Good for you WIMH (being naughty )

To be honest when something life changing like a marriage breaks down, we all have to assess ourselves and our lives. I know I have. I feel I have lost me in the marriage, I was on my own for six years with DS1 until he was 7. He had quite severe SNs which I didn't fully appreciate and I cope with it all on my own. His father with an alcoholic and opted out of parenting. I am very co-dependent and am realising that now. My therapist said I was only really secure and happy (?) when I was on my own, own job and independent.

When I got together with DH, I was pregnant within 7 months and had an horrendous pregnancy and everything started on the slippary slope then and I "lost" myself. I had 3 babies in less than 5 years and that in itself is a lot for any couple to handle. Together with the business, financial problems and 3DS also diagnosed with ASD, everything got too much for both of us.

Once the DC are back at school, I am going to take a leaf out of my friend's book whereby she has a day just for herself, no housework etc. Just a day doing what she wants, going out to lunch, shopping, reading etc. We owe it to ourselves, to have fun, be happy and just "be".

DH and I am changing together and hopefully for the best. Both have big issues with our childhoods. Apparantly we attract people with similar childhoods and similar emotional "baggage" and self-esteem issues. So we really to have to work on ourselves before we can do anything else.

It sounds like you have really reassessed yourself and your issues and unfortunately your H hasn't done that with himself. If he doesn't sort himself and his issues out, he will end up wrecking his relationships with his DC the way his F did with him and so it goes on down the line.

There we go, another therapy session.

I am so pleased you are so positive with everything - it is a new and better life you are embarking on

Hi CT10, so pleased to hear that things are much better for you and DH. I think you are so right, actions speak louder than words. I think women get good at reading those once you've had your eyes opened.

My DC are gorgeous though. I cant believe they're mine. All mine. I feel so lucky and H is such an idiot as he's done something terrible to his family that he can never ever rectify. It's a true measure of his charactor and I dont think he'll ever recover from it. He gets angry as he can see it in the way I look at him and talk to him now. (tough)

I do read back sometimes, I see the first post I wrote, as it's often at the top when I flip the thread. I cant ever see myself being that woman again. I feel so different now. I realise that the DC and especially I - given that I am the mum, the kind of planet in the centre holding it all together for the DC - should have been coming first all along. I'm determined to live that way from now on. I dont know why I let someone as selfish as H muscle his way in to make us all revolve around him.

I think when you have DC, you naturally step to the side of your life and you're vulnerable to someone else pushing their way in as well. That's fine if they are a team player and they put you in the centre of their world. But H never did and I think I knew that. These are all the things they dont tell you about having children, you tie yourself in. I used to say to H, I wanted a more modern marriage and didnt know how we'd ended up where we did.

I'm trying to capture some of that independence and feistiness I had before I married H. And that sixth sense I used to listen to. I dont know if I mentioned it in a previous post, but when I started dating H, I had just had a severe car accident and was very fragile at the time and he looked after me - a kind of life rebound. I realise now that I read more into his character because of it than there turned out to be and it had changed the first impressions I had of him (too shallow, not the marrying kind, have an affair only. I used to call him a "wide boy" and joke with him (we were friends for 7 years before we dated), that he would never be my type). He asked me to marry him on our first date and asked me every few months for the 5 years we dated before we married.

Even until the end I believed he was more. Until all his behaviour afterwards started ringing alarm bells at things he'd said and done beforehand. It was like my eyes were opened and I cannot see him the same way ever again. I keep saying he had amazing piece of luck to have married me and he couldnt keep it up. But he did well to do it for 9 years. His dad died at 59, lung cancer and heart disease, and H smokes like a chimney too and works stupid hours. So I wont have to look after him when he gets ill. I'll let OW or whoever is around that time, if they stay around, do that!!! The DC and I are free....

Do I sound arrogant? I'm just starting to appreciate me and how kind I am naturally, and think i deserve the same back. And so do the DC. Sorry, posting a bit of a therapy session. It's where I am now. I have my ups and downs on the practicalities. He's still bullying on getting everything how he wants it, but really I'm separating myself out now and saying, nope that doesnt work for the DC and I, and we are more important. HAH!

PS Australian is nice. Also have lovely Navy guy (brother of friend) who adores me and we're great friends! Enjoying the attention, but being very good. (Except of course with the Australian - with whom I'm being deliciously naughty!!)

oops! cross posted - sorry!
(You can tell how long it's taken me to read the thread in full!)

So proud of you WIMH, if you ever feel down read this thread and remember how you used to feel.

whereismumhiding - are you hiding?! Please let us know you're ok
x

I'm glad things are really looking up for you WIMH.

There's always another woman isn't there. Remember someone pointing this out to us at the beginning of this thread - the elephant in the room - and none of us could believe it of our "D" Hs.

Keep protecting your heart !!!!

How awful the way your DC met OW. Remember mine introduce OW to my DC without me even realising there was an OW. Words fail me with these men.

Anyway, me and DH are still working on the marriage. He is working through a lot of changes in how he deals with everything in life and I'm working through my issues too. Hopefully we will have a wonderful marriage in the long term.

He is thoroughly ashamed of what he did re OW, he is repulsed by her and embarrassed etc. She has been removed from the bookies where she worked and we've been told she will not be allowed in there again (she has been put on relief work apparantly, was lucky she didn't lose her job by having the relationship with my DH in secret as he was a serious punter in the bookies). DH has also stopped gambling but like any addiction, it is one day at a time. I believe that the gambling has been the root of the problem but that came from his seriously dysfunctional childhood and abuse issues.

As with all these things, actions speak louder than words and I can see he is doing everything in his power to put things right in every respect. We are off to Center Parcs again next week with the youngest 3 DC and DS1 will start his new SN college on 5 September - had all the funding agreed and just now waiting for confirmation of the taxi to and from the college as it is 2.5 hours away. The powers that be don't make life easy for any parent with a child with SNs.

Your Australian guy sounds lovely and don't forget you would have learnt an awful lot about yourself in the last few months and will not be prepared to accept second best in future.

Hi Girls

Am back. Been offline for a while as internet connection been down since changed provider- Ggrrrrrr! Cant check this website from work..

Anyway, IWMI I am soooooo sorry to hear your news. I remember that feeling of "Oh my god, what am I supposed to do now..", your whole life changes and all the things you took for granted before are suddenly different. It's like waking up in a different world each morning and you just want to roll over and go to sleep and wake up in the right world.

It sounds as if things weren't right for you either though and you will be OK honey. I know that and you'll look back at some point in the future and see how far you've come and how happy you are there. Just take it one day at a time in the beginning and dont think about the future. You're on the money to concentrate on the children right now. At some point in the future, when it's right, you will meet someone who is right for you and makes you truly happy. Then you'll wonder what you ever saw in H and why you wasted so much of your energy on someone who was not worthy of you.

And it's nice to be on your own for a while and be in charge of your own destiny, it's a real sense of freedom. I've learnt that living with a person who isnt right and it all being on his terms makes you miserable underneath in a way you dont notice until you're finally free.

Thank-you NanaNina, I read your post very carefully and think you have a point. I didnt take any of what you said in any way other than a kind suggestion. I'm doing quite well right now. I'm dating someone- the Australian - but keeping him at arms length in some ways by putting DC and my life with friends first so he's very much fitting around me.

I've definitely realised that I have to not put my man before my needs. Hence ending things with the Fireman. Hmmm, yes, I sensed he was otherwise involved... Or too attached to his bachelor life. Either way it wasnt going to work for me, so I'm not staying in anything that doesnt make me feel absolutely happy and cared for. I didnt listen to my sixth sense with H, before I dated him and at the start, so I'm determined to do it this time.

You're right though, I am a lot more emotionally fragile than I was before and everyone is telling me that. I think I'm a very different woman than the one who first posted on here. I do worry about the DC. They seem fine but I'm constantly thinking about what is best for them. Wont tell you what H did... OK, will. He introduced OW (found out he was seeing a single younger polish woman from his work when we were still married and before we were even going to Relate, sleazy pr*%k, what a waste of all that money, it was just for show) to children naked in his bed. They found her there one morning couple weekends ago. One night in 14 he has them over night and he couldnt restrain himself for that one night. GRRRRrrrr, dealt with that very well though - I really held my ground about how inappropriate that was.

I did go to Relate on my own after H left for a few months, and she felt I was doing remarkably well and become strong again as worked through a lot of it. It was funny the only things that bothered me were H's behaviour after the split. I wonder whether I generally process things quickly if I understand them, I switched off very well from him by talking on here and talking in Relate and suddenly opening up to RL friends about how he was on bad days.

It was almost as if I hadnt been listenning to the voice in my head and he'd been telling me I was irrational to worry about that and how I was wrong. It feels great to know that it wasnt me, it was him all along. I've hit my stride again the way I used to be, dating, taking no nonsense ... as I trust my own voice again now. Even Australian guy says he finds it refreshing how open (i.e. blunt) I am at times. He knows I have a three strikes and you're out policy and just asks that I warn him when he does something that might incur a strike so he can avoid any further ones!!

Eve, sorry to hear that H is not being a team player. Hmmm, what are your thoughts on it?

What have the rest of you girls been up to? Sorry long post...

I will make it so sorry to hear this, but now you can finally move forward and build a happy life for you and the children. Be strong you have given it your best shot and be proud of what you have achieved. x

Dont know whos decision really, he made it but i forced him into telling me the truth about how he feels.

Dont know whether to laugh, cry or spit in his face when he tells me im his best friend and he loves me deeply but never wants to be intimate with me again.

Even worse is the sad truth that i think its the right move for us, although i wish with all my heart i could change the past and make everything ok again. But he felt like this for a long time b4 telling me and has moved beyond the wanting to try stage, cause he certainly didnt despite what he thinks.

Am now working hard on being friendly and fair, a struggle at times!

So sorry to hear this iwillmakeit. Don't really know what to say. Was this all his decision or something you both decided on ?

Please keep strong and concentrate on yourself and the DC - unfortunately they are the innocents in all of this.

Thinking of you and take care.

xx

Hello all,

Last i posted h was moving in, we had a lovely hloiday, despite the rainy days. Came home muddled on deluding myself, h believing things would sort themselves out by magic. Relate trying to bash our heads together!

He finally left our marriage and home 4 good on sat, eldest was heartbroken, middle one joined in and baby .....? Will she ever know what affect this has had on her life?

Am very sad, angry, dispondant etc.

But determined to get on with my life now 4 my babies to start with and then when im up to it 4 me.

Take care all xxx

Whereismumhiding. I have been reading this thread as the same thing happened to me a long time ago. I am new to MN and am so impressed with the kindness and thoughtfulness of people who can reach out to others in distress. SO glad you are feeling so much better.

However I would urge you to take care about getting involved with men again at this stage in your life. You have been physically and emotionally abused and shaken to the core by your ex H's behaviour. Your self esteem has taken a battering and you must still be emotionally quite fragile. You will take time to heal (longer than you think I suspect). Would you be willing to see a counsellor to help make some sense of the past and help you come to terms with what has happened. I know that you and your H went to Relate before.

I am a bit concerned that you deluded yourself to some extent in the past that your marriage was happy and your H's angry/violent outbursts were just something that had to be endured. You have mentioned that you don't like to think about this, but I think you need to be supported to be able to recognise and accept that your H was (and is) a very damaged person with a violent disposition, although with a more pleasant side to his personality. it sounds to me like your marriage was conducted very much on his terms and you accepted that was the way it was. I think the danger is that unless you are really able to accept this and understand some of the reasons for the fact that you put up with this for so long,you may make the same mistake again.

I am sure you need to feel that you are still attractive to men (and I have no doubt that you are) and this is a very commonreaction to rejection. However i think you should give yourself more time before going on dating websites and getting involved with other men (incidentally i honestly don't think men go on these sites for friendship "only". I think you could easily be hurt again. I suspect that your fireman was in a r/ship or married as he was unable to commit to making arrangements. Have you considered this I wonder.

Also please do not under estimate the way your children could have been adversely affected by what has happened. It is very early days and your H is still playing mind games. They will continue to be affected and the last thing they need in their lives just now is another man, however nice he is.

Look I'm sorry to say all this and I really am not saying that you should remain celibate for years on end, but I am afriad for you - I think you are "needy" (understandably) and are in danger of being hurt. Wait until you are emotionally stronger and you will give yourself a much better chance of finding a worthwhile man and someone who can accept your children. Emotional strength in a woman is a very attractive thing and you will be less likely to get involved with a man like your ex H.

I am not excusing your H's behaviour in a ny sense but I note that he recognises that he has anger problems stemming from childhood. And yes, that is what it's all about - we are all the product of our childhood upbringing. When you meet the next man, find out about his past. If he had a happy and secure childhood the chances are he will make a good partner.

PLEASE accept this in the spirit in which it is written - out of caring about you after all you have been through.

Wow things have moved on. Counting to 10, so glad things have moved forward for you both and h has seen how his behaviour has impacted on you all. And well done in getting that funding, I know how difficult those things can be. Take the counsellors advice, take some time out for you, I know how hard it is, but it is vital.
WDUAT - so glad everything is moving forward, must seem strange but sounds like u have turned a corner.
Have suggested relate, but h doesn't think we need it!

Eve. Hope things work out for you and you all have a lovely holiday. Maybe worth mentioning relate to your H and see how things go from there?

CT10, Glad things are going well and H is working on things.

As for me, well I am seeing someone now and all seems to be going great. H is aware of it and we are getting on much better then we have in ages as friends. We have even spoken together about our new relationships which is a bit strange but there you go! OW met my youngest dc the other week which did turn into a row but I just felt bit strange about it at the time. Fine with it now. Divorce papers are out and just waiting for H to sign the acknowledgement of service and then onto getting decree nisi. DC and I are off on hols next week so cant wait for a week in the sun. All is going well really, hope it is for everyone else who used to post here too!

Well we are still together and still going to Relate - they have actually reduced the fees for us as we are going so much and it doesn't look like stopping anytime soon !!! We must be really screwed up. Therapist has actually said I am not fit for work .

DH is very pleased with Relate, feels he is understanding himself now, why he/we did/do things we do/did. No excuses obviously for running off with OW but he nows feels repulsed by her and his actions and has all the associated feelings of guilt etc to go with it.

Maybe Relate might be a good idea for you EVE - a third party might help your DH realise how his behaviours impact on you and the DC.

Anyway my DH is turning everything around in the business - staff are really shocked (and pleased) at the change in him. He wasn't just badly behaved towards me.

I am very hopeful of a very happy marriage but I really need to sort myself out aswell. Very bad past with alcoholic 1st H and now with everything that has happened with 2nd together with 4DC's with special needs thrown in for good measure. Good news is I have secured funding for DS1's SN college (another stress I had to deal with whilst DH was doing what he was doing). Therapist says I just need to "be" without doing anything eg housework, working, anything.

Sorry for the waffle everyone and thinking of you all .....

This might be a long one :-)

ot sure if anyone comes back to this thread, DH moved back at the begining of July. It has been difficult to say the least. He has been working hard and planning his bike ride (john o'groats to lands end) so has had very little time for us.
He has had several nights out. His phone is super glued to his pcoket still. All signs that worry me.
He has been ok, I keep trying to talk, he says I am here that should tell you what I want.
Money is a big issue. We have nothing, he has had nights out, and has gone on a stag weekend this weekend. I think he is being selfish, we are all going on holiday in Sept and should be saving what we have for that.
I am letting things ride out til after the holidy, but things have to change...
so watch this space :-)

Hi ladies - where are you all?

Would love to have an update?

xxx

Hi to all
TSL - sorry hes being a git still, no it wont get lonely ypu will get over this and move on, it just might take a while.

Now he either is the lowest of the low or he will eventually wake up and realise what he is throwing away the kids like that, i hope its the latter. Sounds like a big kid himself (arent they all?????)

Chin up babe and keep posting 4 support xx

Me? H is moving back 2moro

He seems quite excited, im very nervous still but viewing it as another step on our journey. My parents been away 4 3wks and the day they came back the tension started which is a shame, more so that i have to deal with it alone but heh!

Kids are happier seeing daddy more, we are away in a teepee 4 a wk on mon, maybe too much!

Keep plodding/skipping on all, wishing you well xxxxxxxxxxxxx

WIMH - I think your attidue to dating just now is very healthy - no way should you be waiting in for any man - and the friends idea is excellent

Cto10 - how lovely of your MIL - and nice that you are still cracking on with it

As for me - the bastard has decided once again that actually he isn't happy to move back in and actually doesn't love me and actually doesn't even really want to see his kids - he says he isn't that bothered about seeing them

Oh joy.

At least now I can mopve one cos this is the last time he is going to mess me about. No turning bacvk now - even if he got on his knees and grovelled.....well maybe I might consider it then - but as for me doing the comprimising and agreeing to all his demands - he can feck off

Rah! Hope it doesn't get too lonely :-(

Hi everyone,

Glad to see everyone is hanging in there and moving forward in various ways.

about the fireman WIMH but as you say you could have had your heart broken so soon after all the other devastation. BTW I think you will find any divorce judge taking a very dim view of your H defaulting on the mortgage because you had him "falsely" arrested.

Well I had my weekend away with the DC - had a wonderful time at the races in Ascot and saw Hairspray in London (wonderful, feelgood musical). Unfortunately I suffered from a lot of "sledgehammer" thoughts about DH and OW eg him taking her out shopping and for meals etc. I think I am probably going through the depression/acceptance phase of the grieving process and it hurts like hell. DH has been trying to help me but basically it makes him feel even worse when I talk about and he does know I need to talk about it.

We are also having a bit of a tough time with the business and cashflow problems which is bringing some old behaviours back (both his and mine) - we recognise this and are trying to deal with them.

Still going to Relate - seem to have been going forever, must be at least 7 visits and they keep booking us more appointments ! Must think we need them !!!!

BTW MIL sent me a lovely card for my birthday - saying what a special DIL I am etc. Made DH think again about things

Hang in there everyone and take things slowly - it's a hard path whichever one we chose or are pushed down.

Hi Girls

Well, just been catching up with all of your posts. Goodness a lot has happened.

TSL- do what's right for you x You're allowed time to think about it as well, it's not all about him. xx

WDYAT- thank goodness. Listen to your inlaws, goodness if his own parents think that then, wow. Says a lot for you really that they rate you even higher than their son. That's really quite an amazing compliment.

IWMI - stick in there honey

Eve- HOORAY!!! I really hope he sorts himself out. At least he was honest. How are things going?

Hi Semper xxxx

CT10- fantastic news honey, really pleased for you. xxx

Well, do you want to know what's happened? I ended things with the (lovely) fireman. He was sooooo nice and I didnt even shag him. How gutted am I that I didnt cross that item off my list!! But he had so many other commitments and he couldn't book even a week ahead, so I felt I was waiting around for him. I started to feel a bit like I did with my workaholic ex husband. I thought he might break my heart if I got involved with him. So was being a bit sensible. Damn Damn Damn!!!

Anyway, this will make you laugh. Have put myself on a dating website (plentyoffish!!) !! As Friends. Not anything else. So anyway, bit busy, going out and stuff.... meeting new "friends"!! Being very very safe and making sure my real friends know where I am going and who with, and oooohhh have found a few nice VERY TALL blokes, but one in particular. Australian sweet guy - 6 foot 2 as well. With kids. ooohhh. Might go ice skating with him soon...! He rings me most nights... how sweet is that.

Oh and I like him. Now how fickle am I?! But hey ho!

PS H still being an arse, defaulted on mortgage this month, as halved what he was giving me "because I had him falsely arrested 3 weeks ago". Think I told you all about it, but anyway. Covered it with savings, and hopefully he will pay next month. So... He has no idea he's about to be re-arrested as they have the photos of the injuries and I agreed to make a statement (finally!). Doesnt matter what I do, just would be nice to have someone else talk to him about his behaviour and him not be able to bully them back. Being a bit brave right now...!

wdyat - so nice to hear you being positive and things moving forward - good on your FIL for backign you like that-fantastic!

Discussion did not go well - it just comes down to him agreeing a date to move home and then a week later finding excuses to put it off again - what a palava

I am now at the point where i really don't think I WANT him to come back. I just desperately want another child I think that the MC is clouding my sense here....

Looking forward to hearing some more from everyone! Its been so nice to see how well we're all doing!

Wow how things are moving for all of you! To those working through it with your H's hope it continues to work out the way you want it too. Its great to come back and read that your moving on and are trying to make things work and that your h's are coming to their senses!

As for me, divorce petition is out finally! I have signed and returned mine and h has received his copy and is FINALLY seeking legal advice this next week so hopefully it will be signed and returned to my solicitor this coming week. He has asked me to be 'friends' but at this moment I just cant. He has said to me how he will always care and love me and will be always sorry for what he has done but is still with the OW. Suits me as dc and I are moving on and looking up.

Had a frank talk with my FIL who told me I am far better off without my h who is even telling bare faced lies to them and is living like a pig in their house(at least he isnt doing it in my house anymore!) He said him and MIL thought I was mad to even consider taking him back right at the start and they dont even know who he is anymore as he isnt 'the son they knew'. They made it clear they are not turning their back on me and have no inclination to meet or have the OW in their house. They even agree with the 'shitty'-as my h calls them- solicitors letters.

I think the only sticking point I may have now with my H is the fact I have had the locks changed and he cant gain access to the house and he is entitled too. Have to see what happens when he gets legal advice I guess.

Continue moving forward everyone. TSL, I know exactly what you mean by it being calm on your own. No one to raise eyebrows or roll eyes when the dc fight and no one to answer to except yourself and the dc. It is more peaceful and I actually find now that when my H was here I was on edge and now feel so much calmer and relaxed. Good luck with your discussion today and hope it has the outcome you want. Will look out for an update from you.

WIMH, Hows things with the lovely fireman??!

Sorry for the essay!

eve this sounds like progress indeed! I am glad he at least had the decency to answer all your questions - I think that knowing all the facts makes a huge difference in a wierd kind a way.

As for me these days - well I think we may be getting somewhere.....we are having a big discussion tomorrow and will see where that leads......being a single mum isn't that easy but at least its calm you know?

Semper - thank you for that. I can at the moment not it affect me. I hope it lasts that way only time will tell.

This week has been a bit hit and miss as we have both been working hard. Have a day together on Sunday so will plan something for us to do and spend some time as a family.

Watch this space - we both know what we have to do, but also know that I will not tolerate any of the shit I have before.

Eve!!!! Am glad that you are giving it a go but not so glad to hear about the ow . I hope you can work through it if thats what you both want.

Just remember that you can be the new super Eve without h if you want to be.

Good Luck and keep us updated x

Am glad you r all still making through lifes ups and downs as am i.

We have had a few "words" recently about his efforts (?). But 1 we had words and 2 he is trying to do a bit more and 3 i had him on his toes for a while! So we r moving on....

Not been on much as life has settled down so much but will keep looking after you all xxx

The silver lining that sounds so difficult, I hope that he sees what he is rsiking before it is too late.

WMIH - you got get jiggy girl you are a grown up and can do whatever you like. I see it as part of moving on if you can get intimate with a new person it means that the past is now behind you completely. Good luck x

CT10 - I hope that you keep talking and moving forward together.

Me :-)

Well it has been a strange week H came home last week, it was a bit strained as expected. I had got hold of his phone which opened up a few difficult questions. He came clean, he was seeing her had had sex with her but it was just sex, he didn't want it to be a relationship, although she has grown very fond of him. We were in notts again for the weekend and spent some lovely time together and with DS we went to Thomas land which was a great family day. We talked all the way home and he answered all my questions. I have to let it go now and we can move forward together. WE have both learnt from our mistakes and we want this to work and know we have to keep talking and move forward together.
so 8.5 weeks till spain, so excited got my bike out to try and get a bit fitter and lots of good food so watch this space fora new super EVE!!!!!

Wishing you all the very best for the future it will be brighter and better.

I will keep in touch x

c210 - great news for you - well done!

WIMH - you are a grown woman with 3 DCs and a job and a life....you wanna get deliciously naughty with whomever you please - who the hell are we to judge?!!! You go girl! Glad you have something so fabulously distracting while all the crap of your twat of an ex is being sorted!

thanks for the well wishes ladies...I can't think about the MC - its safer locked away but other areas are going really well

I have some pets, my boys are happy and secure - doing great at school, business is great, and I feel really calm. H however is still able to upset the apple cart in one fell swoop....I still get "booty calls" from him (which I ignore - how rude is he??!!) and one minute hes setting a date for moving back in and the next breath hes saying he wants me now but doesn't think he wants me forever....wtf??!!!

Sorry mate but you signed up for forever or not at all when you married me! I am starting to get angrier and angrier with him - I need to try and get him out of my space for a while so I can think clearly you know? He keeps dipping his toe in then dashing off - its so confusing for me and the boys. Am at the stage where I want to just tell him to sod off just so its a decision iykwim?!

