Hello all
Another (brief) returner to this thread...not sure if you all remember me or not??!!?

I have lurked on here since I left the thread but had to come on and say congrats to Baffy and LL :-)

LL- My DD was born at 30+6 (although due to IUGR she was a titchy 2lb 10z!) The time on NICU is hard and the expressing can be a nightmare but it is so worth it :-) DD is 19 mths old now and still BF morning and night!! If you want any advice from someone who has been through it you can contact at myheadisspinning@yahoo.co.uk. Big hugs to you xx

I'm doing great now after a rocky few months I finally saw the light and have started divorce proceedings. Even though it's definitely the right decision and everything is pretty amicable it' still not a nice time but I am muddling through pretty well so far.

My life is FAR better than it has been for a long time . DD and I are doing just fine on our own. STBXH is very much involved in DD's upbringing and sees her at least twice a week. In fact he is more involved than when we were together and in fact bizarrely we get on much better too. I'm getting my social life back and am looking to the future with excitement and hope rather than the apprehension and fear I have had over the past 18 mths.

Just a very quick hello from me and I will try and read to catch up soon.

Things have been hectic here. Ds2 arrived safe and well on his due date - thanks for keeping everyone posted TFM. Just one hour from the first proper contraction to him being delivered!! I was in shock for a good while! Luckily I was in the hospital though!

They offered for me to go home that afternoon too! I swiftly declined that offer and asked to stay in for the night! I definitely needed some quiet time with the new little man to get my head round it all!

Anyway, Ds2 is absolutely gorgeous even though he has a good pair of lungs on him and is nothing like his chilled out laid back big brother! You get about 30 seconds warning for feed time and then all hell brakes loose!!

Things are going well though (apart from the lack of sleep of course). Ds is fantastic with the baby and dh has earnt the 'd' back with his constant help and support no matter what time of the day or night. I'd have been lost without him. Things are really good between us.

Few other things going on though - dh has been given 2 weeks notice and is being made redundant. It's come as a massive shock. So we're frantically looking at our options but I may well be going back to work next month. So once things have settled and I know what is happening from one day to the next, I will get back on MN properly!

LL I just skim read to see how you are and I was so shocked to read that your lo has arrived! CONGRATULATIONS!!!! She sounds absolutely perfect. Was there a reason why she was so early, did I miss that? I will have to read through everything properly.
Sending you lots of love and good wishes to get her home as soon as possible.

Nice to see some of the old faces too - Annie I remember you well and all of your fantastic support and advice. Good to see you too UC.

I will read properly and catch up soon xx

(p.s. I washed my phone in the washing machine!! Don't ask! Really lost my brain this time. Anyway, I've salvaged the sim card but lost everyone's numbers, so if anyone texts me just put a little note to say who it is! And apologies for not texting everyone with the news - now you know why!!!)

Lush - just tried to CAT you and you have choosen not to allow them - you can either change your options or cat me instead.

Lush - Yes hopefully mums medication is sorted now -lots of changes though.

No tips for expressing - i could have fed the whole hospital with mine when i went back to work - but ds would not take anything from a bottle so a total waste of time. I ended up feeding him at night and then he would not feed during the day - but hopefully he turned out ok - awaiting GCSE results now - just dont know where that time went.

I will cat you and then if you are happy i can either email a few of the teabags or post it on the private group on FB.

Good to hear from UC and AGYG - glad all is well with you both
HW - glad your mum is home, though sorry to hear she is not her former self. Did they sort out her medication?

Hi everyone else <waves> I don't want to say her name on mumsnet but if anyone has any ideas as to how I could let you know discreetly, then I'll be happy to fill you all in

Hope Baffy and baby are well. My teeny dd is doing well but still in Neonatal Unit. She is 32+3 and is perfect apart from needing to fatten up. She is full of character already I am finding expressing milk hard work as I don't seem to get much - any experts here?? This is why I am up at this time - in case anyone wonders if I am going mad. Expressing in the middle of the night is supposed to boost prolactin levels

Hi UC - yes i do remember you, glad things are going well.
AGYG - congrats on becoming a mil - i think i am sort of looking forward to that - but hope it is a while yet.

Ginnny - come and have mine for a day to help you get over your broodiness . After today i want to be a nun.

Have a great holiday TFM - anywhere nice? And enjoy your builder free time - i too am fed up of men in my house all the time - but i know it will be worth it when it is finished.

Hi AGYG and UC - Nice to 'see' you!!
Its great to hear you both sounding so positive and happy.
This thread has gone very quiet - I don't know about everyone else but I'm finding that MN is getting a bit rubbish again lately, don't know if that's just my miserable mood or because its the summer holidays but I don't come on here much at all atm.
Anyway I hope everyone is OK and Baffy and Lush are enjoying their lo's and managing to get some sleep .
I've just spent the afternoon with my friend and her 10 month old baby boy - he's adorable and I'm all clucky again!!
Love to everyone else

Hello everybody, I saw the thread on "active discussions" and dipped in. Don't know if you remember me. I don't think I've posted for a year either, like AGYG.

AGYG, I remember you too, good to hear things are going so well.

Congratulations on all the babies - Baffy and Ladylush!

Dior, so sorry to hear things are going badly. Like TFM says, you will get through this, I remember she told me 15 months ago to smile, pretend to smile, and soon you will be smiling for real. It takes time, but it works. And the practical advice is good too. Work out what you want and then go for it. And always remember, one day you will have a man who deserves you - if you want one that is! <<hugs>>

As for me, things only got better after the hell that was March - July last year. I am divorced now, still in what is now MY house with my boys, exH is engaged to OW, and they have a baby due later this year. All of which I take in my stride now. I realised last summer that we weren't right, and it was possible that his leaving was maybe the best thing that could have happened to me in the long run.

In November, I met a fabulous man (internet dating!), who I've been seeing ever since, we have 4 kids between us, and are seeing more and more of eachother - we call ourselves a "composite family". The kids get on, we are happy, and about to go off on our first holiday together on our own while the exes have the children. Can hardly wait.

I also want to say thank you to you all for the support last year. I felt a little guilty about leaving the thread, but I felt I had to concentrate on sorting me out. I think my story is testament to the "it can be done" and "you are strong" advice that we all get and don't believe at times. It really can be done. I know, because I am so much happier now than I think I have ever been....

Sorry if that's patronising - it isn't meant to be.

Love to you all. UC xx

I remember you AGYG!! Gosh, you have been busy yourself. It sounds like you have turned a corner now though and that you are in a good place. Long may it continue! Oh yes, Congratulations on becoming a MIL!

Hi to everyone else. Hope you are all doing ok. I'm trying to pack for our holiday but we still have a house full of workmen so it's rather challenging to say the least. As for Teabags, I', sick of the sight of 'em!! This lot drink far too much tea!

... bah, I said "guys" twice. Probably shouldn't have said it even once. Just pretend I said ladies. Or Teabags. Or amazing godlike beings.

Hey guys

Anyone still remember me? I don't think I've posted for the best part of a year. But I remember you guys, and am astonished at how you've moved on - especially the ones with babies! Many congratulations. It'll take a long while to read back and see everything that's been happening.

As for myself, I've been having an odd few months: divorce sorted, moved into my own house and thought life was going to be swimming from now on, then got sacked from work because I'd spent too long being depressed! So I've been working on the tribunal appeal with extensive help from the union, and job hunting. Just started a new job last week, in fact, at half my previous salary but also half the commuting and so far a great deal less stress. The tribunal case is due to be heard next month. Oh and as of last Monday I am a mother-in-law! You may spit on me if you wish.

congratulations Lush - oh please let us know the name and details - so glad you got your little girl and hope it wasnt too traumatic.

Sorry i havent been around - went away for a few days but have been ill. Dont think it is swine flu though - just some tummy bug. Though i had starved it out of me and then last night felt dreadful again so its back to water for me for the next couple of days - still good for the weight loss . Feeling better today but a bit weak so have taken my first day off sick in 2 years (although only being part time makes it easier).

My mum is out of hospital now and seems to be doing ok - she will never be her old self though and it is horrible to think it will probably be all down hill from now on. I will be there for my dad though as he will need lots of help now.

How are you dior? We must catch up for that coffee soon - otherwise the holidays will be over too.

Hi to everyone else and i will go on facebook and see what i have been missing .

That's probably because you are 'still generally pissed off with life', we tend to be less tolerant of our loved ones when we are feeling discontented. I still stand by what I said on your FB thread , you are too young to be so sensible!

Hi ladies (and baby Teabags!)
Hope you are all doing well.
Thanks MacD and TFM for your advice this weekend. I feel a lot more sorted now, still very pissed off with life in general but I'm just putting my head down and getting on with it like we all have to!
Dior - How are things with you? Hope you are OK.
Lilyloo - I saw your thread when it first started and thought I'd posted but it must have vanished into the ether.
Hope everyone is surviving the Summer Hols so far. I am finding it very trying and am actually quite happy to be at work today - I love the little darlings to bits but they really are trying my patience atm

ooohhh

LL massive congratulations would love to know her little name , TFM let me know!
How is she doing ?

HW no i meant how you are so open and thoughtful giving so many people advice on here in relation to your own situation , i just couldn't!

Haven't really discussed it anymore as been away camping this weekend so that yet to come but thanks for advice ladies

See LL, even the baby was in a rush to open the envelope, so much so she came early

It's so lovely, I'm really happy for you. Would you be able to post her name? If not on here on FB. I for one want all the details xx

Thanks everyone - we did open the envelope today and the sonographer was right .
She wrote "female - I think!" I don't think I'd have believed it though, so glad we didn't open it. Off to do last milking duties of the day so good night all x

Congrats and well done LL

Congrats and well done LL

Congratulations LL.
That's fantastic news - I had a feeling it would be a girl!!!!

CONGRATULATIONS LL!!! I am so happy for you, so very happy. You have got your little girl I am so pleased for you.

Hey, we can open the envelope now!!

You take good care of yourself. Lots of love xxx

OH LadyL - congratulations. I am glad she hung on long enough. Hope all is going well. Take care of yourself xxx

BIRTH ANNOUNCEMENT: dd born 13/7/9 weighing 3lb 10oz (not bad for 30+5 weeks). She is in hospital neonatal unit but doing very well. She is adorable . I am expressing pretty much all day so shattered as well as emotionally wrung out but was discharged from hospital yesterday and it's lovely to be home with ds and dh again (though heartbreaking to be away from dd).
Will catch up properly when I can.

Hi Everyone.
I have posted a thread on FB as I'm too paranoid to put it on here.
Hope everyone is OK and looking forward to the summer hols

Hi

My mum is still not out of hospital - she is not ill as such just not able to handle her diabetes on her own any longer so there will be carers coming in to help her. It is quite wearing but i am trying not to get too involved and let my father do what he needs to do. I know i can be a bit of a control freak at times.

Dior hope you are ok

Lilly - your thread has caused quite a stir and there is a real divide.
I agree with what TFM says and try not to let him make you feel guilty for how you feel about it.

Hi to everyone else

Off to london for a few days at the weekend, so better make sure i have my credit cards.

Morning ladies

Dior, how are you today? I hope you are ok x

HW how is your mum? Is she home? How are you coping? x

Lily I haven't posted on your thread but I just want to say I agree with HW. If this were me I would tell DH to take everything into consideration i.e finances and make his own decision, a decision that he feels is best for your little family and not just for himself, not lay it all at your door so that he can hold it against you for 'stopping' him from going when in fact you won't be stopping him, you are just being the adult and considering the financial implications. Hope that makes sense. We have got workmen in and I am so tired, my brain is mangled

Hope everyone else is ok? It's pouring down here, only one more trip to school in the rain and then six weeks off!! Yippee!!!

no probs lilly - was i so open??
But i dont think you are being unreasonable at all and given what you have been through i would have thought he would have been a bit more understanding too. Hope things are ok now though and he has seen that he was just being a bit selfish about it. Let us know how it goes.

Dior so sorry to hear things have turned so nasty with your h.
I am in tbh that he thinks he can reason with you why you should question who you are!
You are a very strong person and you can do this. Esp with the teabags help! Not sure i can be classed as one of them as not around enough but they are fab strong women!!!!!!!

HW thanks for your help on thread , i cannot be as open as you but share the rolled eyes at the opportunity to be young and free and single i'm sure

Why would he think you could turn into your sister? - i am afraid i may turn into my mother ffs.
I am sorry to say he is just putting the blame firmly back onto you.
You could turn into all sorts of things but that shouldnt stop hiim loving you now.

Anyone of our partners COULD turn into a nasty piece of work but if we all lived in fear of that we would not have any realationships.

Dior you are a wonderful person - always seemed lovely to talk to .You are talented with your crafts (which i am still in awe of btw - as i cant even trace neatly).

How ridiculous if i were to say 'sorry dont want to meet up with you again in case you really are a nutcase!!!!!?????'

And wrt to how you will manage - you will be fine - it may not seem it when you are trying to work out all the money - but you will be ok.
Take all the help you can and remember we will ask for you help again soon so dont feel bad in anyway for leaning on us now. I for one still have a house of housework you can do for me in return.

Stop apologising - that's what we are here for.
You have supported all of us at one time or another -now its your turn.
x

Please don't apologise Dior, we are all here for you, you be as needy as you like. You sound to have made a good start anyway, making the decision to sleep separately from him means you have taken some control. Good for you!! His expecting a kiss after he has been so cruel is pure arrogance if you ask me. A kiss is the last thing he should expect, a slap more like

Try not to worry about the unknown. The more you worry about what might happen the more likely you are to talk yourself out of taking action. Just set yourself little goals, i.e tomorrow ring a solicitor and book an appointment. When the appointment is made you can stop worrying about what might happen until you have discussed all your options. I think once you have talked things through with a solicitor you will feel much better.

Meanwhile, zone out from H. Concentrate on yourself and shut him out of your mind as much as is possible. In fact, try to keep out of his way physically too, when he enters a room you leave it. Do whatever it takes to protect yourself emotionally. I don't mean to sound patronizing Dior so forgive me but, you are in a very vulnerable state already with your depression. Don't let him drag you down further. Just look ahead to the wonderful, carefree and happy life you are going to have in the future xx

My choice to sleep apart, not his. He also said, 'I look at your sister and keep thinking that YOU could end up like that'. .

Oh, and I'm NOT strong at the moment. I will need all your support to do this. Sorry to be needy!

Thanks girls. I am sitting here in tears now because you are all so lovely. We have been polite to each other since the chat. The next morning, he tried to kiss me goodbye and seemed offended when I gave him 'the cold shoulder'. I need to have the conversation about splitting, but I am really shitting myself about having to leave the house and not being able to afford to live.

I DID tell him that I would rather be alone than be with someone who doesn't love me for ME. He seemed surprised and we have been sleeping seperately for the last two nights.

Oh Dior

I feel so angry for you too.
And just to echo Macdoodle - no not all men are like this - my h (with all his other faults) does not give a shit about my weight either and only tells me i look lovely and sexy ..... And having met Mcd i feel i can say this - we are similar in size (and that is bigger than you dior)!!!!

I know you have defended him in the past saying that he is right that you need to lose weight (and maybe you do a bit - i know i do).

BUT that is not the most important thing in the world - and if is then he really is a complete and utter fuckwit.

He knows you feel bad about your weight and he is repeatdly using your weakness to control and emotionally abuse you. That really is not love is it?

If you need support to sit with you just give a call anytime and if you want some company to visit a solicitor i will be happy to.

But you know what dior you will get through this and see how he has dragged you down - and you wont need our support because you are a fantastic strong person anyway. But we are here anyway .

Dior - HOW FUCKING DARE HE.
Not all men are like this. He is saying that to keep you under his control. Not all men are as shallow and controlling as him and you deserve to be loved for the beautiful person you are inside and not be cosntantly judged by how much you weigh/eat etc.
So he's been 'patient' with you? Well give the man a medal . You have put up with so much over the years Dior and its time you stood up to him and moved on.
You will be fine, go to the CAB and check out what your options are.
We will all help you through this.
((((((big un-Mumnsnetty hug for you}}}}}

You know wht Dior - he is a fuckwit of the highest order!!!!!!!!!!! I am so so so for you I could just spit !!!
All men are NOT NOT like this - my lovely lovely new DP honestly does not give a SHIT how fat I am (and I am pretty fat at the moment), he says he loves me all the time, calls me sexy , cant keep his hands off me , never ever comments on my weight/clothes (other than to tell me I look nice)/what I am eating/exercise, and actually genuinely looks suprised when i say I am fat and need to lose weight
My lovely best friend has been married for 20 years, she is as big as me, her DH adores her, they still have sex A LOT, he compliments her IN PUBLIC, yes they argue but I dont think he has ever criticised her weight (and she is at least 5 stone more than when they got married), I could give you loads of examples!

And as for being ok, darling you will be more than ok, I promise you, you will manage be happy and thrive, and when you want to lose weight for YOU, then you will!

First step go and see a solicitor, it will calm you down and rationalise things for you!

Please dont let him bully and hurt you anymore!!!

Right! Action stations! First thing, don't worry, you are going to be just fine. You will find the strength to deal with this, you will show him that you can not and will not be controlled and be bullied any longer. You are going to take him by surprise and knock the wind out of his sails! The GIT!!

Could you make a free half hour appointment with a solicitor? Write everything down before you go, all the questions you want answers to so that you don't waste any of the time.

Take figures with you such as his salary, how much you think the house is worth etc. I wonder if you would be entitled to legal aid, in your own right, because you don't work.

Now is the time for the worm to turn!! Don't let him treat you like this. Who the hell does he think he is?? If it were me I would have his bags packed and ready at the door for when he came home. He could find somewhere else to live while things were sorted.

Above all else do not let the fact you are worried or scared stop you from taking action!! We are with you all the way and will help you as much as we can. Lots of love xx

Sorry to rain on the baby parade . Problems with h.

The other night, things about weight got out of hand again. He told me that he had 'been really patient' with me over the issue in the last year. He said that all men are like him and that I should hear some of the things HE has heard from men re fat women. He is worried that I am going to end up like my sister. He loved me as I was when we married.

I am now working up to The Conversation with him. The thing is, I have no idea hwat I am entitled to and if I'll be able to stay in the house. Last time it came to this, I had a part-time job. My parents have offered any financial help I need, but I need to know how to be alright without their help, in case I need to be.

Please help me.

Congrats Baffy thanks TFM for mail
lovely name , hope he is an easy going lo !!!

Hi Ladies

Baffy sends her love and thanks for all of your love and good wishes. She will come and update us as soon as she gets a chance. Would you believe she actually apologised for not having checked in already!!

New baby Baffy is doing really well and Baffy says has a good pair of lungs on him!

