bottles, let alone sterilise them.
They are in countries where the cost of a single tin of formula can be over a third of the family income so it gets watered down to make it last.
They are being fed where people cannot read their own language let alone English and companies don't put native languages on the instructions on tins.

[trellism]

They die because the formula is either made with dirty water so the child dies of diarhhoea, or because the formula is made up with smaller quantities to make it go further (as it's expensive) so the child is malnourished.

[SomeGuy]

I gave it to DD until she was three because it said on the package that it had extra vitamins and because the handy cartons didn't need to be heated.

My son is BF but also has bottles of toddler milk. I certainly don't think they're bad for him.

They aren't bad, but the 'extra vitamins' don't serve any purpose. Normal milk is perfectly good.

[Ninks]

This is a bit upsetting, images of ill babies so be warned.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=zctp7VGeUew

It gets the point about Nestle across fairly well though. The bit about the woman with the twins is very sad

[kitkatqueen]

Someone asked for figures, The most recent one I read on a website ( can't remember if it was kellymom or on a link from there) It stated that it is estimated that 1 percent of the female popultion of the world will be phisically unable to breastfeed and that only 1 percent of 6 month olds are still sole breastfed. I think what we need is more help for mums to breastfeed, its not rocket science but its a skill we mostly don't have anymore. I know lots of people who wanted to b/feed but were told they couldn't. FGS, one woman was told her nipples weren't long enough by a midwife.

groundhogs, I don't make formula, but i've been contemplating making human yogurt

or cheese....