Hi everyone.

I have been lurking and keeping up with you all. WIMH, glad to see the fireman is still on the scene. Keep having fun but protect your heart, you've been through an awful time lately and you don't want your heart broken any time soon.

H has now moved back in permanently and has told the DC that he is never leaving again, he is staying forever (my 4 yr old kept asking him if he was staying forever every time he saw him ). We are still going to Relate which is very helpful especially as sometimes we feel the need to raise something that we won't do with each other just yet for fear of upsetting the other if that makes sense.

We are working through the denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance phases of things. I have felt extremely homicidal towards OW in the last couple of weeks, realising that she was pushing his buttons and pulling his strings, telling him what to say to me, what to do etc, etc. He has accepted responsibility as well and is struggling with his guilt and horror over what he has done, what he did to me and the DC and what he could have lost over "rough minger from the bookies". He and I both know he was going through some sort of breakdown/mid life crisis (with unresolved childhood issues, gambling etc) but it doesn't make it any easier.

It is my birthday next weekend and he has arranged a weekend away at Ascot and in London - 3 nights without the DC .

It does seem that all our lives are settling down 3 months on from all the initial trauma and devastation .

WIMH, Your fireman sounds lovely! Enjoy your weekend with him! Just enjoy yourself and have some fun, you deserve it after everything. Glad it wasnt anything more sinister with you H parking near your house. Sounds like he has got the message and is staying clear.

SEMPER/EVE, Glad things are on the up for you both and hope it all works out.

The weekend the dc and I just went out and enjoyed ourselves which was really lovely. Had to see H Sunday when I dropped dc3 off with him. Was all a bit strained. My in laws were lovely towards me though and H said they know that I found him in the car with OW. Saw him again yest when he came to take dc2 to afterschool activity and turned into a bit of a slanging match as its all my fault apparently and I havent given him any chances. He is such a idiot.

He thinks I am turning the dc against him by making clear to them what he has done, at the end of the day the dc had no idea till they saw him with her so he cant blame me for that one! I have been chasing solicitor for my petition and I should have it next week. So I feel like its finally getting somewhere now. Im still feeling positive and looking towards the future without him. Have been busy sorting out the money situation and changing bills over to my name. Just hoping that we will manage ok.

The man I went out with the other weekend has been texting me a bit and wants us to go out again so thats nice. He just seems to be a really busy person so is bit hard to arrange something when I only have one child free night out of two weeks!

Hi Ladies,

Sorry I haven't been around for a while but I think I mentioned some external issues we were having and it was the final day today and we got the result we wanted so all is now well in the Semper household.

I won't go into what it was simply because it is so longwinded that explaining it would be impossible, but needless to say it was a very stressful situation and it has been hanging over our heads for over 6 months so now we can get back to normal .

WIMH - your firman sounds lush! In fact he sounds just like my DH was when we were 'courting', those late night, goodnight, phonecalls are fab - ooh its enough to warm my cockles. Why not be naughty with him eh? You are a grown woman, separated, sensible enough to take precautions - have fun I have spent my whole life being a goody goody two shoes - I met DH when 19 and that was after a long(ish) term relationship in my teens - why not, you are young, free(ish) & single - live a little!

Eve - I am thrilled that your DH has seen sense. I had those feelings that you are describing and I can happily say that they are fading with time. So much so that I will happily row with him now when needed!! At first whenever we rowed, a horrible feeling of insecurity would creep up on me and I would think, oh - he is gonna buggar off again now - and I had to force myself not to apologies all the time. Now I will happily nag away make my point whenever necessary.

To me its all about picking my arguments now and realising that we are completely different people but are working towards the same goal, and that we both get it wrong at times. I am trying hard to be more laid back as I am freakishly slightly controlling and my DH is so laid back he is almost horizontal but we are trying to meet in the middle.

IWMI - sounds positive - fab news! 2 dress sizes eh?

TSL & WDYAT - you both sound so much stronger - its a cliche I know but time really is a great healer - keep going x

Ah, Gorgeous Fireman rang me tonight to say hello and see how my day at Butlins with the DC went (inset day, so I took my 3 DC on a day trip to local one with some of the other mums from school. I had sent him a text saying "Help, they're making me watch BillyBear shows!!") . (He has 2 DC too but bit older & funnily enough "gets it" in a way that even H never did because he was too busy working/ignoring us). It's quiet on the watch so he rang me before he went to sleep.

I LOVE that.

It was extra nice, as I had a bit of a shock when got home, neighbour came round to warn me that H's car had been pulled up just down from my house for a while. It really made me panic but I got given a panic alarm by police last week, so put the button in my pocket and locked up. Turns out H was just visiting neighbour to sort out checking his new house out, as he'd agreed before (he gets there in the end but has to make a fuss first). My other neighbour rang me to tell me after he'd gone. Starting to feel less like Eastenders now, as that was a more normal thing to happen... Felt a bit silly that I had got scared for a while, (as H isn't a complete nutter, just prone to angry outbursts when he can't deal with a situation).

Eve IWMI & Semper it sounds like your H's do care and realise that they are responsible for working together at your relationships too. Bl**dy brilliant!!!!

Eve, stick in there honey, as you will know if it is right and enough for you soon enough anyway. But remember what you are worth, as you can do this on your own too which is a great place to start.... I think it is natural to have a wobble after everything H has put you through and it's healthy to have a bit of caution. Listen to what your gut feeling is, as I think we pick up things from tone of voice and thier livttle "gives well before they become conscious... Your sixth sense will protect you if you need it and you are a smart woman x iwmi, your best friend sounds great. It sounded like he needed someone to talk sense into him. Good that he listenned to her, she must have really struck a cord. That is such a hopeful thing to hear xxx

Girls, I really hope things work out well for you all - Keep going!. Also keep thinking about what you need too and make sure you see yourself as gorgeous mums who deserve to be treated well. xxx You're not anyone's second best.

WDYAT & TSL how are things after this weekend? Thinking of you both xxx

By the way, Gorgeous Fireman is Hot Hot Hot!!! Seriously fit body and handsome..

I cooked him dinner on Sunday night and he .... took over (in his words...) "searing the prawns" (he knows more than me about cooking!!!) but also offered to get my washing off the line as it started to rain a bit, and then..... in between kissing me.... washed up! (Oh, and I snogged him for about 3 hours in total. Couldn't stop. Barely watched the DVD we'd rented )

Planning to be deliciously naughty soon .. (Do you think that is OK?) (Am I being a responsible mum) (Planning to stay at his on my weekend off next week.... he's cooking for me, and taking me out to the beach and into town..) I know I ought to be careful, but hey. I've been married, settled down, had DC. Did everything the right way and thought I had picked a good man. But I hadnt. So done all of that now. I like having a boyfriend that all your life and hopes arent caught up in. (Although, I do really like Gorgeous fireman...Is it normal to want to shag a man that washes up for you???)

WIMH - so pleased to hear you feel free, I can so see where you are coming from. Over the last few weeks, I have relaxed and so has DS, I can do what I like and with whoever I like :-)

I have been wanting H to come home and try, I have the chance now so why aren't I jumping up and down.

He wanted us to spend sometime together, in Notts his mum can have Ds and we got to lie in, go shopping have lunch out etc etc. It was lovely, but just felt on edge. Waiting for him to say you need to d o XYZ....

we agreed we were both at fault, we had got stuck in a rut, we need to do more together and as a family. It was great and it could be again if we both want it too....

IWMI - so glad you had a good weekend, sometimes I don't think they can see the obvious and it takes an outsider to point it out....

on the up side H aunty is having a baby :-) I am so jealous but thrilled....

Had a lovely wked 2gether, he mentioned that my best mate had a "word", bless her, it just saddens me that none of his have yet, or maybe never will.

Wdyat - am glad to hear your happier, keep going x

Eve - a strange one there, prehaps he had a shock? Did you go, how was it?

Wimh - hmmm, maternity undies! Have been out and brought me new lovely bras and undies... oh yeh and new tops and skirts and trousers... oops have gone a little crazy, but have gone down 2 dress sizes so am able to excuse myself! Its a great feeling isnt it!

Baby girl been sobbing 4 ages, need to go and deal will look in later.

Take care all xxx

(The knickers thing, is because FINALLY I've thrown away all my maternity knickers!!!!!)

Hooray, burn them!!!

Not having any more DC. Just me and the little 3 muskateers. I like the gang we have now. No one will ever get inbetween us.

iwmi glad to hear your good news honey xx

As for me. Well am definitely happier without H now I know who he really is. I'm lucky to have found out now, whilst the DC are still young. I was in love all those years with a man who wasnt real. So, all those times I couldnt understand why I felt frustrated with him and let down (the not getting up in the night ever, the selfish behaviour) well I realise now, it wasnt me expecting perfection but the fact he loved himself more than the DC and me, and could never be the right man for me.

I really thought I had picked a good one. Everything he has done on the run up to, and since, has convinced me, he is a poor excuse for a man and that I deserve so much better, just more of a man. So good luck to him in his new life. I genuinely dont care, I've no interest at all in what he is doing or who he is with. Only that I dont have to live within his shallow little world anymore, I can rejoin the real wonderful geniune world.

I think I will have a wonderful life. (Fireman or no fireman!!). Planning on doing things that make me happy for a change. That suit the DC. And no one ever, ever ever will push their way into the centre of our worlds again and control or take more than they give to us.

I feel free for the first time in years. And the world feels terrific. Full of hope. I get a chance to start again but get it right next time. And wear girly skirts and high heels whilst I'm doing it!! (And lacey black knickers as well of course!!!)

Eve Hmmmm H is confusing. Wonder what he is thinking. Why are you driving him up to Nottingham? If he wanted to spend time together you could just stay local. (That'd scupper any plans he had?)

You could always go & abandon him there if he misbehaves!

WDYAT you cant ever take him back now he's physically hurt you. Glad you're seeing how sad & lonely his new life is compared to your warm one. Good for you girl, to start setting your own boundaries, and say hang on, that doesnt suit ME (or the DC). He will have to work around you now. It feels good doesnt it?

Just a quick one as I am so confused it is driving me mad..

DH had a accident on Tues AM - nothing serious but has been at sick bay (MOD) and in a lotof pain. He has text alot but we haven't been able to see him.

He phoned yesterday and asked if I wanted to go to Notts for the weekend (family) I asked why. I thinking he has something planned and needs me to drive.
He said he wants to spend sometime together and has missed me.
I have been up most of the night trying to make sense of it all.
3 months of nothing and all of a sudden this?
I don't know if I want this now.

Am going to see how the weekend goes but not sure if it is what I want.

Wow I have turned a corner.

Hugs for everyone x

Semper: I hope you had a lovely birthday and done something special.

WIMH: I am sorry you have had a tough week with your H. Did make me laugh about the name change in your mobile! Hopefully your H will start to back off now and leave you and your dc to get on with things. Make sure you have fun Sunday with your lovely firemen you deserve it after the week you have had.

IWMI: Glad everything is going along ok and relate is helping. I am sure your family will make an effort with your H for the sake of your dc. Its hard as they just dont want you to be hurt again.

TSL: I hope you and your H can work things out. I am sorry to hear about your miscarriage and hope your doing ok.

CT10: Sounds like you are making progress with your H, hope it continues and you both manage to work through it all. It sounds like things are looking up.

As for me, since h's 'incident' last week I have managed to not talk to him. I sent him a detailed email of contact for the summer holidays and have started to move the household bills over into my own account so I dont have to rely on him too much. Communication has really only been through text message. He has been trying to open conversation but I just answer to the point and if he replies just ignore it. He was here last night to take dc2 to his swimming lessons and managed to not let him into the house(he had been coming in and being far too comfortable!) and do handover outside. I could hear him asking and asking dc1 if he wanted to go and watch and dc1 saying no over and over again.

When he dropped dc2 back he asked if he could have them all Saturday, told him no its my weekend and we have plans(we do) so next time he will see them will be next Thursday. He wasnt too happy about that as he has pretty much had free reign with midweek contact due to us 'talking'. He made this situation though so he can deal with it. Dc and I all walked back into the house laughing and joking about something while he was sat in the car looking a mess.

I do feel so much stronger about everything now and I dont spend my evenings wondering if he is with ow or what they are upto. Still no divorce petition out and its now 5 weeks down the line. Going to get on to them today and chase it up. Everyone has been saying that this is the time now that he will start wanting to come back as I clearly mean business this time, but instead of clinging onto that as hope he will be back now I just think 'NO WAY!'

Well it would seem you lot cant be left alone for a minute can you!

All sounds yuk and i echo everyone elses shock but am glad its kinda helping you move forward.

H been coming over regular, aiming to move back in in 4 wks, have a big wkend coming up as baby will be 1. Will see how we get through that and how i cope with him staying 2 nights!

Biggest prob still looming is my family, who are my lifeline in all this and how they and h come to a civil relationship............?
Maybe by babys 21st!

Relate still helping and am on waiting list 4 drs counsellor just 4 me which i hope will help me change the crappy patterns of behaviour we r in.

Weird how things are easier 4 me 2 without him, and im happier as a result - need to somehow hang onto that me as we become us again!

Love to you all and i hope things settle down for you wimh and wdyat, take care all xxx

Hi MNs

All Ok today, been organising things with solicitor and still waiting for police to take statement but they took photos on Wed of the bruises on my arm. Am resigned to fact I have to make statement so will just get on with it.

Semper Happy Birthday! 30 is a special one. Glad things are good with you xxxx

silverlining Glad you are feeling more positive. I liked your phrase "Man-child behaviour" I think that captures it really well!

Did I tell you I have changed H's name to Kevin the Teenager in my mobile phone? So that name flashes up and puts a smile on my face before I even look at the text or hear from him. (Well at least until I see the text he has sent). He got worse this week and I had a meltdown on Wed morning at work, couldnt stop crying after he sent (yet) another email to my work address. My managers sent me home and are blocking his email address to my work now. And I am taking steps to make me safer in other ways. Yes, I agree, I realise he has gone too far, and nothing I do is managing to calm down his behaviour. So yes, am speaking to police and other agencies to get him to back off.

Aside from that my 3 DC are as gorgeous as ever and it was great not having midweek contact this week as kids slept better in the evening. We went instead to outdoor paddling pool yesterday after school with big sandpit, you can imagine how much fun a 6, 5 and 1 1/2 year old had! They went for a "paddle" in the paddling pool but strangely enough both ended up sopping wet in their school uniforms!! Bad Mum!! I should have just stripped them down to their pants, but hey ho..!

Meeting gorgeous fireman next on Sunday evening. Gorgeous fireman is getting more lovely by the week. xx Am going out bowling tomorrow with work (only couple hours) then out for curry with other mum friends on Sat. So have to find babysitters.

OH MY GOSH!!!!!!!! What has been happening to all you lovely ladies whilst I have been away??

WIMH - I am shocked beyond belief at how things have turned? What the hell does he think he is playing at? I know I referred to him as having control issues earlier but I didn't think it would end up like that - the utter utter idiot . Just a few bruises? There shouldn't be any bruises at all, cor, I am fuming. How bloody dare he and in front of the dc's - flipping idiot. Am so glad that it was reported, he needs to know he cannot go on like this. Keep us updated as to how things progress. It is assault, pure & simple and whilst I am sure you wish him no harm, he does deserve to be reprimanded for that.

WDYAT - same for you too - what are these men thinking of?

Things still okay here, I haven't been on for a while as we have had a stressful time of it recently (external issues) that we have been building up to (one of the main causes of our issues I think), but it went well & the right outcome was achieved so that has taken a load off.

Then I was 30 the other day so have had family & friends visiting so have not been on MN for ages. Good to see you all coping so well.

Eve - get yourself on another date & have fun. Buggar your (d)h, you can still hope he changes his mind but have fun at the same time. That way if he doesn't come back, you know you have wasted no time in trying to get your life back.

Hugs to all x

WIMH - you are an inspiration lady! Thanks for your kind thoughts - I am at the stage you are (although sadly not with gorge fireman in the wings!!) in terms of keep waiting for life to be harder but it still keeps getting easier.

I am not sure if I could cope with his man-child behaviour if he came home.....life is all shiny and fun and calm.......but ok maybe a little lonely....
And don't you ever say "just for a few bruises"

He was bang out of order has been for bloody ages and deserves everything he gets coming to him don't you dare feel bad about that!

WIMH it's so great to click on this thread again and read your positive story on here.

Your H has been (and is still behaving like) an utter twot. It's blissfully refreshing to read the progression of your posts and see you blossoming now he's done you a massive favour by farking off

PS. Bought gorgeous skirt today, all girlie blue and pretty flowers around the hem of it. Painted my toenails pink. Have been wearing strappy heels a lot recently. (It wasnt for a man, as was doing all this before met fireman)

I have this big smile on my face a lot of the time, didnt realise that i was missing out on so much of life spending my time looking after notsoD H and DC. Now still looking after DC and house on my own, but life is so much easier. I keep expecting it to be harder.. but it's not.

Hi All

silverlining still thinking of you after your miscarriage... such a sad thing. Are you doing OK? It's hard to be able to trust H again after him leaving... it's all the unknown again isnt it. You needed him and found him wanting. But I hope you can work together to get over it. There is always hope, while you are still working on it honey xxx

Eve hmmmm calls from his bank? Oooooh girl what are you going to do next weekend without DS??? Are you going on another date?? I think you should.... I'm terrible for leading people astray... I know we ought to sit at home and look after our children and just be mums. But I tell you, it feels good to be out and about having fun again

WDYAT I am so sorry you had the same experience, it's frightenning. Have you tought about ringing the DV helpline? Will find number for you.

Gorgeous fireman still gorgeous. He's texted me 2x today and phoned me and is just returning to the station right now, having dealt with a tire and bush fire down by the river... Ooooohhh, he could talk shop to me all night. I just go weak at the knees! (OK, perhaps I should admit to a thing about firemen, policemen and men in uniform in general.....)

As for H. Well, been to GP, Children (Social) Services as welfare report made on my children by police as standard practice (because of Police arresting H and children seeing incident leading to arrest, it's a protective thing for the mum and DC), back to police station today AND then also to solicitors. And upshot is ..... going to get a lot of help dealing with nasty H behaviour. Have to make statement tomorrow (solicitor talked me into it) and they will be rearresting H this week. OMG. I am a bit scared of what he might do now to retaliate as I dont doubt for a second that he's seething underneath but he will get even worse when he finds out what is about to happen (re-arrested and possibly charged)
Goodness, all for a few bruises. I keep thinking that's nothing to what he's done before... He will also think it's nothing and be annoyed to be pulled up on it.

He didnt turn up for mediation this morning anyway, C&F (Soc services) manager talked to me at length this morning about protecting the DC (from H, not from me!) and that they will be addressing it with him directly and challenging him (i.e. I dont have to do it myself anymore but be interesting to see if he keeps his temper with another woman challenging him).

He cant keep threatenning me with money either as solicitor said if he tries to default on the mortgage we will go to court and get enough to cover it taken directly out of his wages!!! She said it wont look good for him any of what he has just done as a caring father would have been more intersted in leaving with his DC for their lovely weekend together as DC were outside getting into car, than instead spending his time trying to force his way into house , she said it is clear he is using contact with children as a route to getting at me and a judge would see it that way, otherwise he would have chosen another time or just left with DC. She's right.

I am so grateful that the police told him that he's not allowed to come back to my house again. I feel free!!

ladies I have been AWOL having real problems logging into mumsnet - it just kept crashing my internet explorer which is wierd. I hope this posts ok as I cannot believ what you guys have been putting up with in my absence. I am so sorry you have had to put up with fingers marks WDYAT and WIMH. Thats disgusting

Good tho to see eve, WIMH and WDYAT sounding so positive about their situations depsite everything!

C210 - wow things have come along way for you and DH thats for sure - glad soem time away was useful and its a credit to your strength and forgiveness that you are working this through with him.

As for me - the miscarriage left me reeling especially as H just kind of left me to it while it was happening - no sympathy or anything and that really hurts.

He wants to move in with us - he thinks now I am sorting my life out I am ok to be with again......I feel really confused and wonder if I would be a total muppet to have him back - after all what happens if I lose the plot or have PND or lose my business or something equally hidious - will he leave us again cos I am not "fun" to be around during that time?.....

Ladies I am really glad I have been able to get back on and see how you are doing - I thought about you all alot and wondered how things were going.....

Stay strong ladies xxx

WDYAT & WIMH - my heart goes out to you both. I know that this is something that you didn't want to happen and I am so sorry that it has. I hope that it gives you both the resolve to keep moving forward into yuor new lives and that going to be so much better and brighter.

Couting to ten - that sounds great I am so glad that you managed to spend some time together and hope that you keep moving forward together.

Nothing to report here - had a weekend at my mum's. I am shattered DS didn't sleep well so I put him in child care today and have slept all morning.....lovely. H bank keep phoning here so that must mean he is not managing his money....not sure when we are seeing him again, had little contact since we saw him on Wed. I have reminded him that he is to have DS ALL weekend next weekend. Can't wait!!!

WIMH, I am also sporting the finger mark bruises..not good is it. My dc was screaming too seeing H push,pull and throw me around. My H looses his temper like that too, gets really angry then in a hour or two is 'im so sorry' etc.

I hope he keeps away from you now.

OMG, you have all been living soap operas atm haven't you and I thought my life was like one too. I hope you are all recovering from your ordeals and hopefully seeing your Hs for the controlling human beings they are.

Well, I had a good time at Centre Parcs. It gave H time to think about what he had done, what he had almost lost and what he had done to his family. He had buried himself in work and the business so he didn't really have to think about things IYSWIM. Anyway I needed to see him feel some of the pain I have and am still feeling which he is doing. He can't believe what he had done and cringes and shudders at the thought of OW now (and boy, was she minger) and how manipulative she was and how he fell for it (but he also takes responsibility because he could have said no although he has gone through a breakdown so don't think mentally he could have made the decision). I am beginning to see the man I fell in love with again and we are both beginning to heal with the help of the therapy which I would recommend to everyone whether you intend to get back with your H or not.

I wish you all good luck with your present problems.

WDYAT That is terrible!!! God that's like an episode of Corrie. What was he thinking??? He seems to have become a low life to do something so sordid..Sudocream?! It's hardly romantic love is it? Glad you're in a clearer space now and that in a funny way it helped you.. Big shame but your H is entirely responsible for his own behaviour and what he has done to his marriage and DC. Not you. You keep your dignity as you are, and live your life without H in a much happier better way.

Eve You'll be OK honey, I can tell... You're really strong, gorgeous, sweet and feisty. You will find someone who deserves you but concentrate on you at the moment. xxx

Well girls. Want to hear my shocking weekend? H was arrested on Saturday for assulating me, he stormed past into the house and wouldnt leave then kept grabbing me pulling me around. All this infront of the children. DD2 and DS1 were really distressed and worried about mummy. DD2 refused to get in his car, so he screeched off (despite me asking him to wait until police arrived and calm down) with DS1 and DD3 (baby) in his car and the police were looking for him until he came back. DD2 was hysterical at being left behind but not wanting to go. He was totally out of control.

It was like someone had dropped me into Eastenders. I always thought soaps were grossly exagorated. I suspect he'd been drinking on friday night and was hungover and wound up about something.

Anyway I asked the police not to arrest him and refused to give statement etc. But they did anyway. That was indescribably shocking for me. He went off in police car to station. But they rang me back 3 hours later to say they have dropped the case for lack of evidence after interviewing him (he denied it etc - but I had red marks on my arms which are now finger bruises so I dont doubt they believed me)

Anyway, it's on record now so I guess a line in the sand has been drawn. The police told me that H was told by them to stay away from my house and he cannot pick up the DC from my house anymore. So... it'll be contact centre now once sort that out.

In some ways I feel this sense of relief, as I just want him to leave me alone and would feel much better if I never saw him again.. DC fine but not me. It's like he can't let go. He seems to be so out of contrl. Like the debt I've discovered he's run up. The thing is he is soo controlled and manipulative in some ways, he can lose his rag, go extreme, then snap out of it. He did when police arrived and probably charmed them and seemed so plausible.

I think that frightens me more than anything. It's not like a genuine losing your temper, and then realising afterwards, he covers instantly with all smiles and "hello officer how can I help you". You should have seen his eyes flash when they arrested him. it's all so controlling. So I feel intimidated as he equally switches into a rage quickly when he sees me. You would think I'D had an affair the way he behaves.

I think he is p**sed off at the divorce petition- and yet it was so mild. Oh by the way he is contesting the divorce... as he hasnt behaved unreasonably...!! ???
Claerly he's not helped his case at all yesterday. He seethes underneath, that's the problem.

