Sexless marriage heading for catastrophe?

[aegeansky]

We're in couple therapy as our 10+ year marriage is in deep trouble. It started gradually enough - just fewer and fewer things to talk about outside the daily grind, until childcare and our routine was pretty much the only thing left to talk/ argue about. We used to go out about once a year but that has grown longer after a disastrous experience that nearly ended our relationship on the spot. We haven't been physically intimate for at least 5 years, and that was only a brief interlude following an earlier period of about 3 years where practically nothing happened. When I look ahead I see some kind of unstated agreement that we'll weather this out forever. There's not enough time in couple therapy to get to the heart of the matter, and I'm now, for the first time, confused about what I want. I've never been unfaithful, but a few times just recently I've felt a strong attraction to someone and have had to deliberately keep myself away from trouble by talking about my wife, children, cats and dogs, as if we were still the model of a happy family. It makes me very sad inside as it's so far from the truth. I've seen what happens when a deceipt and betrayal happens and it's heartbreaking. I don't want to ever do that but for the first time, I feel myself susceptible to temptation and it's a horrific dilemma for me. I don't have anything tangible to fess up, so that's not really a good option. Anybody familiar with such a situation and how to make it end well?

[SolidGoldVampireBat]

PLease bear in mind that you don't have to stay in this relationship till you die or the other person does. You will not be sent to prison or banished from polite society if you decide that you have had enough and want to leave. Only you and your spouse can decide whether the good aspects outweigh the bad, or not. And if one of you decides that you have had enough, there are worse things to do than put an end to a marriage that is making you miserable on a daily basis.
What counselling can do is help you make the ending of the marriage a more civilised affair, as long as both of you are reasonable, decent people.

[Petesmum]

The rest of your life is a long time, especially of you spend it unhappy. It sounds as though you are putting the effort in to save your marriage but at no point have you said you love your wife.
It sounds as though you've reached a major decision point; agree to end your marriage or accept that you're going to spend the rest of your life living in the same house with a friend. Christmas will only highlight this to you.
Good luck.

[Malificence]

Search for the posts by Ineedabodytransplant, he was in a sexless marriage for a similar length of time and he finally found the courage to end his marriage. A sexless marriage can only work if both people within it are happy about it.

[aegeansky]

Sorry have asked for this to be deleted.

[SirCliffRichardSucksEggsInHell]

What you have put into words here, with us, is very moving. Would it be an idea to let your wife see that?

There are many reasons for a relationship to hit a stalemate and I do think that both of you need to put effort in. We can all identify with the bores of a routine. For me personally, if I feel underappreciated or un-noticed then my sex drive takes a dive. Do you kiss her at all? Even a peck on the cheek? A spontaneous hug? Do you notice if she does something different with her hair? Or buys a new top?

Being a mother is exhausting and it's easy to let your entire attention be devoted to them. You are in demand and on call 24/7 and it can be so much easier to just lounge around in jeans and a t-shirt not making any effort whatsoever and being pretty much unresponsive. When I'm down my dh will leave me to it which is the worst thing he could do. I am aware that I push him away but more than ever I just want him to hold me. Which he obviously doesn't want to do for fear of my reaction. So it's a vicious circle.

Your wife has obviously agreed to therapy, so she knows that the marriage is in trouble and presumably wants it to work otherwise, why bother going? It can't be easy going to therapy?

I suggest you write down how you feel and give it to her followed by a hug. Then start from there. She might have a long list of grievances or she just might not seem bothered, but when confronted with love and kindness even the toughest of people eventually crack and that's when all the emotions come running out.

[SirCliffRichardSucksEggsInHell]

Why do you want this deleted? You need to talk about this.

[aegeansky]

SirCliffRichardSucksEggsInHell. Because it is making me very sad to read it stated like that. And because I'm paranoid about being found out, even for saying this.

[SirCliffRichardSucksEggsInHell]

Look, don't be paranoid. You can ask for the thread to be moved to another section that cannot be searched, I forget what it's called. MNHQ will know what you mean though.

I'm so very sorry that you feel this way and find yourself trapped like this. Please please do print this out and talk to her. Chances are that she is just as miserable and you are both ekeing out this miserable existence unaware that the other is suffering just as much.

One of you has to break the mould before either you or she does something you regret. You both deserve a lot more happiness. Your children too, what idea of relationships will they get from this? Are you affectionate towards each other in front of them? Are you best friends? Are you able to talk?