Hope everyone is ok. Especially LL, I'm thinking of you, hope you and baby are ok, not seen you around for a while.

xx

Cogratulations Baffy, we all knew you had it in you ! (sorry, that's a VERY old joke!) Hope DS1 is enjoying his new baby brother and we look forward to the photos.
HUUUGE hug to you all!

Many many congratulations baffy.

Lots of love xx

Congratulations Baffy!!!!
I bet he's just gorgeous.
Am very

well done baffy - as i see we are near the end of this thread we much think of a name for the new babies.

Any news from lush yet?

TFM can you email me too with the name?

LOL! He is a boy, but we have known that for ages!! Baffy found out at the scan and shared the news with us way back. As for his name it's a lovely name but I'm not sure I should post it on here, don't feel it's my place to blab something so personal. I will email you!

Erm...boy or girl? Name? C'mon TFM, get it sorted!

CONGRATS!!! to Baffy. xxx

Roll up Ladies, I have an announcement to make!!

Baby Baffy arrived safely but quickly an hour ago weighing 7lb 12oz. Very fast, no time for pain relief but both doing great

Well Done Baffy!!! xxx

or she is stalking us all tannee.

To be honest, we've hardly seen her so far. She seems very nice, gave us some turkish pastries made by her mother, is an architecture student but speaks very little english - but then, that's why she's here. Didn't see her at all this morning - hope she's ok, but she's added me as a friend on facebook so she can't hate us...yet...

ggo luck Tannee - i really am not sure i could have someone else living with us - especially if they are to see 'real british life'.

Fingers crossed for Baffy - ooh, so exciting, makes me feel quite broody - also for LL and your little unopened envelope !
Up late due to watching my secret vice - Upstairs Dowstairs - made me almost cry. We have our first foreign student of the year today. Young Turkish architecture student with very basic english - guess she feels as nervous as we do but it will pay for a new shower - ours broke last week. I do rather miss losing 'my room' for the next 4 weeks. I didn't realise how much I'd made it my own until I had to move all my stuff out of the drawers!

HW I am so sorry to hear this I can imagine how stressful and frustrating it is I hope you are trying to look after yourself a bit too!
I cant really advice without knowing a bit more though this is not unusual in hospitl medicine - is it your aim to get her home with your dad or are you considering a home ??
Please feel free to email me am happy to make some suggestions if it would help or vene just be an understanding friendly ear

Lush - i think she needs a mental capacity test - however because of both her conditions no-one is willing to do ANYTHING . Both conditions can cause mental confusion at times and so both teams seem to be playing ping-pong as to why she is like she is. It is also so erratic and there seems to be no real reason for why she is so much worse at certain times - we have tried to link it to blood sugars and to her drug regime and there really doesnt seem to be a clear link to either. but of course the nurses can just pass the buck and say 'well that it the nature of these diseases' but without a clear pattern it is becoming impossible to care for her. If we knew her 'down time' was afternoons say we could plan for that.

The only good thing is that she is there and until they do manage to get her stable they will not be able to pass her onto anyone else. Its nearly 3 weeks now that we keep hearing the same things ' oh thats unusual we would expect xyz to work...' YES thats what we have be saying for the last few weeks too and getting nowhere except a sore head from banging it against a wall.

Anyway thanks again everyone for listening to my rants.

HW - has anyone suggested a mental capacity test? Can't remember if you mentioned that before.

Thanks lush - i didnt think that last post of mine worked as new computer doing odd things - found out ds has been using it [angry[.

Been to see my mum again today and pretty much as before she is still going downhill but no-one will take charge. I almost swore at a nurse today who just seemed to think my mum was putting some of it on for attention,
I did demand to see a dr who was surprised at my mums condition (she said she had not seen her like that before) - however i asked if the nurses had not reported how bad she was and it appears that no one is. At least this dr could see just how incapable she was and understood why we feel unable to care for her properly at home.

Hi everyone, just a quick post to let you know that all is well with Baffy. She is seeing the consultant on Monday and if there is no sign of baby she will hopefully be induced next week. She is in good spirits though.

Hope everyone is doing ok. HW I am thinking of you. And you too envelope Ladylush. I will keep you updated on Baffys progress. Have a lovely weekend everyone xx

HW - oh dear I'm afraid working as an auxillary nurse on medical wards put me off general nursing. I hated the fact that I was not allowed to feed patients because there was a set routine of washing them at a particular time, checking blood pressure/blood sugar etc. No flexibility at all. One poor man (had Huntingtons)used to get his food put on the table and had no help to eat. Most of the time the fork completely missed his face - let alone his mouth. Food and fluids are basics - if we can't get that right what is the point in nursing? In your mum's case I agree that they need to sort out her treatment and I would suggest that the Diabetic Cons and the Neurologist need to meet to thrash it out. I don't think my friend would be able to advise in this situation because of the confusion with her current treatment. Another problem in elderly medicine in particular is polypharmacology resulting in toxicity causing confusion. It clouds the clinical picture +++. Hope you get some answers soon. It sounds like a case conference is much needed. Could you request one?

fantastic lush - Glad the consultant backed me up

yes i would love to get more info re.mum - trouble is she is diabetic and poorly controlled - this seems to be the main problem at the moment with her blood sugars running very high - but when they try changing the insulin she goes into a hypo - however she is also on a cocktail of drugs for ?? parkinsons - (i have my doubts she was ever properly diagnosed) But mu has been happy to take this cocktail of drugs and it would be difficult to go back now. so the diabetic team are 'blaming her parkinsons drugs and the neurologists are saying the drugs are not working because of her erratic blood sugar.

Hospital is not the best place but my dad cant look after her well and certainly wont be able to keep her blood stable if the hospital cant after nearly 3 weeks.
The level of care is dreadful though - last night no-one seemed to know what my mum had been up to - the nurses say we need to talk to the dr but what do they know they only see her a few minutes each day? The nurses are very busy and whilst i appriciate the cannot keep tabs on patients all day it would be nice to know if she has been fed and watered at least.

its all the things i have to juggle that is getting me down - yesterday i spent the whole day doing things for everyone else.
Buying kit for ds for his trip away - watching dd do ballet, get school uniform ready for evening (prize giving at school), then took 2 dds to ballet - grabed some pressies for teachers, visited mum collected dds and then went onto prize-giving.
H is good but he just doesnt understand and wanted to go out for a meal with dc last night (thinking it would help me[hmm[). They are all grumpy from lack of sleep already, the house looks as if a bomb has hit it. H in his usual manner has arranged for builders to be here and there is a thick layer of dust everywhere. AGHHHHHHHH.

There feeling better already - i am off to work today and so h has taken the day off - he can deal with it all now. Trouble is he just does not see it the way i do and certainly does not seem to have the guilt of feeling as though i am slowing sinking under this pile of washing.

At least next week there will be no cries for 'where is my pe kit' followed by me saying 'well did you put it out to be washed?'.

HW - Keep your chin up and keep well in yourself. If you need to get away at any time, you know where I am x

TFM - tell Baffy we are asking after her. Glad all is ok.

HW - sorry to hear your mum is going downhill Are you getting enough info from the team treating her? Have they tested her cognitive functioning? My friend is a nurse practitioner for Elderly Medicine. I could ask her advice on investigations/management if you like.
Re. scan - you'll be pleased to know that the doctor I saw today did use the info from the sonographer. He also told me the same thing as you - that as long as baby's growth is between the 5th and 95th centile they do not worry about growth. He said the doppler results are particularly important in terms of assessment of growth - and mine were fine.
I have a proper management plan now
Twice weekly visits to the hospital for clinical and chemical monitoring (weekly scan inc. doppler, bloods, fetal monitoring). C-section at 34 weeks unless any sign of infection before that/changes in lliquor/pains in which case delivery likely to be earlier. At my gestation 90-95% babies ahave a very good prognosis at this hospital and baby would be out of NICU and with me within the week. At 34 weeks baby would be with me within hours So I am a happy lady today.

Dior - well done for joining the gym I am sure you will feel better for it. I did when I was going.

TFM - baby has given me enough surprises. I might as well let it surprise me again - so no, I will not be opening the envelope

LL - I know! 5 weeks maximum - not long at all. Yikes. Nothing ready. Room not painted.
Oh well.

Brilliant dior - just wish i had the time to join a gym at the moment.
Mum not doing too well - she seems to be going downhill - and i am not sure she is really being 'cared' for in hospital. She needs reminding to drink and eat and there is never anyone around who is looking after my mum to check this with - i have no doubt they are busy and doing their best but it still makes me so to see her like this.

Googleing all sorts of dementia sites as i am sure there is some there but as with a lot of these type of diseases we could all be sufferers.

End of term tomorrow for us and ds is off treking somewhere exotic (although not jealous as it is camping and you know how much i hate camping).

Also had the most delicious home grown veg last night and even the dc commented on how yummy it was.

Hi to everyone - still enjoying the last few rays of sunshine as it meant to be raining this weekend.

Well Done Dior!!! Thats brilliant and I am proud of you. You go for it!! You will soon have pecs to be proud of

Yes, LL and Baffy I agree with Dior, we are now dropping the honorary!

Forget honorary! We are almost flesh and blood now you know!

I joined a gym on Tuesday and had my first session last night. I am going for my induction this morning - in about ten minutes. I am definitely on an upswing in mood this week and the exercise is going to help. It is also making me want to eat less crap, which has to be a good thing!

Morning Ladies I hope everyone is enjoying the the lovely weather.

LL I am thinking of you and also hope the little one hangs on for as long as possible. You see, even the baby is in a hurry to open the envelope
Oh, an my money is on a baby!! But, I do feel it could be a little boy. Difficult one this, it would be much easier if we knew what was in that blooming envelope!

How's your mum HW? I hope you are still coping ok.

I have had a text from Baffy and she is fine, just busy with preparation for baby and life in general. She sounds very happy though Baby is due on the 10th if I remember correctly so we are on a countdown now!! Ooh it's exciting, all these baby Teabags. I hope we get to see photo's!! And can we be honourory (sp) Aunties please????

glad i can help lush - i have never had any problems with pregnancy so really have no idea how it feels - but i try and listen and learn.
Like i said try not to worry that the baby is not growing as these measurements are so tricky and as a sonographer we get just as frustrated with the drs as they seem to not use them anyway - and will act on other factors. I will put my money on a girl too.

LL that's only 5 weeks away hope lo hangs on until then. Nah i guess a girl

Thanks for that HW - very helpful information Yes, I meant that baby was at the upper end of the range in the 22 week scan and now at 29 weeks is at the lower end of the same scale.

lush - when you said such a difference from 22 week scan do you mean baby was at upper end of normal range and now is in lower range?

Dont forget we are talking millimetre measurements and as long as the baby is within the range there is nothing too much to worry about. Like i said with different sonographers and different machines and the baby in a different position it is possible to get results that can appear worrying.

The main thing is that on the 2 weekly measurements there is not a change - it is often the abdomen measurement that drops first too. Unfortunately though until you have at least 3 scans it will be impossible to see the trend - which is why u/s is not the best indicator for how well the baby is doing.

Lush - oh it is a worry - they can survive with very little fluid but obviously best not too. And it would be very difficult to see the genitals without the fluid.

The fetal weight is estimated by measuring the circumference of the abdomen at a certain level - which is more tricky with less fluid. There are charts which then tell the fetal weight - the problem is of course these charts were compiled a while ago and often with babies that were at risk anyway so not as accurate as they could be. The weight given would have been as of that moment and as you know in the last few weeks babies can put on an ounce a day! It is usual to do head and abdomen measurements to make sure the baby is growing at the same rate. However with breach babies the head can be a slightly different shape and so accurate measurements can be difficult.
As you can see there are so many variables and the information needs to be looked at in a balanced way it is difficult for the drs to interpret exactly what the results may have shown. Look for problems and you will often find something to worry about . Along with the culture of the nhs to cover their backs because of fear of legal action - and you end up with frustrations all round. One of the main reasons i am glad i am not in the nhs anymore - i am not very good at staying neutral.

The main thing is they are monitoring baby for any fetal distress and will be prepared to go in. But i do understand your frustration at wanting to find out everything that is going on - i suspect the staff are not allowed to say anything much.

Fingers crossed for you and hope you can hang in there for as long as possible.

oh LL what a worry for you - must say I am less than impressed with your initial management
I have everything crossed for you and LO - he/she will be a teeny one But perfect I have no doubt xx

Sorry guys - being quite self-absorbed at the mo. Will catch up when I can.

HW - I went for m/w appt. today. I questioned the lack of plan. She was also concerned so looked into it then told me that the NICE guidelines for management of women with PROM has changed and that's why I wasn't offered a scan or regular checks. Anyway, I had to hang around a while for blood tests and afterwards she called me back. Suddenly everything had changed and I was booked for a scan today. She questioned the rationale with the fetal medicine unit. If the doctor I saw last week had done that I'd have been scanned a week ago. It does concern me that there is so much inconsistency and that you only get action when you repeatedly question plans (it must frustrate the clinicians as well).
So............scan showed extremely little fluid. So little fluid that it was hard for her to see clearly. I am hoping that may mean her measurements are off as baby measuring on the small size for dates - though still within range. Compared with my 22 week scan though there is a substantial difference - which imo is not explained by the PROM as that only happened a week ago. By the way how on earth does a sonographer estimate that baby is a certain weight? Surely that must be very hard to guess. She estimated 2lbs 12 oz.
Most useful was the information that baby is breach - unlikely to turn as no fluids. So I am looking at a C-Section at 34 weeks.
Current plan is twice weekly bloods for CRP and FBC and fortnightly scans. I am seeing the cons. on thursday morning. The dr wanted to keep me in due to the risks associated with prem labour and breach presentation but I requested to go home to discuss with dh and review plan on Thurs. So that's it in a nutshell! What a naughty baby. It surely must be a boy!!

Go Tannee!! That's the spirit.
Silly man - he's so lucky to have you he should be jumping for joy. Still at least he's being nice now ( at taking rubbish out - DP doesn't even know where my wheely bin is!!)

Hi everyone, sorry not been around - absolutely mad at work due to holiday leave. I am trying to do ten jobs at once and the heat is oppressing!

Lush - hope things are ok with you now.

Dior and HW, am still up for lunch only I won't have any littlies along

McD - at your XH - well, I can only think OW must be thrilled at the bargain she has got!

All well here again. DP is being very sweet - I think I really called his bluff the weekend before last, and I put it in an email to him too, so he knows I mean business. He can push off any time he wants! Only I've made it clear that if he wants to sell, HE can do all the work. As a result, he has been much nicer to me AND to DD - though she is still avoiding him and will cut him no slack - and why should she! I'm keeping on my guard, and if he shows any slackening, will come down on him like a ton of bricks. He IS a good man, but a seriously damaged one, but thanks to our lovely TFM I am learning to control that damage, I think - and if things go belly up I still know I'll survive, even if he doesn't. At the moment he is being very much the man I want to be with and I am taking every care to keep it that way! He even put out the rubbish last night! A First!

Would love to x

Dior - yes with at least some of mine.

Lush - the trouble with seeing if the baby is growing is that unless you do a series of scans you cannot track the growth. Is there a problem or is it a rogue reading, is your baby naturally on the large/small size. Even doing 2 scans will only tell the growth between those 2 dates and if there has been a problem it may not be detected until at least 3-4 scans have been performed. Looking at the placenta gererally is also subjective and later in pregnancy it is usual for there to be areas of change all over the placenta and calcification too. Placenta previa is unlikely as you are leaking fluid and not blood - and would have been noted on your intial scan.
The other option is to do a doppler - to see if there is a restriction to the blood to the placenta - but again without baseline measurement may not give you reassurance - and again needs to be done with an experienced sonographer who can interprut the readings correctly. These are usually performed if there appears to be a problem with the growth, or if your blood pressure is very high (i expect you feel as if your blood pressure is high anyway!!!).

Not wanting to put u/s out of bussiness but too many of the junior dr use it incorrectly. When i was pregnant with no. 4 and not working at the hospital i was under an dr wanted to send me for growth scans as i appeared large for dates - i argued against it as i knew it was a waste of time - the dr thougth i was being stoppy and made me see the consultant who just backed me up and told the dr off.

But still hoping things are ok for you and i totally understand why you need the reasurances.

HW - I suppose I'd like to know that baby is growing ok and that the placenta is working. I read on another thread that a woman went into premature labour or so they thought - if they hadn't scanned her they wouldn't have known that it was a placental abruption. That could've been fatal for her and the baby.

HW - would love to meet - do you mean WITH kids? Ds would no doubt LOVE that! I know a lovely place where they can run around and we can have civilised coffee and cake...

Lush - not sure regular scans are the way to go - yes they do reassure to a point - the main reason i think you should have one is to establish the liquor volume - there are different methods to do this but it is mainly subjective (as is most u/s), so unless you have the scans with the same sonographer each time it may well be more of a worry for you. And even if they do find you have what is considered a reduced amount of fluid you need to know what they are going to do. If your consultant would not do anything anyway what is the point.

Can you tell i get a bit of bee in my bonnet regarding over use of u/s?.

But i wish you were nearer so i could give you peek at what is going on in there - unfortuantely i would have to tell the other teabags exactly what is in that envelope.

Good luck anyway.

McD - so glad NM is still being so lovely - do you think you dont trust yourself to have a good relationship? Or cant trust him fully?, and so you are keeping your defences up?

Hi to everyone else - may well call on you dior for some distraction in the hols - can we meet up in your town sometime?

MacD - what a wanker your xh is. Thank feck he's an ex. I'm prepared for lo coming early but am hoping I might be the exception who hangs on til term - or at least a few weeks before term. I am taking my temp and pulse 4 times a day and so far no cause for concern. I had bi-daily CTGs when I was admitted for 3 days last week - all fine. I am using the doppler at home to check hb (not as good as CTG but better than nothing). I also had FBC and CRP bloods and swab - all normal. Oh and urinanalysis - again normal. What I really want though is a proper management plan with regular scans. That's what I'm going to ask for when I see the cons. on Thursday.

Dior - we were posting at the same time then!! Glad you are feeling better. Gym membership sounds like a good idea,they say exercise is a good antidepressant.

Bloody Hell MacD! Talk about double standards. He can bring OW to pick up DD with him but you can't have your DP there when he does? What a dick!! DP sounds like he handled it well though. What a star!
DP is doing really well. I think the FB status was when we had planned to go out one Friday night but he started his night out at midday and wondered why I didn't want to join him in the pub at 7.00 when he was off his face . I ended up having a girly night in with my best friend and actually had a better time anyway. Apart from that we are getting on great. His Mum's birthday is coming up and I know that will set him off again but I'll weather the storm as usual
LL keep your legs crossed. Hope lo stays in there a bit longer
Sorry to hear about your Mum HW. Hope she gets better soon.
Dior - how are you feeling? Hope things are improving.
It looks like its going to be another hot week so hope you all enjoy the sunshine.