So I had the DC all yesterday and last night, we had a lovely day watching DS1's football tournament and he got a medal, I took some lovely photos and the girls and I trundled and cheered on side lines. Then we watched night at the museum and ate popcorn last night. We had fab day which H missed out on. So anyway Fathers Day today, they went off with him via neighbours house this morning.... I even did lovely photos of kids for him for F/D. It doesnt matter what I do or agree to, he is never happy. Nothing seems to settle H.

Hey all of you, well what a few days we have had. Wednesday night I have a call on my mobile while driving so pull over at next available place. See my H's car there and ring him, he dont answer. See something moving in his car so go and open the door. And there it was. My h laying on his front with seat reclined right back and OW stradled on top of him giving him massage with...wait for it...sudocream??!! I mean come on sudocream?!?! I put that on my baby's bum! Seen it for what it is some sordid little thing. He pushed and pulled me all around the carpark with our ds1 watching. Not a good thing.

DS1 was screaming saying he hates daddy and daddy is a liar and he never wants to go in daddys car again. You know what it never made me feel sick seeing it or even cry. I think that is a good sign that I am over it and clearly dont love him anymore. A few months ago I would have reacted so badly to seeing it but its really not how I thought it was in my head. I am so so sorry that my dc saw her but he has acted so grown up over it and is coping fantastic.

I know now I never want him back. I spoke to my solicitor and told her to get a move on with it all and she will do so. My petition isnt quite so tame as WIMH but at the end of the day its the truth of our marriage. Now I look back and see it how everyone else did.

So here I am looking onwards and upwards. I have even been out tonight on a date!! Had such a good time. It may have taken me 6 months to get here but I am there. At the end of the day anyone who leaves their wife is an arse but he left me with a 6 week old baby. She is now 7 months old and we dont need him. I will never stop the kids from seeing their dad but this weekend(he's weekend to have them) they dont want to go, I cant force them too so they will stay with me.

I am sorry this is so long and all about me but its gonna be so hard to name check you all so I hope you are all where you want to be and if you aren't happy do not put up with anything else then 1000% from your H's.

Eve, hang in there, you dont want you kids to look back and wonder why i understand that and you can only do your best (not his as well). Our relate lady keeps telling us that kids are only borrowed. But dont sacrifice yourself for an ideal, it doesnt exist, you might b a much happier family unit without him....?

Take care all (wimh - prehaps take precautions too !)

WIMH - you really are amazing. I know I keep saying this, but you truely show how far a person can come in such a short while.

I don't know why I am hoping H comes round, He hasn't changed at all. Does nothing around the house, does nothing with DS and does his own thing all the time....

That is wrong actually - I want him back because I want Ds to grow up with a family....I know it will always be a family, but you know what I mean. And I know that is not enough. Oh shit!

Anyway WIMH hope you have agreat date, I am sure you are being mindful, enjoy yourself, let your hair down and have a great time. You never know where it might lead too. x

Goodness, I was a bit full on about my fireman wasnt I?! I am taking it slowly/ easy, honest guv. (Apart from thinking how great he might be in bed...) (But trying not to think about that...) That's very naughty

By the way, my house still smells nicer!!

Oh, and aside from laughing, I promise I didnt encourage DS - he just constantly surprises me how perceptive and funny he can be! That's really quite a funny thing for a 6 year old to think up!

PS. Going out on date 3 with gorgeous 6'2" fireman on Friday night Thinking about putting on some seriously sexy knickers! And very high heeled shoes. Bought some ridiculously high 4" gladiator heels last week.

I have to be careful or I could fall for gorgeous fireman, and I know it's too early and I'm too vulnerable. But I feel safe with him, he is so calm & kind and not to mention drop dead shaggable (and a good kisser! ). It makes me realise that there are much nicer men out there .

You go girl, Eve, have some more dates. You find as many interesting and nice men to spend time with, and one of those times, you'll meet someone who you click with and who falls head over heels with the funny gorgeous spirited woman that you are.

It makes me mad that all these H's have been making us wonderful women feel second best. If they cant see how wonderful we all are, whilst we have been busy looking after them AND our DC, then that is a FATAL FLAW on their part.

Eve, if he cant sort himself out, then I suspect he will keep repeating the pattern and you will have had a lucky escape. But I hope for you that things work out. xxx

Well I hope for all of us xxxx

Hi Everyone

Eve, am so sorry to hear about your H. He is just messing you about. I think you should listen to the "I dont feel the same" bit though, as he comes back to this each time. I wonder if a bit of time on his own without you waiting for him, and moving on, will help focus his mind. I think if a relationship is going to work, then he will come back and you will be in a stronger position. I just think that sometimes someone has to lose something to shake them out of the position they have got in. He is just sabotaging any efforts to get back together otherwise, until his heart is really back in it. I'm not an expert tho' so that might be terrible advice!

Maybe you shouldnt listen to me, as I dont want my H back and dont even consider him my H anymore. I dont know who he is, or who I was married to all those years, but I feel free now. And I look at him differently, as a bully. Yes, I agree he is a w**ker.

WDYAT Argh on your behalf! How bloomin' annoying of him. I hope you get it moving again soon. x

IWMI Sounding good... at least you are working on it together. There's hope there x

Semper how are you doing honey?

Me- thanks for your posts. H is worse and worse. He is apparently now ... challenging the divorce. !!!!! I also found out that his credit card is £10000 in debt. I cleared it off last year from our joint account, so he has spent £6000 since Xmas and £4000 alone in the last month on credit. He is heading for a crash and burn. AND he now wants to take me to court to challenge the divorce??!! What for??? He accepts the marriage is irretrievably broken down, but wants to put "his own story" (Wife wore me down with kindness)(?!). The solicitor and I wrote mild and innocuous reasons, so I would be interested to see what a judge thinks if I have to disclose more!!

He threatenned me the other day that if I said anything, he would say he had concerns about the type of mum I was. I'm a great mum, so that is a really low blow he is trying to pull. Luckily the Relate lady said "It's down on record (from assessmnet with Relate) that he said you are a great mum" She thinks he is just saying words to threaten me, and that he's scraping the bottom of the barrel! She told me that a judge would see through all of that & reflect badly on him. We had a giggle in the Relate session, as I told her about him talking through the letter box at me, after I had shut the door mid sentence on him. He's 38 years old and he wanted to talk through a letter box!!! (in front of the DC too??!!). I wonder if he is having a breakdown? Dont care though.

Let me tell you something funny... I dont involve the children in any way, but this was volunteered and came entirely from 6 year old DS1. He found the "My Dad is Brilliant" book (we also have a "My Mum is fantastic!" book) you know the series that has My mum is fanastic at fixing things & cartoons of mum fixing things, and so on.. telling stories, dad roller skating etc.

So as I said, DS1 you can take that to daddy's house now if you like as we dont need it here now daddy doesnt live here anymore. DS "Yes mummy AND YOU could write a book called "My HUSBAND is RUBBISH!!" (Said with great relish by said DS1!) - Then it could say .. He lays in bed all day .. He shouts at lot and gets red in the face.. He is smelly in the bathroom (!)... I couldnt stop laughing, what a bl**dy brilliant idea for a book!! What about you girls? Any pages you would add ...?

Evening all, so sorry for the absence I lost this out of 'my threads I am on' for some reason.

Sounds like we are all at different points.

WIMH - you are so strong you really are a great person have such stength I always admire how you manage with such a difficult H, the tables will turn and you will be the last one laughing...

IWMI - so glad the relate is going well wish I could get H there....it sounds like you are making small steps keep at it

WDUAT - hang on in there girl, it will be a long process especially if he is ignoring the paper work.

As for me, well in the last week, my car has broken down, I have got locked out of the house, My work computer packed up. Tom tom stopped working whilst I was in the middle of no where and now my mobile is playing up...... so the icing on the cake was H coming on sunday for the day, took him 2 hours to travel 20miles to get to me as I needed him to let me back in, gave me some crap excuses.... had quiet day with him not talking much, then he text me that night to say he is fed up of meblaming him, and pushing him all the time, he can't pretend, he doesn't feel the same and just has had enough.

I phoned him and said that we should talk, we said nothing new and agreed that it was a waste of time.....

Following evening I told him to come and sort his stuff and and make def plans with his son as 1.5 hours a week is not enough. He cried and said he wasn't ready to give up yet!!!!! FFS

So back to holding my breath. I give up. Have been chatting to a few blokes nothing serious but enough to know I won't die a lone so I am leaving him to it. I haven't called or text. Told him to see his son twice a week and alternate weekends, so very much up to him now.

Sorry it is such a long one..... hang on in there girls

Hi all hope you r all ok.

WDYAT sorry to hear h is still trying to control u, but note the word 'trying'. You r after all getting out there and having fun without him. Solicitor wise if you cant get an ans what about her supervisor? Might need a little shake up?

WIMH - hard to pass judgement without knowing ur h, but....

He sounds like a complete w*er! Glad ur getting stronger to let it wash over you. Its hard to reconcile the you now with the you then, thats how i feel. Almost embarrased that i became that person and allowed those things, but time to draw a line for both of us, no regrets that was then this is now and we will be better women and mums for it!

H did stay fri, offered to sleep on sofa but i felt that would be wierder! But no shananigans just a longed for cuddle.

Had relate tonight so feeling like a coiled spring, we went for food after to continue the discussion so still feeling like we're moving on. I get really tongue tied, i struggle with saying whats really going on in my head without apportioning blame, cause am begining to see 2 sides to this story and really want us to move on but need to air my resentments for once and for all....

I dont know am all of a muddle, will go away and try and think (try!)

xx

WIMH - it sounds to me like this is a control issue on the part of your DH.

12 emails in one day whilst you are at work?? That is ridiculous! He wants to live his new life in his way ans yet he expects you to do everything you can to facilitate that. It is like he wants to be free but still retain ultimate control over you - how bloody annoying . Just keep going as you are.

WDYAT - I feel for you, I think legal timelines are completely out of sync with the rest of the world. Ditto for your DH not responding to paperwork - again, think it is quite a controlling thing to do.

Keep going

xxx

WIMH, Its great to have an update from you. Things sound like they are on the up for you. Like the sound of your fireman .

I havent posted on here in a while but we are doing ok (dc and I) I have had some fab times out with friends and am enjoying not have h around. H, well he still playing games and still seeing the ow. Im sick of it, he just gives me headache now. He hasnt acknowledged any of the solicitors letters or signed anything and although I saw my solicitor almost 4 weeks ago to get the petition drawn up I still havent heard a thing. I ring and she is not in the office and then doesnt return my calls. I first saw them back at the very start of March and I am no where near getting a divorce. Im not sure of the timeline of such things but surely this is just stupid.

Hope everyone else on here is doing ok.

Tell me how you are all doing?

2nd sentence.. should read....

in mediation

Hi MNs

Generally doing quite well. Have been happy and content at work and in life. 6' 2" Fireman still gorgeous! Mmmmmm

H is being difficult, not sticking to agreements made in
Forwarded emails he sent to me to solicitor who says to call his bluff as he hasnt stuck to agreements and needs to learn there are consequences. She said he was being unreasonable and from his emails is being a bully. It was a bit weird hearing that, as it's not just me thinking that now.

I dont know, what is best to do. As I dont want things to become antagonistic but I can see if I let him walk all over me and give in everytime he threatens us with money or give him his own way all the time regardless of agreements he has made, he is going to keep holding things over me and I am never going to escape.

I have started to feel free recently, which means that I didnt feel free before. Isnt it funny how you can think you were happy before but not notice this deep sense of sadness underneath. I thought it was having 3 young DC, I kept saying I was in groundhog day - but I feel free now even though I am now I am on my own with them. So I've started thinking it wasnt the DC, it was HIM. He made me feel like I was in a prison. I was a servant. Our lives were all about him.

I keep realising each time what a bad bad man he was and is. And what a lucky escape i am having right now, I'm like a bird that has been let out of my cage.

Is this normal? Is this how other MNs have felt when their marriages broke down? Is it a stage I will go through or is it really about H. I am so bored of all his games and wish he would just grow up. It makes it very easy to ignore him and give him little thought, as I dont talk or think about him unless he has just contacted me (12 emails today whilst I was at work!!!!!)

iwmi good for you. See it isnt all about him. It's good for your H to know that.

Make sure you get to decide some things too, as it should be an equal partnership xxx

Eve at least you went on a date, it's a start. I think you have to date a few men to see what you dont want/like before you can work out what you do. Remember if things are going to work out with H, then they will, as fate does that on your behalf. So you wont lose anything by getting on with your life in the meantime...

You sound like you're seeing the possibility of your life with DS and you, without H. That's a hard place to be in and a bit scary... xx H is th devil you knew so he will seem better ... But he left. Try not to compare other men to the H you knew with the life you had with him - he is now fundamentally flawed in someway for him to have walked out on his gorgeous DS and wife. You deserve to be happy and to be adored by a gorgeous man, and if H is too stupid to see that, then live your life and decide what you really need. I think you will find it and you're a terrifically spirited independent woman.

hi MNs
Just checking in. Doing OK, had lovely day yesterday with DD2's party.

Having bit of a wobble, but generally doing really well. I had to explain to my 83 year old neighbour why my H couldnt pop accross to help her, (I did it), and she couldnt understand why he would leave me and his gorgeous young children.

It reminds me of what an arse H is, and how selfish. Was doing well not thinking about him, but it is difficult to explain, as what he did is outside my comprehension. You think you know someone, when you ahve been married that long and friends even longer. Now I'm realising how little I like him or know him and dearly wish he would just disappear. He's sent a few emails that are just about him wanting things, despite effect on the DC and me. I am repeatedly reminded what a self centred excuse for a human being he is. I wish I had chosen a better dad for my DC and a better H for me.
I didnt and he's gone now. But he's still playing games and really I'm trying to ignore what he is doing but it's difficult when he keeps messing around with money and things that impact on the DC and I.

Sorry, will snap out of this wobbly mood soon. It's just it hits me sometimes what a terrible person he is underneath. I regret having him in my life and regret that he might influence the DC in any way to be even a bit like him. It's not my choice as the DC need to see their dad but he's a poor role model. Is it normal to worry about that kind of thing. I know I can or should do nothing as these things happen and work out how they work out. I am feeling very protective of the DC>

Morning all,

Hope all is well,

IWMI - got everything crossed for you.
SEMPER - it is amazing how far WIMH has come I am so excited to hear how far she/you have come it gives me hope.

ME - date was ok,nice enough chap although bit on the short side, I am afriad it just made me want H all the more.

I came back and he was here so said we needed to talk, he tried to get out of it, I am just going round in circles with him, but have told him it has to come to a decision soon. He said his feels haven't changed, I explained again that he needs to spend time with me to try and rebuild those feelings, not being at home is not the answer. So left it with him, his choice is to either come home and we try damn hard or we call it aday.

So back to the dating web site for me..... x

Thanks all for your support - things going faster now as he asked to come over tomorrow night and stay (is having kids sat am so makes sense). This was all at 8am - not my best time of day! Trying to herd boys upstairs to get ready for school and touch baby without getting covered in breakfast! So agreed but a little unenthusiastically i might add. But wont hurt him that i didnt leap at the idea

Been toying with the idea of getting a sleeping bag out just in case!

Am fighting to stay strong and get what i want out of this am more worried about that than anything else.

C10 yes we are fortnightly and it is helping.

Will let you know how i get on, good luck to eve amd wimh on your dates. Stay strong all xxx

You know what WIMH - this thread should be saved to show women out there that there is life after a marriage breakdown. You sound so positive & happy. Am ridiculously pleased for you

And no hangover this morning. Result!!!

Wanted to say hello MNs xxx We're still here. Having a lovely day with DD3 at home, then DD2's birthday party after school

Just to let you know that if your H does leave - everyone rallies round, when you are left on your own. My neighbours, friends, family, work colleagues, I have been so amazed at how many kind people there are out there. They have been helping me practically and just as lovely kind people which has helped me heal I guess. So, even without dating, I am happier than I have ever been (and I thought I was happy before).

H, however is more miserable than ever. And funnily enough, whether he gets what he threw away or not eventually, it isnt something that I care about anymore. He geniunely has become irrelevant in so many ways to me and I realised I had more than I thought, none of which depended on him.

Sorry bout my spelling, I was typing fast and had a few glasses of wine tonight with friend!

Goodness girls, you are all so good working at and worrying about your relationships with you Hs

Eve- I think you are right. Move on just a little, enjoy your date tomorrow nigh. If it's right then he will find a way back toyou. I think I worried myself sick about doing the wrong thing and pushing him further away but really it's not you, it's him that has walked away and you dont have ocntorl over that. It doesnt matter what you do honey. If he's going to come back, he will later anyway.

Semper - well that sounds a positive move, the next posting, it's very isolating to be on your own, sounds nice to have more friends around you. xxx You might find yourself again xx

IWMI honey you will be fine. You can do it, can hear in what you write that you are starting to get a bit stronger xxx Just take each day as it comes and have a bit of a filter on what he says. He isnt the important one here, it's you and the DC.

CT10- glad to hear you are OK. You seem to be working through it. xx Enjoy center parcs, it'll be fab!! Try to take pressure off of yourself xxx

OK, second date with gorgeous fireman next Sunday, My choice as I had things planned this week and big birthday party at weekend (have kids) for DD who is 5 and I dont want kids to see anyman I might date until I am very sure I wont have a "series of men" going through their lives. However gorgeous fireman has texted me 3 times a day and rung me each night since I saw him on Sunday. Totally cool! I think he might be a bit keen too! Early days and not thinking anything, but quite enjoying the excitement! PS he is a good kisser!!

IWMI, are you and your H having therapy? I would recommend it. My H is staying in our home for up to 3 nights a week atm and at his mums the rest of the time - we need to take things very slowly. My head is still all over the place, our counsellor likened it to being hit by a bus and it is going to take a long time to heal - I will have good days and bad days.

We are going to Centre Parcs next week so it will be interesting to see how we get along without any outside pressures.

Good luck.

Thank you ladies, you are very right, i have given it some thought today, he is meant to be over tonight, but as yet not heard from him, and it is time to move on, that is I stop standing still, if he wants to try and build bridges in the future then we can re assess then, but I have waited long enough.

Ok so sounds good to me, anyone what to tell H :-)

IWMI - sounds like a difficult time, at least he is talking, can understand him be careful about returning home and upsetting the children again, but it sounds like you are both putting in a lot of effort and see that as a positive.

I am sure your friends will rally round when your parents are away.

IWMI - good, sounds positive, a scary step i know but I hope all goes well for you both.

Eve - I think IWMI is right. You should live your life for you. Your DH knows the door is open for him but he is not really willing to come back at the moment is he. I am so not into game playing as I think it can be very very dangerous, but you have given him quite a bit of time now and he hasn't returned. Maybe if he sees you living your life independently of him, this may give him the kick up the bum to sort his needs & wants out?

I could be totally wrong but am just thinking out loud. I sometimes wonder if telling them we are waiting for themk and the door is open (which is exactly what I did so definitely not judging ) doesn't give them enough incentive to want to come back fully. You know if they thought they were going to lose what they had, then maybe they wouldn't take so much time to make their mind up.

Arrrrgggghhhhh!

He had the kids all day, made us all tea, was lovely to me, happy, fun, fixed my sink etc etc...

Then i asked ....................
He does want to come back, i said he could only come back if his mind was made up, not as part of the process as not fair on the kids. He does, i want him back (dont need him back) but we have a long way to go and this part seems just as scary as the break up. H realised that he felt the same about me all along but just couldnt see it, know what he means went through a long time of disliking him (but not enough to have a fling!).

Had to call my pal when he'd gone as dont trust myself to make rational judgements where hes concerned, needed a sounding board.

Feel lost and scared, can anyone fastfwd this bit?

My parents are off on hol for 4wks soon and will need to sit them and sis down for cards on the table time b4. It feels like to much to ask of them to support me in this but all i can do is try.(Havent spoken to sis yet!)

Semper - seems like you're doing the same, the move to friends will def help, just hang on in there til it happens.

Eve - cant support much(never did like the smell of coffee!) Keep trying to live your life 4 u, when you get to the point where you dont NEED him to have a life the confidence you exude might wake him up, then you decide.

Good luckxxx

Thanks WIMH

Ooh Eve, I am excited for you for Thursday! I know you are going into it with a heavy heart but think of it as just two people meeting up for a drink to see if they get on. It may not be what you want but if you get a confidence boost out of it then I don't see any harm!

By the way, the guy you are meeting is probably as nervous as you are. Just keep trying to focus on that. I sometimes get 'brainfreeze' when meeting new people, so maybe you could think of a few topics for discussion before you go?

I was trying to think of how I would be in that situation, you know meeting somebody new when I have been in a relationship so long and I honestly think I have lost the art of conversation!

WIMH - your future plans/ambitions sound great. China - wow - would love to do something like that. I think you should do it asap - see it as like peeling a layer of skin to reveal the new, improved version underneath. I once read somewhere that a psychologist recommended taking such a life changing holiday/adventure after the breakup of a long relationship. Apparently, he described it as a shock to the senses, being in an alien environment that makes you reassess & renew your outlook & let go of the past.

Where are we now? Well, we are still giving it a bloody good go. Things appear to be working but you never know do you. The same issues are there but we are trying to battle them together. We are due to move to a new posting soon but we have requested that the move date be brought forward as my DH is due to be sent on operation in autumn and we want to be in the new house way in advance of that so I am not left trying to sort it on my own.

The new area, I hope, will bring changes too. We are on a strange posting at the moment where none of the neighbours' husbands work together so not a lot of socialising amongst the wives occurs. I have literally spent the last 2 years with no friends, aquaintances, no nights out as no babysitters (apart from when family come to visit), with a husband who works ridiculous hours and is often away for days at a time. This has obviously had considerable impact on my personality and our relationship.

This new posting is with DH's battalion and I already know a couple of the wives there that I consider to be friends and so am hoping to have a few girls nights out & know that me & dh can go out too as I would feel comfortable leaving ds with the people I have mentioned. Whilst I know this won't solve our problems I am hoping it helps as I can at least have a bit of independence and start having fun again.

Wow - long post - sorry ladies. Will keep checking in! Take care all x

IWMI - how are things did you talk to your sister. It is so easy to bad mouth ex's because you think that is what people want to hear. I am sure a few gentle words would put it right

WIMH - I am so excited for you, I hope you re read the begining of this thread and see how far you have come. Well done you. You so deserve better - and a firmen.....

Thank you for the wise words from everyone - I know that We have our own hang ups. It can be hard to over coem them, but promise to be super confident me on Thursday - feel sick at the thought. Just hope it goes well.

H has phoned this afternoon, he doesn't feel well, so won't be over today, so he hasn't see or talked to his son for a week now. I just want to cry, he just can't anyone else before himself. I can see his true colours but so want him to be different so I can have my little family, but think it is slowly slipping away. Time I woke up and smelt the coffee hey!

whoops posted too early then, excuse half sentences and spelling of initiative!!

Hi Iwmi and Mavis

Good to hear from you both xx
Heh heh. Apparentl

It was one of my 20 yr old womanly ambitions (to shag date a fireman or policeman!!) Oooh perhaps before I'm old and reminiscing, I can have achieved both.

I have other ambitions as well, my list is getting longer, and includes things like
go to china,
go sailing for a weekend

All of which I can do earlier now i get time without children and dont have to drag H along.. I realised he has no initiate and all the social stuff we did was organised by me or someone else. I'm planning stuff for me and making it happen, I dont know how, just thinking through what I can do and seeing where the possibilities are. As a single woman, (i.e. flirt, flirt) things always seem to be easier to arrange somehow than when you're in a couple with a grumpy bastard!

Just quickly dropping in as ds2 is mid growth spurt and is feeding constantly. Just wanted to say

A FIREMAN??? Bloody hell, this thread is moving on

Good for you WIMH have a fabulous time.

Nothing new to report here. Still in limbo really. H going abroad in a few weeks time so I'm hoping that breathing space will be useful to both of us. If it's truly over I just want to move on. esp if there is the option of firemen

Hope all you ladies are having a good week.

Hi all!

WIMH - wow sounds fantastic! Enjoy every min on the new you!!!!

Will try and have a little word with my sis if anymore is said and go from there. Thanks for the advice - dont know about the list though a knowing her she will and it will be HUGE and i will be quizzed on it!! Hee Hee!!

He has kids 2moro all day so dont know whether he will want to stay and talk (properly) to me after. If not i will have to arrange a time with him i guess - want to know where his head is at after our revelations last wk.

EVE as a larger lady too i sympathise but have been going under a radical rethink of how i feel about myself as i came out from under the cloud that was my marriage. Now i hold my head up high, put my shoulders bk and wing it. But saying that the pretending you r happy in your own skin to begin with makes a difference and is becoming second nature for me now and i feel much happier and confident.