Please don't brush this under the carpet, it's much too important for that.

[aegeansky]

She won't take a kiss, not a proper one. We don't touch or kiss like lovers at all. I can give her a hug but what I get back has no meaning. I gave up trying to initiate any intimacy the last time we tried it (now all those years ago) as I could tell she wasn't into it and just wanted me to hurry up. I can't do that - I know men are supposed to not really care so much, but it doesn't work for me - I find it a turn off unless I can feel that I'm wanted emotionally. It was horrible then as she was a fantastically responsive lover when I met her and for years. If I try and kiss her, She does this sexless thing, like a friend kiss on the cheek.

[SirCliffRichardSucksEggsInHell]

Keep doing it, keep hugging her, keep kissing her.

I went through a patch where I didn't want sex either. I rejected my dh on so many levels because I was afraid to lead him on. I didn't want him getting the wrong idea so I didn't return his kisses or hugs.

Let her know how much she means to you. Don't try anything else, just a brief touch, a compliment, a smile.

You do need to sit her down though and tell her what you have told us. That you feel unloved. You won't be telling her anything she doesn't already know but right now neither of you want to be the first to broach the huge elephant in the room.

You obviously do love her. So be the first to try and fix it. Either way you need something to change as you cannot go on like this.

[MerryMarigold]

That is sad, aegeansky. You have a lovely name, by the way and you sound like a nice man (are you my dh?!). I can empathise as we are a bit further down the line (your marriage 5 years ago). We've had sex once in 4 years. The only thing I find is helping is that a) the kids are getting older so I am feeling a bit better/ less depressed/ more confident, though I have WAY TO go on that. Could your wife be a bit depressed? b) We are trying to just spend a bit more time together to feel closer, to talk intimately about ourselves, what we are feeling etc. as it's hard to just jump into bed after all this time c) always talking about it, staying open and honest. How would your wife take it if you were totally vulnerable and basically told us what you have told us in the first post? I think she needs to hear it. I would need to hear it if it were my dh. There is nothing wrong with being tempted. It is also lovely that you care whether your wife is being responsive and having a nice time. I think you do need to deal with this now in the couple's therapy rather than lots of other stuff. Perhaps you could basically tell her this post in the couple's therapy - or just before - so there is some help with dealing with it immediately.

[aegeansky]

SirCliff - yes, the children will be confused. I know it and it hurts me. We argue in front of them even when we're discussing how to deal with their lives - not often, but enough.

I'm worried that it's too late. I can't even say if I love her romantically any more - there's deep familiarity, respect and care, but love? - how could I say that when the physical side has collapsed for so long? I thought I did love her and then suddenly, bang, I felt/ feel such a deep yearning to get to know this funny, clever, sensitive girl who seems to want to know me as much as I do her, and now I doubt everything.

[MarinaAzul]

OK, is this a marriage or a brothe/sister thing ?

The MM I had an affair with (completly over for 18 months now) had a similiar problem and was tempted into an affair (with me) However, when his W found out about us, instead of dumping him (like I had hoped she would do) she asked him to dump me and concentrate on their marriage. He did and they are still together !
Don't let it get so bad as to have an affair (as I was the one left devastated).

[MerryMarigold]

The funny, sensitive, clever girl could turn out worse than your dw! It's always lovely at first, and particularly when it's not allowed and when you have felt unloved for a long time. I had an affair (before dh), so I know. It went sour very quickly when it all became 'legitimate' after he left his wife.

[aegeansky]

MarinaAzul, sorry to hear about your experience, it sounds very painful.

I couldn't have an affair with this other girl as I like her too much. That's why I'm staying right away, physically, by no longer going to a club I joined for other reasons.

[aegeansky]

MerryMarigold, thank you for your lovely supportive comments and your incisive analysis. That's really really helpful. I think I do need to say this in couple therapy, BUT I'm worried she will only hear that I'm on the brink of an affair and react with the same anger, confusion and pain as if I really were having an affair, and then I'll have a hard time explaining what I think. I'm also worried that if she asks me, I will no longer convincingly be able to tell her I love her. I recall that a female friend very intuitively (and correctly) discovered her husband's affair by doing just this and getting no answer. As I am not having an affair and am minimising any risk of futher temptation, this would be a disastrous outcome.

[MarinaAzul]

Sometime it's the fact tht someone else finds your partner attractive can shock you into taking notice of them.
Yes, I got hurt but I knew he was married and was foolish. I've learned a lot and the most important lesson is that we never really know what is going on in a relationship, mainly because we only hear one side.