McD - offend? not at all. Sounds like your h is still being a wanker difficult...maybe OW will see him without the rose-tinted glasses as a result!

HW - sending you a big hug and glass of something alcoholic medicinal. Sorry your mum is not good and your dad is not stepping up to the mark. Can I do anything to help?

Things here slightly better on the depression front. I have an appointment with a consultant in a week. H is 'worried' about me being so overweight as he is concerned for my health. I am incredibly unfit and get so hot in this weather. He has said we can pay for me to have a gym membership, so I am going to look into it this week.

LLush - keep everything crossed - literally! Hope things ok this weekend.

Everyone else - not sure what to say except thanks for all the support.

Up and down here !
DP is a star - came down - booked a holiday for us (only Butlins but DD1 is desperate to go, and as he was paying didnt want to take the piss ), surprised me with a lovely birthday present! He is lovely, but am to say that I do get annpyed with him sometimes because he is so lovely - grrr am never happy am I !!!!

XH is an arse!! He came to get DD1 and happened to be the 10min I had to pop out to do a favour for my best friend - so DP was watching both girls - well he lost it and threatened DP, pushed him , then waited for me and threatened me as well - had to get OW (oh yes she had brought him up to get DD1 apparantly that is ok though) out of her car to get him to leave, told her I would call police if he didnt go - actually felt sorry for her watching her trying to pacify him and calm him down, while I had lovely calm supportive DP inside, who was wonderful!! Onwards we go day at a time ....

Oh LL am sorry to hear that xx
I am sure you know that this baby is going to come early no matter what you do now it is just a matter of how long LO stays put - the biggest risk is infection - are they monitoring you?? Temp, bloods etc?? they should be, and regular scans and CTG's as well??
Equally though LO will be fine, prems do SOOOOOO well nowadays especially when they are expected and planned - I am sure you have had steroids for lung maturity!
It will be ok but it will be different to DS - am thinking of you loads xxx

HW, am so sorry to hear about your mum xx How is she doing, how are you doing ?? I understand your thoughts of H, think of yourself first and he will follow

Tannee I dont really know what to say, I think you know my feelings.There is only so long you can use depression and alcohol as an excuse for shotty crappy behaviour
He treats you so badly I am sorry, you deserve so very much more IMHO, I think you are amazing!
I am at what he said about DD, IMO thats pretty low, what exactly did he want you to say/do in response to that??
You are so strong, I just think you deserve to be happy and treated like a queen !!

Dior ?? How are you doing, how are things?? I hope I didnt offend with my last post

Ginny ?? How are you, how is P, I saw a FB status update a while back ?? Whats up is it ok now??

Anyone else, anyone heard from Baffy?? Surely she is nearly due now
TFM
Hope everyone else is ok xx

yes lush makes complete sense unless you are a man and then it just looks as though you are being an unreasonable bitch giving everyone a hard time. And the awful thing is i know i am being one too - just cant seem to stop myself at times.

Father is still being a bit slow with the being the carer role and just wants someone else to tell him what to do so that he can not take responsibility - aghhhhhh.

Still another week - school uniforms ready, homework done and house - well tidy enough for now roll on the school holidays when i can at least blame them for my lack of drive .

Thanks for advice happywoman - yes that makes sense. I would like to know how much fluid is there. I understand how you feel - it's a defensive thing. Also though you may forgive you never forget being badly let down by a loved one and in times when you feel extra vulnerable it makes sense that you would want to protect yourself. You look at the situation with your mum and put yourself in her shoes...........makes complete sense.

Dh is being really good - which makes it worse in a way. I feel as though i am a different person and its one i dont really like.
Although i do like feeling independent and in fact more and more i feel this.
I know men are crap at being the carers and so i feel i also need to 'prepare' it for myself too if ever i was ill.

Feel i just want to go and join some commune of woman where we will all look after each other - oh i have its called the teabags .
Thanks for listening.

Lush - i think they should do and ultrasound to establish that there are some pockets of fluids at least. Although dont panic too much - the amount of fluid around the baby can be very different in each pregnancy. And although you may feel as if you are leaking loads it may not be enough to cause a problem. I know i had masses of fluid every time. But do take it easy all the same.

Good point Iamnotabill. I was also going to say that if you tell dh how you are feeling he is less likely to feel shut out. He might appreciate being able to do something practical for you if you don't need emotional support e.g. cooking, cleaning, taking the kids out to give you some space or buying you a treatment etc.

I'm sorry you are having such a hard time too HW. I'm sorry to hear about your mum, it must be very difficult for you. Please don't feel bad for wanting to do things your way, there is nothing wrong with wanting to be strong and independent, just tell your H how you feel and then perhaps he will give you the space you need (without taking the hump! )

Thinking of you too xx

Hi HW - sorry your mum has taken a turn for the worse . I'm not surprised that you're angry with your dad but remember he is a man and they are a bit crap at these things - especially when their dw is ill. It's like their anchor is gone. I saw dh looking very stressed this past week as he's not used to me being in a vulnerable state.
They are not monitoring fluids. I wish they would. I lost a lot when I was in hospital (first night). I am drinking a fair bit to try and top up as much as possible. I'm seeing the cons. next thursday so I need to compile a list of questions that dh and I can ask. I've been trawling the prem births threads on mumsnet to try and prepare myself a bit. I am still in disbelief a bit that lo will be coming early as ds was so big. I suppose every day it can hang on is better as it will mean less time in hospital and I don't relish the thought of coming home without baby let alone spending weeks apart.

lush are they monitoring how much fluid there is - it may be that just some of the fulid is leaking?
The lots of movement may also be due to the fact that there is less fluid and so you are not cushioned from the kicks as such.
Hope you are getting lots of rest and that baby stays put for a bit longer - each day the risk is lessened - but you probably already knew that anyway.

Mum - is not doing so well again and had a 'funny' turn when i went to visit.
I am feeling very stressed as i feel out of control and want to do the best for her and it seems the hospital is not the right place. My father is not helping and seems to have gone into victim mode which makes me cross too.

I can feel myself getting very angry with everyone again but cant seem to stop myself - h is also getting it in the neck from me. I know i am pushing him away when he is trying ot help but i also feel i want to stay strong and indepedent.

Weather hot and humid here which also doesnt help - the hospital is soo hot.

Thinking about you LL and praying baby stays put xx

Hi to everyone, hope you are all having a good weekend. We are

Baby still inside me Still leaking fluid but I guess that will happen now. Feeling ok. No sign of infection. Every day is a bonus.

I was wondering about Baffy as well.

Hi Lilyloo

Ginnny, our DPs must be twins separated at birth! Enjoy your sportsday and have a Pimms for me

Lush - - after seeing my baby nephew I knew what my BIL will look like when he's 90 (only taller, of course)

Hope everyone's enjoying the sunshine. Seems like a perfect English Summer's Day.

morning all

LL hope lo stays put for longer , that must have been a real shock!

Has B had her lo yet ?

TFM love the new name

McD i am so with you on the lo's being hard work. DD2 would have been my last if she had come first. She is into everything and climbs on everything! Had a real shock last week when i almost ran over her Ginny thanks for your comment was a real

Will try and catch up what i have missed

Lush - glad all is well with baby, you must have been scared after all you've been through so far.
Better open that envelope - put poor TFM out of her misery before she bursts!!

Hey Tannee!!! A month it is then
Obviously you are handling him just right. By not rising to his silly "selling up" threats he backs down, which goes to prove its not what he wants at all. Next time he does it just say " whatever"!!!
We have trouble dealing with arguments too. DP hates arguing and will not argue back with me. So I shout and yell and its all over and done with and soon out of my system, whereas he will brood and sulk (and drink) and it takes him days to get over it and thinks we should split up. He can't seem to get it that all couples argue and its quite healthy, but its how you deal with it afterwards that makes the difference.
Oh well - another sports day this afternoon. I fancy a jug of Pimms!!!

lol at "wizened version of his father"

LL - glad to hear things are holding up with baby - what a worry though! Keep that cervix shut and open the envelope ! (TFM is very naughty!) If it's any comfort, my sister had your experience with her first - my nephew decided he was bored inside and popped out at 7 months, so weeny he was, like a wizened version of his father and we were all worried. He's now 16, tall and gangly, and scarily intelligent as well as extraordinarily funny. He got terrified by an apple strudel on Father's Day and had us in fits.

Ginnny, TFM, we would need a WEEK at least to chatter. And if HW, Dior and McD joined us, a month!

HW glad to hear your mother is coming out soon (of hospital, that is). If your father is anything like mine, he's panicking at having to do the caring instead of being cared for! Hope things go well.

DP is behaving better again. He seems to have these 'selling up' fits about once a month at the moment - every time we have a disagreement, he takes this stance. I think it's because, as he himself has admitted, he hates arguments and is no good at them, and nor am I. We both get emotional in different ways. But whilst I accept that all couples have disagreements and you weather them (my parents have been yelling at each other for 60 years) - he sees it as terminal, he's a failure, we're a failure and he wants to escape. After the latest, though, he's done a couple of things he's never done before - actually left me a note when he went out on Tuesday night (normally he would just disappear without telling me) and left a note for DD yesterday, passing on a phone message. Normally he doesn't even answer the phone! DD was quite disconcerted! So things are improving again, but I'm still on my guard. Don't worry TFM, I haven't forgiven him yet!

Hi everyone - nope defo not avoiding anyone Like the new name TFM Sorry just a quick update for now - will catch up on all your news soon.

Have been in hospital past few days. D/c yesterday evening. My membranes ruptured on Monday whilst I was at work. So a bit of a shock, to say the least. I was only 27+5 weeks. No idea why. No pains and fluids are clear. Cervix closed. No sign of infection as yet, which is the main risk to me/baby. Have been monitored 4 times a day and my obs have been consistently within normal range. Had steroid injections just in case baby decides to come early. What a rollercoaster this pregnancy is turning out to be. Baby is doing fine and moving about a lot. CTG traces were fine. Have to go back to hospital next week to see consultant.

Hi everyone
Sunshine is lovely here - we had a fantastic sports day, and a couple of medals for DS1 and DD2, DD4 has hers tomorrow after her school trip today.
My brain cant cope at the moment - there are so many end of term things going on, And i havent even seen a single match at wimbledon.

My mum is still in hospital but should be coming out soon - my dad is not looking forward to having to do the care though and is being a bit awkward at the mo.

Not sure what is worse kids or parents .

And thanks for the comment on my new name. I've had a couple of compliments on it now, I might just keep it!! Well I get plenty of 'time for me' now so maybe it's time for a change.

Hi Ginny! Lovely to hear from you. I thought you had all started anew thread and left me behind

With regards to a meet up yes, I reckon a weekend might be a good start, I can talk a lot once I get going you know. I bet that surprises you doesn't it?

I think LL is avoiding me. I reckon she has opened the envelope and knows what we are having but wants to keep me hanging! The norty girl!

Hi TFM (love the new name - even though Lush is still not cracking!)
It is lovely here, really hot in the sun but a nice cool breeze at times too.
How are things with you Tannee? Hope you are enjoying the sunshine and not getting too down about DP.
Dior - don't know what to say to you, you sound so down. I just wish I could come up there and give you a hug! Lets fix up a date for that lunch TFM I think if you were to come to a meetup it would have to be a weekend affair, we'd all talk ourselves hoarse!

TFM here, just saying "hi" to everyone! Hope you are all enjoying the sunshine. It's nice here but not as hot as they promised it would be. There's rather a cool breeze to the nether regions!! probably due to the fact I'm wearing a dress today rather than jeans!

Hope everyone is ok xx

Hi Tanee You sound to be doing so very well despite the obvious upset all of the problems with DP are causing you. You remain firm and look after yourself. You are unable to help him if he refuses to be helped but you can stop yourself from enabling him. Don't worry about replying to the emails, I know you have a lot on your plate right now And I would love to meet up with you all one day, I truly would. I think once we all start gassing we would need more than a lunch hour though

Dior, I feel so sad for you, I hate to think of you feeling so down. I wish there was something I could do to help you. I think you should put on some lippy and go out for lunch with our girls and give the people you trust the gift of being able to help by listening to you. I do hope you start to feel a whole lot brighter soon. Thinking of you x

Hi to everyone else. I hope you are all enjoying the warm weather. It's so very warm here but we have no sun!

Oh by the way Dior, 'the obvious' would be a *VERY BAD IDEA*. This planet would be very dull without you. Come on, let's be ladies who lunch!

Dior, sorry to hear DS is having relationship problems too - boy, they're starting younger and younger these days. Usually I say leave the kids to it and try not to involve the mothers, but if you and she get on well, do you think you could arrange to meet for a coffee and talk it over in a positive way, without seeming to criticize her little madam outright?

Ginny and TFM thanks! TFM I have read your emails over and over and will respond when I have a break(I should be working now but what the hell!) Yes it IS shitty of DP to drag DD into it, I think it's partly because he knows she's my remaining weak spot and maybe it makes him feel better or maybe even noble to 'admit' he's dangerous - it feeds his self-hatred - but as Dior will understand, when you're in the throes of depression, things look very black, Black, Black - it's like that Fast Show sketch - and of course DP exacerbates it by drinking. When he'd depressed and drunk, it brings out his darkest side and EVERYTHING is negative, so he wants to run away and hide, throw out all his toys and then when he's alone again in some crumbling wreck of a flat, he can say to himself, 'well, this is all I deserve because I'm such a bad person, but look, I saved the woman I love and her daughter from the evil that is ME'. He thinks, in that mood, that splitting up would be best for all, but I am sure deep down he KNOWS that it is being with me that is keeping him alive! Perhaps he doesn't want that ...

He's been very quiet since Sunday night and I have kept largely out of his way. No mention of selling again, and he has been quietly friendly and given me the usual little kiss when leaving for work. I realise that selling up is his usual refrain now whenever he feels out of control - it's his one way of trying to regain that control. If I don't bite, he's left rudderless. So yes, TFM, I'm not biting. As I said to him on Sunday, following your advice, HE can choose the agents and make all the arrangements. I leave it in his 'capable' hands !

Re lunch, Thursdays are good for me too, but I can take a day off to fit in with everyone else. And don't worry about being depressed with us Dior, we are there for you whether you are down OR up. We're your friends and if you need people around you, here we are ! TFM - would there ever be a chance of us meeting up with you?

Ginnny - that made me feel sad but happy all at the same time IYKWIM! Thank you

I am having a bad time of things at the moment. Ds is having problems with his 'girl friend' (in that she is a manipulative madam, even at 8) and I have totally over-reacted over it all. I have made a mess of the whole thing instead of remaining calm. I really like the mum but keep thinking she we are going to fall out over it all .

Everything seems so much bigger and blacker at the moment. I am an emotional parasite and need people around me all the time or I freak out. I really don't know what to do with myself, apart from the obvious. It would solve everything for me, I couldn't do that to ds though.

Tannee, I'm so sorry he's being so difficult. I agree wholeheartedly with TFM he is trying to push your buttons and get the upper hand, so don't let him. Bit shitty to use your dd for emotional blackmail like that though.
Lunch one day would be great. Thursday is a good day for me but can probably juggle things about for another day. Let me know when you can all make it and I'll be there. I'd love a day in London away from it all. I'm so busy with work, sports days, parents evenings etc and it was ds2's birthday last week and his party on Sunday so I'm still reeling from that!!!
A lovely child free lunch sounds like bliss right now!!
Chin up Dior - we all love you x

Tanee I have emailed you with this but I shall tell you here in case you haven't seen it. You take control by telling him "You do whatever you need to do DP and let me know when it is done. Don't bother me with the details until then" Deliver that speech and then walk away. Pour yourself a glass of wine, grab a big bag of crisps and go watch some rubbish tele! That will take away all the power he feels he has by saying those wicked things! If you are giving him permission then he has nowhere else to go with it.

Thinking of you xx

Hello to everyone else

I agree BILL - tannee if you do go ahead and put the house on the market he will claim the 'victim' status.
But i can understand that you do need to take control and make sure you get what you want.

How are you dior? Lunch not looking too promising at the moment - DM still in hospital.

thanks both. Part of me knows he's unlikely to act, part of me wonders if I'll get home one day soon to find a for sale board up. I shall sit tight TFM and see! I'll be v cross if I do, as the garden's looking so pretty now and house prices down our road ain't great. Not that we'd sell quickly - the house is too cluttered and I won't be doing any tidying!

Tanee - no advice, but neither do YOU have anywhere to go. Tell him to shift himself and find somewhere.

Big squishy hug

OK!! You win!! You CAN ignore me!

Tanee, try not to worry sweetie. He has stepped up his game because he knows his previous tactics get no response from you. He is pushing his boundaries even further. He knows that DD is your achilles heel, your fatal weak spot, he knows full well that by mentioning her he will get a reaction. He doesn't want to split up, he doesn't want to sell the house, if he did he would just go ahead and do it. He would have no concern for you, DD, which estate agent to use, he wouldn't want to discuss it because he wouldn't want any opposition. By going about it the way he is he is looking for opposition. You sit tight sweetie, try not to let this get you down, try as best as you can to keep a distance between you.

Will be back soon, visitors here!! xx

- no, 5am would not have been good. I've been exhausted all day as a result, though had a good time at my parents for father's day. Have been avoiding DP all day and sleeping in the spare room. He's just come in and asked me whether I have a preference for estate agents for selling up and separating . He says he's
going to contact agents tomorrow. So maybe this is really it . He also suggested I send DD away until it's done. He's projecting all his anger, misery. whatever, onto her and said he thought he might be a danger to her. He himself won't go as he says he has nowhere to go to. Of course, he'd been drinking as usual, but he was very quiet and serious. It's all gone horribly wrong. Am hoping TFM will steer me through this - she's been a rock. I feel rather numb. Can't believe our fairytale romance has come to this.

Tanee - . It seems that we both drift on in our lives with the same old crap. Should we swap lives for a bit and sort the other's out? I would not stand for any drunken crap from yours and you would make mine see things differently...worth a try?

I would have loved to see you, but maybe not at 5am...

Dior you are def not mad or bad - I have met you and i know you are lovely! In fact, at about 5am this morning I was driving towards Col up the M11 and thought how nice it would be to stop at yours (major upset with DP left me driving around Essex on Midsummer morning - don't ask!) I am glad to hear that H was supportive of you this week but OH how I wish he would be the same when you are feeling positive! You so deserve it!