Good luck xx

semper you always impress me, as even with what you are going through, you're so wise x Good advice you gave to Eve and iwmi!

Well girls, another great day at work. How are you all doing.

Take it from me, if things dont work out with your Hs. There is life afterwards... Dont think about no one else wanting you as that's absolute rubbish. There is always someone else and he (or she!ike to be equal opp here) might be nicer!!

Hi all,

Been at work all day, dancing and singing. Was doing it friday before knew about my date anyway, so something has changed. H had kids all weekend, apparently DD2 was playing him up (like I'm bothered?!) but I danced the whole weekend away!! It was like my life before children. LOVED it. Can see the benefits for me of a break up.

Eve You are funny!! Honey you are gorgeous. You forget I've met you in RL! Yes you're curvy, so what?! That's what women are SUPPOSED TO BE!! Take it from me, skinny minny, LOTS of men prefer curvier women - I can be far too skinny for some men. It's really individual taste and about personality and how you see yourself too.

You are lively intelligent and have a real spark about you, I thought you were fab and a real woman. So will other men. Please dont ever appologise for the good catch that you are. Just because your H was being an idiot for a while, that doesnt mean other men will be.

(If it helps at all My sis in law is much bigger and she is single but has no end of men trying to shag her, constantly because she's confident & alluring and doesnt appologise for being a bigger woman. She has 4 or 5 boyfriends on the go at a time).

Too right honey, you go out. Dont tell him. All you are doing is living your life without endless reference to him, as you are not sure of him at the moment. It doesnt hurt to explore your options. It's not as if you are shagging another man, just meeting for a drink and chat.

WIMH - he sounds fabulous - so pleased you had a great time and if nothing comes of it, well you know you are 'out there' again and it takes away the old worry of will anybody ever want me - that it seems all 'left' wives go through. Yey - WIMH!

Eve - nobody should judge re: the heavier side and if they did then they aren't worth your time. Not all men like skinny minnies you know, and we all like to give ourselves a hard time over appearance ( I have an issue with my rather large huge nose) but you know what, it has never stopped me from forming relationships with men and when having honest chats with my DH he says he barely even notices it. What I am trying to say (rather ineloquently) is that we all give ourselves a hard time over our self perceived flaws and others barely even notice it, so remove that thought from your head young lady and have fun!

Family situation - I know that well - when my Mam got a little too critical of DH when he had split up, I just spoke to her calmly and said, I can understand your feelings as he has hurt me & you just want to protect me but criticism of him is not what I need to hear right now. She understood and left it alone - probably cost her dearly knowing my lovely --gobby- Mam!

WIMH - that is great, glad you had such a good time. Enjoy the company and the attention you deserve it. And don't feel guilty.

Been chatting to a few guys on web site, most of them loons, so not getting excited, feel sick at the thought. Chap who I have been talking to for a few weeks is without his children this week so was feeling a bit low, so suggested we go for a drink, told him to read nothing into it. I know I am not everyone's kinda girl being a little on the heavier side (i know people shouldn't judge but I know it isn't that great) so will see how it goes.

Just got to lie to H so he will babysit ha ha. I would tellhim the truth but I really want to see if he wants to try again.

Morning everyone :-)

Whereismumhiding - I've only posted once on this thread and just clicked on it to see how you are doing - And the answer is clearly fabulously!

Well done Enjoy your gorgeous fireman

OK, my secondly bit.....

WENT ON A DATE TODAY WITH A GORGEOUS FIREMAN!!!!!

CT10, didnt need condoms today, heh heh! Not quite that reckless that I'd sleep with him!!

But God, oh my God. He was lovely.
I just went on a date not expecting anything. Met him at beach, just thinking, I'll say hello for hour and bit, then head back home and get on with things at home. It'd be nice to have someone to go on the odd dinner date here and there with and maybe a bit of a flirt.

We spent SIX HOURS TOGETHER talking and chatting and got on amazingly well. We both had to literally drag ourselves away. He is was so funny, gorgeous and easy to be with.

I'm going to be careful. But... agreed to another date. He was SUCH a gentleman.

(AND he is DROP DEAD GORGEOUS, have I mentioned that?!!!)

Eve Blimey we cross posted - tell us MORE!!!

Hi MNs

Firstly iwmi good luck at Relate. I think it means, that you're getting a bit stronger underneath and it's not all about him and what he wants or thinks anymore. It's about you too.

Hmm, the sister issue. I think you could say to your sister that although you appreciate her support, it doesnt help at the moment to hear his negative points. That there might come a point when you will really need that so can she please save them up for you on a big list, but for the meantime it is unintentionally causing a bit of distress for you so could she just take her lead from you at the moment?

Eve how are you?
CT10 how has your weekend been?
All the other MNs, are you all OK. Would love to hear from you all about how things are going ...

Going to put another post on.... he heh!

OMG I have a date on Thursday....arhhhhhh

WIMH How exciting!

Wouldnt know where to begin myself so make sure you enjoy!

Spent the day together with kids at the beach, had a lovely time etc etc but not bothered when he left - dont really want him in my space at mo. Not sure what that means.

Is anyone else having family probs? My sis has been wonderful but as things get easier with me and h so she gets more outspoken about his bad points, i know them and dont want them rammed down my throat... also we all have negatives, i dont know it just makes me feel sad that its heading to a confrontation with her and yet i can honestly say i wouldnt have coped so well without her, any wise words?

He has kids all day tues again including sch runs, whiched caused a stir i can say
so maybe we can talk then as he said hed been thinking since weds relate, i just wonder what about?!

Good luck to all - another week on our 'journey' complete, another starting...

WIMH How exciting!

Wouldnt know where to begin myself so make sure you enjoy!

Spent the day together with kids at the beach, had a lovely time etc etc but not bothered when he left - dont really want him in my space at mo. Not sure what that means.

Is anyone else having family probs? My sis has been wonderful but as things get easier with me and h so she gets more outspoken about his bad points, i know them and dont want them rammed down my throat... also we all have negatives, i dont know it just makes me feel sad that its heading to a confrontation with her and yet i can honestly say i wouldnt have coped so well without her, any wise words?

He has kids all day tues again including sch runs, whiched caused a stir i can say
so maybe we can talk then as he said hed been thinking since weds relate, i just wonder what about?!

Good luck to all - another week on our 'journey' complete, another starting...

Go for it girl,let your hair down and have some fun. So jealous of your new found you - mine is just dreary!!!!! So must start doing something about that.

You go girl!!

You go for it WIMH - just remember the condoms !!!!!!

Glad you are having such great time atm - remember you deserve it. We all give up too much of ourselves when we become wives and mothers.

PS. I have wear matching slinky underwear now too. All the time. Amazing what a difference it makes..!!!

Don't feel like "just mum" anymore, am getting a bit of my life back with all this time I have off!!!!!!!!!!

Hee hee

I so want to!!!

But I'm aware that I'm a bit reckless at the moment, only treating things as fun... but hey..!!

wimh - do it do it do it!

It will boost your self esteem tremendously! As long as you go with the attitude that its just a bit of fun - what harm can be done?

HI MNs

Eve thanks- that's so sweet. I still have your coat in my car. When you're around next week, let's meet up xx Sounds promising.

Agree with you, we do deserve to be adored.

Keep going CT10, can you find some fun things for you to do on your own/with friends that will keep you going too ? xxx Nothing like a good boogie night out or some girlie giggles to lift your spirits when you need it xxx That's what's been helping me.

Infact, I am finding I am happier, more contented than I have been for years, strange eh? But I'm finding me and I'm fun, light hearted and warm and genuine. I'm not someone's servant, not just a mum and nothing else. And I think I can do better, be happier!!!

OK, I've filed for divorce. I'm pushing it through. H is erratic still, but hoping he will calm down now he is living in his own (3 bed!) house as he and tf wind each other up. I dont have any feelings, strong or otherwise when I see H now, he's becoming irrelevant (which is annoying him).

SOOOOOOO enjoying having a WHOLE weekend to myself. This is the MOST time off I have had in 7 years!!!!!!! It is such a tonic, like being in my 20s again (BK, before kids)

DCs still up and down, not sleeping well, but aside from that are doing great.

Had fab weekend, went out last night dancing in Southampton

Have been asked on 3 dates!! One of them is a smooth policeman, bit of a charmer so I know he is dangerous for me.

But I have written a list of all the things I want to do in the next 1-2 years, some that I'd always thought I'd do in my life before I got married. One of them is to go sailing all weekend (hence 2nd date offer!!), another is to paint some pictures for my house, go exploring some of the local cities near the coast here, to have long nails and paint my toenails regularly, grow my hair long; go away for a weekend to Bruges, go to London for the weekend for a show; buy a tent and go camping for a weekend; another is to go out with a devastatingly gorgeous policeman or fireman

I'm being a terrible flirt at the moment and sat with the policemen/firemen on a joint training course recently, I've forgotten what I was like "in action"!!! All subtle smiles and little in jokes!!!!

OK bit naughty (as I'm really only recently separated) but got asked on a date (no. 3 which I am seriously considering!!!) by (divorced) fireman (oooohh, 6' 2" tall dark handsome muscular in that way only fireman can be...) and he keeps texting me.... as he thinks I'm a doll!!!

Am feeling my will power weakenning as I think it might be better to wait a while longer. But then I'm not looking for long term thing, just think it might be fun to date a bit..!

What do you girls think?

Counting to 10 - sounds like you have dug deep and come through some difficult issues with each other - hope the week away gives you both the opportunity to spend quality time together.
WIMH - sorry to hear you have had a difficult few days - please do get in touch if I can do anything, just pop over for a chat or build a swing, I am happy to help. Hope this weekend is fun I know you had some plans to get out and let your hair down.

Some very wise workds from WIMH - I know I have to get a life, I just am so tired when DS isn't here I just sleep.

Spence came over last night at last min, which was nice he chose to come and see me rather than chilling out at base. I take it as a positive, he has also made plans with me for next week, out together tuesday night (babysitter needed) and An afternoon out with Ds and I to sea side weather permitting.

I know that I should not read to much into this, I am just waiting it out at this time, I hope that time will see him wanting to be with us more.

I am off to my sisters for the weekend so looking forward to a change of scenary.

Stay strong ladies - we deserve to be adored!!

Good morning everyone,

Sorry I have checked in for a while but I have been lurking unable to post.

I'm all at sea atm with everything that's been going on with H and Relate therapy. Finding it quite hard to cope atm with my head and 4 DC on my own. H has decided business needs his undivided attention as obviously it has been seriously neglected in the past 2 years and more recently last 2 months whilst he has been with OW - even managed to upset his last 2 remaining staff. HM Customs and Revenue are seriously on his back and all his chickens are coming home to roost!!! I understand why he is doing this but I could really do with some healing time with him. We are going to Centre Parcs in a week so we will see what that brings. He is still at his mum's btw.

Sorry everyone else is going through all this uncertainty too - it's really shite !

My mind has been mush - the therapy bringing out all sorts of things for both of us.

Take care everyone.

Hi MNs
Wow a lot has been happening with you lovely mums since I last logged in.

WDYAT Eve IWMI I am so sorry to hear your Hs have been so backwards and forwards and not fully there. It does seem like they want it both ways. You dont deserve it, remember it's nt you, it's them. You are lovely and kind and doing what a good mum is supposed to do.

I was given some advice early on in this thread, after he'd just walked out - about building my life separate to H - doing what I wanted and made me happy, finding the real me again & what I wanted (on my terms), enjoying the DC and getting out and about more. Then whatever H does, wont be as important, and he would be more likely to realise that what he was losing.

I wonder whether "moving on" in your head would help, put things more on your terms. Then if H sees you can manage without him, he would have to work harder to come back & not take you for granted as he might if you waited around for him. The other side of me thought at the time but oh no, if I let go to all the hope, the love goes, and we have nothing to keep us together, so I might make it more likely that we stay separate. I didnt know what was best to do at the time, except cling to some hope. That's all gone now.

But I really understand your dilemmas and want you to know that you will get through it xx You can do childbirth & sleep deprivation, look after children when you are ill, you can do this. If your relationship works out- that's brilliant- but if it doesnt, believe me that it's almost a relief once it's done and he's definitely gone. I think the dilemma stage is the most painful because it's so prolongued and confusing. I dont know if other MNs found the same?

Eve - reset up that date honey!!!!
Hobbies- oooh, but been card making, painting, writing, cycling, and lots more in time on my own. About to try to pick up dancing again...!

Generally I've had an up and down week. One of my worst days was Monday, but my friends (true angels) picked me up again and carried me until Wed when I got back to chirpy capable me again. Just spent tonight building DD2's birthday present in the garden- I bought a swing set on my own!!- with a friend's kind DH who she sent over to help me.

Will talk a bit more another day, been run off my feet the last week. Sending you all my thoughts and warmest wishes to keep you company in these hurtful times xxxxxx Keep strong xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Hi! Eve sorry youre having a tough time, texts rnt grt in some eyes but if its a way to say something scary and start a conversation then whos to complain? It was a brave one you sent there, not the ans you wanted but maybe while hes having his 'time' you can start getting your thoughts in order. Do you remember that beautiful south song (or are you too young) 'i need a little time'? The lyrics of that are constantly going round my head and are quite useful(?) when im feeling im having to wait for him all the time.

Relate was an eyeopener last night! Lots of deep hurts being aired by h and yet i didnt feel overly responsible (big shift in perspective there) or guilty.

Left with a big hug that niether wanted to end - which was nice. I aired my reservations about the next step - he wants to come round one evening and just veg - like we used to b4 he moved out! and pointed out we have spent a yr doing that and it wasnt good enough 4 him so he left - need more but not sure what that is or how we get there!

Spoke to him tonight and filled him in on my adventures - getting locked out and having to climb in through top window with aid of a giggling "friend" 2 toddlers and a baby! But i made it without killing myself or getting stuck - always a plus! Anyway after hed stopped laughing he told me hed done alot of thinking since last night which sounded positive. Am still looking forward to sunday 2gether

Relate lady and h had a long discussion about how much happier i looked and h said that was something he really wanted, but recognised how it had happened since hed left, feels a little threatened by that i think.

God i hope we can work this out!Still seems a long way off.

Take care all and xxx for all

Eve - Sorry your not getting to the bottom of things with your H. I just need time seems such a cop out dont you think. My H has used that line for the past 6 months! I never understand what the time is for either. Its like they want the best of both worlds the single life and then the wife and dc when they feel like it. Your H sounds like mine, he is going out with his so called mates all the time and then wants to have 'family' time (like he wants us all to go to the cinema one night this week-I dont see the point we are not together!)

Its took my H all this time to grow some balls and finally tell me what he wants but even now I still dont get him, he has been ringing me last few nights like nothing has changed and even asked what time we got up in the morning as he wanted to ring us then.

I really hope your H doesnt keep you hanging without an answer for too much longer like mine did.

Eve - so sorry you feel like you're being kept hanging round. I really don't know what the matter is with these men! Question is - how long do you wait?

H came back today from his weekend away and we had a good talk about stuff. It's great that we're still talking, I'm veering between thinking we should be able to sort things out to not being able to see how we could ever really get past our issues. I'm hoping Relate will help with that. Mind you when he complains about my apparent lack of spontenaity and general good-time-ness I can't help thinking "we've got a 3 yr old and a 9 week old - FFS, what do you expect???" Apparently it's my attitude to looking after the children, running the house and, oh yes, completing a degree in the evenings that's the problem there .

Hope you're all having a positive day.

IWMI how did it go today? Hope it opened some doors for you?
You are right we shouldn't settle for second best, I don't know why I am trying to hard to hang on to this relationship it was sucking the life out of me, but I hope if we both put some effort in it could be good again.

Well I did the UNbrave thing of sending H a text saying I was trying my best and it was obviously not good enough and I had lost the man I loved so very much.
He called and said were did that come from. I explained that he clearly did not want to be at home last night, ignoring me, and ds and I felt that he was just stringing me along.
He came back with I just need time.....
FFS - time for what! He was out last night with the boys has plans for the weekend he isn't interested in me or our son we come second to his life and plans, it isn't going to change, but hey i will wait and see got nothing much else going on at the moment..

Evening ladies, just a quick one as I need to get to bed before ds2 wakes up again! Just wanted to say good luck tomorrow IWMI, let us know how it goes at Relate. We have our first appointment in a couple of weeks.

Anyway, off to bed. Hope everyone is doing ok

Hi all!

So we r all in the same place again, isnt it odd the pattern we're all following. Do you think they have a hanbook we dont know about yet?!

H had kids all day, mucked up teatime by letting them have a picnic at 4pm, joined in and so didnt want to stay. Did at least have the grace to calm down the boys after they broke down when he was leaving. Glad hes seeing the hard times too.

Asked me to join them sun at seaside and then said something about seeing how we get on...

Feel i am on trial even more and then a little terrified he plans on moving back in - help!

I do want him back but need to hold out for some passion (one of the major probs in our relationship). am getting confused by myself - prehaps relate will help 2moro?

Semper/eve - i understand how you feel i spent a year walking on eggshells hoping i could change and fix it all. When he finally left it was such a relief and gave me the space to see it wasnt me who needed fixing or anything i could do on my own. It was h that decided that things werent right and left/ran away and our life (3 young kids, no money, no time etc) is the same and cant change yet so he has to do the accepting and growing up and adapting.

Hang in there and dont accept 2nd best, surely you/we deserve more after all we've gone through!

Good luck x

Eve that is what my H says when he told me he wanted us to try and was very half hearted in it(I now know it was because he was still seeing the OW) He says it was because he wanted to do the right thing. He says that this is the right thing for everyone concerned now and that I could meet someone who will whisk me and the dc away. He seems strangely ok with the idea of this but the reality would probally be different I am guessing! He says for him to do what he has done things were really wrong. Just wish he could have spoken to me about it at the time. Its not even a case in his mind, of it not being her it would have been anyone its her that matters to him. She comes above me and the dc all the time, its like some infatuation with the boss eyed ugly pig the ow.

I do see it as a fresh start, I have been going out on my DC free weekends with friends I havent seen in a long time and having fun.

I understand you dreading the conversation, think you need to get to the bottom of it sooner if it isnt feeling right. You have managed these last few weeks and proved that you can do it so you can definatly manage in the future on your own, if things do go that way. Make the most of child free time and go out and enjoy yourself or just enjoy being able to have lie ins and time for you.

WDYAT - so sorry that it has come to a head like it has, I think we are heading the same way, H is hanging on because it is the right thing to do but doesn't really want to try in his heart it has already died.
Hope you can see this a a fresh start. planning ahead what is right for you and the children. You are right H is no longer part of the family he made hisdecision and has to make his own plans and follow the consequencies.

I am so scared of having 'that' conversation,as i said I think in his heart it has died and there is no changing that - I am back to square one and not knowing how my life would be without him in it.

Back to the dating website for me then!!!!

Eve sorry to hear its not going how you want it too. I would talk to him and tell him straight he needs to make more effort if he wants to come back. I know just how awful it feels when you want to try and H doesnt seem to want it as much as you do. When my H told me we was trying he wasnt putting the effort in either.

My H had the end of he's week and then put off the talking bit. Eventually he told me that things are over, he cant ever see himself coming back as things have gone too far. He wants us to be friends, I just cant be friends with him right now. He cried and said he really wants us to stay friends. In time maybe but not right now. He is still seeing the ow. He wants us to do 'family' things together and told the eldest dc that we would all go out together one night after school this week. I cant see the point, it just confuses them. He thinks we will always be a family and says things like 'wdyat your not on your own I am here'. We are no longer a family, I am a single parent family and he is well an estranged dad I guess.

He hasnt acknowledged any letters from my solicitor as he hasnt had legal advice, to be honest it would have been better for him to sign the original letter. It was laid out quite clear that if he didnt things would be worse for him. That is his problem now. He wants us to sort out the bilss and debt as he cant keep paying the bills on the house. He finally has the life he has wanted for god knows how long, someone (ie he's mum) to do all his washing, cleaning, ironing and cooking and to do whatever he wants when he wants.

Hope everyone else on here is doing ok!

Semper glad you are ok, can understand how you are feeling, you are bending over backwards to ensure everything is 'purfect'.Life isn't like that it is full of ups and downs. Keep talking to him, hope he does his bit too.

Had a odd evening, h stayed last night, I couldn't sleep it was odd having him there, I kept thinking is this what I really want - couldn't answer it to be honest.

He kinda sloped off this morning, he was back this evening as I was baby sitting next door. he got back at 4 I got back after day out with DS at 6. I cooked, washed up, did 3 loads of washing put DS to bed, did pack lunches etc etc - you get the picture - he is not going to change he is not trying.

I get the feeling that he is just stringing me along til I get fed up and tell him to sling his hook.

Now what. He is back on Wednesday I think I am just going to have to have it out with him. He either comes home and trys or we make steps together and try or we go our seperate ways....

I just want to cry

Just checking in ladies

Eve - date, what date?

Think you are all doing fabulously.

DH & I are plodding along nicely at the mo. We had a good weekend with bbq's & visiting freinds etc, it was nice.

Still can't shake the insecurity that he may just up & off again at anytime he feels like it. Am trying hard not to walk on eggshells as I want him to be with me because he wants to, not because I am totally changing my personality to suit him & his wants.

Maybe I am overthinking things (another semper trait, I am afraid!)

Keep going all x

IWMI - glad you had a good couple of days. Sounds like you aremaking positive steps. It is hard, I keep thinking why do I want H back, he is lazy, shouts and never did much for DS or me.
I have forgotten the hurt I had a few weeks ago, but I know I want a chance for my family to work, if it doesn't at least we gave it our best shot. Although it seems fake.
I had a lovely weekend and slept loads. Got some work done and went out shopping...
Hope everyone else is ok.

Hi all, all seems to have calmed down a little with you. Mavis am glad you're getting some space from h.
Blimey eve hope you're family is coping! My h's brother left the same wkend as h but has gone straight to divorce talks with sis inlaw still reeling from the shock, their mum proved their upbringing by putting her head firmly in the sand!

Infact i spoke to her for the first time yest as she rang to thank me for letting the kids visit, know what she meant so was polite but didnt really have a choice!

Strange couple of days on my own, but saw lots of friends and had lots of jobs to do, kept busy. H also rang loads to tell me how they were getting on. Got back yest, he had them since thurs am, and thought i'd test him and asked if he wanted to stay for a bbq (I dont know how to use it!) and he did, was quite surprised as usually rushes off asap!

He is having kids tues as i have work and wants to stay and have something to eat with me, and we have relate weds, am feeling a bit hemmed in!

Supposed to be writing a list of things i want and want discussed but dont know how to start. Love him but now am getting other peoples point of view who knew us and am suprised at what a selfish git he came across as and how compliant i was - how do i go about sorting that one out?

On i go...

Evening ladies. WIMH, keep looking at the positives! I could have written half of your post, although everything (so far) is very amicable between H and I. I was messing about with ds1 earlier and realised that I was really happy and it only really mattered that I was there with the boys. I know that when H finally moves out properly I'll have that sadness but at the moment I feel strangely liberated. It's like I'd been waiting for years for H to change and now I don't have to put up with any nonsense anymore. H is so upset by the situation that he's gone to Barcelona to see a friend for the weekend so I've got a couple of days to myself.

Heaven know's what's in store in the future for me, not sure who may want a middle aged divorcee but I think we'll all be ok.

WIMH - what hobbies have you gone back to?

Eve - sorry to hear about your sister, sounds like she's well off out of it though. Does she have dc's?

Afternoon all.

Mavis - hope you are ok, it is a bit of a bind having DH in and out AM and PM can he perhaps come every other day?

WIMH - you have come such a long way, hang on in there, the children are a real credit to you. The hurt that someone can do this to you and your children is the hardest to come to terms with. We deserve better and in the future who knows what will happen.

Chickened out of the date!!!

I have had a really lazy day today - after wondering what I would do with DS I have discoved I can relax. I have Slept for 12 hours (shocking I know) and have just pottered about at home.

I really should go annd walk the dog now....

My sister has left her husband this week after 20 years together. I am so shocked, I thought they were so strong together. Am so angry on her bahlf he has been seeing someone else and has done it before.

Hi
Yup enjoying the sunshine. You sound stronger somehow Mavis. How are you feeling about it all?

I have this terrible sadness inside, where it has really dawned on me that this is it now, divorce papers are in (I filed them) and there is no going back to "before I knew". I understand now that this isnt a bad dream but the world that H really chose to drop the curtains to so that everyone could suddenly see who he really was, including me. The DCs are sensing it too as they keep saying, Daddy is diffrent now and dont want to stay with him as much as he wants them too. (I just reassure them that it'll be OK, they'll have fun, as cant risk his wrath if they say something accidently to him).