[MarinaAzul]

And remember if that girl is 'funny, clever and sensitive', then she wouldn't touch a marrried man with a barge pole. It's usually people with low self esteem that let themselves be drawn in. It was in my case anyway.

[aegeansky]

MarinaAzul, well spoken. But aren't people in my position often very skilled at telling the story just so it looks as if the whole thing is already a car-crash and in the process of being finished completely? I've seen that happen several times.

[ledkr]

Poor you. I was the woman in a similar marriage 8 yrs ago.I kidded myself i was staying for the lifestyle/children/career/house etc etc and that id stick it out so as to not upset the children. I convinced myself i was gettying my emotional needs met from my friends and had a good social life and loved being a mum too.
I was repaid by him cheating on me causing me and the children lots of pain and embarassment. The relationship between him and our sons has been ireversably damaged and my dd has no real relationship with him as he quickly had children with his new partner and makes little time for her.
How i wish we had had the guts to end it before an infidelity occured.
I dont blame my ex for what he did,but what a pity it had to happen at all.

[aegeansky]

Ledkr, ouch, this is a terrible experience you've been through. I really feel for you. I don't want to be the one to do what you describe. Very, very sad to hear what happened with your ex and the children. They do often seem to be overlooked , typically by men doing what you describe.

I hope you have been able to heal the pain a bit now although I bet it is very difficult.

[ledkr]

Thanks aegean Its been years now,i am re married to the most fabulous man in the whole world now the children are my concern,i have 3 grown men who are still angry with their Dad depsite my explaining to them it wasnt all down to him.
I just wanted you to see the other side to affairs although you do sound lovely and are trying hard to stay married and faithfull.
Could it be depression?
I agree that a sexless marriage isnt great unless you are both happy with it so dont feel bad.
I wish i could help more. It is possible to have an amicable break up though especially if its done before any infideltiy occurs on either side.

[anonamater]

(have name changed for this)

I am the woman in an equivalent marriage. We have had no true intimacy for many years; children, money, time...several other reasons too which I wont go into here.

As with yourself, on occasions the grass has been greener, and there's been a lovely man holding the gate open for me, but I haven't (as yet) explored further. You have to look past the thrill of the new, the romance and the sense of being desired - and being seen as desirable - and consider long-term where such a choice might take you. Do you still love her enough to truly address what's happened between the two of you, do you believe it can be resolved? Are you prepared to accept the impact a split would mean to yourself, your DC's , your income, and of course, your DW. Or has the dissent gone too deep and too far?

For us, we've spent hours and hours and time away from the children to address this. He is only learning to understand that, for me at least, sex isn't a perfunctory kiss and get on with it. Intimacy starts at the beginning of the day, through noticing and commenting on how you feel about that other person (how they look, what they did), finding some way to demonstrate that he finds me attractive and desirable at any point in the day. A touch, a caress, a compliment - these may seem small but (imo) for a woman sex starts in her head way before she even considers the physical aspects.

And finding time is so very hard with children about. The demand on many womans' emotional time is huge, so much so that there sometimes seems litttle space for anyone or anything else. The exhaustion, both both of you, can seem overwhelming. Perhaps consider reinstating a weekend away without the DC's every few months, and if that isnt possible just an evening away from the house for the two of you.

Talk with her. Alone, no counsellor. We all deserve happiness and fulfillment in life, people - and their relationships - do change. Only you can decide if yours is salvagable.

[veryconfusedatthemoment]

sorry no time to read all the (great) posts above but please dont do what my ex has just done to me. We had this situation - he wouldn't deal with it at all. The lack of sex was my "fault" - knackered 1st baby at 40, little help, no emotional intimacy with ex DH, stressful job, PND, early menopause etc. He started an EA, followed quickly by a full affair. The lies have been horrific and the damage that alone has done will destroy our future relationship for a very long time with DS age 6 in the middle. Our marriage was over but the ending of it didn't have to be this way.

[aegeansky]

veryconfusedatthemoment - poor, poor you. This is exactly the carnage that I want to avoid wreaking. It does seem to be the way many men deal with it in the end, and I'm not going to follow suit, whatever it takes. I've made a promise to myself. I am so sorry for DS 6 in the middle, poor mite. I hope that in time he will be able to make sense of it all and come to terms with it, although this is a very big ask.