Anyone up for a lunch in Essex or London? We have takers with HW, Dior and Ginnny and I REALLY need a break! DP is doing my head in - nice enough for awhile but then completely unhinged (we had a weird incident involving what he called 'the evil celery' when he was supposed to be making spagbol for a friend of his, but then abandoned it when a stick of celery knocked the dish of drained fat all over the floor, and left me to clean up and let his friend in while he sat in the garden plugged into his ipod and a bottle of wine!) and last night/this morning a heart to heart where I told him to leave - and then drove off into the dawn myself for over an hour. I really feel I've had enough of his crap belief that he is trapped in this relationship, but he WON'T BLOODY GO!

So I have not slept all night - have to try to nap as I am visiting my dear old dad later.

Hi to everyone else!

McD - thanks for your post. I honestly can not decide what causes me to feel this way. I had a bit of a meltdown on Wednesday, which I won't go into too much on here. It was very scary and I am very grateful to the friends who looked out for me for the rest of the week. H was able to come home slightly earlier, work from home the next day and has been very supportive. He does come up trumps when I need him, but I do take on board what you said.

I am facing up to the fact that I have a severe eating problem. I don't know what it would be called, but it is like bulemia without the throwing up! I have always has issues with food.

I am not bad, and would not call myself mad (well, only as a way to be nonchalent about my situation), so I must be sad. I feel horrible though as h has been so supportive this week, and has given me lots of hugs and cuddles.

I am really glad to hear you so happy McD. Your story wasone that I despaired over tbh, as your h seemed to have such a hold on you. I am so 'proud' of you that you have moved on and are happy with nm.

HW - sorry you are stressed at the moment. I am thinking of you xx

HA!! Can't ignore me now can you????

McD that was a great post - but we must all be a bit 'mad' to meet up with random internet posters surely.

And what is overwieght anyway? Some chart some loony Drs refer too. I would come up on the very obese scale and yet i ran a 10km race a few weeks ago.

I also look back to my lowest weight of recent times and it was when i was at my lowest point - and i would not want to go there again.

Lol HW. Yes we can all ignore a bill

MacD - great post. Totally agree. Would also add that although not madness, distorted thinking can mimic madness - iyswim. For instance, it is clear to us that Dior would feel differently about her weight (and more importantly about herself)if her h didn't keep reinforcing the negative view she holds. Yet because she is so far immersed in the problem she can't see beyond the weight.

Unless you were a bill TFM then we could ignore you.

My mum is not too well - they cannot get her blood sugars stable so she is a bit up and down.
I have said that we (me and my father) are not prepared to take her home until she is able to look after herself a bit more - and the hospital have agreed with us. Yet they were willing to discharge her on Monday, with no support.
I had to be all assertive too - and although i did find it difficult i think my dad is really grateful as he was not coping too well.

DH mums memorial service today too.

feel as if i am running on adrenalin at the moment.

MacD, brilliant post!

LL, I am not an envelope!! You cannot ignore me!!

ok I am back

Dior, I have been lurking and thinking so much of you at times You seem so very very sad and how long have we been going?? afew years now and it doesnt seem to be getting better!
So ok am going to be blunt, please please ignore me if I am off track or offend I dont mean to, I just want to help!
As a GP and a friend (albeit an internet one), I have some musings !
As GP's (and LL will correlate this as well) psychiatric patients fall into 3 main groups, mad bad and sad!
So you are clearly not bad Are you mad?? That is do you have a chemical depression ?? Well obviously without seeing you, asking some pertinent questions, doing some scores I cannot say professionally!
But you have been on and off high dose AD's with little effect?? You have had counselling on and off with little effect??
And you can be happy and charming yes?? I am sure those teabags who have you met you (HW??) will testify to this!!

So just say ok just say....you arent actually mad (a good thing no??), then you are sad
And so to the why, why are you sad?? I know your weight is an issue for you, but would it be if your H didnt make it such a major one??
So I wonder (and these are only the onderings of an internet friend, they may be totally wrong), is it your H/your marriage/your life I guess that makes you sad Something you cant do anything about
I have done a LOT of reading recently about emotional abuse, and yes am pretty sure XH has been emotionally absive to me for years...and I wonder (I'm sorry if I am wrong) if its not your H that is a big cause of your sadness - he seems to make you feel so small, so worthless, so crap.....so sad
It shouldnt be like that, honestly really it shouldnt, now being with someone who treats me with utmost love and respect I can see that (when I moan I am fat, he actaully looks at me in amazement and says no you're not, he says he loves me, calls me sexy and doesnt ever ever put me down or criticise me...I honestly never knew it could be like that and also a bit )

Dior is it your H that makes you sad, just look at it from a different view, YOU have tried to change, YOU have tried to make the effort,YOU have been treated for depression, what exactly has he done to help, does he even think he needs to??

And yes I get the good bits, I get the loving them, I get the truly believing it is all your fault, I get all these things, it doesnt mean they are right

Just think about it

Ok need to go sort DD1 out will be back for the rest of you later

MacD - good to hear from you Sorry about dd but glad all ok. Reminds me of the time I put nose drops in my eye by mistake. Ouch still remember Guess having a bit of medical knowledge is no protection from these mishaps - could be even more likely to happen because one tends to be less cautious iyswim. Hope your divorce is sorted soon. Glad all going well with NM Btw, ignore TFM

<<sob>> LL, how could you be so cruel <<double sob!!>> For a minute, due to my lack of sleep, due to the dreams, I thought you were implying that you would be able to see the genitals through the window of the envelope!

MacD!! Lovely to 'see' you. I'm so sorry you are still having a rough time. And bless DD1! Gosh! I'm pleased everything is ok now though and I hope you aren't beating yourself up about it?? These things happen you know. Don't you remember the time I 'accidently' spat in DP's ham and pickle sandwich? When he wasn't such a DP
I'm pleased to hear everything is going well for you with your DP. It will be well worth the cost of the divorce to get rid of the old one.

Can I ask you something of a professional nature Macd? How would you go about surgically removing an envelope from a very stubborn lovely Teabag? Is it a major operation?

oops posted too soon back to catch up on all of you lovely lot

Hi all
I have been around, been lurking a bit! Have had an eventful few weeks/months - just seem busy or tired all the time!
DD2 is at that absolutely gorgeous but very tiring toddler stage - she is an absolute delight but if anything more lively and mischievous than DD1
DD1 is ok we had a major trauma when I put verruca ointment in her eye and burnt her whole cornea was a complete nightmare but all ok now thank god!

Divorce proceeds slowly with much delaying and manipulation from ex - though nisi is now imminent! Though the solicitors costs are mounting, have had to increase my work hours to pay for it

Things with new DP going well

HW you are a stirer
TFM - you are evil
Actually it is a window envelope. Still can't see though. Might get to see the genitals at 34 weeks - having another scan then. If I do find out I might just keep you in the dark for the hell of it

And yes, that is mm. MM!!!

And don't blame me if you have a loooong labour, a very loooooong labour, I did warn you that the longer it takes to open the envelope the longer it takes for the cervix to dilate. Don't say you weren't warned, when you are 48hrs in and still only 5mm!!

ENVELOPE???? Did I hear the word ENVELOPE?? Is it to be opened?? Please say it is, I can't stop thinking about it, I keep having dreams about envelopes, they keep me awake at night, I'm exhausted, I have big bags under my eyes, LL, please help me!

If only it was a window envelope......

Ooh a party. I love party games, pass the envelope, guess what's in the envelope, who can open the envelope the fastest. All good games Ladylush

I think your ds wants that envelope opened for his birthday.
There that will bring them back - especially TFM.[gin]

Its' all gone very quiet here........

Dior - glad your gp is referring you. You're not mad believe me

HW - hope your mum is ok.

Ginnny - glad you had a good weekend

It's ds's bday this weekend so we've got a party to organise. Well just food really, as it's at a farm and there is lots to do there. Keeping my fingers crossed that 1) he doesn't get chickenpox in next couple of days - doing the rounds in his school 2) the weather is ok.
Bump is ok. Only 5 weeks left at work. Very pleased about that as it's feeling like a chore to go in. I will miss some of my patients though. I've had some nice feedback. One of them in particular said some nice things - and considering that she never actually wanted a CPN that's quite an achievement iyswim. Anyway....enough self-patting on the back

Hope everyone is ok. Where's LL, Macdoodle, TFM and Baffy? And anyone else I've forgotten.

Ginny - would love to see you again . Let's make sure we do it soon.

HW - Is your mum ok?

I'm glad he has referred you now Dior. Are you feeling any better? Is H still being nice?
HW - I hope your Mum is OK.
Tannee - Good idea to get some support yourself. I found Alanon helpful when I went. Its nice to get away from the madness for an hour or so!
I'm loving this weather. We had a brilliant weekend, we went to the South of England show on Saturday and had a lovely family BBQ on Sunday. I'm just hoping the sun stays around this week as its DS2's birthday on Thursday and his Sports Day on Friday.
I'd be up for a meet up too - a day in London sounds great.

fantastic Dior - lets get a date soon. Sorry not around much today - my mum has been taken into hospital again and i am going to help my dad sort some things out.

A day in London would be lovely.

I saw my gp on Saturday morning. He listened and seemed in a genuine quandry as to what to do with me. In the end, he decided that the best option was to refer me upwards again.

<Mad emoticon>

always up for a meet up - i would love to come to london again as i really enjoyed the last meet up.

Dior could we tempt you to have a day in london with dc?

wow, all gone quiet - is there anybody out there...?

Dior, agree with Ginnny too - and you would NEVER bore us! I am with HW in suggesting lunch - we can all be miserable together . I'm enjoying my garden but still not 100% over the moon with DP - just hoping the summer weather stays nice enough to keep my spirits up. I saw my own GP last week and he said that if DP won't seek help, I can always get some support for myself - I too feel sometimes that I need to offload to someone out of my circle, so as not to bore my friends or my lovely sister!

Dior - I agree with ginnny.

Dior. I don't think the GP should just ignore this. If you are on the highest dose of AD's and still not right then its his job to find something that does work for you. I'm glad you've made an appointment, its one step closer to getting better.

HW - I WAS referred back to the psychiatrist. I saw one of his assistants. At the time though, I was not 'depressed enough' to require help. So, I knew it would just be a matter of time before I would be bad enough .

I feel like going to bed. If I did not have to be up for ds, I would be there now.

HW - sorry, I would be crap company at the moment. I know it would do me good to get out but I just feel like you would regret it <ironic smile>

I've got an underactive thyroid too LL. I would say depression is one of the symptoms that never really goes away completely, it lingers in the background and rears it's ugly head sometimes for no apparent reason. And I find it is harder to lose weight. It's the feeling cold all the time I find hard to cope with, I hate feeling cold, oh yes, and the constipation. And that's on the correct dose of thyroxine.

HW just two words to say to you - Agnus Cactus!

yes dior - could you talk to a different GP?

I do have symptoms of the menapause - my GP who i generally like wanted to prescribe ADs (to treat the symptoms) but did not think it worth doing a blood test to establish the cause. The Gynae consultant later wrote to the GP to reccomend some alternative treatments and backing me up with the fact that it probably was menapause.
If you know there is something not right then you have to fight to get what will work for you.

Still wish i could have an underactive thyroid though - as it may help with weight control.

I have an underactive thyroid that was only picked up when I asked for a thyroid function test after having a few unexplained m/c. My mood was low but I put that down to the m/cs, I felt tired all the time but I put that down to being a mum to a young child and working in a demanding job.....it's not always obvious is what I suppose I'm trying to say. Worth getting checked out Dior. CAT is rated well amongst therapists. One of my colleagues is training to be a CAT therapist. I'm not sure I agree with your G.P's approach. Rather than telling you that you are on the highest dose of AD possible without referral to a psychiatrist, maybe he should just actually refer you. Also, what ADs have you tried?

Dior - i felt a bit like you on a much smaller scale - i too wanted it to by thyroid problem. I was also feeling the cold and when i researched it i came up with that it could be anemia. Although blood test is normal i do know from the past that my Hb levels are normal on the upper end of normal, this time it came back on lower end of normal.

So i have been taking iron tablets together with extra vitiamins and i do think it is working. I dont feel as tired and low.

Just a thought - give me a call or email if you do fancy lunch - i will pick you up if you like.

PS i never got the tidy bug either and i still feel as if i am catching up.

Apologies, I mean as CAT worked well for you before.

Well done for making an appointment with the GP Dior

As CBT worked so well for you back then maybe another course of it would work for you now. Reading your post, it's issues you have with yourself now, maybe CBT would help you with that.

I think it would be really good for you to talk, to really spill your guts! Without apologising for yourself or feeling that people won't want to hear you. You are a lovely person Dior and well worth listening to xx

Thanks TFM. I have already have three different types of counselling, including CBT. The best one for me was CAT, which did help a couple of years ago. I have sorted through a lot of my old issues with my mum and we are actually on brilliant terms now.

I really don't know why I am feeling like this. I just know that I am sick of being me. I was to be slim and happy, not necessarily in that order.

I have noticed that I am getting overly snappy lately and that I am being different towards my friends. They are being good about it but my paranoia is making me think things which is not helping.

OK, so I have booked an appointment with my doctor as this can be done on the Internet now and doesn't involve me actually getting up to get the telephone

I was just thinking Dior, how would you feel about a course of CBT? www.rcpsych.ac.uk/mentalhealthinfoforall/treatments/cbt.aspx I often think I might like it myself

Don't you worry about us . It will do you good to talk about how you feel, I think you keep a lot in for fear of 'boring us'.

Do you think that your depression might stem from your circumstances at home, the lack of attention and affection etc? Feel free not to answer that if you feel it's too raw or personal for you

I'm pleased you were able to take your mind off things this morning though.

Thanks you two. I am avoiding GP at the moment as there is not really anything more he can do for me. I am on the highest dose of Prozac that I can be on without being under a psychiatrist. He told me last time that there was no point in changing my pills because I am on the highest dose of the one that has worked the best so far.

I don't seem to be able to get active enough to do anything. I helped out at school for an hour this morning and it did take my mind off things but, now I am sitting at home 'festering', as h calls it.

I KNOW that I would feel better if I were to see a friend, or go out for a walk. BUT, I can't summon up the energy to do it. I am shutting myself away which only makes me worse, but I don't want to go out.

Sorry, I'm boring myself now, so I dread to think what I am doing to you all.

I might be way off Dior but have you thought about having your thyroid checked. A work colleague of mine has recently been diagnosed with hyperthyroidism she had unexplained tiredness, depression and weight problems.
Hope you feel better soon x

Would talking to your GP help Dior? There may be some kind of alternative help they can offer you. It does sound as though you are in a real depression, especially when you describe the wanting to sleep.

Funnily enough, I never got the cleaning bug before I had ds! Mind you, I think H would have had a heart attack if I had...

Things not good here. I am really low. H had a go at me yesterday, because I just wanted to sleep. He gets really frustrated with me because he wants to be able to help me in a practical way. I slept from 8pm. He did apologise this morning though.

I just can't seem to life myself out of this fug and it is affecting me a lot .

<<TFM wonders if she will get the nesting instinct when it's time for the bunion to be 'delivered'>>

LL have you steamed open that envelope yet??

Baffy - must be imminent if you've got the cleaning bug Glad all is ok with baby Hope you can take it easy at work. It's good that h is helping you. How are things between you-have you made any decisions?

Ginnny - well done Good for you.

Will do TFM!

HW I'm on my way round!!

Me! Me! Me Baffy! Text ME!! and I will text you when I finally have my bunion removed

Baffy that sounds great - well the fact that you are well. Often the head does not engage as it did first time around - more space this time.
Can you come and live with me for a bit? I need to get the cleaning bug but there is so much stuff to sort out it is impossible to keep on top of it.
When the weather is fine i want to potter outside and when its dull like today i cant get my arse into gear.
With GCSE's its also hard to know what bits of paper i am allowed to 'file' - ds bedroom is a tip but apparently he has it all ordered to do his revision and i have been banned from touching anything - still only a couple more days and then i am going in with the bin bags.
In fact we are having some decorating done whilst away on hols - it is impossible with the dc in the house anyway. So i am haveing to sort out lots of things.

Hello all

Just a quick catch up as I haven’t had a second lately!

Thank you for the text TFM

Well it looks like it wasn’t a show. Or if it was it’s made no difference! I’m still hanging on and still working! Luckily, my boss has been really understanding and I’ve done lots of work from home with hours to suit myself. I’m still doing the odd day in the office as I actually quite like it here and enjoy keeping busy. I’d go crazy at home as I’m desperate to clean every inch of the house but it’s just impossible with the SPD.
It’s like an internal struggle between the urge to ‘nest’ and the sensible part of me knowing that I need to rest and do what’s best for ‘me’ so that (hopefully) once the lo arrives, the SPD will clear as quick as possible.

H keeps telling me to rest and god bless him, he is doing his best. But I find myself sneaking to the bathroom and then casually ‘dropping’ something so I can get on my hands and knees and clean the floor on the way out! I’ve even bought those anti-bacterial wipes so I can do the floors quickly and inconspicuously before H tells me off!! I'd never make it past him with a mop and bucket!! I’m losing the plot!

Lo seems fine and is not even engaged yet. He’s still turning lots, to the point where I can feel exactly where his arms and legs are, and I’m convinced that despite all of the scares, he will hang on as long as possible. He’s enjoying it too much!

I’m due on the 10th July so 1 month to go! I was 3 weeks early with ds so everyone thinks this one will be the same. That would be nice! But as I said, I’m not holding my breath!!

LL how are you doing?

I will try my best to keep up. I’ll be finishing work by the middle of next week at the latest, so should have much more time then. If he’s not here!

I will text if/when anything happens so someone can update you

p.s. ginny – definitely the right decision! The thought of a lovely little place with just me and the boys is so appealing! H is great now, and I do love his company. But I totally understand where you are coming from!

Good morning ladies

Well done Ginny! I'm proud of you for sticking to your guns. What strong women we have turned out to be We definitely do deserve the Teabag title. It also goes to show that you don't have to be a doormat, a pushover or a victim so as not to lose the relationship, stand up to them and you have them eating out of your hand - eventually! I can't believe how far we have all come since we first started posting, going from not wanting to lose them to knowing that not only would we be ok not living with them but we would also actually enjoy it

Why thank you for the Jesus sandal suggestion Tanee! I thought I would get a big, thick sock and put it over the top of it so it was hidden but your idea sounds much more fun. I still can't believe I'm actually looking forward to it. MIL has already got the school runs sorted and no doubt she will be doing meals on wheels too so, for the first time in my life I am just going to sit back and enjoy doing nothing! In fact, I am going to milk it dry!

Hi to everyone else, hope your weather is better than mine. It's freezing here, I've put the bunion back in boots!

Hi all. We had the 'talk' and we've agreed to leave things as they are for ever now! I think he knew he'd blown his argument out of the water by going to the pub - idiot!!
I have had a weekend alone with the boys and tbh I have loved it. They have too I think. Its nice when its just us but I do start to miss him after a few days.
Sometimes I wish I'd never met him. My life used to be so simple - a bit boring but a lot easier
Tannee - oh for a spare room - HEAVEN!!!