On the outside I'm doing really well though, everyone thinks I seem happy and more myself, but also more relaxed than I have done for ages. The Relate lady said I wasnt "squashed down" anymore and seemed to be more confident and coming out into myself. Those things are true. However, I can't quite come to terms with what a selfish piece of work H is, and who I have been living with and loving all those years.

I am so shocked at who he seems to be, he almost seems fake and empty. His behaviour now is tremendously petty - clearly stuck on believing the only important thing is what he wants. And doesnt care how it affects those around him. I have been starting to wonder if he is genuinely stupid or that self obsessed? Then he throws a vicious verbal attack each time he doesnt get what he wants and adds a few threats about money in.

It's like watching a bully at work who doesnt quite have the power he wants to have. It is really helping me step back and think, you are quite toxic to be around.

Aside from that I'm OK. Wondering if there is life out there after divorce, when you have 3 young children like I do. We do have a nice life all together and I'm managing well, with lots of friends around me. I'm picking up hobbies I used to have (BK, Before Kids) as I dont have to bend my life around H anymore. We're doing new things too, all on our own. It's nice to feel in control of your life and not beholden to anyone.

Evening all - what a lovely day today has been (weather wise that is) - I hope the sun has been shining on everyone else!

Eve - it's all sounding positive and as WIMH says you have to give it a shot as you've nothing to lose.

WIMH - hope the sunburn has calmed down and that you're enjoying some peace and quiet in the evenings.

Not much to report from here. Our intial appointment for Relate has come through although it's not for a couple of weeks. H is coming round every morning and evening just about so he can see the boys and to help with bedtimes/breakfasts although tbh I wish he's just stay away for a few days so I can get used to being on my own. He's not even packed a bag so it's like he's still living here. He's ususally away for work a lot so I'm used to toddler wrangling by myself, so I really don't need him to be here as much. Haven't said as much to him though, letting the novelty wear off for him then we can formally organise access.

Hope you all have a lovely weekend ladies

Well done IWMI I think not clinging onto H's ankles as he leaves begging him not to leave was a wise move. Showed remarkable restraint!! Sending you some hugs xxxx

Eve Yes, I think it is worth trying at least. What H did in walking out and talking to OW really hurt you, so you will feel less love. This is just my opinion, so feel free to ignore it or for someone else to say that's rubbish... but

Will he go to Relate with you for couples counselling? At least he is trying and he's talking to you openly. You have such a gorgeous DS and if you could work this out, you would regret (for you and for DS) not to at least sit it through, try where you are able to and see how it goes

What's the worst that could happen? You get hurt. Well, it hurts anyway when you lose your marriage - I think the regrets and going over and over what you could have done are part of that hurt, and I would love to have had that chance before it was too late - so honey what are you really going to lose by trying? And you can be careful and take it slowly so that you protect yourself.

If it doesnt work out after then, then at least you can look back with no regrets knowing you tried. xx

Besides you have new friends now, who are here with you xxxxxx Keep us updated xx

Evening all.

WIMH - hope the sunburn is ok, mine has gone a golden brown :-)

Hope everyone else is ok.

Spence came over this evening so we could spend sometime together, he said that he feels that we have building a better relationship but is not in a hurry to rush back home.
Told him not to leave it to long. We had a good talk about the things we felt hurt about and want to change.
I feel positive about the relationship, but don't feel the love I did, I think it might be a mistake to try again, but I am willing to try and build what we once had, Can it be done though?

Hi all
how are you all doing today?

Things are settling down for me. Ignoring most of what H is doing, which is working well for me. DCs are wonderful as usual. Getting everyone to bed, and having a bit of time to myself in the eveninngs. Tonight we had a treat and watched Enchanted before bedtime with doughnuts!

Like Eve I got sunburnt on Monday. ankles and nose - ooouch! It's gonna be a warm weekend - cool

Mavis hope you got baba to sleep - it takes ages doesnt it, im on dc3 and back to "what do i do when they refuse to eat anything other than bananas?" - have given up!!!

Had friends round today, they were excellent and made me write things down, then 1 rang while he was here to remind me to b strong.
So i was and it was awful! Have apparently got wrong end of stck again and he hasnt yet decided whether he wants to come home. I realise things have to change but now feel i am still on trial - v hard, not up to going all through it now, v tired and my sis popped in unexpected
and just left, way past my bedtime!

Anyhow h left after a big hug and me in tears but i did resist clinging to his ankles and begging him to come home!

Am off to sleep on it and hope all will magically make sense in the morning.
Eve hope things went better with you x

Ooooh Eve that sounds hopeful. xxx
Sorry drove past your house twice today and forgot to drop your coat off! Argh...! My memory is appalling at the moment, at least I remembered to collect all 3 DCs! Will try again tomorrow if you're around...!

Mavis glad you're OK. Bit sad for you that you've come to realisation that you're at Relate to have amicable split rather than work on it. It seems daunting when there are som many problems. Sometimes I think we feel we need to focus on the problems rather than focus on building the good bits - and the problems then become less insurmountable once you have the good will and love back. I dont know, I'm not in a position to be an expert in relationships as mine is gone but I guess underneath it feels that's an easier way to tackle something. Small steps, changing focus... Good luck anyway. let us know how Relate goes for you xxxx Glad you told your parents and tht they've been supportive xxx

I've been to Relate on my own tonight. Feeling OK. Amazing how much more capable and together I'm feeling. Relate counsellor said it was liked I was squashed down before and now I'm bouncing back into me. That was quite nice.

Best go to bed, DCs are finally sleeping tonight, we've had shenanigans - up and down each evening /night - over weekend as it was H's weekend so he had them until after tea each day. Hoping DCs settle down with it all soon as I'd like to have some time/sleep to myself!!!

Evening mavis, you sound so strong. Relate is a really good idea (I should take my own advice there)as my dad said to me prepare for the worst, hope for the best. You are hurt and trust is a big thing in a relationship. It can be built on if you both wish too. But also an amicably split is a good way forward for you and you can be in control.

So glad you have told your parents.

Well as for me he showed up this evening and we had a pleasant evening with DS.

We had a chat about a few things and I explained that certain things don't add up. He reasured me that there is only me, that the other girl is just someone to talk to. That he has been working etc etc and he is hurt that I don't trust him.

We talked and I said that he had to see it from my point of view.

He said that he wanted time, and I was doing all the right things....

So back to square 1 - and I don't have a clue what is going on..

Hello all, quick update from me - just put ds2 down and I don't think he'll stay down so will respond to everyone later if you don't mind!

DS's 3rd birthday yesterday which was nice. Had MIL up to stay so myself and H managed to get a little bit of time together to talk. We're going to go to Relate although I think it will be able to help us split amicably rather than for reconciliation. I've told him that I just don't trust him to not do this again, and we both agree that if there is any chance of us being together there is loads of work to do. If I'm honest, the more I think about our relationship the less I think we can ever make it work.

I told my parents over the weekend and they were lovely and extremely supportive. H is still coming over to do bed times and breakfasts and so it doesn't really feel like he's moved out. He's away for work for six weeks soon so I think I'll be able to get into my single person stride then. Until then it all feels a bit unreal still.

anyway, I hope everyone is doing ok - I will go and catch up on the thread now and hopefully ds2 will stay asleep - I've not been able to get him down before 10pm the last few nights - I'd forgotten about the 'just how do you get a baby to go to sleep?' thing!

forgot to say ouchy ouchy sun burn.....

wDYAT - understand just how you feel, although onyl been 5/6 weeks for me, it is a simple decision if you ask me your family and some hard work, or your bit of skirt and little contact with your children.

I don't see it as a hard decision, but they want their cake and eat it.

I have decided today - so far that I will talk to him this week, he is with his dad at the weekend and then tell him next week that I have moved on emotionally. I don't want someone iin my life who othinkns they can treat me like this. I deserve more.

WIMH - you go girl. Let your hair down and see what happens.

IWMI - ok how about just out of the shower with just a towel wrapped round you????

Been reading but not posting, this is moving so quick now that I am struggling to remember who has done what!!

Semper good luck with your H hope it works out for you both.

WIMH, Your sounding so much stronger now. You have moved forward so much well done you! Hope you have fun on your girls night out. I have had a few nights out now with friends and have had so much fun. Not done anything with anyone but had some male attention which has been nice .

IWMI, Its hard not to say all them things to your h when thats the way you feel as you just want them to know dont you.

Well I had my solicitors appointment and seeing as my h has not even acknowledged any of the letters he has recieved now have to divorce on unreasonable behaviour. Felt like she was twisting things I was saying to get something on him iykwim. We will see if he buries his head in the sand when he gets the petition just glad I get to see it first. Hope my solicitor pulls her finger out and gets it done this week.

Things have been fairly strained between us the last few days with him putting phone down on me etc when I rang to see how kids were(it was his weekend). He wanted his 'week' to think then told me half way through that he was still in contact and seeing the ow. He wanted no contact with either of us, not quite so simple when you have 3 dc but he didnt see it that way. He rang last night and told me today is 'd-day' and laughed? Things were left just that he would ring me today. To be honest I am so fed up of all the dithering and dont see the point in any of it, he has had 5 months to think about things and done nothing. Just when I think I am getting on with things up he pops with things like 'give me a week'.

I am pretty certain that the outcome of it will be the ow (or yet more dithering!) and although I dont want to accept him being with her I dont think I could have him back now. I have read the texts he was sending her and its just too much to get my head round (him saying how it feels so right with her and dont WANT to stop it all). Too much time has passed with no positive actions from him I am getting out and about and having fun. Life looks brighter, sure I still have bad days but I dont think I miss him as a person its just the having someone there.

Good luck girls with your dastardly knock'em dead plans. I always go for the wearing matching underwear under my cool jeans and a top that fits nicely. Oh and heels so that I wiggle a bit.

Not that I am putting any of that effort H's way, he's off my radar, but funnily enough I'm dressing up for work and when I go out a bit more. Have a girls night out in 2 weeks, with friends, plan to have a couple drinks and good boogie. Think about whether I might try a date or two.... Bit quick really but there's probably no harm in having a bit of innocent fun (no late night cups of coffee if you see what I mean...!)

I can't believe I'm even thinking it, but it shows that I'm seeing me as an individual who's no longer under H's control. Oooh it's like being back at university again...!

Been doing that but no reaction at all!

Wood...

Wear your best under wear, clothes you know you look good in, make up etc etc. Be sexy be confident and see him fall to his knees. I have got H on and back foot on that front, but he doesn't want to confuse sex for love.....doesn't bloody stop him trying though.

Eve - know that feeling, infact commiserated with him 4 marrying such an idiot in our one and only row b4 he left!

But your not, remember that and taking the initiative and confronting him will re address the power (yes realise i need to take my own advice, but am a wimp!)

H also here 2moro to but kids 2 bed and have a chat - will log on after and swap notes!

Quick question to all any advice on how i tell him i need some loving feelings and actions without coming across as needy and desperate? Am not when on own but with him i just want to beg, need to be able to stay in control a bit more.

IWMI - I am thinking he thinks I am a bit thick. We will see, he is here tomorrow to put DS to bed. I am trying to get a baby sitter for Thursday so think I will wait til then to talk to him, he is off to his mum's Fri and his dad wants to have a chat with him. Feel like I am being taken for a fool.

Also much better 2day, went out on my dads boat with boys and mum had baby - just cant understand why every adventure with my dad has to include a near death experiance!

But all had a grt time and baby so happy to see us all she could stop waving, does make me feel so lucky - blessings to count etc! H is a sunlover but had to stay in all day as burnt yest, or so he says, hee hee!

Eve and WIMH glad you had a good time at the beach, the little things are so special when the dcs are small arent they.

Semper - yes of course you need to try and to give it your best shot xxxx

Good luck semper and stay strong, hope it goes well!

Eve - is he just taking the piss? Do you need to spell out what you expect and dont? I had to point out that his "friend" was no friend of mine or therefore ours (twice!). Relate put it better she told me that a relationship/friendship where one of the couple is excluded is an affair! H finally gave it up then.
R u going to counselling?

He came over sun for kids, told me we would talk but i have to ask again!

Christ sometimes i think i've married a lump of wood!

Semper Hooray!! Am so delighted for you, that is just such wonderful news. Really hope things go OK, at least he has come home to work on it together with you. Brilliant xxxxxx

IWMI Mavis hi - hope you are both hanging in there. Dont forget we're all here together xxx Good to start finding your feet, as you have to start thinking about you first and foremost. I wish I had understood that earlier, but I do now. It does help. If you can do things that make you happy, then DCs benefit too. xxxx Hee hee liked the ideas of things to do when you're angry , perhaps we could write a list together (not that I'd do anything but nice to dream..!)

Eve- great to see you today (Eve and I found out we live in the same town and went to the beach with our DCs today!! Built sandcastles, water forts and pretty much chilled out whilst baby ate the sand and our kids rumbled round together! we were all wellied up ready for rainy day on beach and glorious sun came out . Had such a lovely day!). PS you didnt go on about H, you & J were delightful company xxxx

Semper - that is great news, just take each day as it comes. I hope that you get the loving husband and father you deserve. I have everything crossed for you

IWMI - glad you have a girly weekend planned, sounds great. Sorry you have had a tough couple of days.it is so confusing, we want what we had, but remember the sad times and wonder why we want these men back....

WIMH - Good to see you today, we had a wonderful time and sorry I waffled on about H.

Mavis - how are you to day?

As for me, I am no further forward, DP went off all dressed up Sat night,fishing with no fishing stuff sun, and working today, but when asked on the hop was swimming and seeing a friends.....

then I get a text saying he is missing us, and wants us to go out one night this week. When put on the spot, can't do wed working late tomorrow.....

Grrrrrr just going to have to bite the bullet and ask if he is seeing his 'friend' I am trying to give him time and space,but my mind is thinking the worst of him all the time and the longer he is not here the more resentful of him I get.

Oh, I also wanted to say that I am also aware that this could go belly up too. I'm not expecting it to all just be better and am aware that it still may not work, but I have to try, yes?

xxx

Hi ladies,

Just wanted to update you all. DH came back yesterday! He said that although there has ben no lightbulb moment for him where he realised that leaving was wrong, he said he knew that a lot of our problems were down to external influences and that he would regret it forever if he didn't come back and work on fixing things. He said that I was right all along that we should be joining together to beat our difficulties, it just took him longer to realise.

I spelled out what I needed from him in terms of behaiours that were leading me to nag in the first place and he agreed with what I said.

We had a lovely evening yesterday where he bought me wine & chocs and was very attentive. We have all just been in the garden today enjoying the sunshine and each others company as it felt a little awkward at times. Suppose that is only normal as he has been away for nearly a week.

I still feel insecure though as I still feel upset that he left. But I suppose that is normal too and I have to practice what I preach and try & forget it.

I would love to stay on this thread if thats okay? So I can find out how you all are. You have all been great and this thread has given me a real feeling of companionship over the past few days amongst women who were going through the same emotions as myself.

I really do hope that you are having a better day WIMH. You have amazed me with your strength of mind over the past few days. Eve - keep on going, you said you have nothing without him but you do, you have your DS and sound like a lovng person wanting to do right by her family. Mavis - again, I second your hope for a fabulously sorted life by your 40th birthday.

IWMI - Can understand that the wedding must have been hard. You know that you are wearing nice undies tho - and you never know who you are going to meet and when .

All others too - keep swimming.

xxx

Hi all, a few tough days been going on again. I did ring h the other night, felt very pleased with self 4 being assertive!

Realise am still in danger of being a doormat where hes concerned but battling that one.

Spent last 2 days feeling so sad, even had a little cry. Went 2 best friends wedding all doled up and felt grt but surrounded by love. Held it together but hangover next day mixed with a v dark depression, even felt sad today when buying new bras - atleast the lady in debenhams liked them, noone else will see them at this rate!!!!

WIMH - have a plan, post poo through letterbox or wasps or maybe not! But plotting when angry might lighten the mood!

Poor dcs theyre having such a hard time, birthdays mucked about etc its just not fair. Dc2 sobbing when daddy goes home, dc3 teething and dc1 joining in i put all 2 bed early tonight and just sat trying to assemble my thoughts, no easy task. Why do i rely so much on him? why do i want him back? Havent really seen the changes i was hoping for, says he misses us, me etc but not really banging door down! Dont know if i have the strength to hold out 4 what i want, need counselling, relate keeps cancelling and moving appts. Hes taking all 3 dcs to his mums thurs-sat, 3hrs drive away and has said twice im welcome but have refused, have made lots of girl plans and not cancelling, but dont want him to miss out on kids overnight, out of thier home. Very selfish i know but he needs to take a bit more responsibility without me bailing him out constantly, i dont know maybe thats wrong?

Mavis, hi and so sad to hear from you, you sound like youre on autopilot at the mo, hope/wish that youre hvisitor is as grt as mine was, just say yes to all offers of support even if it arrives when youre on a good day, theyll b there then on a not so grt day and so will we (if i can get my bloody computer 2 work!)

Take care all x

WIMH - Sounds like you have had a bit of a tough day? It is so hard, we just want the happy H back that we were in love with and had a family with. I hate the thought that he has seen me at my most vulnerable and now has just pissed all over me (sorry for swearing)
He was/is my world and he doesn't give two hoots about me and DS he has gone off and done his own thing without a care for me and what I am up too.
Do I really want this man in my life? We have had some very tough times, his parenting is not like mine, he shouts and swears talks to be like crap, does nothing around the house and goes off and does his own thing most of the time, so why am I fighting for this rubbish relationship because I was ready to walk last year.
I try to hang on to the fact that he put him self before his son, and for me that is unforgivable. It still hurts.
Well done you for having a look at the website, I have had a little look too. So watch this space,we night get the man we deserve rather than these waste of space people we call H. x

so sorry to hear whats happened. ~I havebeen though the same and its horrible. ?You will get through this.. for your kids if nothing else. You are not alone ,, it is happening all the time. I was in bits when my ex left, I couldnt eat,, sleep and lost about a stone during the next two months. People in happy relationships dont know how lucky they are. I am in one now but it bloody hurts when the father of your kids buggers off. I wish you well and lots of hugs, hugs, hugs. /Keep strong and see your friends as much as possible. Remember....NOTHING STAYS THE SAME FOREVER AND ONE DAY YOU WILL BE HAPPY AGAIN. lots of love and support here. !! xx

Back again now. No one else around today?
Had an OK day. Am doing OK. Spoke with H earlier, as problems with DC. (DD2 came home "starving" again, as "daddy didnt feed her" I think she might be playing us up, as DS1 tells me he did check she had eaten enough - apparently they had salmon, prawns and macaroni cheese for tea !! - and H spoke to her as well on the phone and I heard him remind her he had checked she had eaten enough. Will leave it up to him to sort out with her, as clearly they have an issue).

But also DC3 baby had new big bump and bruise on her forehead, but H didnt recall her banging her head anytime except for "maybe at 3.30 when she fell off a step". At least he's able to talk normally with me now, rather than go off the deep end, as he is realising I'm not accusing him of anything but just wanting to know what happenned and when, so i can keep eye on DCs if need be afterwards.

Anyway, talking to him when he is normal, reminds me who he used to be. Then I get this pang of sadness that he cant be like that all the time. It's almost as if he's two different people. Gonna try and remind myself all the horrible things he has done since to remind me how appalling he is underneath. It's hard to do this isnt it?
The everything has changed but nothing has changed (when you're talking normally).

What am I supposed to do as the abandonned wife? The DCs were talking about meeting tossfriends new girlfriend (the one he left his wife for, over a year 1/2 ago) and how she seemed nice and daddy gave her a hug.

It makes me mad as H is being such a hypocrite as he was so scathing of her before. But also, it reminds me that H will soon, if he hasnt already, get a new girlfriend and want to bring them into my DCs life. I dont want to have to cross that bridge. I want him to stay on his own forever more and be sad and lonely. Not being reasonable am I?

Hi Mavis glad you're feeling ok. Somehow in the midst of all the heartache, there's a sense of relief when you've been having arguements and you suddenly have peace and quiet.

It does help if H behave really badly as it makes you see that they really arent good enough for you. The more tey just cut off, though it's harder in the beginning as you dont understand to start off with, it somehow makes it easier to think about a future without them and moving on. Because what you had (old H) simply doesnt exist anymore. And you dont like the "new disimproved H". My H is probably doing everything he possibly can to make me see him for the warped terrible excuse for a human being that he is. I wonder how he covered it up for so long. He really has nothing to recommend him.

It's harder when the Hs are confused and come and go more, like some of the other MNs Hs are. As it's holding onto hope that slowly gets you. I imagine it's worth it, if the Hs do sort themselves out and return to the men they were, that your relationship is better as a result. But boy, not easy getting through the days not knowing.

I cant see how things would ever ever ever work out between my H and I. I wouldnt ever want him in my life, not as a partner and never ever as a friend again. I have much better choice in friends!!! 21 years we've been friends and I had no idea he was such a selfish controlling shit. He's not good enough for me or good enough for my DC.

Unfortunately it's not up to us mums to decide who the father of our DCs are once they're here, so I'm stuck with him in a small way staying in my life. All I can do is support the DC, ensure H is able to see them regularly as his dad and trust that the DC will be able to make their own minds up about their Dad as they grow up. I hope none of them take after him as he is seriously fucked up and flawed.

I confess I do resent the influence he might have on them, given how awful a human being he is showing himself to truly be. But then, that's to me, hoping he isnt behaving the same to them. They have told me he has said a few terrible things to them, so I hope that stops soon. Nasty piece of work.

I've decided I'm rarely going to ring my SIL anymore as some of the things she says are clearly from another agenda, and I think she has invented a few things, so I'm not sure about her anymore. Some of it seems to be about my "understanding" H so that I feel sorry for him (!!!!???)) . She still thinks he's an idiot for leaving and that he didnt need to do any of this.

But it's his problem now. He will have to make his own effort with the DC and will soon get fed up. I wonder how long he will be able to keep it up, I get more of a rest now than I ever did.

He looks so ugly to me now, I cant see what I ever saw in him at all. I'm quite pretty, warm and kind, and I have found out how many friends I have down here and how few he has.

morning all, one handed typing again as i'm feeding ds2(it's the only time i get to mn!)

wimh and eve - hope you get to the beach tomorrow - it really helps when the sun is shining, makes all the crap a little more positive.

I'm still feeling strangely ok this morning. I'm sure I've got to crash at some point but just riding the ok feeling for the time being. H has taken ds1 out shopping for his birthday today and his mother arrives later. h'es still staying with a friend so I have to do the entertaining for the next couple of days. we'll see how that goes.

wimh - you're doing brilliantly - just compare your op with where you are now. your h is being such a tosser but as you say it won't last. I think these 'men' just get bored and if the situation doesn't suit them then off they go. lets hope there are decent men out there - at this stage my hopes aren't high but there is no way my life is over. I think we're the same age wimh (38?) - let's have fabulously sorted lives by our fortieth birthdays!

Oooh, just looked on parentsalready to see if it was worth joining at some point in the future, as my friend (tossfriend's wife) met her lovely boyfriend on there. He's much better than tossfriend ever was, better looking and kinder. She's very happy with him.

Jumping a bit ahead of myself, but starting to feel H is such a changed man that I am glad he is out of my life. Also thinking that when things settle for me, I'd like to see if there is anyone else out there that would suit the DCs and I better.

Probably racing ahead of myself. But I'm not one for jumping into things fully, I like to dip my toe and think about it....!!!

Cool, I'll text you a bit later. xx

Ah, yes Eve, he's a bit too impulsive for his own good- doesnt see the bigger picture. Tho I imagine he'll go straight to the shops (tho it's 9.15am so some wont be open yet) to buy another pushchair- one that is "cool" enough for him!!! If he wants to waste £50 of his money, he is welcome to!

I dont think he has any idea how much money the solicitors & mediation are going to cost him. Am hoping I get legal aid for mediation too as that would be sweet! I think he could run up thousands of pounds of legal fees without realising it.

Serves him right for being an idiot. If he were nicer and more reasonable then we could deal with things so much easier, less stressful and cheaper all round. But - hey ho- not my concern, he is reaping what he sows!!

That sounds lovely - yes please...x

Eve - if weather is nice, was thinking of going down to the beach on Monday with DCs (they're with H today as it's "his weekend" but back with me tomorrow). Do you fancy joining us?

WISM - well done you. He will struggle today then.

Hah Hah.
H just turned up 30 mins late to have DC this morning - probably had a "heavy" night. He was so annoying yesterday, he asked me if he could have the pushchair (maclaren) that i use instead of the slightly larger (still umbrella) bright pink one. I said the same thing to him this morning as he said to me yesterday, "Oh well I had better things to do (than hunt out another pushchair)" when he asked about me swopping the pushchairs over. So he's just driven off leaving it behind in the drive - so H has 3 children including a one year old baby with no pushchair!!!!

