AIBU to ask you for some desperate legal advice? (Long, but pls read)(16 Posts)
I've name changed for this, I can't risk being recognised.
I work for one of the big banks.
I was moved to the role I am doing now by a manager who had something against me (it almost went to HR, the bullying was so bad). Anyway, she moved me to this role even though I kept saying I didn't really find myself interested in this department at all.
I committed myself to the job nonetheless and quickly become one of the key experts. I developed good relations with everyone in the department and I had really good work reviews.
Unfortunately, the department that I was working for, was sold to a different company in June last year because of some regulatory changes. I was asked if I wanted to move with the business and I said NO every time. I said my preference would be to stay because this new company was pretty unknown and I wasn't 100% sure I could see myself committed to this particular line of work in the long term. I wanted to stay and explore other areas of banking.
At this time I was up north and accepting the move involved moving to London, working under something called a TSA agreement within the London branch of the existing company for 6-12 months and then moving to the London office of the new company once everything was ready to be fully transferred.
The most senior person in our management team made me an offer- if I agreed to move to London and work under the TSA to help transition the business, I could simply find another role in the London branch of the firm at the end of that 12 month period and then not move over to the new place. It would help him to use my expertise to transition the business and in return he would help me by moving me to London (which I wanted) and also help me to find a role there. He told me to keep my mouth shut about the deal and not even tell my new team members or even my new manager. He would tell them himself when the time came.
This was great, I put my trust in the guy and moved down.
I was told this month that apparently my role was moving to the new company sooner than expected- February instead of September.
First they told me the deal was off and I had to move. When I panicked about that, they threw me a bone and said they could move another colleague in my place and extend my move to April to buy me more time to find another role in the firm. The only additional condition being that I would have to take on the responsibilities of the person moving earlier in my place.
Keep in mind that even now, only the senior person who made me the offer and a senior person at the new company know about this "deal". Or so I thought.
My manager pulled me into a room and asked me outright what my intentions were. I said I was happy to move because that's what I had been told to say. I was told the deal had leaked and basically everyone was pissed that I had played a game. How have I played a game?!?!?! I'm the one who has been gamed here. I was acting strictly according to instructions.
Through all this I was told that if the worst happened and I didn't find another role at the bank, legally they still had to offer me a role at the new company because I was under the TSA agreement and something called the TUPE law. So I was reassured that at least I couldn't be made redundant.
Today i was told that if I did choose to move over to the new company, I'd be sort of demoted and I wouldn't have the same role as I do now. I was miserable. While my preference is to stay, I have grown to like my current role and built some good relationships along the way.
To make things even worse they're no longer giving me straight answers about whether I will definitely have the new place as a back up. What was initially a legal mandate has suddenly become a grey area.
I feel like I've been played.
Can anyone with legal background help? Is it true that they can't make me redundant while I'm under a TSA? Is it true that they're obligated to offer me something at the new company no matter what?
To complicate things further, I'm on a work permit, so it's not easy for me to just apply for a job elsewhere.
What should I do.
Don't imagine too many people will care to read such a long post.
If anyone is able to provide some legal advice, please IM me!
I hate seeing no replies. But I can offer no real help to you. Yes, it does look like you've been played sorry.
I hope someone will come along soon with some real advice/support.
Classic bait and switch.
If you stay at the bank what department do you want to be in? Is there someone in that department who can pull you in?
You need to be crystal clear about what you want and speak to your manager about the fact you were played as right now you are marked as being untrustworthy. It happens all the time, in banking as well as other industries. As a manager I totally understand when this happens and I just let it go, supporting their aspirations.
As you are on a work permit, if I were you, if there is a job you really want but no opening find out who is in the role and have a recruiter lure someone with the job you want away somewhere else creating an opening for you. Also see if someone is pregnant. Chances are they are going on leave for at least 6months It buys you some time.
Ask to get this moved to employment there are some decent employment lawyers who post.
Sounds totally crap. Have you anything in writing about the promise to stay?