TFM - could you spray your Jesus sandal red, blue and gold and pretend you're Superwoman? - only - it would be no pretence !

TFM - I've just read that article too and oh, how I wish I could go back to my nice single flat!! (Except the garden was too shady for tomatoes . If it had had a second bedroom for DD, I may never have bought into this house with DP and we might still have the romantic 150 miles apart relationship that we once did.

Ginnny, you stick to your guns. I actually prefer sleeping in the spare room now - only, since he recovered from his recent strop, DP currently feels abandoned when I 'disappear' there in the middle of the night (I actually made up an excuse on Friday night and said I went because he'd taken up most of the bed - it was actually because I heard my cat mew - which annoys him as she wakes him up - and thought I'd rather have her company and let him sleep on undisturbed!) I'm sure the feng shui is better in 'my' room and it's not cluttered with all his clothes!

I'm pretty sure that if you tell him this is how it's going to be, he'll sulk and go to the pub, but he WILL be back! He knows he's got a good woman ! Just as mine does (as TFM says, don't let him blame you for his lapses. Mine tried it last week when I left him the car to take some rubbish to the tip - which is close to Sainsbury's - which was doing a ridiculously cheap discount on some wines - so he bought a load of bottles and said it was MY fault leaving him the car! I know he was joking, but I still didn't let him get away with it!

And TFM - psml at "man noises from either end"

Dior - yes, h is reinforcing that powerful connection you made as a child. It is good that you understand the pattern.

Ginnny - good luck. Hope dp will accept your terms. He should do, given that you have been more than flexible with him.

TFM - sorry to hear you have to wear a Jesus sandal but at least you can window shop for some lovely pairs you can buy when your foot has healed

Ginnny - I don't blame you for not wanting him to move in. If he can't live with that without running off to the pub, that is his problem.

TFM <ouch>

LL - I mean that I have been brought up only getting attention from my mother when I was ill, so I guess that H reaffirms the view of mine that one will be ignored if one is well and happy.

My Mum had both feet done at once and they put plaster casts on her feet. She looked like Noddy!!!

Ginny, dont feel bad about not wanting to live with a man again. As much as i love DP i would love a little house of my own, no man mess, no man noises from either end, it would be bliss! He would have to date me, and if i fancied a night in front of the tele, in charge of the remote control while stuffing my face with chocolate i could tell him 'no thanks, am washing my hair' it's my idea of heaven! No offence DP

Thank you LL. Doc says i should be all done by October but i think it will be a good few months before i can wear decent shoes. They send you home with a jesus sandal sort of thing. Would rather have a plaster cast myself but they don't do that anymore. Will have to think of ways to jazz up my jesus sandal type thing, not very sexy are they? I thought i could put a roller skate on it then i would still be able to get around ok

TFM - I love that article. I'm going to print it out and give it to him tomorrow. Thing is, its not just him. I can't ever see myself wanting to live with a man again (although its nice to have one around sometimes ). They are too much like hard work - more so than the dc!! I love living on my own with the boys. Its great.
You are so right I've already heard that I made him go to the pub . I set him straight, don't worry!! That doesn't work with me anymore.
LL you are right, if we lived together I'd be walking on eggshells scared to upset him in case he used it as an excuse.
He's coming round tomorrow and I'm just going to say its this or nothing, and if he wants nothing then I'll have to live with it and let him go.

TFM - too true. He will grab the chance of an excuse with both hands. Happy shoe wearing to you

Oh and by the way Ginny, be prepared that DP may put the blame onto you for his return to drink but make sure you pass it right back, point out we all have a choice in life and his choice is to drink. Have you got that?

Well done for sticking to your guns Ginny, you have most definitely done the right thing so don't doubt yourself and don't back down. He is probably feeling sorry for himself now so leave him to it. Don't try to 'fix' things, show him you need business. Anyway, it isn't a part time relationship, it's a 'Living Apart Together' relationship! www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/loving-together-amp-living-apart-466281.html

So, if my bunion is going to grow back then I have a good 20 years of gorgeous sandals and lovely shoes! I can't wait!! I don't fancy the hammer toes though!

Hi to everyone else. Hope you are all having a good weekend. It's a quiet one here, the rain has put paid to any outings or gardening! I'm very jealous of all the veg growing this year, I've stuck to plants after such a bad crop last year. We are having a conservatory built at the moment so I'm planning on what I can grow in it without DP realising there not house plants

Well Done on the race HW! I'm proud of you! I hope it went well.

Dior I just want to say that LL is on the right track with your H. My guess is he feels more secure when you are feeling low and that in turn makes him feel closer to you IYSWIM.

Baffy, I hope all is well with you and lo??

Dior - do you mean your mum was the same with you as h is now? Or that your mum was "rewarded" for being down and punished for being upbeat?

Ginnny - you weren't being "me me me" at all. I think you are right wrt your decision not to have dp live there. If he wanted to prove you wrong he'd have stayed away from the pub since - but no, off he went! That's probably what he'd do everytime you had a disagreement. Not as if he needs an excuse.....but if one comes along I'm sure he'll milk it (or beer it ).

Sorry that was a bit me, me, me!
Hope Baffy is OK - was that a show the other day??
TFM - my Mum had her bunions removed 20 years ago and they are coming back now and she's got hammer toe too!! The doctor told her off for wearing heels!!
MacD - I hope you aren't on here because you are having far too much fun with your lovely NM to talk to us teabags

HW - Good luck with the race today, its quite nice here now, sunny but not too hot.
I'm trying my hand at veg this year too. I've planted runner beans carrots and tomatoes and have coriander, rocket and mint too. I'm quite pleased with myself as I've never really bothered before.
Glad you are still feeling good LL.
I've had a big fall out with DP. He wants to move in, I don't want him to. We are getting on well and he's a lot better but I like my independence and I still can't run the risk of him drinking here in front of the dc. So it all blew up on THursday night. He says I'm being stubborn and unreasonable and he doesn't want a part time relationship any more, but that's all I can give him so we are in stalemate.
Since then he has been in the pub Friday, yesterday and today so I'm just thinking I was right to stick to my guns
I've left the ball in his court now. I've been honest and if its not enough for him he'll have to call it a day. He's bought it all on himself though, he seems to think that everything that happened last year should just be forgotten, which it is mostly, but I can't quite trust him enough to live with him again.

LL - yes, I have thought that too. My mum was the same when I was little.

HW - I meant bad as in really depressed. So how did the race go?

HW - good luck today. Hope the race goes ok. I'm in Surrey and the weather was awful at 6am this morning (terrific thunder storm) but is lovely now so will keep my fingers crossed for nice weather for your party

Impressed with all the veggie growers
Might attempt some tomatoes this year.

Dior - trouble is that h being affectionate when you are depressed kind of reinforces that pattern so in a sense he is rewarding you when you are down and punishing you when you are upbeat and positive. And so it continues.

Bump is steadily growing. 6 months pregnant now. Approx 7 weeks left at work as I am taking a month off to spend with ds in the summer holidays , then start mat leave beginning of September (baby due 16th). Lots of kicks in the evening and baby seems to rest on my bladder a lot at night, so lots of trips to the toilet. Physically though, I am feeling fine. Dh thinks I look more comfortable at this stage than I did with ds. SPD has not started yet, despite some twinges. Reluctant to make assumptions, but it's good to have got to 26 weeks (minus a few days) and not be in pain

MacD - haven't heard from you in ages. How's it going?

Baffy - hope all is ok?

Hi dior

When you say you have been really bad - do you mean feeling low? It is just that your wording makes it seem as though it is a bad or naughty thing?
You are not always in control of the depression - i hate it when you seem to be punishing yourself when it is out of your control somehow.

Would love to see you today if you wanted to come and join us for the party after - similar to last year just without the sun.

Good luck tomorrow HW.

Tanee - yes, I know, it does seem that he can only be affectionate when I am unhappy. At least he is being affectionate though. That is something as I have been really bad for the last couple of weeks.

oohh tannee we are doing vegies this year - it is ds DofE project a new skill - i said there was no skill in growing vegetables but maybe i was wrong. We have curly carrots and loads of tomato plants and we are doing beetroot, peas and potatoes too, and some strawberries.

I am doing the race for life tomorrow - with both dd's. And then we are having a party after - but the weather is meant to be crap.

And of course we are in the middle of GCSE's which so far seem to be going ok.

Tannee i have just put my peppers and toms in growbags this week with some herbs. We also trying carrots too. They all seem to be growing well time will tell!

Been raining here too, and none of us have been in a mood for anything (DP has been in and out of bed all day and is STILL in his dressing gown) but I have pricked out my lettuces into pots and hunted around the shed for big pots for my tomatoes (BIL gave me more hostages to fortune last week - despite my last attempt at tomatoes being dismal he still hopes to make a vegetable gardener of me). DP is looking forward to all the lettuces! As long as the slugs don't get there first. DD is concerned about the size of my courgette plant - she hates courgettes!

Hope everyone is having a good weekend despite the rain !

HW here here , they didn't let dp leave until nearly 4 yeasterday hence it was gone 7 when he got home and dc in bed.
Then he has to go into work today
Seems very much wrok work here at the moment!
Anyone got any nice things planned for the weekend ?
Raining here but dd1 has gone to her cousins and ds has got his cousin here so at least they not arguing for a change

That is exactly the problem - men can switch off from home life far too easily. Out of sight out of mind.

I dont think it is all their fault though as society seems to 'accept' that men work long family unfriendly hours.

My h is so much better now and will tell his staff to go home early and tries to create a far more family atmosphere too. His new job allows this too and in fact are very good at it too. There are a lot more functions to meet spouses too which i feel is a good thing.
Life should not be all work - and we all need to find a better balance.

Lol at bunion ruining your shoes as opposed to shoes ruining your feet

Lilyloo - I think men can switch off much easier when they are away from home. Dh went away on a lads weekender when ds was about 2 yrs old. He didn't see why I was cross that he hadn't called. Similarly when we've been away for a couple of nights together, it's nearly always been me who makes plans to call ds. I don't blame you for being upset about it though.

Hope everyone has a nice weekend.

Well done Lily! Next time he is away try not answering the phone when he does ring to say goodnight, give him a taste of what it feels like! I think you had every right to be cross with him, I would have been cross too!

I can't wait to have this bunion taken off. It's horrible and it ruins all my shoes, the nasty thing. And I'm really looking forward to being waited on hand and foot!

Hi to everyone else

Tanne she has some words of wisdom that TFM

TFM my nan has bunions and wishes she had had them removed a long time ago. I have moved on i think r/e dp. Am only cross today as he didn't phone to say goodnight to dc. Text him to let him know they were upset he didn't. He replied saying he had tough day etc , fair enough but running home and 3 dc's no walk in the park but you shoudl find time to say goodnight But normal relationship stuff is good

LL don't open it , DON'T!! The surprise is lovely! (sorry TFM)

Hi everyone, TFM lol at you being excited over removing your bunion! - I hope DP does lots of running around for you whilst you recover - and brings you plenty of chocolate, strawberries and Pringles! (or maybe just the strawberries, since they're the healthy treat option!)

Dior, wow a new camera! Glad H is being good to you though it would be nice if he could respond when you are happy as well! Sounds like he only feels in control and safe enough to offer you affection, when you are down. Anyway, hope you are enjoying the cuddles AND camera. What about that lunch date then? HW?

Things are ok here after a bad spell. DP had a major down episode for a couple of weeks, but is coming out of it - after I practiced my TFM strategies on him. I told him straight that if he was fed up, he should go, and generally did my own thing and kept to myself - the turning point was last week when I took myself and DD to my sister's for a night - he missed me and from then on he started getting better. It does get very wearing though, wondering how long it will last...but I shall enjoy it and like every Teabag, I am getting stronger .

Lol TFM - walked into that one
Happy bunion removal

You have an envelope LL!! You can go on that if you open it!! One of the mums at school is having a baby and was planning to find out it's sex at the scan on Monday. I have been waiting patiently all these weeks only to be told that the baby had it's legs crossed and nothing could be seen. I have to wait a whole 19 weeks now to find out what she is having!

All is well here, nothing much to report. Apart from I've decided to have the bunion I inherited from my dear dad removed. I've been to see the doc today and he is referring me. I'm quite excited, shows how sad my life is at the moment

Hope everyone else is well and happy.

Lol TFM You are right about the wobbles bringing necessary reassurance How are things with you?

Lilyloo - sorry forgot you had a ds -should have asked how the dc enjoyed France. Interested that you guessed correctly with ds and dd1. I have a feeling this one is a boy but have nothing to go on really.

Baffy - hope all is ok.

<<TFM rushes in upon hearing the word envelope>>

Hi guys! Hope you are all well and enjoying the sun, I am! I'm making the most of it while we have it, we are due for a change tomorrow.

Lily that is great news. I am so glad you feel comfortable with DH being away. You enjoy the space!!

Ladylush, I'm glad you are feeling better about things too. Wobbles are not all bad you know, they are brilliant at bringing us the reassurance we occasionally need I'm pleased all is the well with the baby too. I'm not so pleased that you still haven't opened that envelope!!

Baffy I'm so sorry to read of the troubles you are having. I hope things have settled down for you now and the little one has decided he likes it in there after all and isn't in such a rush to come out

Hi to everyone else!

Oh and well done on the envelope i guessed ds and dd1 but dd2 was a real surprise

Wow LL how did that come around so quickly ??They loved France , (maybe not as much as me with the wine , cheese , pate and bread )

N0 doesn't sound odd at all - ikwym. Yes I think I needed a lot of reassurance - not so much words but just knowing that we all enjoyed spending time together. Plus dh and I had two days to ourselves at the end of the week. It was lovely going out and not having to plan far in advance. Baby is fine. Lots of kicks. Mw appt is still 3 weeks away and I get to see baby again at 34 weeks (9 weeks time) Still haven't opened that envelope What did your dds make of France?

LL this may sound really odd but seeing someone every day through the routine of life can be very lonely..
A break just helps alleviate your subconscious worries i guess!!

Anyhow hows you and the lo ????

Hi Lilyloo Glad you had a great time in France It's also great that you trust dh to be away - shows how much work the two of you have achieved I am much better after my wobble with dh before our week off. I think we really needed that time as a family.

Hey all
hope everyone ok , just popping in to see how the babys are doing! Mine is a real life little monster at the minute (McD) can prob vouch for that!
Baffy sounds scary , hope all good now.
Just back from hol in France which was lovely !!
Need to keep up with you guys. Has been good to have a break and good to say things are all good here.
DP is away this week and i am absolutely fine with it , who'd have thought!!!
TFM glad to see you still around the tea bags needed your advice
to everyone else!!

Baffy - hope all is ok.
Dior - glad h has been caring. Hope you feel better soon.
Tanee - how are you?

Tanee - I am a lot better thanks - probably because of the sun. Plus, I got some exercise yesterday and today.

H was lovely over the weekend and I did get some cuddles. He is always more affectionate when I am depressed. He also surprised me with a new camera just for my craft stuff as the old one I had been using eventually gave up the ghost. He snuck off in town and surprised me with it later, which was nice.

Hope all the F&Gs are well.

Baffy, hope you are still ok. My nephew decided to appear 3 months early and sis was on heavy steroids for days - which worked as he's now some sort of teenage genius! Can't believe there's so little time to go now!

Dior - how are you today? Hope feeling chirpier? Glad H was being good.

Baffy - if baby does come early I suppose it will be be a good thing that you had the steroid injections since lo will be about 5-6 weeks early. Was your ds early? Mine was pretty much on target (at 39+4) but I'd like it to be either the same or early(ish). Hate the thought of going 2 weeks overdue or being induced. How are you feeling? You might find that having the lo puts an end to the SPD. That's what happened with me.

Baffy - sounds like a show to me too. With ds1 I had a show on the Sunday night and he was born early Tuesday morning so it can take a few days.
As long as you and baby are OK, thats the main thing, I'm surprised all that stress in the hospital didn't start things off . Good luck and keep us posted when you can!

dior, i hate it when i do that as you feel as if you have wasted a whole day. Try not to beat yourself up about it too much.

Baffy hope you are ok - sounds a bit scary and also like a show to me - but i also know that even if it is a show it can be a while.

Worked all day today so didnt see much sunshine - but it meant to be nice all weekend so heres hoping

Baffy - hope things are all ok with you. If you are at all worried, get yourself back to A&E!

I am having a very blue day . My course was cancelled today but M&D still had ds for the day. I sat in my bedroom watching the tv DVD of 'State of Play' so wasted 6 hours out of the sun, feeling sorry for my self.

H was good and phoned to see how I was.

Thanks guys

Think I just needed to rant

Not due until 10th July so 6 weeks today.

Although today there is lots coming away (sorry TMI!) but it's really thick and mucus-like and blood stained and I can't help wondering if it is a show. H is away though so I'm keeping my legs crossed! Does that work?!

Hope you're all enjoying the sunshine.

Will try to keep up but if I don't I may well be in hospital having the lo!!

oh baffy that is terrible.

I blame the fact that no-one will take responsibility for your care.

It drives me mad and is one of the reasons i dont think i could back to the NHS.

When my ds was in hospital - we had to wait an 'extra' day because we had to wait for the consultant to remove his drip - ffs - and they wonder why the infection rate is so high???? And when the consultant did finally appear i think he was as horrified as we were, that no-one would just use some common sense and see what was needed. At one point there was a girl being sick and no-one would/could come to help her - so i did (but of course had i helped to spead any germs i would have been held responsible). You just cant win.

And if you dare to argue against the staff then you are seen as stoppy.

But like you say - the main thing is you are ok and the baby seems fine.

Try not to let it put you off going to the hospital again.

Says me who had 2 of mine at home.

Hope you are all having a good half term - weather here is fantastic.

TFM - i managed to get around to planting some veg this year.

Oh dear Baffy Glad all is ok with you and baby though. Bleeding in pg is horrible. Been there in early pregnancy (up to week 15) and don't want to get it again. When is your due date?

Hi all

Just a quick post as I haven’t been around much and not sure how things will go…

Spent the last 3 days in hospital
Was out on Sunday with H just catching up with some friends and totally out of the blue started bleeding. Called the hospital who said just to ‘pop up and see them so they could check things out’ and 3 days later was still there!

They thought it may have been a show or that my waters had gone. I was adamant it wasn’t (bright red blood) but nope, they know best, so they gave me steroid injections to build up baby’s lungs in case he was on his way.