Serves him right. He can go to the shops to buy another puschair. What a tosser?! He doesnt like the pink pushchair as it's a bright colour and apparently rattles round in the boot of his convertable, so he'd rather DC3 had to walk or be carried than take it!!! Our smallest one, a red one i think was stolen, it had been left it out for him to collect - he told me later he hadnt taken it but I never saw it again.

I know it's petty, but really I'd rather not get involved in his little idiosyncracies as they are so pathetic. I used to used work around him all the time, now I think, he you are, deal with it or dont deal with it - it's your problem not mine.

Morning all,

WIMH - good advice from - grey clay. Take each day as it comes. I live in hope that this hurt will lessen for all of us. Right now it is still very raw.

MAvis - well done you for being so strong.

Semper - how are you feeling this morning?

Me - I still feel like shit - I am sure he is with his friend haveing a relaxing weekend, whilst i am here up at 6.30 wet bed wondering what I am going to do to fill the next 2 days on my own.

Mavis you sound so strong and together although it's only been a week. So he thinks "there have been problems for years"... same as my H said. And probably every other ones. Dont believe him. He's trying to find faults in you/your relationship to justify it all to himself and he'll keep repeating it. Just tell yourself he is being a shit right now and everything he says to you is his twisted version to make himself feel more righteous and that he didnt have a choice.

He did have a choice. He could have told you where there were issues and worked on them with you, like normal people do in normal relationships. You're not teenagers for christ sake, you are two adults who were married/partners and have two babies together. He needed to be an adult, not a sulky kevin the teenager who keeps things to himself so you cant work on them together as it's both your responsibilities, and then storms out later on saying well it couldnt be helped. Tosser.

Frankly they're all tossers. They are the losers in this as they have no character and no reason just enough to explain how appalling they are behaving right now.

I definitely think there is a better life out there for me, perhaps even a better man, than this loser I married who covered up some serious personality flaws for so long.
I hope your H comes round and realises he's being an idiot.

Greyclay thank-you, I needed to hear that. I read your post over and over - it helps that it's not just me that thinks he is being a shit. I have this whole house to run on my own (he was good at DIY), he's left it in a state, half finished jobs, no carpet on stairs, wonky floorboards, a drain outside that keeps blocking, damp problem by the front door, and I also have three young children to look after, I work and I have our whole lives to run. All he's doing is popping in and out when it suits him and playing arsey games as if I havent better things to have to deal with.

I have been trying the his life isnt my interest approach, but as he is staying so close, so much of it overlaps. I keep asking my friends and the DCs not to tell me anything. At least H's sis thinks he wont stay in the area for long as he works in London and is likely to change jobs in a year and a half anyway (he changes jobs evry 2-3 years to get promotions/pay increase and as he's easily bored). I also think he cant keep up the every wed aft leaving work early that he is insisting on doing to collect the kids at 5 - as I dont think it's a long term plan with his work or any of his type of jobs. Keep telling myself, sit it out, sit it out, he cant keep it up.

But I dont know if I can bear to have him live so close to me for even a year. I'm telling myself, give it a year, if it's still unbearable and he has renewed his 6 month contract at house round the corner, then I will start looking to move to west country where I know he cant follow (too far commute for all the FTSE100 company IT jobs he likes). It's difficult to have such a bully get his own way and dominate our lives as much as he does. I want to be able to get away and take the choice away from him, but it isnt what is best for my DC, so guess I have to try to live around it.

Hi WIMH - Your H is being (expletives). Of course your need more space for him because it will help YOU in your healing process. Of course he is renting a street away from you and being cagey about his own (expletive) address because he is still trying to control the split from his family (and the universe). I'm about to buy a ticket to the UK and move in next to him so I can be the worst neighbor he's ever had.

Ok, deep breath. The fact of the matter is, even if you move to another town, he will make it difficult for you and make it your fault (i.e. how dare you take my children from me). I'm afraid, you are going to have to weather this storm, for that is what it is. Pretend you are not interested in any aspect of his life (where he is, what he's doing). It will take power away from him. I know you have a vested interest in your children maintaining a relationship with him which is a very healthy thing to do. You can facilitate this but the rest is his responsibility. Start detaching contact from him as much as is feasible (I know it seems impossible at this stage) but the more you do that, the better you will start feeling, the more your kids will be ok with continuing their relationship with him (and not be in the middle) and the more he will flounder on his own.

He is not your problem anymore (his worries, feelings, strange rashes). He is your kid's dad. You are their Mom. And you will soon have your own life with them that is separate and distinct from his.

Keep going, you are doing great. The most powerful thing you can do now is start cutting the cord that attaches you to him. Divorce proceedings are a start.

Hi folks,

Have just spent bets part of an hour reading this thread. Wanted to send you all love and luck.

Can;t believe what utter wanking bastards these men are. DOn';t know how I would cope, you are all such fabulous women.

8 weeks?!?!?!?!?

You sound very strong & calm. I'm off to bed shortly but wanted to respond before I did so.

Great mantra - will repeat it to myself in bed tonight. Take care and hopefully we will all check in with each other tomorrow.

he says a split was inevitable and that things haven't been right for years. Things have come to a head now as we were due to move abroad and he feels that he didn't want to go and then split up. how thoughtful. mind you he also says he doesn't want to talk about it as he will realise he still loves me and that will make it harder to leave .

at least I have my sons and yes it's shitty that he's chosen now to go but ds2 will never know any different and ds1 will forget this time. I really feel for those of you that have older children who are having to go through the whole 'daddy isn't living here anymore' thing. H is away a lot for work so the impact on ds1 will be lessened.

he's the loser here. I suppose this should be our mantra on the bad days.

Oh Mavis - 8 weeks, I know there is no right time to leave someone but

How are you and the little one's? Such an amazing time yet so traumatic for him to do this right now.

Has he given any reasons? Just that things weren't great?

Semper - thanks for the welcome. I've told a couple of friends but haven't spoken to many yet as it's ds1 3rd birthday next week and H is coming to the party. It will just be easier if people don't know yet. I do have my MIL arriving tnorrow who knows about the situation and who isn't best pleased with her son.

It's a bit weird, I haven't really cried at all - I think I must be in shock. I just keep thinking of practicalities with an occasional "what the hell am I going to do moment". shock or denial.

and 'scuse crap typing ds2 will not go to sleep and is still sat on my lap. what shit timing my H has.

WIMH - it's the MN thread you don't want to join isn't it!

I had been following your story before it all happened here and I am taking inspiration in how far you've come in such a short time - much lol at the likelihood of your H been posted somewhere mosquito infested when he works for M&S.

I really don't know how my parents are going to react - I strongly suspect that they will be supportive and (obviously) hugely critical of H however I don't think I want to hear a tirade against him just yet. He was always a bit of a wild card in my parents eyes and I think it could easily turn into an 'I told you so' type of thing. I've spoken to my sister and I have a really good support network of friends. I suppose I feel like this is a failure on my part even though he's taking responsibility for it. At least my dc's are too small to initially be really badly effected.

I'm currently at the stage where I'm convinced he's having some mid-life crisis - sure things weren't great but they were no worse than a lot of my friends marriages. However if he's made his decision then I suppose I have to move on. And that's hard.

Hi Mavis - welcome. So wish you didn't have to join us posting about the basta*rds we seem to have married. Think I am starting to get to the angry stage so excuse the swearing - I am not normally so expletive. I am at the nearly a week stage and have cried, cried, cried, hardly eaten, smoked far too many cigarettes (despite giving up) and seem to change from one mood to another in rapid succession. Keep posting. Have you friends around who can help out seeing as you don't want to tell your parents?

Eve - you do have a life without him - you have your ds. I am so sorry he seems to be toing & froing like he is. I don't know if thats worse to be honest, to see that glimmer of hope, then for him to still not know what he wants.

DH has been away for nearly a week, needing space and whilst I respect that we have had a hard time and this may do us good, I am also angry as I know that no matter what (excluding infidelity) that I would never leave him for that amount of time while I thought about what I wanted.

I know its only a week but I feel like screaming, how much longer do you need to decide if you want to be married to me or not? Am I that unlovable? I think I am being unreasonable in thinking this so have not voiced it to dh - just venting on here. Am still hoping it turns out the way I want and we are together working on our problems.

WIMH - he is definitely being a prize knobjo*key (there I go with the swearing again - so sorry). He has no right to crash your plans for dds birthday. It would be wrong to deny him the opportunity to celebrate her birthday with her but you aren't doing that. DD has said she would like to go for a special dinner with him so why cam't he just do that without sabotaging your plans. Has he not thought of your DD in all this? That it would be hard for her to have him just turn up at a party and for him to make her Mum uncomfortable? Selfish selfish man.

The mind boggles with the lawnmower thing. Is he trying to prove a point? Am .

I really don't know, yet again, he has gone off, no text or anything, I am not making the first move again. I will wait to hear from him as painful as it is.

Just had MIL on phone, she is going to call him tomorrow and see 'what he is up too' Best just to leave it a lone. He is in Notts next weekend, so they are going to talk to him, I told her it isn't anything that hasn't already been said.

I feel in my gut that it is completely over, as much as it breaks my heart, I just don't know how I will get on without him.

WISM if your children are with their dad again next weekend I have a DS free weekend too, if you fancy catching up?

Mavis so sorry you joined us. YOur children as so young, 8 weeks??? What is wrong with the man?? What is wrong with these H???? Are you OK? Would your parents be supportive? If they would please please ring them, or ring someone to come round an

Eve - sorry I cross posted with both of you. I hope so too, as that would just be awful for him to spoil her birthday. Yes, it is so confusing that he's changed. Do you really think your H is out with his "new friend" this weekend? Does he not have any fishing gear elsewhere? Pretty rubbish cover to use if he just left it all behind. Your comment about true colours is true. I hope yours isnt really messing you around.

Is it OK to wish that your (to be ex) H got posted by his work to somewhere far flung and perhaps a bit mosquito infested?

I know it is unlikely to happen -given he works for M&S headquarters - but i was thinking of adding it to my prayers. Dont know if God would think it was a nice prayer though.

I have started to wish that something would happen, not something awful, but somehow he left me a bit more alone.

WIMH - so sorry he is being a shit, I hope he doesn't spoil your daughter? birthday. He sounds such a shit, I am sorry he isn't the man you loved, it is so hard to see them change.

Bet my H is all sweetness and light with his new friend - like he was with me - he will show his true colours.

Mavis so sorry you have joined us. it is so painful and the grief is unbearable in the first few days, keep taking each hour as it comes. Look after yourself and don't beat yourself up.

Evening ladies, another one here in the same boat.

H came home on Thursday announcing we should split. Our dc's are 3 and 8 weeks. Same story, I didn't see it coming and a decision has been presented to me. I know the boys and I will be ok in the long term but I can't even bring myself to tell my parents yet. I really don't want to be single with 2 children at 38.

He's staying with a friend for a couple of days but is just there in the evenngs as he's been hanging out here all day. I took the boys out as I'm finding it hard to be near him but not with him IYSWIM.

It's just shit isn't it?

Hello Eve and Semper
Bit annoying, wish your H would be clear with you what they are actually doing. Sorry if you are having trouble, it's the not knowing that

Luckily I know my H is being an arse. He excelled himself this evening. He is renting a house literally a street away, but wont tell me his address but kids told me. I asked him to think about whether it really was a good plan to live in the same town as me- or could he give it some thought about maybe moving a few towns away to give me a bit of space so I wont feel that I'll be bumping into him.
I got, I'll live where I like, you have to make your own decision (ie. he doesnt work here, I do, kids go to school here, but he's trying to force me to move to get some space from him!!! ARGHHHH)

I had texted him to to help me restart the lawnmover after he dropped kids off (petrol hard to start one, we have huge garden, obviously not for much longer mind...) and he said he would - but then I saw him drive off with his roof down on the car. I rang him to say, but I thought you were going to help me... and he said, "I've showered now and I'm not coming over to do the lawnmover as I have better things to do..." Seriously as all he had to do was pull the cord for me as it was stuck, I had done most of the rest of the lawn myself and it wasnt a dirty job. A 2 seconds job.

Clearly being a tosser takes up an inordinate amount of his time and effort. I really hope he gets the clap.

DD2 told me that he whispered to her today that "mummy is a liar because blah blah blah" (I can assure you I'm not a liar and have not been bringing DC into anything) and he also told the DC that he was going to turn up to her birthday party in a few weeks time as he was trying to find out what we had arranged and DD let it slip (that's kids for you) - But it is just after school so he would never have have come before as he is at work and a day he never is able to leave early on, AND I've paid for and arranged it on my own- and I deliberately didnt tell or invite him to it.

It's a play place so I guess he could turn up tho not sure the place would let him in without any DCs. Anyway, why spoil it for us, he has her the day before her birthday and DD2 said she wanted a separate party with daddy, so had asked him to take them out for a special meal together. I'm hoping he doesnt know the time. It seems very controlling as he is just threatenning to crash our arrangements, how awkward would that be? It would be different if he was a nice character and it was an amicable split as you'd like to think you could do that kind of thing together politely, but he isnt and it's not.

Can understand you wanting to be near your family, it did cross my mins at the start, and I din't know now if I will stay here.

Maybe if you are having to move out anyway, it is best to go where you know you have the support.

The endless evenings are painful aren't they.

Yes 'friend' is the text's I found, and it wasn't what I think. I am tempting to pull him up on the fishing things, but he will just deny it so what is the point.

I am slowly relaising that he is playing me for a fool. I have nothing without him.

Yes am in glorious MOD accomodation! I know I have 3 months but am struggling with the thought of being on my own when I have friends & family up north that I can rely on.

My Mam & Dad are going tomorrow so am probably gonna feel a big low tomorrow night.

I am staying in the hope that it has only been a week but don't want to stay for th full 3 months if it doesn't work out as I know nobody around here. My DH is on an e posting which means he is separated from his battalion so none of the wives talk to each other round here and there are none of the baby & toddler groups ususally associated with army estates. Its the thought of endless days & nights on my own that makes me want to get on that train!

Is his 'new friend' the friend he refers to whom he says he has met but nothing physicalis happening? Or have I read it wrong?

What is happening at the moment, does he ring and say he wants to visit and then doesn't plan another? That would wind me up big style about the fishing stuff, in fact I wold have to call him on it but then I am a nagging harridan type - thats why he has left me. Sarcastic

Not funny I know but I have to laugh at myself at the moment otherwise I may just go loopy!

Semper - good to hear from you, don't rush a decision about moving just yet - you are in MOD Accommodation? you have 3 months? I think.

These men are just wimps.

Just looked in the garage - H was meant to be fishing tomorrow - funny that as all his fishing stuff is in the garage.

So I guess he has gone off to his new friends for the night? Just want to cry, why can't he give us another go? or push off.

Arrrgh - so annoyed for you Eve.

The ups & downs must be driving you batty. I have read through and from what I understand it he is saying that he wants to give it a go but seems reluctant to actually do so? Sorry if I have got that wrong?

Did he say where he is going? So sad for you. I can imagine how I would feel if I were you. Would want to question it but so scared to rock the boat in case he says you know what, I don't want to give it a go anymore. So sad, that we are so scared like this.

I am not saying you are wrong by the way as I would be exactly the same. Its so hard.

Am getting a bit annoyed with my situation today. Feel like a fool for hanging around but too scared to go runing back up to the north east in case staying here would be better for us to get back together. I feel so stupid.

Evening ladies,
WISM - hoping you had a peaceful day and the children were well behaved on thier return
Semper - sounds like you had a lovely day, one thing at a time - give up smoking another day.

Not sure what is going on today - H turned up 11.30 - got stuck in traffic. We went out for a few hours had a nice time with DS. Came back and I crashed out. We tidied up the garden and he showered and got DS ready for bed eary and shot out of the door at 7pm. Don't know when I am seeing him again. But he has showered, shaved and ironed his clothes...
Feel pants today, feel like I am being tested.

How has everybody's day been today?

WIMH - did you manage to enjoy a bit of time to yourself?

My Mam & Dad took little man out for the day so I sat in the back garden in the glorious sunshine, with my Mary Queen of Scots book & had two glasses of wine! Smoked loads of cigarettes too tho . I had given up but this has sent me reaching back for them I am afraid. Oh well, will stop again when I don't have so many things rushing through my head.

Was a bit more positive after my afternoon rest but have crashed again now. I hate hate hate this.

Greyclay thanks for that. I cant see a point where I do get over it, whilst he is still hanging around. But I hope I will.

Eve and Semper Sounds positive, at least H's are wanting to work on your relationship and still show signs of caring about you. That's a good thing as it's something to build on. xxxxx Stick in there.

Hi MNs
Am here this morning. H is coming over to take all 3 DCs out for the day. Dreading seeing him. I have a day off to myself. Looked at the grass that I intend to cut and it's long and wet. Groan. Have a few plans but on my own all day.

Feeling bit better than yesterday. Went to bed at 7pm last night straight after put kids to bed. Good sleep until DD snuck into my bed at 1am, and proceeded to disturb me all night for a cuddle, she ends up with her nose right to mine on the same pillow!!!. It's sweet but hard to sleep when you have a limpet attached to you!!!

I'm fed up that H wants to rent a house literraaly a street away from us. He is just crowding us, there's no reason for him to stay in the area - he works in London, has work colleagues that live up near Wokingham- why cant he give me some space? It makes me feel that I wont be able to stay in the area long term, otherwise I'll be bumping into him all the time. I just want some space, I want to feel free.

Evening ladies, I have had trouble with my internet today. WIMH - hang on in there, you have come so far in such a short while, and this is just a knock back, you have taken control of the situation by starting the divorce process and the children are feeling safe and secure in your care. Try and get out and make the most of the nice weather. I know it must be really hard having H popping in and out, it is something that is going to happen, it will take time to adjust again, but you have done so well.

Semper - I know just how you feel, I just wnat to scream at him come home and give us a chance we can work onthis together.

Well as for me, H has been over this evening and wasn't feeling well. He spent sometime with Ds and went back to his base. He said he will come back tomorrow and spend the day with us.

He has decided that we should stay as we are and keep popping in. Great, so you get to chill out and relax except for 2 evenings aweek for 3 hours with Jacob and a few hours with us at the weekend - whilst I deal with all the shit.

Said that it is ok, but I expect him to up the contact a bit, if we are trying to build on our relationship I expect more contact when he is not here.

I am not getting my hopes up, in fact i am just fed up with being messed about, feel like I am being strung along.

I'm sorry you are having a down day too WIMH. Wow, divorce papers signed. Must feel so strange. GC is right, you have been so positive in all of your recent posts so try and see today as a blip if you can - it is bound to be up & down but I too am in thee WIMH fan club and think you are doing amazingly. Keep going.

Dh came round lat night to put little man to bed & we had a long talk. He said that this is absolutely killing him but we have been having so many problems that he feels as though he has hit a brick wall. He is scared that if he just comes back home (like he wants to) then nothing will really get resolved like always happens after arguments and then 2 years down the line we will break up anyway when little man is more aware of what is going on. He just doesn't know whether to make a clean break now or not. He says the fight has gone out of him.

I am the first to acknowledge we have had a hard time over the past 18 months or so (my depression, moving to a new area with no family or friends has meant that I have become far too over reliant on him for well, almost everything, lots of external issues, then him being a TWAT).

Thing is though, I would rather see this split as a shake up & to acknowledge that we CANNOT continue the way we were. It was inevitable I suppose that things were going to come to a head, but I would rather use this as a springboard to move on and change for the better on both sides. We really have had a lot to deal with which I won't go into (far too long & complicated) but I want us to move on together. I want us to join together to beat our problems. He says that he is scared to come home, all will be well for a few days & then ultimately, everything will start to crack again. I say we have been stuck in a vicious cycle - a rut.

There are so many positives happening shortly. One of our major stresses is due to be over in a month, I will go back to my GP and maybe start taking the anti d's he prescribed, we are due to move in 3 months to an area where I will have much more opportunity to make friends and regain a sense of freedom again.

Why can't he see this?

He was so upset and kept crying and saying there is nothing he wants more than to just come home but he thinks he should still stay away for a while as he is scared that the feelings he has now will come back in a day or two. He says he has to know it is me he wants to come back to and not just that he is missing ds, his home comforts etc.

I asked if he wanted to go for a drink tonight as my Mam is here to babysit (we never get to go out together normally as there is no-one for DS). He said thanks for the offer but didn't think it was a good idea - its space he needs, and having a few beers and then being with me will only make him want to come home.

So still stuck in limbo. Have applied for a job toady, I don't want to but if this doesn't work out then I am going to have to go back to work and my SAHM days will be over. I will also have to move back up to the North East as the house will have to be given back to the army. Feel so sad at the thought of all of this.

Have a thumping headache.

Hope you have started to feel better as the day goes on WIMH and all you others. Keep swimming.

Hi WIMH - sorry to hear you are having a bad day today. Please know that is just what it is though - a bad day. And it is part of the grieving process. You feel like you take one step forward and then two steps back sometimes. It is very normal to feel sad as you are grieving and mourning the loss of a life you had. But you are doing tremendously well and you ARE moving forward. You only have to read this thread from the beginning to see it.

Tomorrow will be a new day and you will feel much better I promise. Be kind to yourself and give yourself time. Unfortunately getting over these things does take time.

You may never know exactly why your H has made the decisions he has but one day you will turn around and not care anymore. And you will be happy again.

Courage.

Is anyone there today?

Had a sleep but still tired and still feeling incredibly sad. Been bit tearful today about losing the H I loved. Want to know where he has gone and whether he will ever come back. I would do anything to have that H back again and my future back how to how our future used to be. It feels so unfair. Why did he do this? Why did he do this to me or the DC?

Hoping that DC3 will fall asleep soon so that I can return to bed. Weather is glorious but I have a headache as so tired.
H rang this morning, to speak to DCs - damn was hoping he'd be kidnapped whilst out there & kept (nicelly) for 2 years. Anyway he rang at 8am just as we were about to leave for school , and he sounded cheery just wanted to speak to DCs. He startd a long conversation so I had to take phone and say, 'we're just walking out the door so can you be quick please'.

Crashed my mood again, as I kept thinking, why is he doing this? why isnt he missing me? how does he imagine his life as better without me? He just wants all the good bits, to drop in and drop out when he wants and sleep/rest, spend his money and go out when he wants to, whilst I look after the DCs and do all the hard work. He imagines living round the corner from us and his life being great, the best of both worlds except without a wife. Whereas I think my life would be better without him in it, if he's gone I want him completely out of the picture and our lives.

God, crashed today. I am so bloomin' tired this morning, my eyes are bleary, DCs are argumentative. DCs up all night, both DD & DS in my bed, I ended up sleeping in DS's bed.

CT10 Oooh I think you can relax a bit, as I would imagine she will be helping him see what he is doing to himself. Since he sounds so messed up, you have the perfect opportunity here for someone other than you reflecting that back to him! I'd think of her as your new best friend!

iwmi Ahh, of course you want to hear "I love you" back, then it will all be OK and the world will be right again.

But what do you want him to mean by I love you??? Cos those words could mean anything - I'm scared, I miss the easiness of us, I miss my home comforts and a wife who dotes on me, I want to make you happy, you complete me... I think his actions will show you whether it's the real deal or not and I imagine you want the "I love the woman you are and am putting you and the DC first, I will meet you halfway, I notice all the good things about you and will carry on appreciating those forever more.."

I dont think you can get love like that by doing everything his way, as that's selfish love about him. I think we should want it to be about us, that deep love of who we are, not we can provide for them, so by putting yourself first, working out what's acceptable to you too, and taking it carefully, you'd be making sure H understands it's about you now, or you both as a couple, not him him him him him...

Gosh, do i sound strong now? I have been laughing and being me again, all day. I guess I found my sunshine . The DCs and I are having such fun! My days arent groundhog days anymore and my future is open. I feel excited and set free. Wow I guess today is a good day and I've had a few of those in a row now.

Thanks all of you for what youve said. Your right, i need to be a bit more assertive and get what i want.
But still just want to hear "i love you".

Something he said last night really pissed me off, course i didnt say anything but might ring tonight - will report back if i have the courage!

CT10 night together sounds very brave, hope you get to say what you want.

WIMH how did this strong woman appear in such a few (all be it long) weeks! Well done you, am taking inspiration.

Hi WIMH, he is seeing the same one right now - dread to think what she is saying to him .....

Hi CT10
Welcome back. You do sound like you've been busy. Wow a night together at a hotel tomorrow, that sounds exciting!! And so positive.

Interesting things the Relate lady said to you. Do you think she has a point? That's a lot to think about. Wonder how your H will find it tonight and what she says to him. Is it a different Relate lady? Or are you seeing the same one?

Hi everyone, I have been lurking for a while unableto post anything as my brain is completely fried. H is living at his mum's atm, we are having a night away together at a local hotel tomorrow night and we have booked a family break at Centre Parcs for 4 weeks time which the children are terribly excited about.