I want to be in the regulatory reporting team. Given that I'm on a work permit, job security is very important to me and those are the only teams in banking that I see growing at the moment.
I do have communicator conversations as well as a couple of emails where the senior director has asked me to complete courses etc so that I could get my promotion this year since I intend to stay.
Plus, it's the worst kept secret of the department by the looks of it. Apparently everyone knew about his promise all along.
I just really needed to know that I had my existing role as a back up if I couldn't find anything within the bank. And now that's a grey area so I'm feeling a lot of pressure and stress.
I can't eat, sleep. I have visions of being kicked out of the country. I've been here for six years, my friends, my life are here. It would be a personal and professional loss if I had to leave.
You would be taking a huge risk to trust someone in a word of mouth, secret deal which would have no legal basis and, as you have found out, it seems to have worn thin already. It might have paid off but chances are it would not have - too many other variables come into play which also might be outside the control of the person who suggested the deal. However since you wanted to move to London perhaps it was a chance you were prepared to take. So I don't blame you even though for me just two people knowing about a deal that would mature in 12 months time seems very flimsy - I agree they were probably playing you. I don't know enough about the law or the details of the the case to know if you can be made redundant but I would think that anyone can theoretically be made redundant at any time if the company no longer has work for them. Why not make an appointment with HR to discuss your case in detail making your desires and concerns clear.
By the way, sorry you are feeling so bad about this. It is horrible when you job is under threat. What you are doing is probably okay - a couple of months to see if you can find a ne wrote with existing company but if not be prepared to take a chance with the TSA.
Sorry - in my last post I meant take a chance with the new company. Overall try to remain positive as this will help in finding a a new role as the existing company or settling in to the new one.
Go to ACAS today. They are free.
This is a disgusting way to treat someone.
I feel for you, OP.
I am no legal expert, but my experience of TUPE is that it is a transfer which keeps your T&C 'equivalent'.
Except that once you've moved over, they can change things. So, for example, someone in role X getting paid £40k, could be TUPEd and would still have to do a role like X for £40k. But after a few months there could be a restructure that means that they are now asked to do role Y which is capped at £35k. Effectively a demotion, but often presented as a 'realignment'.
Unfortunately I don't think one single person has the power to make these kinds of 'deals'
Not sure that helps, but I hope it all works out in the end.
Do you have anything in writing about continuing to do your job but then transferring inwards?
How much experience do you have outside of the HR position? Do you have experience of where you want to be?
To be honest, it's inadvisable to put your trust in the word of one person without proof, and now that the rest of the bank knows, it may well come across that you intended to cheat them. I shouldn't think this will help your situation.
You can either pursue a job internally, bearing in mind that if the transfer date is February, it's very soon, and this type of thing tends to follow you in banks - it's a trust based world and you might not find it very secure after this.
Or you can change go the new company, doing something that you appear to be good at but might not want to do. A previous poster has explained the laws here - you'll transfer on your existing T&Cs but after a period, these can be changed. It might be worth talking to the new company to see what their plans are for you and your position, although take this as a guide unless you get any promises in writing.
There are other banks in London, so you could consider transferring, but you'd likely need experience in the area that you wanted to transfer into and you'd need to look into the impact on your permit and also what your reference would be like.
As mentioned in my earlier posts, I do have bits and pieces in writing which indicate this senior person had promised me I could stay if I wanted.
Also, the transfer date is not February. I was old my role is moving in February but then in the end the date has been pushed forward to April/May now. So I have until March/April to find something in the bank now.
My biggest concern is if I don't find something in the bank, will there still be an opening at the other place as I was promised? And will it be the same job that I am doing now, or will it be the shitty job they're wanting me to do?
I can't talk to HR because they will rightly take the management to task and ask them what the fuck they were thinking. This will piss them off even more and they will be even less likely to help me.
Anyone who is or knows a member who is an employment lawyer, please please please could you message me
I think you need flowery on the employment boards.... Get your post moved to employment and the employment lawyers will pick it up
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