The couldn’t scan me on Sunday though as the unit was closed. Same story Bank Holiday Monday! So was told I’d just have to stay there but I’d be scanned first thing Tuesday.
Then due to the backlog from bank holiday it ended up being Tuesday evening before they scanned me! I had a really important school meeting I wanted to go to with ds and I sobbed my heart out to get out of there, but they still didn’t do anything.

Anyway, finally got scan, at which stage they said waters hadn’t gone and baby absolutely fine. No explanation for the bleed though.

However, they then still couldn’t discharge me without a doctors sign off, and they were all in surgery!

Feel like they started off so well and within hours I just became a number in the system and they really didn’t care when I got seen or when I got out. I explained time and time again that I know how it felt when my waters went and this was just bright red pure blood, nothing else. Baby was on monitor so many times and absolutely fine. All the bleeding had stopped within an hour of it starting and everything was fine.

Arghhhh so frustrating!

Main thing obviously is that me and the lo are ok. I still think there is probably a good chance that I will go early, especially as I did last time, but have totally lost all faith in the hospital. To be honest, some simple things, for example when I called to explain the bleeding and get advice they said ‘just pop up’. I didn’t take anything with me. They later said ‘it’s hospital policy that you have to stay in at least 24 hours after a bleed’.
Why the hell couldn’t they just tell me that on the phone?! I had H, my mum and my sister all running round getting things together for me and sorting out ds. If they’d have just said that from the start I’d have packed everything I need, dropped ds round to mum with all his stuff, and been a whole lot less stressed out when they wouldn’t let me go home

Sorry. Needed to rant! Extremely hormonal!!!

Hope everyone else is ok

hi guys

Sorry havent been around - as computer finally died. It had been ill for a while but i just couldnt bring myself to bite the bullet and buy a new one - but i had to.

Still getting to grips with it all and transfering all my important info. across. But it is wonderful as it is so much faster.

Half term is whizzing by too.

Will try and catch up on things i have missed.

Oh. That must have been hard for him. So not critical parents but emotionally unavailable (mum due to death, father by design). Did he idolise his mother?

NO, he wasn't. He had a loving mum but she dies when he was 17. His dad never did family time really.

Dior - I would hazard a guess that your dh was raised by overly critical parents. Is he has self-critical as he is critical of everyone else? Does he have any friends. It must be awful having such impossibly high standards - I mean that sincerely, even though it seems as if I'm being sarcastic. It means he will never be happy.

Ginnny - enjoy your time with the boys and catching up with friends

We just got back from the Coast. Had a lovely 2 night stay. Very relaxed

The thing that isn't clear from my last post is how hard it is for me to have to go through this every time. I don't expect him to like all my friends or make an effort every weekend. Occasionally he has to see one of them, and most partners would surely enjoy socialising?

We have been invited to a quiz night and I told another friend (who is getting the team together) that he would not be interested. She sort of looked at me as if to say, 'How the hell do you know without asking him?' I always have to tell people that he is not very sociable, but when they DO meet him, he seems lovely and they then think I am horrible for running him down. Then, later the same evening, I will have to listen to a list of reasons (in a reasonable voice) of why he didn't like so and so, and wasn't it awful when XXXX said this or that or how he didn't agree with YYYY over that.

It makes me feel so sad inside and I dread being asked anywhere with him. Obviously, when you get to know people, the next stage is to get to know their families. But I can't do that and I am left having to explain it.

I am quite cross with him today, in a resigned sort of way. I cocked up last week and arranged to see a friend on Monday, as it is half-term here, forgetting that it was a bank holiday. I didn't want to let her down as she is a single parent and that was the only day we could both do. So, h came along and we had (what I thought was) a pleasant day.

Then, when we went to bed, he started, in a light-hearted way, basically telling me all the things that she didn't do or say, and how she wasn't his type of person. I said that he had commented on how much he had liked her in the past and he said that it had been because it was in a 'smaller dose' . I had to defend my friend against all the things he was saying. He wasn't being aggressive, but he made it clear that he had felt a spare part and would have prefered to be just the three of us.

I seethed quietly in the bed until I fell asleep. This morning, he asked why I was a bit funny and I told him that I was fed up with him running my friends down after being nice as pie to their faces. At first he said, 'I apologise', but there was a 'But...' afterwards. Then he said, 'Well don't arrange things where I have to spend time with your friends then'

Sorry to make you feel like you have to be sociable .

Dior. Arsenic Pie is a very good idea!!!
LL I think being on the relationship threads does get to you if you read them too much and you are feeling a bit wobbly anyway. Your H sounds great for being so reassuring. Hope you have a good week off.
I've got a week off too. It will be great to spend lots of time with the boys and catch up with some friends who I've neglected since I went back to work.

@ Tanee!

A friend said to me the other day, 'What are you making XXXX for dinner...arsenic pie?'

<'Of course I would never do anything like that' emoticon>

Dior, I have some electric leads you could borrow .

Tell him that at least you can do something about your weight if you choose to but it seems he is stuck with his twattish attitude. You need to give this bloke what for Dior. You need to give him a shock!

He keeps making refs to my weight as a 'joke' too. I am Not Talking To Him at the moment because of one this lunch time.

yes ladylush, you should, im a mind of information when it comes to supplements. Im a firm believer in them. Im studying 'special' supplements now for Diors H

Dior - that sentence says it all............"I feel quite happy until he walks through the door....."

Hi all!

H took the hint on Tuesday night and was slightly affectionate towards me, which was nice. BUT, nothing since then. And, I feel quite happy until he walks through the door of an evening, bringing his doom-laden attitude with him. Everything is wrong, I've left the car out, the lounge is untidy etc etc. GAH!

TFM - think I'll defo come to you for advice on supplements if in need Agnus has done wonders for you - lucky lady

HW - do you ever wonder if spending time on the relationship threads means that the infidelity is always on your mind and makes it hard to move on? I think I tend to feel more negative if I read/post on an affair thread. I've been reading a few lately and have started to feel very negative - especially when the betrayed women express the same sentiments I had. Obviously being pregnant has made me extra sensitive - which doesn't help. Last night I was awake from 1-6am. I sent dh an email saying I don't trust him etc. and asking him if he is up to anything. I felt terrible later when I received his reply. He was so good about it, really reassuring me. I guess being pregnant gives me some indemnity Anyway, I feel better for getting it off my mind. We are both on annual leave next week so looking forward to spending some time together.
Hope everyone has a good weekend

you have mentioned that suppliment before and i do think i may well give it a try. I too have wondered if there is some phycological reasons - but also with the health scare it could have been that.

I have been given the all clear for now and i actually do feel a bit better. Now with that excuse gone i can prehaps start to work on what the problem is.

It could just be a bit of a dip and so we are both trying not to get too hung up on it at the moment.

No definitely not too old, but if I were you I would wait until you are 66 then you can draw your pension at the same time as your child benefit, twill be quite a handsome sum!

As for your libido, you know what they say, use it or lose it! Have you tried using it lately or have you just let it leave How about giving some supplements a try? Tell you what, Agnus Cactus is proving great for the big 'O', makes it very intense. It's been brilliant for me, regulating my cycle and stabilizing my moods. I was going through a bit of a miserable time with constant periods and PMT but I'm back to normal now. Anyway, I digress, there are other supplements that are specifically for libido if you fancy trying to resurrect it. But, having said all of that, maybe the fault (for want of a better word) is not a physical one, after all you have been through and after the very dignified way you have handled things it wouldn't surprise me is there was a bit of psychology involved somewhere. You could always conduct a test

i know TFM i even came over all broody just at the thought of free footcare - am i really too old for another?

Well i,m not quite 66 yet.

But then of course that would mean having to have the s word - and with my libido at rock bottom even using the word is difficult.

Four times HW!! We missed out 4 times!! I would have tried to exchange it for a free hairdo! No one sees your feet, I couldn't even see my own feet!

oh i love having my feet touched - reflexology and all that.

My mum is diabetic and the one plus side i would love is the free chiropody.

I didnt know you could get it whilst pregnant though - missed out there didnt I.

"taken gone for it"?? Mmm I think I need chocolate today!

I think your GP or your midwife refers you LL although I'm not sure cos I missed out Having said that I don't like my feet messing with anyway so probably wouldn't have taken gone for it. Have a word with your midwife and ask her to get you referred, get some pampering while you can!

Ooh I didn't know that TFM - does one need to be referred to Chiropodist or can one just book themselves an appt?

Baffy - google osteopaths in your area. That's what I did and a website with a list of local practitioners came up.

Hi Baffy, I was going to add that they are a bit of a passion killer but thought I would leave that bit out, I didn't want to put you off

Have you got a chiropodist? I found out, just after dd was born that you are entitled to free chiropody too while pregnant, so if there was ever a time to get those corns, callouses and hard skin sorted out now is it!

I hope you are feeling a bit more comfortable today. Have you started working from home yet? Make sure you do!!! <<said in best mother hen voice!>>

TFM you're spot on - I have one of those support belts and it does help to hold the lo up and take some pressure off the pelvis. Not the most sexy or comfortable of things to wear! But whoever said pregnancy was sexy or comfortable!

LL how would I even go about finding a good osteopath? Definitely sounds like something I should do, thanks xx

HW - the thing is I don't actually mind performance being measured. I'm all for that because I actually work hard and performance measuring might reflect that . What I have a problem with is management lumping everyone together and treating us all as if we are out to scam the system. I don't know if you have heard of KSF - it's a performance measurment for clinical staff. It came into effect about 4 years ago. In my work areas it's never been used. Maybe they should be pulling their finger out and applying this.

baffy - I meant osteopath not obstetrician. I am losing it

totally agree with you Lush - i too work in a field where lunch breaks are not taken and i would cover for others and i think morale and loyalty needs to be recognised a lot more than measuring 'performance' whatever that is.

TFM - Oi <mock indignation>

Baffy - Great news about your chat with the boss. Hope that takes a lot of pressure off you. In your shoes I would (and will - if I get it again) see an obstetrician - one that has expertise in pregnancy related conditions. I've heard they can make a huge difference. NHS physio was crap ime. Thanks for your opinion on my work situation. It's useful to get feedback from someone else who is a manager. I can see your POV. I suppose I just disagree with this form of management because it is indirect, impersonal and rather tactless. I work in a team where imo very few people take the piss. Tbh there are few of us in the team anyway. Many of us take on more than we should and are way more flexible than the organisation deserves - eg. not taking lunch breaks (which are unpaid), staying late, covering for duty even when it's not our turn etc, going in at weekends and not claiming time back etc. We don't expect a pat on the back, but to get an email like that is a huge insult. Maybe it would've been better if he had sent the email and said something at the end like "I'd hate this to detract from the otherwise great work we do" for e.g. I think private sector companies are run differently and performance related stuff is dealt with in this kind of way. In my line of work, it is generally dealt with differently. For a start there are no bonuses, no pay rises (well unless you count the basic 1-2% increase which for years has not even caught up with inflation), no financial incentives to keep people meeting targets. Targets are met by motivated staff who enjoy their work and feel that they are making a difference. A manager working on the assumption that all employees are likely to take the piss, will imo not get the best out of the team. Recruitment and retention are a huge problem in my field and if people are unhappy they will leave. Sorry very long post

I'm glad I make you laugh Baffy, it's good for the SPD It takes your mind off it. It's a shame you don't have an envelope to open, I bet you wouldn't be as stubborn hard to crack as LL!

That's good news too about your job. I hope you are going to take full advantage, not in a 'taking advantage' kind of way you understand, in a not still putting the Company first kind of way IYSWIM?

I was thinking, you know those maternity belts you can get, those elastic things, would one of those help you? It would take the weight of the baby a bit if nothing else. Just a thought I'm not really up on SPD but I know it can be very painful.

Oh that is good news re the work situation Baffy. Sometimes it just does take having a quiet word to sort these things out!

Hope you are ok x

TFM you do make me laugh

LL she’s telling the truth you know. Cervix does take as long to open as the envelope!!

LL in defence of your boss, I think it may be a confidence thing, but also I do sometimes see the benefits of e-mails like that. Of course it is preferable to address matters of conduct individually, but at this stage, when finding his feet, he may not want to be so confrontational.
He may be hoping that a general email (where people know full well that it’s them doing it) will be enough to address the issue. Then if not, he then has recourse if he does have to speak to them individually, as he can refer to his email of xx date, and explain that since that date, he has noticed xyz etc. It makes the issue his to tackle iyswim.

I understand the frustration on your side. But playing devils advocate, it was a technique I was taught when I took on this team (15 people who are by far the worst people that I have ever managed) and it saved me wading in too soon/incorrectly during the early days. Sometimes it’s easier to keep things general until you know exactly who you’re dealing with

TFM it’s great news about dp and ds. Their relationship sounds like it has come a long way in the last 12 months. Fantastic news. And nope, no idea where your ds gets his determination from

Dior – I am going to re-post TFM’s words:

“There is nothing worse than living with a man, loving a man who you feel finds you unattractive. It's soul destroying. And here you are living with a man who tells you openly how your excess weight makes him feel. It's disgusting!! He should be totally ashamed of himself.”

And then some words of yours:

“I do agree that there would be something else if it were not for my weight. I remember him not wanting me when I WAS slim.”

So you know yourself that weight is not the issue here. You don’t need to listen to us, you already know that if it wasn’t the weight it would be something else – i.e. it is him with the problem. He doesn’t see you, or treat you, in the way you need.
That seems to me, what it boils down to. You sound like you are working so hard to gain the love and affection of a man who previously, has shown that nothing you do, is good enough

Ginny – great news that your ‘d’p is back

TFM I’m not sure H is anywhere near earning his ‘d’ back yet
But I will enjoy it all in the meantime.

Tanee I’m so glad TFM’s advice is helping. I wouldn’t know where to start with the things your dp says. Depression is so so awful

Quick update from me too – midwife was great on Friday. Said I’m not making anything ‘worse’ by continuing to work – which was my main concern, so big relief there.
She said the key is that I don’t do anything I’m not supposed to (any sort of lifting, carrying ds, careful on stairs and getting out of car etc) and rest as much as possible so that the pain stays manageable. So if I want to continue to work they are happy for me to do that as long as I get a balance between work and resting. They said I will know myself once the pain gets too much that it’s time to call it a day.

So, I spoke to my boss this morning and he has agreed that I can manage my hours to suit myself (i.e. early finishes if the pain is bad etc) and do 1 or 2 days a week from home (in which I will get the work done in whatever hours I choose, but use the time as much as possible to rest) so I feel much much much better for that

Glad you had a good day yesterday Dior. Will you ever meet his high expectations? Do you even want to? Why should you even try to sit with him, when he is so cold towards you.
Poor barber .
Tannee - I think we have the same DP at times They get down, drink too much, become horrible and obnoxious, sleep it off, feel guilty (don't always remember why!) and then go all nice again to make up for it.
After boozing for most of last week and spending all day Friday in bed, my DP has been PERFECT all weekend. He has reminded me of why I love him so much. He even took the dc down early to make me breakfast in bed while I had a huge lie in on Sunday morning. If he was always like this I'd never complain again. He did say Thank you for being there through the hell of the last few weeks and apologised for being so 'difficult'.
Anyway, back to the cleaning - I just found a mouldy carrot in the bottom of the fridge, it stinks!!!

Dior, you would NOT be a burden - seriously, you would be most welcome, with or without DS!

Oh, and you KNOW I have always fancied my barber man

only an idiot if you hadnt put on your waterproof mascara.

You are anything but silly - if you need to cry then do so - bet your friend was fantastic anyway.

Keep talking - you will find your way in your own time and we are all here for you. Some nearer than others dont forget.

No HW, I don't try because it feels like I am always the one and I don't want to be rejected. Also, I feel like I need him to WANT to hug me, to prove himself IYKWIM. That is something that he says - that I never come to him, but that is my fear of rejection, and also an element of 'why should I?' which I do realise is not a good way to solve things.

I feel so sad. I ended up talking to a friend this morning and crying . Idiot.

oh doir - and now your attentions are turning elsewhere too, the barber.

You really do seem to be giving your marriage your all - and it is still not giving you what you want.

I hate reading your posts - because i know what a wonderful happy person you are and yet in your posts you do sound so down.

A hug sounds so little to expect - are you trying to cuddle up on the sofa with him?

Yes, the shared cleaning makes him happy, so it makes our time easier. It also meant that he was in a good mood, so agreed to go to Pizza Hut for dinner .

LL - Yes, he is a clean/control freak. You have come to my story much later than the others and all my old posts have been deleted, so you probably don't know this! Everything in his life is controllable except me!

Tanee - I don't want to be a burden to you by dumping myself on you - but if you ever need a friend to go out with or spend and evening moaning to, I will come and stay with you. I wasn't inviting myself over as such and I certainly didn't mean with ds!!!

On Saturday, when h and I had the argument/discussion, it was about me feeling unloved basically. Eventually, I tried to move forward by suggesting that, if I spent more time in the evening with him, showing hiim that I do want to be with him, maybe he could be more affectionate. I told him that what I need are big hugs every now and then. So...I have spent the last two evenings watching tv with him - have I had a hug or anything? NO!

Oh, and I tried to book ds in to have his hair cut with lovely barber man, only to hear that he is in hospital having been hit by a car! Two broken legs! Poor guy, and poor me <wail>

Dior

It is good to clear out the kitichen - but it does sound as if you are happier because you know it pleases him than makes you happy?? iyswim.

I would be hopeless with a clean freak - dh thinks he is one until i get him to bring down his washing from the bedroom floor - then he sees what a slob he really is.

Tanee that is brilliant!! NO,it isn't evil, you have to get your own back somehow!

I'm so pleased you are feeling more positive today and thank you for the lovely words. You are most welcome and I am here for you anytime! xx

Dior, glad to hear you had some good shared time with H - even if it was cleaning ! I think that's what my DP lacks - the incentive to do anything shared in this house. We started on DD's room together - then he had an episode and walked out without warning. He never gave me a reason for why he couldn't continue, but I reckon it was something to do with creating something for DD - that was in the early days of our troubles. We managed to complete most of our own bedroom together, and he did a lovely job on the picture rails, but it's not completed as we still have a bookshelf to install and our fourposter to erect - and I have lost the heart to suggest we do them, so they languish in the attic.

Yes, it was very hard to hear him admit to his drinking and desire for oblivion. And his determined refusal to seek any help. I realised the next morning that he'd already had a lot before the conversation started. I suspect he regrets some of what he said - and probably doesn't even remember all he said - because all yesterday he was doing little things to please me, which he hasn't done in a long time - just things like making me coffee and pasta, making salad and dips for dinner, and he was quite sweet again this morning, suggesting that as DD's away for a couple of days and we've both had a rough night (slept badly and both had anxiety dreams)- we should try to have a nice evening together.

The thing is, he does these things when he's sober. He's lovely then. The shite comes out when he's drunk . I try to hold on to the sober DP in my mind and remember that it's the depression talking when he's drunk.