Have been to Relate on my own today and I found it a scary thing. I have had a traumatic life and traumatic things happen to me. The counsellor told me my H was an addict and passive agressive to mention few things and I have to take emotion out of everything (easier said than done). I have to work out what is the worse thing that can happen to me and how I want to proceed. I have to start taking care of myself and stop trying to control everything. I have been with controlling, manipulative men all my life including my father (everything goes back to your childhood) and I am the third generation of women in my family with "shitty" men as she put it - god that makes me feel great about myself not. I have to stop making excuses for H and decide what I am prepared to put up with, etc for the sake of the kids.

He is going on his own tonight so watch this space.

Sorry that all sounded miserable but hearing it as it really is from a third party is very hard.

I will let you know how tomorrow goes.

Good wishes to everyone and hang on in there.

Went horseriding for the first time in years on Tuesday - discovered muscles I'd forgotten I had

Signed the papers today to file for divorce. And dropped them off to the solicitors.



Wow, I am feeling brave this week.
Feeling more in control of my life for having done that.

OH, and it sounds bloody good that he does love you and miss you. They are great things to hear.

Hi Eve
That sounds good, that you were talking. Does he have to come home though? Can you not take it slower with him living somewhere else and you starting to get to know each other again. Then you have more choice and control over how you respond if he does or doesnt change. Like he would have to prove himself first before you could trust him again.

I just think you have come so far, so you dont have to feel your only choice is to let him return to living at the house to make a go of it. If you're feeling uncertain, it just puts you under pressure to make it work and put up with whatever he does. Whereas the middle ground is lives elsewhere and comes round and you start a new relationship. Remember it's not about him, it's about you now xxx

Afternoon all,

Some good advice as always, just hope we all stay strong and get through it all. I know the pain will pass, I am confused. I have been so hurt and just wanting h to come home. He come back last night as I needed to work, I haven't heard from him since Thursday.
He was really nice, cuddles and holding hands whilst we took the dog and DS for a walk. Said he loved me and had missed me, and was thinking coming home was the right thing to do. We had a lovely evening on the sofa talking etc.
So this might be a turning point, so why am I not jumping for joy? Maybe I don't belive him, but I think if he does come home nothing will change, and we will be back here again and I can't risk that all over again.
We have talked about what needs to change, I will do what I can, but I am not convienced he will.
Watch this space.

It's definitely easier when you dont see them (H). I've enjoyed the space of this week. It makes me see how my life could be if H didnt live anywhere near me.

Morning all

Semper good to hear you have a better day today xx See - that sense of stability & that you just might just be OK - comes and goes and thank god it comes sometimes as those days keep you going. So enjoy the good days, and remember the bad days just last a day, then the next day is different. If you have a bad day, really just focus down on to getting through the next few hours and start planning things that make you smile.

I am taking my DCs bowling after school today, something I could never have done before as busy getting their tea/H's tea/cleaning house etc before H eventually got home, if he did. He's also in India and my mobile phone strangely quiet since I added his mobile number to reject list whilst he was away.

My friends think it is funny that I keep saying that I'm in the angry stage of grieving now as they dont see much angry! I guess I dont do it loudly, but more in a quiet "bollocks to him" way. DC3 (age 1) is currently bashing the beejeebees out of H's cycle helmet that she's carrying around. Dont care, it's his! She's using it as a handbag/bashing thing!!

I love this feeling that H's (& his stuff is) insignificant now, just not important anymore. H wants it all to be about him. What he wants and envisages his new life to be. I am bored by all that. He spent last week berating me about a favourite t-shirt he couldnt find (out of all the 48 t-shirts I packed nicely for him!!!). He left me, with 3 yougn children, a house to run, pissed around with our money, has done all these other things, and his biggest concern is a t-shirt??!!! Selfish people are never really that interesting. I have more exciting things to think about - I'm thinking about what I want my life to be with the DCs and how I envisage it, and working on that!!!

I'm also OK with having just signed the forms to petition for divorce - doing it on the grounds of his unreasonable behaviour (kept it mild and innocuous). Starting to take control of my life and DCs'. Planning DD2s birthday party - a school friends one and a big my friends & kids barbeque party for 3 weeks time. MY weekend! H can have his only "little" party for the DCs when he has them and this is what DD2 wants (she's not daft - 3 parties instead of 2!).

Morning all - wine was lovely ta!

Had just over half a bottle so enough to make me sleep but not enough to get me wankered and wake up feeling crap so result all round.

IWMI - I second everything wimh and GC are saying here. If it works, it works & that would be amazing but it cannot be just about what he wants. Imagine say you have bent over backwards to accomodate his wishes, you get back together, then a short whi
le down the line it happens again. What do you do next time to accomodate him? You have already done everything to his wishes?

Also, I think if you feel it is all about him and not you then at smetime down the line you will feel resentment thinking, it only worked because of what I was willing to sacrifice, accomodate and put up with and then that burning resentment will show itself in other ways.

I am not saying put your foot down or become over harsh because getting back together is what you both want and I so wish me and dh were at your stage but just don't be blinded by that need to stop listening to your inner voice too.

Maybe I should listen to myself eh?

On a positive note, I weighed myself this morning and I have lost 3lb - I am back into the eight stones - yippee! Have been trying to get there for over 2 years. Another couple of weeks of this and I'll be back to pre ds weight! Although all haggard & drained looking to boot .

Also, can I just say that you are all so clever & sensible in your posts and insightful. At the moment, I am struggling to write my own name at times let alone phrase posts coherently so forgive my ramblings and typo's

Hi Greyclay

Cross posted again! That's such a lovely thing to say. MNs is being a lifeline for me. It really helps to hear how other mums got through it and talk each other through the good and bad days. The DCs really help too. When I feel like I cant keep going, I focus down onto doing something funny with the DCs. Abba Dancing Queen is always a good bet! (Watch a 6, 4, and 1 year old dance to that and you can't help but laugh!)

My head is quick but my heart isnt but I'm getting better each day. I have good friends who are angry at him and friends & work colleagues are being so kind. I'm also not on my own. He is. I'm in my house, with my stuff and my DC with me. Everything is as before but without H there and the world is still turning. I belong, he doesnt. I havent lost my anchor in him - which is how I felt at the beginning- I discovered that I was the anchor in our family, the heart of it, and H was infact expendable.

I also realise now how blessed I am that I have the most wonderful kind hearted people around me as they're carrying me when I start falling.

Semper yes I remember driving myself crazy over and over, if only I had chilled out, not pulled him up on some of the (thoughtless) things he did... and we'd still be happy and he would be here... and it would all have blown over and never come to this....

But is that really true? Did you really pull your H up on everything he did, or let a lot go by, get on with caring for your DC and only respond to the fact you were seeing a series of selfish/ terrible behaviour or respond only to the very worst things he did? Should you have not reacted to any of them? Are you not allowed to have feelings and express them? He gets to behave badly and you get to do nothing or he will leave .

If you feel angry and unappreciated in an adult partnership, then why can you not broach it? If at some point it doesnt end up a "sorry you felt that way, I didnt mean to hurt you or intend it to come accross like that" (Or by his behaviour changing or his doing something kind to say sorry without saying it), then then this was coming anyway.

I realised after 5 weeks of driving myself mad that the reality is, no matter what I did or didnt say or do, he would have left anyway. As that was what he was building up to, all that selfish behaviour wasnt a staying-in-an-adult-relationship-long-term-behaviour. It was sabotage.

So, my experience is, that you might get to the bollocks to him bit in about a month. But the good bit is, that you get to a few bollocks to him he is a twat moments every now and then, for a few days, on the rollercoaster you are on right now. Enjoy them whilst they come and they're more fun than the tearful bits. And you get to burn a couple t-shirts on the bollocks to him days.

Did you enjoy your wine?

Cheers WIMH . I have been continuing to follow this thread and have been very humbled by how you have been rallying your self worth and your strength in such a seemingly short period of time. In fact, I tip my hat to all of the women here. I went through my own similar experience quite a few years ago now so it is at a safe distance for me and I only really have the wisdom of hindsight. I wish that mumsnet existed for me then! At any rate, please know that I am wholeheartedly rooting for everyone here.

Oooh Greyclay, welcome back! That's good advice.

IWMI No, it shouldnt feel that you are that hard to love or to want, after 14 years, this isnt about you but him wanting the world how he wants it. Remember, you're just dating and you're trying him out now, not just the other way round.

Do try to get back to being you, separate from him. You can still be warm, talk, listen and do all those things to rebuild your relationship and compromise, each take your responsibility for your share in things. But I'd definitely start first by rebuilding good times together and good memories, rather than long strained talks about your difficulties as that will make it all seem negative and too much at a stage when you need to make things stronger.

Will help you feel more in control if you know that you can get on with your life without him? Then, he will sense it and respond to it more positively. That is the bit you can work on. Can you think of any little things you can do in your life to make you feel more independent and better about yourself? New clothes, new friends, flirty with other men, whatever it takes? If any other MNs have any tips, will be welcomed! (I would definitely love to hear some tips!)

Because if you do feel you need to have him back at any cost and it's not right or fixed with equal amount of committment from you both, then what's to stop him doing this again? If he wants to come back only if you are dormat willing to accept him back anyway you can get him (half a man not fully in it) then would he stick around forever anyway? Would you? It's too much power, so you have to take some of that power back more equally and let him see you can manage without him, can see your life without him if it's not right for you either. You'd be saving yourself the long drawn out pain of him dragging it out then leaving you and the DC again.

I hope this isnt bad advice. It's just what my instincts tell me.

iwillmakeit - you are a brave woman to go through what you are going through and still fight for your marriage. Make sure that you outline some of your own terms with regards to the reconciliation. Your H doesn't necessarily get to "test drive" the relationship on his terms alone. Set boundaries with him for yourself where possible, it will help you feel more in control. If he wants to stay over a few nights a week, maybe stipulate that they have to be consecutive evenings or only over the weekend, or whatever you prefer. The point is, it should be what YOU prefer also. Not just what he prefers. Good luck...you have every right to feel frustrated.

Hi all, feeling crap tonight. Went out with h 4 pizza, didnt just want to exchange pleasentries like we did last week. So started asking what we were doing, hes booked off our holiday week if thats alright withme! Wants to , if hes going to, move in slowly, just for a few days/nights etc, wants to keep "dates" with me.

Find it all just so depressing, am i that hard to want? to love? Jes we've been 2gether 14 years! Feel like i've been given more hoops to jump through and still might fail. Wanted to take some control of all this but dont know how. So much more to rant about but dont know where to start or stop. How can he want to just chuck our lives away? WIMH what you said about disengaging is so true, but now it feels like he wants it all back but without REengaging, i cant do it.

Sorry can only see the dark side at the mo

wimh - I understood what you meany about the give yourself a break comment so no worries

You are right on so many levels - so very very right.

I know that I was right to pull him up on his behaviour recently, its just that now he has left I am blaming myself thinking, if only I hadn't done that - chilled out a bit more - maybe he wouldn't have left. Sad, I know but its a process I think - you blame yourself, pick at your own actions, analyse every argument and wonder what you could have phrased differently. Mental - enough to drive you insane.

Then hopefully, will come the stage where I go, you know what, bollocks. I was right to have a go because you were being a twat. After twattish behaviour, you would expect him to sort himself out and start being nice. But no, he leaves!

I haven't been too hard on my Mam - she means well and probably just wanted to vent. I have just said that next time, please check with me before you tell people. I was trying to avoid the family knowing because I knew I would get lots of messages and like you, it feels like I go through it again every time I tell somebody.

She has been a great help, putting ds to bed and just handing me a bottle of sauvignon blanc . Only having a glass tho

What do you reckon the chances are I'll be back here in two hours all pissed and maudlin

I am definitely listening, in fact the laptop is red hot after having it switched on and on this page all day. My Mam has just said that she is so pleased I found MN. I wish none of us were going through this - I really really do but at least we do know others are out there feeling the same right now and we can try and draw strength from each other.

WIMH - Just wanted to say great post lots of words of wisdom in there.

Sorry when I said "give yourself a break" at the end of my last post. I meant it in a loving way. Just read that back and realised that it didnt sound right - I meant to say, *Be kind to yourself*. You need to be kind to yourself and go easy on yourself more than ever now.

Can you tell that I'm in the angry stage of grieving now??

Sorry Semper, I'm angry at your H on your behalf. I wish I could spare you all the devastating confusion and pain you're in the midst of, like we all have just been. I really really feel for you and remember we're all here. Listening. Do read through some of the advice I & other MNs on here got and other MNs gave as well, earlier in the thread. It kept me going when the days were dark. It still keeps me going.

By the way I'm angry at all our Hs for doing this. Not just yours Semper.

Semper

Glad to hear you have friend coming down and your Mum. It is your news to tell who you want when you are ready - your mum wouldnt have meant any harm though, she was probably just shocked. Can you ask her to do damage limitation and ask cousin and Aunty not to pass it on to anyone until you are ready? That way you can feel in a bit more control to let it sink in before you start telling people and tell only a few at a time. I had to pace myself. It's like re-experiencing it each time. I couldnt cope with it in the first 2 weeks. I could barely get my words out. I'm so sorry you're here too honey.

I think a great piece of advice I had early on in the thread was someone said ignore everything coming out of H's mouth, as he's just trying to justify it to himself. A MN said to me, imagine it's all crap coming out of his mouth. I drove myself mad in the early days trying to make sense of it, why had he left, what had I done, what could I do to fix it? It didnt matter. It wasnt me or the kids. It was who he is now. People usually work things out together, or seek help and put their cards on the table, compromise.

So keep telling yourself - it's not you, it's him. Of course in every arguement there is 50:50, but the differnce is that if one person is willing to meet in the middle and talk it through, and the other simply walks away or doesnt talk and share what's going on, they've disengaged- it's easier for them to walk away and reinvent. You can change the way you argue, you can be nicer to each other. It's not that difficult to do, if you ar both committed to changing yourselves or your behaviour for the better. We all develop and grow as we get older, it's called maturing. Ask yourself what type of man walks away from his wife and young DC???

It will be about his unhappiness with himself, not being able to work at something and risk his feelings/ego/ lifestyle - and all these things are worth it to him to cause such devastating heartache to you and your DC????? There are real tragedies out there that happen, children /partners that get ill, or die, accidents that happen, jobs lost and families losing their homes. All outside people's control. These H's have created tragedies, unneccessary pain to the very people they claim to love the most, or loved at one time. It's all about them. They are putting some selfish idea about freedom and changing their lives "to better suit them" over and above their DC AND their wives /partners. It is the epitamy of the most pointlessly destructive act to do - entirely self centred and without caring about the hurt they cause to others.

H will give you lots of different reasons, and none of them add up to make sense of such a devastating thing to do. Why do men walk out on their families and wives??? Everyone has arguments. He sounds as if he was behaving selfishly, not like a married man / a dad of young DC. When were you the paid childcare at home rather than his equal partner? You're ill DCs ill, the other parent has a responsibility to come home and HELP. Not stay out and get drunk because they cant be arsed/dont think it's their responsibility. Terrible dad, terrible Husband. My H did a series of similiar things before he left and some terrible behaviour, staying out late, refusing to come home if DC or I were ill, drinking to early hours then being incapable of getting up next day and ruining families weekends, breaking promises - it makes me mad to remember it now.

But it's a long process for them of withdrawing and thinking of themselves, then you get cross as you sense it, and then you're blamed for pulling H up on it. It's a ruse. They are behaving badly and being selfish, and nothing you did or said would have made any difference. Give yourself a break.

Crikey TSL - the constant changing of minds thing must be so draining - I think you are being very strong.

My Mam is here and we have just had a row because she told my aunty who has now told my cousin. I got a text from her saying she is thinking of me. I just didn't want anybody to know. I feel its my news to tell when I'm ready to tell it.

Not been too hard on her but it just made it feel more real when I am getting messages from people about it and I just don't want it to be real

semper - ditto. I think its their way of making themselves feel better - if they can somehow blame us then they won't feel like such a shit?.....

i'm really confused just now. Hes being very cold sinmce mondays great chat. But I have resisted any backlash texts which is good for me - it means progress. Previously I'd have been hounding him with "whats wrong" "can I help" etc etc

Today I am just leaving him to get on with it - he's just beign grumpy!

So I am going to just stay very calm and let it ride. I hope I can pull it off!

I am in South East London. I am glad my mam is coming down too. My friend is also driving down after work tonight to stay for a couple of days (5 hour drive) I'm so lucky to have people who want to support me but I can't help feeling its him I want - how bloody ungrateful am I?

We should all arrange a meet up - get pissed & cry on each others shoulder.

Its amazing that people go through this every day and move on - that thought just seems insurmountable right now.

He has been in contact again, saying that he just feels that enough is enough, its killing him but he feels that he is doing the right thing in the long run as it is better for ds to have two happy parents than two at each others throats.

We had an argument the other week because he had been an arse (staying out all night one weekend when out with his mates) then the following weekend saying he would be home at 7 then rolling in at 12 pissed when me and ds were ill. When I was upset, I had said to him that when he behaves like this I wonder why I am putting up with it and that I worry about where I would live and how I would manage financially if I left.

He is now saying that I said myself that I am only here because I had nowhere to go. Thats not what I meant at all. I meant that his behaviour sometimes makes me wonder what I would do if he carried on. But guess what, I stayed and am still staying to try and make it work.

He is turning my words back on me and saying that I don't want us to be together and thats not true. I just wanted him to stop being a twat.

Semper - where about are you? I am on the southcoast. Glad your mumis coming down for a few days. I feel your pain, there is no explaination for why they give up and walk away, a few weeks on and I still don't understand why my h can't come home and try and put things right for the sake of our son?

Have you been to the GP - i went to mine I am all ready on Ant d's so she gave me a very small dose of diazapam, it really helped in those first few days just to get through the grief. Or maybe just someone to talk too?

WIMH - hope you are ok, do keep in touch. Let me know if you can get out again?

Hang on in there girls.

I just feel bereft.

I love him and want him to come home.

I am trying hard not to contact him but cannot understand why he wants to be so cold.

I text him a couple of times telling him I love him and to please come home, that it doesn't have to be this way. I have accepted my part inour problems and want to fix everything but he just doesn't want to. I was lying n our bed last night, in our bedroom with all of our things and just couldn't believe that he doesn't want us anymore. I thought that through anything we would always have each other.

God, I just don't know what to do. He doesn't want to speak to me because he says it makes a hard situation even harder. So it looks as though I am supposed to just move on. I have suggsted counseling and he just responded by text saying please.

I have been with this man since I was 19, how can he not want to fight for us. DS is playing up probably cos he can sense the sadness. My mam is travelling down from up norh oday as I just can't cope with this having no family & friends in this area, but I don't want to go back there yet as this house is my home though I am going to have to give it up soon as it is a forces house. I think they give you 3 months after a break uup. God, I stand to lose everything, I realy realy do but the thing I want most is him and our ds.

Semper - hang on in there, the first few days and so painful, and then you go up and down Be kind to yourself and don't worry about the next few days of TV watching, it will do no harm. Try and eat, just pick at something you fancy.

Everyone else- how we doing, I think that at some point in the future these men will look back and realsie they messed up. I know my dad does - he left us when I was 5. My mum's second H left his family and has many regrets.

As for me, same shit different day. I really don't know what is going on in his head. He won't talk, and I have not heard from any of his family he was with at the weekend - I guess if there was something for me to know they would of been in touch.

I know he has fallen out of love with me, but with hard work and time it could be made right, for the sake of our son.Then I just think that he can just up and leave then why would I want him back but I do.

I just can't imagine being with anyone else - we were meant to get old together.

on the up side, I have been asked out on a date, but I am not going the thought of it makes me feel sick.

I guess they all show traits of being the same they are all being incredibly selfish at the moment. He came round today and said part of him wants to make a go of things with the ow just said to him well go to her then dont sit in my house telling me that. Then he changed it to how he cares about me and will always love me, hates what he is doing to me and can I give him a week. A week for what? He said he will speak to her but just give him a week. He has had 5 months and now wants a flipping week! He said we can do divorce friendly if it comes to it and when he gets letters from solicitors he thinks well if thats what she wants I will give it to her. He reckons he knows he been unfair and must seem to have been keeping me on a string. I dont know where he coming from or going to with all this I really dont.

WIMH, Glad your getting on better at work. Good idea with the mobile blocking his number. Dont know what you could say to your dc, its so hard isnt it. I had dc2 crying for his dad the other night just crying saying 'I just want daddy to live with us again'. I just try to stay as upbeat as I can.

TSL, My H has done that too. After a positive chat goes all down in the dumps and was hard work again. Thats when it feels like 5 steps forward and 10 back. Dont think your being arrogant at all your h should be chuffed to bits that you have agreed to the dating thing.

Semper, so sorry you have had to join in. Keep posting and do get some RL support if you have it around you.

Hope I have got everyone in if I havent I am sorry!

Bollocks - that was meant to be a link - sorry haven't got a clue!

http://mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/758540-Its-all-my-fault-how-am-I-supposed-to-live

This is the thread - I would explain it all but I just can't get it all out again.

I have managed to eat today - a pot noodle

crap I know, but I just couldn't face anything else so went to the hop and bought ne. First one I have had for years and it was actually nice!

Poor DS has been sat in front of Peppa Pig all day - feel awful about that but feel barely able to function let alone get the paints out etc.

I just don't understand how he could do this to us. We love him, we need him and he is gone.

Sick just isn't the word. I feel lke I have been in a massive boxing match or something.

I have been reading the threads and you all seem to have got stronger over time - am hoping I'm the same in a few weeks. At the moment, I'm walking around in one of his dirty jumpers so I can feel close to him - how sad?

Hi semper, i spent the first weeks writing, it was too painful to keep in my head!
When i look back now it helps me see how far ive come on and what an idiot! Fancy thinking it was all my fault!!!!!!!!!!Im bloody perfect like the rest of us here are and so r you im sure.
Chin up if you can, you will amaze yourself at how strong you r over the next few wks, mths...

All that said am racked with the guilts as my best mate is getting married fri, h not invited, and i had avoided mentioning it. Last night he rang as i was herding kids out to a club, stressed! and asked if he could come over fri to put to bed, i said no not convenient, then when pressed told the truth, he sounded hurt now i feel bad! Christ why am i still worrying about his hurt feelings?!

Does make me laugh when some of u write about ur hs, and u'v really written about mine!

semper - sorry you've had to join us - keep with us and we'll all hobble through together

WIMH - you know thats an excellent idea re the mobile. Glad things ok at work - you sound like you have a stressful job so I hope thats giving you focus without too much pressure

H is VERY distant today - this always happens after a positive chat where he says he wants to try and fix this. The next day I get stony silence. He says he is tired and fed up and heading off for an early night. I feel annoyed that he isn't pleased I've agreed to the dating thing. Or am I being arrogant now?

Functioning OK this week. Work are pleased as I'm doing difficult cases again (I'm a senior in my team).

I'm getting on. Smiling laughing, everyone thinks I look better and happier. I look as if I'm getting back to my normal self. My head is there, sensible. But my heart is still smashed. I'm this huge well of sadness underneath, grieving but waving.

DCs have asked me to find them a new daddy, a better one. What do i say to that??? I said, it doesnt quite work like that. You have a daddy, I know he doesnt live here anymore but he's still alive. DS said to me, he's not the same though, he's different mummy. DD said Daddy's smelly (true but not quite what she was meaning I think!!) . Dont know what to think about what my DCs are saying . Do you think they are just saying what they think might cheer me up? I dont want to hear from him anymore, as he can have nothing of interest to say to me.

Semper hello, sorry to hear your news

Have you anyone who can come over and sit with you.. and help you function? God I remember that first week. You'll cry constantly and ask yourself over and over why he has done this. Why did he leave?
There wont be an answer that is enough for you I'm afraid. Even if you understand his reasons, it's never enough to explain why leave your family and loving wife. Even if you were ill, or made mistakes, or grumpy, well who isnt at some point. You have a young DC, you're tired worn out mum like every other mum there, just getting on with looking after your child. Human beings arent perfect. Men get irritated with their wives, women get irritated with their husbands. Most people stick in there and work at making it better.

Yes, it was me who started process of filing for divorce. Divorce papers came through this morning for me to sign and return to solicitor. Could take 4-6 months to finalise. God I'm not ready for this. Made me gasp when they arrived. Friends tell me I need to go for this and start process, as does solicitor so he can't keep being an arse. Blocked his mobile number to my mobile so it rejects his number whilst he is away in India for work. Kids are with me, so there's nothing I am going to miss that's important. I wonder if it will block all his texts.

Can I join this thread please?

My husband left me at 8.30 last night and I just don't know what to do.