TFM, you are a tower of strength, and you are really getting me through. I don't know what I would have done without you. Either gone to pieces and gotten depressed myself by now, or thrown him out and been miserable anyway. As it is, I feel more positive today - helped by you and the signs of the real DP I've seen which prove that he's still in there somewhere and worth fighting for.

Dior, you are welcome here anytime. The spare room is very cosy, nice big double bed, and DS would be welcome - we could take him to see the dinosaurs or whatever he fancies - or if you leave him with DH, we could just go visit bead shops . Alternatively I would love to visit you - but perhaps that would have to be when DD is also away as she'd not enjoy being left in the house with DP! In the meantime, we should do that lunch with HW.

Oh, and I have to share this with all of you - last night DP asked if I'd get out the dips whilst he watched the cricket. So I opened some taramasalata and left it on the kitchen table while I sorted out the rest. I heard a lapping noise and turned round to find one of the cats - the one DP feels a real rivalry with, she loves me so much and mews for me every morning - on the table and giving the tarama a good licking. I scraped off a bit of it - but then left it for DP to have the first helping . Am I evil or am I EVIL? No signs of ill effects so far !

Dior - is he a neat freak? That would tie in with his dislike of voluptuous women. Slender = neat and ordered, nothing out of place.

Oh and, h was happy today, because we cleaned the kitchen. I actually quite enjoyed it too because we got rid of loads of out-of-date stuff in the cupboards and managed to move a lot of stuff from the worktops into the new cupboard space. We also cleaned the fridge. It was actually quite nice working together and I felt good that this was making him happy - fucked up or what!

It is like earning his respect by being a cleaning goddess rather than for being slim and gorgeous...

Tanee - how horrible for you to hear that your dp is trying to drink himself to death. At what point will you allow him to do this alone, or will you see it through to the bitter end? It reminds me of that film, 'Leaving Las Vegas' - that was a laugh a minute . Poor you. Sweetheart - do you need me to come and be with you? I know you have dd, but if you want a shoulder to cry on, I will come and stay with you, or you could come here.

lol Good point about teabags

I think I would have you as my secretary/PA LL, I know I could trust you not to let on any of our business Actually, you could be the Chancellor, if you guard that battered old briefcase as well as you are guarding that bloody envelope you will be perfect for the job!

Don't you worry about Tanee, I'm making sure she stays afloat and isn't dragged down by her DP Teabags don't sink in hot water, they just get stronger!

incorruptible

Lol TFM - you'd be one of the most sage PMs we've had I reckon. I don't think you'd want me on your cabinet; bit of a loose cannon and yep - totally uncorruptable. I'd be leading the opposition making sure you work

Tanee - psml at mooncups to dredge moats Don't know what you can do about dp. He is on self-destruct If you stay he drags you down with him, if you leave him you feel miserable. Very hard situation for you either way. It seems so unfair when you are putting in so much effort and he is hell bent on destroying it.

turned their nose up...

What do you mean I won't have enough time for you, you will all be on my cabinet!! All apart from Ladylush cos she's shown herself to be a traitor by not opening that damned envelope!!! I mean, whoever heard of a politician who turned there nose up at an envelope!!

TFM for PM - yeah!!! - only - you wouldn't have enough time for us anymore - so sorry, you won't get my vote !

I started a post saying exactly that Tanee, about the second homes that is, not the mooncups

My opinion is this, if my DP were to be given a job miles away from home we would be expected to relocate as a family or he would have to rent accommodations so, why do these people expect the taxpayer to pay for them to have a second home? I think they should buy a big hotel in London, or a bed and breakfast and they should all have to stay there while they were working. End of! God, the sooner I am Prime Minister the better!!

Thanks TFM, off to read my email. Goodness, I've been on this laptop all day !

LL just had a look at that thread - love the idea of claiming expenses for a mooncup to dredge your moat!!!! Also the idea of parking all MPs who need 2nd homes in London, in the Olympic Village, appeals. It sounds like Sweden has the best idea - why do they need to BUY second homes? Why not just rent them? Anyway - yawn - bored -just relieved that my MP isn't on any of the lists!

Yes Tanee, you go and eat your pasta, you need the carbs! I've replied to your last email and I think I have it sussed in my last paragraph!!

LL, I am STILL waiting for DD to get into a routine - and she's 17 lol!

TFM yes, feeling a bit better and huge thanks. DP seems to be trying to make up for last night - made me coffee this morning and just came in with pasta. He's having a glass of wine with his, though -and, I note, hasn't offered me a glass of that!

Sorry girls, I posted this morning and then MN went down, taking my post with it! Suffice to say DP was an ARSE last night, but he'd had quite a lot to drink and I didn't realise just how much until this morning. He started by making a nasty remark about my empire building (ie everything in this house is about DD and me, he has no involvement). Of course, the fact is that HE CHOOSES not to be involved, but that's not how he perceives it. He was hugely pessimistic again, said he thought I was happy despite his misery, but since I'd told him on Wednesday that I was fed up and miserable too, he thought we should really call it a day. Admits he is deliberately drinking himself to death, won't seek help, too old for therapy, wants to be on his own and die of alcohol as he hates his life, end of story. God, it wears me out just thinking about it, so I hope you'll forgive me if I go eat my pasta now!

Tanee - a thread on mumsnet (active convos) on MP expenses.

Ooh he was LL and yes, I am well rid!! It's just a shame it takes longer to get rid of the emotional and mental damage he did. I've been divorced from him for 13 years on the 31st of May so I will have been divorced longer than I was married but, the emotional scars are still there, he did a good job on me. I work very hard to rise above it though

Routine?? Routine?? Ha Ha! Try telling the baby about routine!

Dior, I'm pleased you are starting to think about your future. You have a lot to look forward to

Tanee - hope you are feeling a bit better now

TFM - your ex-p sounds like a nasty man. Well rid.

See what I mean Dior - still thinking of others even when you feel so miserable.

Tanee - I agree with Dior. You won't be boring us at all. Sorry to hear you are feeling so gloomy about your future with dp. Has something happened lately?

TFM - nice to get a bit of time to yourself, even if it is to cook the roast dinner. I think I will need to work out a schedule whereby I can get at least an hour to myself once a week when lo born. Not straight away obviously, but once lo is in a routine. Ha ha..........routine......

Tanee - please DO 'bore' us with it. Maybe we could help, and it wouldn't be boring either!

I am trying to get the courage together to have a really good think about my future.

Hi Ladie

Tanee - I await your email my love We will get you sorted, don't worry.

LL - My ex used to call me Thunder Thighs and Big Girl. I hated it and it gave me a real complex. I have never really appreciated my height because I associate it with being a 'Big Girl' I am just like you re the photo's. I look at myself as thin as a toothpick and with really sad eyes. Even though I was thin I never really appreciated my body, it was a constant battle with food. I remember once he was sat eating a Mr Kipling cake right in front of me. My mouth was watering, he looked at me and said "You would love to have a bite of this wouldn't you" God, at that point I would have eaten the hand holding it I was so hungry!! <<shudder>> it was a nightmare time.

Ginny - I understand exactly what you mean re your DP. It's not just about what's on the outside is it? It's about the inside too. Crikey, after the problems we have had with our other halves what's on the inside must be pretty damned special!

I read a book once called 'Love yourself and it doesn't matter who you marry'. The title was very apt. I think if you love yourself, are happy with yourself then you don't seek approval from others, you don't really place a value on what others think of you. You enjoy life instead of wasting time trying to be someone you think other people would like you to be.

Hello to everyone else I hope your weekend is going well. I'm having a crafty minute while DP has taken DD swimming. I'm supposed to be cooking a roast dinner!!

Tanee - glad your MP has scruples Quite rare in politics these days.

Ooh cross post Tanee - will read

Lol Tanee - I don't think I could get away with dresses though. Poor baby will be very confused when it gets older. I like polka dots and yellow dresses so don't necessarily gravitate towards pink. When expecting ds I bought a lot of yellow and green clothes as they are quite unisex but looked better on ds than blue (because of his golden complexion). So I still have these and can re-use for baby. So far, I've only allowed myself to buy some hats. I got a white sunhat from Next and a pack of two blue/white ones - still ok for a girl. Btw, I see you avoided the expenses topic

TFM - nice try (re envelope)
Btw, I was very sad and angry to read what your xp did to your self-esteem and health. At 17 yrs old i was in a relationship with a guy who made me feel crap about my body. He called me "chunky" and always compared me to his sister (how weird) who was petite but shapely. I am the same height as you and weighed 9st, which was about as thin as it is healthy to be at that height. I look at photos now and feel so angry that I couldn't see myself the way I really was. Luckily that relationship didn't last very long. I met dh about 6 months later, who was a refreshing change. Fortunately, he appreciates a more voluptuous figure as well as slender figures so both bases covered (mind you, after this next dc I doubt I'll ever get to 10st again).

Personally, I am at the end of my tether with DP - things very bad here, I feel bleak about our future but I won't bore you all - TFM, I will be emailing you!

Oh, the MPs' expenses row - yes, I don't know why the press are making such a big thing of it now - I suppose it feeds in nicely with the economic climate to find some scapegoats amongst people who are constantly telling us to economise and making laws to bleed us of more money. I'm sure people have suspected that some MPs have made dodgy claims for years and it should have been investigated years ago. Thank goodness my own MP is actually quite honest about her own expenses - she has always felt that reputation and honour are hugely important, and openly said once that she didn't go into politics to make money. No second home, and she pays for her own garden and dogfood! We don't have many treats in the office either, and certainly no great bonuses (in my case, none at all ).

Dior, like Ginnny, I absolutely agree with TFM and LL - and they put it so much better than I ever could. Besides, I have met you and - unless you have put on a HUUUUGE amount since we last met, even if you are over your BNI, you are still nothing like the horrendously obese women I see waddling round our local shopping precinct, usually with several children in tow. And the crux of the matter, here, leaving aside H's preference for slim women, is that he was the same when you WERE slim, and that if you did go back to being a size 10, 8, 6, or a teeny weeny pencil, he would STILL find some reason to avoid intimacy or come out with stuff like the trainers v sandals incident. That's why we are saying it's HIS problem and not yours. If you are dieting, it MUST be for YOU, because the lost weight will still not change what's fundamentally wrong with your H. That IS harsh. Have you tried telling him this?

LL, you could still buy lots of pink and then, if it's a boy, confuse people by dressing him in it . Just don't take photos of him in pink as he will not thank you for it when he's older! Personally I liked dressing DD in navy - she looked very chic!

Dior, I agree 100% with LL and TFM.
The worrying thing about your H is that he isn't showing you any affection. He might have a problem with your weight, and he's entitled to his opinion on that, but why can't he show you any affection at all - its not all about sex is it?
To be honest my DP isn't exactly Adonis (you've seen him on FB!!) and he's not my usual type physically (I used to like them a lot younger and slimmer ) but because I love him as a person the rest is just part of the package iyswim.
Its a shame that your H can't see past the weight you are to the person inside, the person that we all see.

Yes, I can see your point BUT, () if you don't take a peek and it turns out to be a girl you will have missed out on 20 weeks pure excitement!!! You don't have to buy clothes or, if you do you can keep the receipts and exchange them for blue clothes. See, where there's a will there's a way, and where there's an envelope there's a Teabag to nag you!

If you are determined to be stubborn strong then post me the envelope for safe keeping

Oh yes roses TFM
By the way, it's a self-seal envelope. It's untouched in h's bag. I'm cruel aren't I Actually though, I don't like surprises. That's why I'm not opening it. If it says a girl and is then a boy it will be an unwelcome surprise you see Not that I mind having a boy at all - but would not like to get excited about a pink one, shop for dresses, then deliver a boy.

Ermm, roses with thorns in your side you mean don't you LL?

LL is right Dior, you do sound to have taken a passive stance again and we have picked up on it you can bet your H has. He is never going to back down on this because he is getting the message that you agree with him he will be feeling justified. Well, he isn't!!

As you already know my exH was abusive. He used to tell me I needed to lose weight. Like you Dior I took it all onboard. At the time I had a three month old baby and I weighed 11stone. I'm 5ft 9 and a half inches tall so I was hardly fat! But, I went on a diet and lost a lot of weight. One day, at my lowest ever weight of 7st 10lb I stood naked in front of him and asked him if he thought I was slim enough. He cocked his head to one side while studying my body and them proceeded to tell me how I still needed to lose weight off my hips. I was actually skin and bone and had no weight left to lose off my hips!! At this point I was anorexic and soon became bulemic(sp) And to this day, 21 years later, I am left with body and food issues.

Losing weight didn't make him show me love, it didn't stop him abusing me. The only person it affected was me. The most amazing thing is that he was about 3 stone overweight himself!!

My DP has known me to be many different weights, 13st 12lb at my heaviest when I was on loads of medication. We have had our ups and downs but he has never once used my weight against me. He is not slim either but that doesn't stop me loving him. I see the man he is inside, not the big belly I love him for the person he is, the person he has become and all the effort he has put in to making our relationship work. I love him for him no matter what weight he is.

Dior - TFM and I are going to be thorns in your side on this one

Dior - when I say you are back feeling sorry for yourself I don't mean that how it sounds. What I mean is when you take that passive stance nothing changes and the pattern continues. Hope you see what I mean.

Excellent post LadyLush, excellent!

Dior I felt v sad reading that Again, TFM is spot on imo. I don't want to be too harsh either but I think you are actually allowing him to treat you in this way. You made a few steps to assert yourself then you had a row and now you are back feeling sorry for yourself. It seems to be a pattern. I'm probably not putting this as tactfully as I can - sorry, bit tired today. Abuse can only happen when someone allows it. Your h is abusing you. Please don't let him. You see your weight as a problem but being miserable is not conducive to you losing weight - h rejects you so makes you feel more miserable. Vicious cycle. Have you thought about a separation? With some space, without his negativity you can deal with the weight -or at least work out if it is still important to you. I agree that weight is an issue for you and h but in different ways. Also, what is this lack of affection towards you teaching his son? To be emotionally cold and distant towards what should be the most important female in his life..........v damaging to your son imo. I haven't met you but I can tell you are worth so much more than this. You are attractive and intelligent and very encouraging of others. You so deserve more. You might believe it yourself one day.

I hope I didn't sound too harsh there.

Stop apologising and stop being so generous to your H!! Fair enough, he is entitled to his own opinion and entitled to feel how he wishes BUT what he is NOT entitled to do is pass the responsibility for how HE feels on to you. You don't like his attitude towards you but He refuses to change. Why the hell should YOU change just to make him feel happy? Where does it end? It is weight we are talking about here, just a bit of extra padding. You are still you despite the weight. But you know all this already.

As far as I can see, given that you don't blame him for how he feels, you have two choices, you either lose the weight or you leave him. If as you say he was just the same towards you when you were slim then losing weight is going to make no difference, you may be slim but you will still be lonely and you will be twice as unhappy because you will be constantly calorie counting and depriving yourself of your favourite foods. Right now I would say sod the diet and enjoy your food, it's not worth the deprivation just to end up in the same boat.

If you are going to lose weight Dior then you need to to it for you and in your own time at your own pace. The only way you are going to be able to live with H and his present attitude is to develop a hard skin and detach yourself from his hurtful words. Don't allow yourself to be a victim of his weight snobbery!

But it IS my problem because I am with a man who won't touch me. To be fair to him, I AM obese - I just have a slim photo up on my FB and blog. I really need to lost at least three stone to be within my BMI healthy range.

I don't BLAME him for feeling that way, but I do agree that there would be something else if it were not for my weight. I remember him not wanting me when I WAS slim. I am just so sick of being lonely.

He is being nice (well talking to me) now, so I think we are doing the whole 'let's ignore and move on' thing now.

Sorry, I have no input to give on anyone else at the moment and I am all 'take, take, take' .

Dior your problem with your weight and your H's problem with your weight are completely different/separate problems. His problem with your weight is making your problem with your weight much worse and harder to deal with.

You are doing extremely well in standing up to him. Don't feel bad for doing so. Just carry on as you feel fit to and don;t let his problem become yours. I think he uses your weight as an excuse. I think he has deeper issues going on that are about him and your weight is a distraction from that, it is something he uses to either keep you down or keep you at a distance.

I know this must be hard for you to live with and to be honest I am not surprised you get depressed. There is nothing worse than living with a man, loving a man who you feel finds you unattractive. It's soul destroying. And here you are living with a man who tells you openly how your excess weight makes him feel. It's disgusting!! He should be totally ashamed of himself.

You need to get out of this cycle of being affected by what he says to you. You can either choose to believe what he says or choose not to believe what he says. If choose to believe that he is right and believe everything he says to you then you are going to remain stuck. If you decide to sod what he thinks and says and do your best to switch off when he is being nasty and hurtful then you have more chance of getting out of this cycle.

I have seen the photo's of you Dior and trust me, you are not obese and you are not unattractive. If your H thinks you are either of those things then he needs serious help. What he is doing to you is mentally, emotionally and verbally abusive. He is controlling your mood by his abuse. Please Dior, don't let him do this.

When he gets back why don't you try doing what we talked about and call his bluff. Tell him that you understand how he feels and you are letting him go to find someone he he feels is acceptable to him. Say your piece then walk away and leave him with it. See what happens.

But whatever happens, don't you dare believe the things he is saying to you. Believe us when we tell you the problem is with him not you!! xx

So, big argument today . I admit that I over-reacted to something because I have been feeling so unloved, so it was me being a little selfish. However, we had the 'affection' talk and it boiled down (again) to the 'You know how I feel about fat people. I can't change but YOU can..' situation again.

I admitted my part in the argument and apologised. Unfortunately, he didn't seem to want to move on and try to work out a way for me to be with him more often and him to show me more affection. So, I went out by myself and he went for a bike ride.

Basically, my weight is now the whole crux of our problems. I don't feel able to do anything about it at the moment.

Tanee I will tell DS that you say he has to stay And yes, DP is being a star with him, it's lovely to watch. DS is milking it a bit though with requests for lifts here there and everywhere. I surprised him with a bus pass yesterday! Since he got his scooter he has gone of buses, they are not quite so cool! I don't want him getting above his station now, do I?

LL!! I'm not going to mention the envelope today because I know I will only be disappointed! But, is it a self seal type or the kind you lick to stick? Just thinking, if you got just a little bit curious you could slide a knife under the lip, take a peep and then restick it. We won't tell DH I promise!!

Hi to everyone else

Dior - well done for standing up to dh. I suppose you have to ask yourself whether you will be satisfied with him doing a u-turn and trying to get back in your good books - or whether you've just had enough. It does sound as though it's a control thing. I agree with TFM there. When you stand up to him suddenly he doesn't seem as sure of himself any more. What is he like at work? Does he give orders or take them?

Tanee - at least you have a line manager. This guy is my line manager. I have a problem working for people I don't trust. That's why I left my last job.

So Tanee - you probably can't say but what do you think about the expenses fiasco? Tbh I can't imagine why it's only a scandal now. Surely everyone knows that the system is open to corruption - and even when MPs follow the rules they're still sitting pretty at the tax payers expense. Why is it only now that people are getting angry? Because of the economy? Oh purleeeeese. The media are making a meal of it aren't they.

TFM your ds is not permitted to go to Oz - we need him here! REALLY pleased to hear how DP is helping him. Your DP is being a star at the moment, long may it last . Not sure how my DP would cope if he had to look after DD at the moment ...

LL your boss sounds a lot like mine. He does the same thing - round robin emails and not very nicely worded. Then he can be an absolute sweetie. It's very confusing. He annoys the hell out of my immediate line manager, I know she finds him very difficult and I suspect some of the problems I've had at work this week, stem from him.

Dior, well done you . Just keep standing up to him. Eat a Milky Way right under his nose. Better still eat TWO Milky Ways ! I think TFM has absolutely hit it on the head - especially with his comments about why you were 'tarting yourself up'. He didn't want all those little scouts and scout masters admiring his 'possession' -even though he isn't doing anything in the affection/hugs/line to ensure your interest in him. It may not be the end of the relationship - keep going in this vein and you may just show him what he stands in danger of losing.

Re lunch - I don't think I'll be able to do the Thursday after half term as that's Euroelections day & I may be needed at work. But any Thursday after that - or if not, just arrange a day and I will take a day off work (after last week, I feel within my rights and I have lots of leave due...)

hi girls, posting from phone so this will be brief, it's a slooooow process!

Just had to say WELL DONE DIOR!! I am so pleased you stood your ground. I am even more convinced of his insecurity, he wanted you to cover up a part of you that had caught his attention and found attractive. He didnt want anyone else to think the same, hence nagging you to put your trainers on. you should be feeling empowered!

LL your boss is displaying typical passive aggressive behaviour. He is finding his feet, trying to assert himself while trying to be nice at the same time. He is going to tie himself in knots at this rate and lose any respect he may have.

Now, back to the envelope, have you tried holding it over a lightbulb? That works a treat, don't ask me how i know if u see 4 letters its a girl and 3 its a boy, simple! We need to know LL, we have to start choosing names!

Erm, I am really thinking relationship is over .

Today, we were going to drop ds off at Scout Camp for the night and he told me that my birki-style shoes might not be suitable in a field, as it had rained alot in the last 24 hours. Fair enough, but I decided to continue wearing them - my choice. I said I was going to wear them and he kept going on, 'Wear your trainers, wear your walking boots'. I just ignored him and asked if we were all ready. He tried saying, 'Your lovely newly painted toes and white shoes might get covered in mud', and I continued rounding everything up to leave.

He then asked if I was ignoring him. I said, 'I am an adult and have decided to wear these shoes'. So he then started ignoring me and being huffy . I stood my ground and said, 'I can't believe you are ignoring me, just because I want to wear these shoes. I would never dream of telling you what to wear and then getting in a mood if you didn't do as I said.' He got the hint and managed to get out of his strop thank God.

All over a pair of flip-flops <throws hands in air>

The thing is, earlier he was going on about why I was making an effort in how I looked, just to drop ds off at Scout camp. All I had done was paint my (sorely needed) toenails and add a little mascara and lip-gloss. He kept asking me why I was 'dressing up'.

It's all so much hard work and I need some affection/action (). I'm not going to get it from him unless I clearly make an effort to lose weight and now I am beginning to resent that. I don't think I WANT him near me now .

HW - have responded to your email - can't do next Thursday. Next week, I can only do Monday tbh. Can we do the week after half-term?

Ha ha TFM - you are funny Your ds sounds delightful. I'm sure he will b a fantastic dp for someone Yes you could be right. I also have an inside leg of 33inches - at least I used to. I think I may well be shrinking Re. boss - I think you're right about his motives. It's weird because he tries to engage in small talk yet then does something like sending that email.

Hello Ladies

Hope all went well with the midwife Baffy. What a dilemma you are in, it's a bit bad when you have to go to work when you are really not fit to do so. I can understand why they have the 11 week rule but I think in cases where the employee is suffering severe pain and discomfort such as you are, going sick shouldn't affect your maternity leave. Why don't you get your own back by taking mat leave early then going on the sick for a few weeks at the end of it. Chaffed nipples and piles can be very painful and make a person very ill you know

I'm so glad your H is being supportive. Has he earned his 'D' back yet then? He sounds to be being an absolute star, I am so pleased he has come through for you.

You are right about my DS too. He has taken everything in his stride and is just getting on with life. He obviously can't work on the farm (milking cows) but he rang his boss yesterday and arranged to go cut his grass! It's a sit on mower so he was ok. He just amazes me. It seems nothing will hold him back. I wonder where he gets his strength and determination from? I just hope and pray that he is still able to pass his course.

I have witnessed some lovely moments between him and DP. The doing up of the zips, the gently folding back of long sleeves over his pot, are all being taken care of by DP. It's so lovely to see He is really taking good care of him.

Hi Ginny, thank you for your good wishes re DS I do hope DP comes through for you and pulls himself together for the weekend. You deserve a good one.

Thank you to you too Tanee DS already has a claim ongoing for his scooter so hopefully that will be replaced soon. Not that he will be able to drive it! As for the world needing good plumbers, that#e exactly what he says. He is still adamant that he is going to qualify and then move to Australia and earn mega bucks but, considering I can't leave the room without him coming looking for me, or leave the house without him ringing to find out where I am, I am not getting too upset at the prospect of losing him to Oz just yet

LadyLush Don't let your new boss get to you, not yet anyway. He is new and he is a man so he will be throwing his weight about a bit and marking his territory. I think the fact he sent the email rather than speak to people face to face shows he hasn't quite got the confidence he would like to have Give him a couple more months and if he is still acting like a prize knob then give him the full brunt of your pregnancy hormones!!
Oh, and your theory about the length of the femur. Weeelll, my inside leg measures 33ins so it could still be a girl, a girl with long legs. Now, if you just open the envelope..........
I bet you are one of those people who can have presents under the tree for the whole of December and not even give them a squeeze or a shake. Not like me, I open them have a look and rewrap them! You are just too good!! You do realise that by not opening the envelope you are risking the chance of a very long labour, it's a well known fact you know. The cervix takes as long to open as the envelope

Dior, so glad to hear you are feeling a bit brighter today. I hope your day was good

Hi to everyone else. Have a lovely weekend everyone!

Baffy - maybe your suggestion of working from home/reduced hours might work. I'm sure from an HR point of view they should be seen to accomodate the needs of pregnant women - esp. where there are associated health problems. It seems rather inflexible to insist on starting an employee's maternity leave 11 weeks before ewc in the absence of trying an alternative. I don't blame you for not wanting to go back in December. Glad h is being supportive and helping around the house. I bought baby hats today. One white and a pair of blue/white ones. Even if it's a girl she can wear blue. But it will be a boy. I am fairly sure. Still haven't opened envelope. Femur length is 39.3mm at 21+5 so I think it is even more likely that it's a boy.

Feeling a bit down at work at the moment. We've got a new boss. He seemed ok - good even but there have been a few things lately that have put me off him. He sent an email to the whole team which obviously only applied to one or two employees (about conduct)and I don't like that style of management. I think it should be addressed with individual employees.

28th may is in half term - i have said i could meet next thurs and have sent email to dior.

Baffy - we had that rule at work too - and actually i think in some ways it is sensible as people will work up to their due date even when they are not always capable.

Baffy, hope you and your boss manage to come to an agreement. It really sounds like you need to rest .

Ginnny, really glad things went as well as possible with the funeral. You are being a tower of strength to DP - I hope he comes through his grief bender soon - it must be hard for him.

TFM - your poor, poor DS! Makes my 'fat suit' hand sound very trivial (swelling's subsided today!). How mean people can be. Can he claim on insurance for the scooter and bike? Really hope his college can allow for his injuries. The world needs good plumbers and he works so hard. I just read your post to DD and she was well impressed. I don't think anything would get her out of bed at 3am!

Lily, congrats on the exams. I was always crap at maths and struggled to get my 'O' level.

Dior, glad you're feeling brighter - enjoy your course.

HW happy birthday to DD. Looking forward to our lunch - any feelings about lunch dates? I can't do 28 May as I'm getting a haircut.

Dior - enjoy your beading course . Every time I try and go to a course one of the dc is ill or they fall in the school holidays.
LL - 17 months where did that time go?
Lush - you are showing great self control. I'd have definitely opened it by now.
TFM - your poor son. What crap luck. Hope he gets better soon and gets through his exams OK.
I went to DP's and made him a cup of tea before work this morning. He's still very down but I think hope he's had enough booze and he's going to sort himself out so we can spend the weekend together. I did spot an empty 3 litre wine box that wasn't there yesterday so he must have drunk it all last night. YUK!!!

LL they’ve mentioned that to me too about measuring how wide you can open your legs before the pain starts and then that is to be part of my ‘birth plan’ to ensure everyone is aware of the problem and they don’t do anything that could cause me more pain or complications.

I didn’t have a birth plan last time, and this time it was going to be ‘just follow the same as last time, couple of hours labour, only gas and air, get home as soon as possible’! I have never really seen any point in a birth plan as I don’t have strong preferences either way, and truly feel like you never know how it will be, or how you will feel, until you’re actually going though it.
May have to re-think that one though!!

Anyway, I am entitled to sick pay, but there is a rule within the company policy that if you are signed off with a ‘pregnancy related illness’ within the last 11 weeks, that they have the right to start your maternity leave.
I spoke to HR about it and they said they only start your maternity leave as a matter of course, if you are within the last 4 weeks. The rest is at management’s discretion.

However, my boss is the Finance Director. Enough said!

As for holidays, I have saved them all up, but I was tagging them onto the start and end of my time off just so I could have a full 6 months off. I am due to finish 4 weeks before I’m due, take a couple of weeks holiday, then start mat leave. And it’s all going out the window…

I see the midwife today so I’ll see what she says. LL you are right. I really think I should be signed off. Especially when my own staff are saying I look that bad that shouldn’t be here! I really am struggling just to get up and down and walk to the toilet or kitchen. It’s a really difficult one.
Will see what the midwife says. If she even suggests that I’m making it worse for myself by carrying on I will just have to accept defeat and try to work things out with my boss… Am wondering about suggesting reduced hours, or a couple of days a week from home, just to get me through the last few weeks.

I know it doesn’t seem like much, but when it will mean the difference between going back mid January next year, or 2 weeks before Christmas, I know how I’m going to feel!!

H is being fantastic tbh. I actually don’t know what I would have done without him and my mum. He is doing literally everything around the house, from shopping to cooking, washing, ironing etc. ‘Cleaning’ is H’s definition of ‘cleaning’, not necessarily mine but I’m not complaining!
My mum is having ds during the days and for the odd ‘sleepover’ which has really helped so much.
I even get breakfast in bed before H gets ds ready and then goes to work. He puts him in the car for me (as it’s generally a battle and involves 400 toys that ds absolutely has to take to Grandma’s that day!! And as he’s still doing 2 jobs, he will often finish at 5, come home, do tea, bath ds, do some washing etc, and then go back and work until midnight on his other job. He’ll then text or ring all through the evening and if I’m struggling with anything will come straight back home, help me, then go back. (luckily, both jobs are 5 minutes away.)

Anyway, I shall shut up now! I will let you know what the midwife says later.

TFM your dd sounds adorable
I wondered how ds was too. I know you’ve always been so proud of him. And what a strong and determined young man he’s growing into. It’s a real shame that he’s had so much bad luck. And the injuries too – ouch!
I think he sounds as though he has the strength to take it all on the chin and realise that these things are sent to try us and will only make him stronger.
I wonder if they could mark him on his work so far and use that as a guide for the end mark? There’s usually something they can do to work around injuries or ill health. Fingers crossed.

I’m glad things are good with DP too. What a massive turnaround. 98% of the time is very good! I think most of us would definitely settle for that!

Lilyloo I can’t believe dd is 17 months! How time flies! I’m with you on enjoying every moment while they’re small, they really do grow up fast.

LL – OPEN IT!!! Pretty please!

Oh Well at least she is on your side.

I think she meant money to leave

Dior - good old mums eh

Lilyloo - well done on passing exam!

I do feel a bit brighter now thanks. I have my beading course tomorrow.

Well done Lilyloo I only got a D. Fortuitously (especially for my patients!) my numeracy is fine so I don't have a problem with drug calculations.

ooh exams all done , got a c in my maths! Was really pleased.
Haven't started my tt yet! Am going to wait until dd2 starts school i think. Not sure where i will find the time until then!

Yep definately growing up too quickly. I still try and hold onto those moments when ds asks me to carry him up to bed He almost as big as me , or when he sits and plays with my hair whilst watching tv!
dd2 is still the baby to us LL but i know whta you mean. I go to toddler group and look at the real small lo's and cannot believe she is 17mth already!!!
I loved not knowing about any of mine and i would have to get rid of the envelope i think. But don't post it to any of this lot
LOL TFM that's what made the teabags wasn't it ?, we didn't always agree but we always talked sense (tongue in cheek )

I bet he adores you TFM

Lol at sending Dior's mum round to nick my envelope

LL, you are soooooo mean!

Lilyloo!! You traitor!! You are supposed to be on our side! Call yourself a Teabag!! Glad all is going well for you. Have you completed all your exams? Have you started teacher training?

Talk about kids growing up, wait until you have a 24yr old!! I still don't feel old enough to be the mum of a 24yr old!!

Dior you sound much brighter. I'm glad your mum is on hand for you. You must do as she says though and ring her if you need anything. Can you ring her and ask her to pop round to see our LadyLush and pick up The Envelope?

Thank you for your lovely words re DS. He is being a real trooper, going out daily and getting all the girls to sign his pot. It contains more telephone numbers than the phone book!! I really feel sorry for him though, he works so hard and really does deserve a break. Excuse the pun!

Ooh they're growing up Lilyloo It's lovely but sad at the same time iykwim. I keep looking at my baby (ds - nearly 5) wondering when he suddenly grew up.

Something spooky happened to my last post <confused>

LL 'don't open it'!!! it's a lovely surprise (sits on the opposite side of the fence)

TFM all good here. Very busy tbh! dd2 is now at that (not so cute) age where she is into everything and dd1 just about to start her settling in sessions at school and ds is a love and football mad so we usually taking him , or watching him at a game! Glad to hear alls good with you and dp. Things good here too!! But your poor ds !!

TFM - your poor ds - there are some mean buggers out there in the world .

Ginnny - glad the funeral went well. Hope dp manages to pull himself back from the abyss of alcohol fairly soon. A blip can be understood but it needs to be a short one!

LL - OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!

My mum has just been round to see me because I phoned her earlier feeling sorry for myself. H is out bowling with work tonight and won't be in until late. )Pmsl, I originally typed 'boweling' )

We talked for a couple of hours and she has just left. She told me to ring her if I need anything.

TFM I bet your dd looks adorable without her front teeth Your poor ds - so unfair Hope he makes a speedy recovery and has a good run of luck to make up for the rubbish luck he's had.

And no................not relenting

Huh! If you were a proper virtual friend LL you would post the envelope to one of us so we could find out what our new baby is going to be! So there!! <<sticks tongue out>>
Look, you can trust us, we won't tell your DH if you have a peep.

Ginny, glad today went as well as today could and am extra glad to hear that you are leaving DP to it. You will be feeling exhausted and emotionally drained enough without having all of his baggage to cope with. You enjoy your bath

Baffy, I posted a really long post to you earlier and then MN went down!! I sympathised with you for the pain you are in and did my mother hen bit by asking if you had any holidays you could take, just to get a couple of weeks rest. It's an awful position for you to be in, stuck between a rock and a hard place. When do you go on maternity leave and how long are you able to take off afterwards? I hope H is being helpful and supportive.

DD is wonderful thank you she is really growing up. She has lost both of her front teeth now but she looks ever so cute.

DS has had a run of bad luck, poor lad. He had his scooter, his pride and joy, stolen from outside his dads so he has being going to his job on the farm on his pushbike. He gets up at 3am goes to work then comes home at 7.30am showers and goes to college where he is studying plumbing. He is working everso hard. But,, he came off his bike on Saturday, has broken his nose, his thumb and his arm in three places. Then, while h as at the hospital someone stole his bike! The ambulance man had put it over a wall so that we could go collect it. It was only there just over an hour but it was gone when we went back for it. So, I'm worried now that he won't pass his course, he is in the middle of assessments and unable to continue with his practical. It would be terrible if he couldn't complete it after all his hard work.

Other than that everything else is going great. DP is DP again and we live together in harmony 98% of the time. The other 2% is due to either PMT or me feeling bored and in need of a bit of drama! He still gets on my nerves occasionally but he is a man so that's to be expected

Right, enough about me. Now LL get that envelope opened!!!

Oh and you can stop as well Ginnny Honestly, call yourself virtual friends

Ginnny - glad the funeral went as well as could be expected. I can understand why today of all days dp wants to drink. It must be very hard for him

Baffy - it sounds as though you have a very bad case of SPD. Mine disappeared after the birth. It did re-emerge a bit but wasn't as bad as before and it seemed to be only when I had lochia so went completely 4 weeks after the birth. I was told that you are supposed to be measured to see how far you can spread your legs before experiencing pain but tbh all that went out of the window. I had my legs in stirrups because I had an assisted delivery. Thankfully there was no damage. As I said, the physio was crap. However, Osteopathy is supposed to be helpful. As for work, you should be signed off sick surely? Are you entitled to sick pay? I'd have thought you would be. How's it going with h?

Dior, TFM and Tanee - STOP IT . You're not helping The envelope remains unopened. Though I do confess that I held it up to the light on Monday and could only see the word "I". Hmmm.

HW - it was her suggestion to put it in an envelope. Maybe so that she could get rid of us and get the next one in

I still think it's a boy. Baffy, Ginnny and I can go on about "our boys"

Baffy. That sounds awful you poor thing.
LL OPEN IT OPEN IT OPEN IT. I never found out with either of mine (although sonographer let it slip with ds2 and referred to him as 'he') but I couldn't have an envelope and not open it. It would drive me insane.
Dior - hope you enjoyed your Create & Craft. My Mum loves it and spends a fortune gets lots of good ideas on it.
Well the funeral went very well yesterday considering what a sad day it was and the worst weather possible, I think we gave her a good send off and she would have been very proud. I drunk quite a lot of g&t's and feel horribly hungover this morning. DP has gone to the pub today