I have been lurking on these threads the past couple of weeks and it is heartening to see you all 'coming on' a bit further.

I can't eat, feel sick and can't stop crying. There is lots to our story that is far too long to type and I just can't think straight to do so but I think a lot of it was probably my fault but I never thought he would leave us.

We have been married for 3 years and together for 10. We have one ds who is 2.

I honestly don't know what I am going to do

WDYAT - do you know I think we married the same man?! H also hasn't spent any time single - except in breaks from me! Whats different though is at the moment there is definately no OW. I think you seeing a solicitor would be a good plan. He is stringing you and the ow along - maybe if he sees you seeing solicitors he will realise that he has to make a decision and stop this fannying about

WIMH - how frustrating for you! Others are right - he's texting you in a way that suggests he has exactly the same rights as before he left - which is not the case. Somehow you need to gently remind him that actually he has lost the right to text instructions for you about what he wants his children to know about what he is doing - contact with you needs to be on your terms not his. I'm not sure how you do that tbh - he sounds a tough cookie (well arrogant twat actually but I know you loved him once so am loathe to throw that term about too loosely!) but he cannot keep trying to ontrol you and act like he still has the same rights - he doesn't. When he gave up some of his responsibility he also gave up some of his rights

As for me - H and I have spoken again and he would like to try again - he says he can't promise it'll work and he'll move back in and live happily ever after, but he'd like to try dating and getting to know eachother - kind of a new relationship I guess like many of you have mentioned. SParkybabe - thank you for posting - I am full of hurt thats true - but I am not ready to give up on him. I can't.

Its like he's tried to dump me as if I were a girlfriend =- but I am not I'm his wife and my vows are real - I have to give him at least some opportunity to redeem himself. But He's on a time limit - I'm not sure how long is a reasonable length of time for him to realise he can manage to cope with family life.......

I am seriously fed up of the fact he has been unable to make a decision. How hard can it have been me and the 10 years and 3 dc we have or the 18/19 year old he is currently chasing. Deep down I am really bored of the same conversations. He knows the kind of person I am and knows I would find it incredibly hard to get over this amount of lying and the timing of it all. It is never the right time but this is over the later stages of my pregnancy and the first few months of dc3 life. When I should have been his priority I wasnt-she was.

I dont think my h was always like this in fact I know he wasnt. He took up a hobby that took him away for hours on end from the family home and started drinking heavy. I would like to smash his head against the wall till the old him came back though!.

I think you explained it well, wimh. On my strong days I feel just like that. But then there are the days when all you remember is the good times and thats when you miss them. I dont think I miss him as a person more the idea of having someone here. When he is nice its very easy to think oh I miss you but I know its not really him as he changes so easily. I think he is just trying to keep his options open by being nice to me the ow said as much to me weeks ago. It just drives me mad when he rings up like he used too and is all 'babe' and 'darling' on the phone-eurgh!

I am seeing my solicitor this week to get my divorce petition drawn up. He still doesnt want a divorce in fact he hasnt even said we are over that is drawn from his actions. I guess I should be thankful to the ow really as I now have a whole new life to look forward to and I know she has a life of looking over her shoulder wondering just what he is upto.

How do things stand with your H wimh? Was it you that had started divorce proceedings too?

WDYAT It sounds like you know your H very well. Not a hopeful picture you describe of who he is at this point in time - It sounds like you are really fed up of him now. Is that how you feel underneath?

I could have written some of the exact same words about my H. It's so disappointing isn't it? That they aren't just... well more. You think you're getting a whole person, and you're living all that time and loving a whole person - and somehow they were empty somewhere. Maybe that emptiness just swallowed all the nice bits about them up and look what is left.

I keep thinking was he always like this just covering it up well? Or did a small hole suddenly just start gaping and grew and grew to where his charactor was hollowed out? I'm not sure if I'm explaining myself well. But on my strong days, i think so little of who H is now because of how appallingly he is behaving. It sounds like you're kind of there some days too.

Then I have these pangs or reminders sometimes of who he used to be and all that hope and plans I had for our future together and the fun times with the old H. The old H that is dead/gone now is the one I miss. Perhaps he was never who I thought he was and it's hard to accept that he is never coming back. That there isnt a magic wand.

He has never had regrets about anything he is very single minded and if he thinks he is right he is right. He has told me he wont change who he is or anything about him. He met ow at a club where she continues to work and he has said he wouldnt give it up as its 'just a place'. I think deep down he knows it wont work with the ow but a huge part of him wants to see if it will. Ive said he would soon get fed up of going out all the time with her mates but he says its not like that.

He has had 5 months to have some kind of wake up call and to finish with her but he hasnt done either. He has now been having some kind of relationship with her for 9 months. Looking back he kinds of drifts from one relationship to the next and hasnt really ever had anytime being single. When I met him he had only been split up with his previous girlfriend for a few weeks.

He swings from being nice to being nasty depends what mood he is in. I have just had him on the phone for the second time tonight asking to come round and do the garden tommorow and 'talk'. I have no idea what there is left to talk about. He said he is too old for a girlfriend but what is she then if not a girlfriend?! I dont know if he is going to come round tommorow I have nothing to talk about with him its been 5 months now and all seems a little late in the day. Im just so fed up of all the same conversations with him nothing changes at all.

Hee hee My friend has just emailed me this joke to cheer me up and it worked . Copying it here..

A nice, calm and respectable lady went into the pharmacy, walked up to the pharmacist, looked straight into his eyes, and said, "I would like to buy some cyanide."

The pharmacist asked, "Why in the world do you need cyanide?"

The lady replied, "I need it to poison my husband."

The pharmacist's eyes got big and he exclaimed, "Lord have mercy! I can't give you cyanide to kill your husband. That's against the law! I'll lose my license, they'll throw both of us in jail, all kinds of bad things will happen. Absolutely not! You CANNOT have any cyanide!"

The lady reached into her purse and pulled out a picture of her husband in bed with the pharmacist's wife.
The pharmacist looked at the picture and replied,

"Well now, that's different. You didn't tell me you had a prescription."

(Not that I am condoning poisonning Hs!!!)

Sparkybabe what a lovely post. That is really good advice.

If I had ever seen this would be who H is now, I would never have married him. He wouldnt have been enough for me. By that I mean what I thought he was thoughtful, deep and kind hearted. What an idiot I was to believe he was deeper than he is proving himself to be. The DCs and I deserve a proper man in our lives not this little boy who sulks, shouts and bullies and thinks only about himself. What a FU he is!!!

Silver Lining - I have been lurking, but your posts sound so full of pain. WIMH is right - he is gone. Evaporated. The person in his place is not the same guy, and if he came back even on your terms it would not be the same. Don't think about him with someone else, think about you with someone who loves you and lets you be you. You are a different person too.

WDYAT
Interesting that your H says he is confused and sees no future with the OW. Why do you think he wont ever have a wake up call?

Hard to know if all or any of them will have wake up call moment where they realise what they have lost, and whether they would say anything anyway. Some men are stubborn pride driven men who dont ever like to

My H is putting on a really cold strong front which is so controlled and so "I'm right, this is the right thing to do" that it's almost as if he cant talk about it incase it puts a chink in his armour or the story he's told himself.

One of my (really balanced) lovely female friend is on her second marriage to an older man who left his wife when his DC were much older. They have second DS together. She says DH2 often says how he regrets doing it, and realises he could have done something different. DH2 left his wife years before he met her and they now have a son together.

Her own H1 left her with a 5 year old boy for OW and H1 said to her 13 years later that he realised it was him that was unhappy, he had numerous affairs and went from OW to OW, and realised 13 years later that it was nothing to do with her and all about him being unhappy with himself. He is also very unreliable with their DS and she said DS1 is very balanced as she has always been there for him and worked around H1. But DS1 is under no illusions about his dad, has made his own opinion of H1 and H1 regrets that.

It sounds like it all takes so long for some Hs to understand themselves and really reflect on what they are doing. I bet some forever justify it to themselves with their wives' imaginary flaws or real things that they exagorate to themselves to stop them feelnig guilty. I can see what my H has been doing.

It all seems such pointless heartache to cause. Why cant some men be happy with what they have and work at making it better. I bet you could all say the same as the bit I am about to say - It's ridiculous thing to do - as I am lovely, kind hearted, funny warm person, great mum, the DCs are gorgeous, well behaved and lively little things, and I know that, but it still makes me feel somehow I have failed or it is me.

Everyone keeps telling me, it's so not me, it's all him. Most men would have loved to been in his position and had what he had. And he threw it all away. For what? Is there really something "better" out there??? Or just a less stressful life where you have less people depending on you. I think H simply wants to stay in bed more often, spend his money on himself with latest gadgets and not have to tidy up after DC. I also think there is OW at work who he wants to shag.

WIMH, The texts your h has sent sound like the sort of texts he would have sent if you was together. Your quite right if he continues I would text him to say I dont need to know where you are or what your doing as its none of my business anymore. Its when they start the contact that it all comes back to you isnt it. What your relate lady said is interesting although I do think its a shame that the old h has gone forever. Do you think any of these H's will have their wake up call when they wonder what have I done? Mine wont, but some of them will at some point Im sure.

My H seems to be telling me what I want to hear the point of it being what I do not know. But he says stuff like 'I know there is no future with me and the ow' ok so why is he still chasing after her and seeing her? Some part of him must think they do. Its all the same crap with him, he says stuff like he doesnt want anyone or he is so confused and doesnt know what he wants BUT his actions are very different-chasing and seeing the ow.

Hi MNs

TSL IWMI Your Hs sound confusing at the moment and making you feel responsible for how they are. I hate that bit when you feel confused. I feel more peaceful when I know where I stand and am not at the mercy of what he wants or is thinking.
The Relate therapist & GP helped me by telling me that the old relationship is gone. It's past. The old H is gone. If anything ever resolves in the future, then it is a new relationship that you build from scratch. That has really made sense to me. So I am trying to stop missing the old H as whilst our previous life together still existed (Relate lady said "it's written in the history books"), it's gone now. So old H no longer exists. He is who he is now. He made these decisions based on who he is now and that is the H who I have on the edge of my life. Does that make sense?

I dont think it matters what you do really. It is all about them. So, do only what you feel comfortable with. I dont think it hurts to say, "here are my boundaries" as it stops them in their tracks and makes H think.

H is unable to ring the DC on the 3 days after school that they are around, as he is in India this week for work and travelling at those times. He's already tried emotional blackmail me "If you want them to speak to their father" (What wake them up??? Or ask them to take a phonecall whilst in school??!). However he's texted me 3 times in the last 24 hours to "say hello to the DC an tell them I am...just setting off on airplane/landed in India/ blah blah".

It's annoying me as I was looking forward to having some time without him and each text reminds me he's still around. If I get anymore in a short period, I'm going to ask him to stop texting. He doesnt live here anymore and I dont need texts constantly from here on stuff we're not interested in.
Admit I am hoping something will happen and he wont return from India. How awful is that?!!

Thought I would drop back in and see how everyone is doing. Havent posted in a few days just because everything is still the same really! Had a row with H over money the other day and whenever we talk on the phone ends in a shouting match with him putting phone down. Drives me mad!

Hope your all doing ok this evening.

God I know, f...ing games, Ive always hated them, i am what i am, take or leave it and I just get confused when others arent. Thought he was the same as me there, but another in a long line of things ive got wrong!

That crap saying " to assume..etc" keeps going round in my head. We had counsel;ling this time last year (not relate i must add, theyve been fab sofar) and it always started with "why do you think h is here" or "what do you think h wants to gain from 2nite" and i would dutifully make up what i thought was expected when inside i was screaming HOW THE F..K DO I KNOW WHAT HE WANTS OR WHY HES HERE!

Wish i had said that but wasnt strong enough then and relate lady doesnt ask me daft qs!My rambling point there is, we thought we knew them, assumed we did but in reality we only know ourselves and thats who we have to trust and honour now... still not made my point clear will think somemore, do u get me?

TSL - hang on in there, as WIMH said the hurt has to come out some how and emotions are a terrible thing you can't just switch them off. Know what you mean in your last post, I can't imagine being with anyone else. And it cuts me up inside thinking he could easily go off with anyone. Just take each day as it comes.

WIMH - glad you had a better day, enjoy the peace I am getting use to it now, Shoved H out of the door when he arrived, as I was taking DS out for his tea and he didn't need to stop ha ha.

Am cheering myself up talking to losser on dating website - great fun have developed a whole new mean, that is very checky.

Hang on in there girls, we deserve so much better than these men that walked out on thier families.

i can handle it if i think about it like that and its fine when hes on the want and I have the control yes I know its the fact I am out of control that upsets me the most perhaps?.........arrggh - i hate that I am havign to analyse my every thought just now. I just want my nice life to come back....this one is shite.

TSL - its scary i know, I see it as me getting something i want, ie i wanted some comfort other than cuddles off my mum! At the time the l8r i just dont know.

I really miss him and now hes being nice i miss him more, but need him to miss me more than that,

Chin up xx

i will make it - hmm sounds a bit like DH here too - texts and asks for "favours" iykwim - and I am always torn wondering if I should say yes and hope it makes him realise what hes missing and comes home or should i tell him to forget it unles he's prepared to come home - in which case he may go elsewhere for it.....am terrified of this - I would die inside if he went elsewhere that much I do know.....

i feel sick :-(

H came over for kids yest and asked if he could have a cuddle, said yes but didnt put baby down.

Feel really hopeful, but theres a voice in my head telling my its all a game, this was his plan all along. Said he was going for 3mths, had 6 wks of fun and now being nice and saying right things in counselling in hope will be fixed in next 6wks, which by the way will be babys 1st bday, or am i just being cynical?

How much honesty is too much? Do i say all this? Keep to myself? Lap it up? Play hard to get?...?
Am really going to try and stck to my guns about being loved, not too much to expect, but feel it would be easy to cave...
Arggggh!

TSL - yes you can do this! We all can, women are made of sterner stuff.

Its a bad moment and will be replaced by a better one xx

(inlaws ignoring me too)

wimh - great post - thank you

yours sounds liek agood plan - not syure how i cope through the next 2 years though....

i sometimes wonder if actually i miss HIM or just the IDEA of him. I don't feel that I could go onto a 3rd marriage/relationship - it wouldn't feel right or be right you know?

I am so angry at DH as I married in church and took my vows bloody seriously - better or worse.

Am also really angry today at the in-laws - MIL especially. They are just allowing him to walk out on his family - beutiful children who have done nothing wromg and me who yes has been rather emotional and hormonal the past 18 months but I was just getting to the point I was feeling human again when he left! hes staying with them, they are spoiling the kids rotten and havign parties and sunday luinches etc all with the DCs and the family and I am left out in the cold. I don't get on with my family - they don't "do" family gatherings (well they do but they never tell me about them!) and my in laws became like my adoptive family. How can they just "dump" me with the same ease of conscience that H has done?

If one of my kids wanted to just walk out on their family so soon after a new baby born etc I would kick em back home and tell them to remember their vows and work on it before running home to mummy.

I am bitter and angry today and I hate it - its not me. I just can't go on anylonger its too hard. It hurts too too much

Oh and I packed up H's DVDs and PS2 games, and scratched a PC game in amongst the box, that he used to spend millions of hours on ignoring the kitchen / dinner/ shopping/ any jobs he promised to do/ the DCs & me. That made me feel so much better.

Bit out of character as he was always the one that damaged things, not me, but then having my H walk out on me and our 3 young children is kind of a weird road new to me.

Eve your post made me laugh! He does sound bothered, to have asked where you were when he rang & got shirty! Good answer. You sound so together at the moment. Hold onto that thought xxx I love your evaluation of him at the end!!

Am doing OK today. Just dropped sis off at train station and put DCs to bed. Lovely to have her to visit, but realise perhaps the timing wasn't great for me. Anyway, feeling a bit freer now have house to myself. I wonder if I will ever be able to share my house again (except with the DCs!)!! Starting to like the peace and quiet that I get in the evenings with no one else to look after.

TSL know just how you feel - especially the wanting to run as far away from them as possible. So you dont have to see or deal with H or have those memories around you, feels easier to start somewhere new far away. You can always do that in the future, just stay where you are right now and keep that as your secret escape route if you need it (let's hope you don't). I'm giving myself 2 years to see how I feel and keep things stable for time being. Then I plan what to do next at that point.

TSL Give your gorgeous baby a cuddle. DS does not hate you, he's acting out. It'll be OK, because of course your DCs love you. You're right in some ways - you can't do this right now - you sound exhausted by your strong emotions as you try to deal with this. I definitely think you need to have a bloomin' good cry, scream & sob into a blanket. Then when you have cried yourself out, you will realise you can do this. You're the nice one here.Being distraught and angry and all over the place simply reflets how geniune,deep & caring you are. You cant just switch it off. I definitely think the pain & love all needs to all come out in tears and wailing.

I'm finding out that you dont have to do it all in one step. On bad days, it works better to just focus on the next couple hours, get through them, break up the day into portions, and then plan nice treat like a bath before going to sleep. Then think right all I have to do tomorrow is get up in the morning and get DCs to school/nursery/ breakfast. And think what can I do to help tomorrow be a good day? I really focus down to the DCs and doing something silly with them, when it's a bad bad day.

mega struggle day.

Veering between sobbing for the loss of my darling husband and spitting feathers and looking at jobs in scotland so i can run away from it all

DCs have been pretty hard work today. Eldest crying and telling me he hates me so so so much (I wouldn't let him play out in the rain or drink a gallon of juice in bed etc etc) and how he wants daddy not me etc - and now the baby is crying and refusing to settle to sleep and shouting DaDa constantly.

I can't do this

That is good to hear. Hang on to that feeling. Has your sister gone back yet?

Ok day here, finished my work, which I am pleased about. Have pottered about. I was at Tesco getting a few bits in and H phoned asked what I was doing. Just said I was out and about :-) he said that sounds interesting and asked who I was with told him it wasn't any of his business.

He got all shirty. So good knows what is going on in his head.

Anyway he is on his way back, going to drop DS off and go. So his weekend with Ds he took him to him mum's fri night spent weekend with his uncle (was doing a sponsored bike ride) collect Ds from his mum sunday luch with him and dropping him back here - so great weekend for DS! Tosser.

Eve all good ideas.
Somehow a sense of calm came over me at lunchtime. I was in Asdas thinking "I can do this!" and smiling. I was thinking, he's in a dark place, and I dont have to be dragged in there with him. I was also thinking, what's the worst that could happen. The kids and I will be OK even if they get a bit tired.

WIMH - morning, sorry you were up early, you must be tired. Lots of emotions going on and with H not being reasonable it must be re opening the wounds all over again each time he does something/says something.

Does DS have to do the football thing? I know it is important, but in the grand scheme of things maybe a few days with GP would be good for everyone - they also might have the opportunity to talk to H?

Have you thought about going to relate or having some counselling? I know it is very early days but there is so much going on that maybe this would help?

As painful as it is, the childrens routine is going to be upset with H - they don't have the 'work load' mums do and don't understand the importance of it all. Children are adaptable, and sleep well in cars although I wouldn't fancy that trip with 3 children!

Know you have packed H stuff away and understand with 3 children it must be hard, but have you tried re arranging the furniture? Make it your place not our place. Just a few small changes can make it feel very different.

Understnad you have to think long term, and the idea of H being in and out of your life must seem very painful, but you have built good realationships here both for yourself and the children. Time will make this pain easier, always good to have a plan, but don't run before you can walk.

Maybe He could move 10 - 20 miles away so that he isn't so local?

Glad you had a good night :-)

Long term, I dont want to stay in the same county as H. I cant imagine bumping into him and seeing his life. I dont want him interfering in mine or the DCs to the extent he wants to.

So thinking, let the divorce go through, and if I have to sell our family home, then at that point, I'll say to H that either he moves or we do, as I can look for a new job somewhere else and house and nice schools. I dont know if it is something I will have to do, the time comes to it, but it comforts me knowing that I can be free in a couple years time if I need to be. I dont want to lose the kids friends and mine, I have down here, but I dont want to be anywhere near H more than that. Hoping he will change jobs before then and "have to move".

Good morning MNs

Got out last night, went bowling. Was nice. I dont think my sis was overly impressed that I wasnt just going to bed, as we'd only just got back from meal out, but I needed some space. Up at 5.30am with baby and DS1 and told her to stay in bed. Planning to bath DCs and have play date with DS's friend later. Just filling time though.

H was a bit dishonest. He told me he was taking DCs down to his mum's all weekend which I said yes to as nice to see Grandma and they will be well cared for with her(Kent which is 2 1/2 drive from here) for weekend. But he didnt mention that DS had football tournament in the afternoon (he told football organiser to send email to him not me!!), so they wont be there until just before bedtime, which seems a long journey to take them on for such a short time.

Hardly worth it for the DC as long drive late Sat and long drive back after lunch on Sunday. Just so he doesnt have to stay around his friend's house with DCs as think friend is getting fed up of my DCs being round there (DD and friend's son who stays with him Fri-Sat afternoon, broke a radiator in friend's house 2 weeks ago and he hasnt "had time" to fix hot water yet!!). It kinda tells me DD and friends DS were left on their own for quite some time to have played with a radiator (!)- as it's not really her first choice of toy. Dont know what I want though. Just not this.

H in India now. He's cold and switched off and still nasty to me if he can be. Trying not to engage with any of it. Still can't beleive who he is now. Where did the nice man I married go? He's totally selfish and self absorbed and it's all about him, not the DC or me.

WIMH - sorry to hear you have had a terrible day, hope you managed to get out? I too am feeling crap. Had thought I would be ok, but mate let me down tonight and have just drifted about with no purpose. Have dome some work, need to get some more done which gives me something to focus on. Have played some music loud.

Knew I would come down from my high. I know deep down he isn't going to change his mind and come back home. I can't imagine being with anyone else. He is the world to me.

I stopped taking my diazampam Wed, but took one today.

Mum went back this morning, it has been nice to see her and she cleans everything insight but am glad to have some peace.

H - is with his family doing a sponsored 24 hour bike ride. Have talked to them all this week, I know they will try and get some sense out of him. I am sure he will just dig his heals in further.

Right back to doing some work

wimh - no its not just you - I couldn't bear having someone stay with me just now - I don't even want to spend time with ANYONE just me and the DCs. I want to be left alone to greive in my own time and my opwn way.

I too am feeling a little despondant today - the day has just dribbled by with nothing much being acheived - and i had such high hopes for it :-(

Feelign utterly crappy today

iwmi I like the idea of a pink bedroom. Tell us when you've done it!!! The laundry gets out of control doesnt it - I have similiar 3 DCs, so I know exactly what you mean. It's hard hearing about H's exciting lives when you're left at home with the drudgery. But remember you get all the good stuff with DCs as well and once you feel a bit better, you'll leave H behind and have the interesting life while he has a shallow one. Or at least that's what I'm hoping will happen, when I can stop thinking about laundry, bills, keeping a roof over our heads and what I can afford to spend on food!

Is it my situation that is making me feel so crowded? How are you girls coping when someone comes to stay with you? Eve has your mum been helpful?

My sis was genuinely trying to help last night, but she let the DCs come in her bed and chatted with them until 8.30pm all snuggled up (1 3/4 hours after I'd put them to bed!!!)- I didnt know they were both in there! DD slept in with her last night, despite us agreeing this would be a night in her own bed.

I have to deal with this after sis goes home. She is so trying to help me - so i dont feel I can say anything and I would never want to upset her - but it's undoing all the things I've been doing to keep them in their routine since H left. I am probably being over sensitive and should just go with the flow but I am so tired.

Argh, my sis has just come in again and looked at the screen. I have to keep saying, "privacy please!!!! Can I have some time on my own"

Hi MNs
Sounds like we're all having a similiar weekend. Feeling distracted today. About to head down to M's Valley to tromp around with kids, my friend and her DCs and their dog. Oh and my sister.

The thing is my PND isnt going. I am hovering over this huge precipice and the one person I loved and counted on more than anything, is the one person who has suddenly morphed into this alternate nasty man who I dont recognize. I cant get over that bit. I miss my old H. I wish I could have him back and that this horrible "new H" imploded and disappeared.

Now I've made myself cry. Sorry, struggling. Have no space with my sis here. She goes home tomorrow. Am going to try to find someone to go out with tonight to get some space. But also tired tired tired....

When will I get over this?

Grrrr the dog has flea's. Have de flea'd everything, so much for peace and quiet.
H - has cleaned up his emails and cancelled his dating website, so on to my snooping. Gutted. Surprised he didn't say anything to me.

Haven't heard fom him today, I don't expect I will all weekend. I was on such a high yesterday today feels a bit empty. I am going to spring clean DS room and get on with some work.

really looking forward to a nice lie in tomorrow.

eve i am envious

i hope i get to the point that I don't give a fig for what H is up to......cos right now I care a little too much.........