Mumsnet Discussions - how do you know when you are drinking too much?

The saturday spirit made me change my views blush

...the good thing is that between sat and sunday, I only had one bottle which is better than 4 (still not ideal I know)..I think I'm better in a way that I dont worry if I dont have wine in the fridge..I know its just small steps..and I know that I wanted to go Cold turquey for a while and I have failed but I'm trying to remain positive and think that actually I have made some progress..I do not drink anymore 2 bottle of wine a day !

Sleep-Dh does drink but it's not a regular thing, he keeps it at week end. He completely disaprove what I have done but now I'm able to talk about it with him and admit that I was wrong becoming addicted and I also apologize.

IUTDTM - what's happened to make you change your view of things since Friday?

can i ask what your partner thinks and how he drinks?
you see i would say i am very much a social drinker-i don't and wouldn't open a bottle of wine on my own,but if there's one on the go then i am first in line for a refill!
i don't want to live without alcohol although i would do if dp struggles to manage the way he drinks-one of the the things that 'got' him at weekend was when i said 'it's one thing going to work smelling of a drip tray once in a while,people notice if it's 3 times a week-people will be talking about it whether they like you or not-and do you want to be the dad at school drop off who fucking STINKS of last nights ale?because i don't want to be married to him and i don't want my kids to be labelled'
you are doing really well, i've joined weighwatchers so there's definitely no chance of me boozing-for one glass of wine i can have a kitkat! although vodka is only a point...
seriously,well done,i'll keep checking back to see how we are all getting on.

Sleepless - I'm in exactly same situation as your DH I think, my main reason for drinking is the boredom, the routine so I'm trying to turn things around by having a hobby, keeping myself busy etc...

I think I have been better lately,I had about 5 dried night and when I drank, it was only a couple of spritzers. I'm kind of happy with it. My aim is not too drink during the week (unless I go out and in moderation) and very little at week end.

if he is an alcoholic then i don't have an issue with it as long as he attempts to deal with it.One of my best friends just celebrated ten years sobriety (he's the same age as me and was an alcoholic teenager)
I think my dp is bored and we are looking at ways to expand his life (long story short was music journo living very much the high life in london at gigs every night with hospitality etc etc gets me pregnant,has to jack dream job in,move 200miles away from friends/life to move in with me/my daughter we have baby,baby is challenging little so and so.Only job he can find is on less than half he was on before doing really really dull research with a bunch of new graduates.So we've talked about him doing a course to refresh his skill set,getting his snowboard out and doing that (he's been skint as been paying for driving lessons and now has passed his test)
basically with him it wasn't the amount he drank but the way he drank which raised alarms.We're fine now,he is going to see what he can do to enjoy drinking sociably,maybe he wont manage it but at least he is in agreement that whilst he may not be george best just yet-his drinking is raising enough alarms for me to find it a problem.
thanks,sorry for the life story.I like you,you are good.

Sleepless

Who has a sure way of defining alcoholism? I don't, and I suffer from it!

All you can say is that problem drinking is drinking that causes problems - the drinker him (or her) self doesn't have to feel it's a problem for him or her.

You need to put number 1 first. If his drinking is causing you problems, don't wait for him to fix them - do what you can to stop them complicating your life. That could mean attending AlAnon or it could mean leaving him or both or something in between - ultimately, only you can decide.

well we had murders here last night when i decided to talk to dp after getting in from a night out.
I have told him his drinking is a problem to me and therefore has a drink problem.
We had armageddon and are still not really speaking but he has accepted that it's not the amount he drinks that is the problem (as we probably drink the same amount) it's just that he'll drink alone,he'll get in from a nice meal/night out and at 1am suggest opening a bottle of wine,he'll go to cook sunday dinner and stick a glass of red in with the meat (and then it's rude not to finish the bottle and if i also have a glass then he'll open the 2nd and drink most of that too)he'll go to the pub and watch a match on his own and drink beer...this to me is alcoholism isn't it?
today is a very strange day.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

I'm finding it far easier not to smoke if I'm not drinking. I am finding more and more that I can take or leave alcohol, and I agree that although it can cause immense problems, it doesn't need to be demonised. It's such a relief not to smoke!

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Good to hear. You can do this, you know.

It's to guard against that sort of thing happening that I go to AA.

Cristal palace is a too far for me but thank you miflaw!

Well I had a couple of spritzer last night when I was out. I knew that I shouldn't have been out, it was to early. I feel really angry against me and sad, guilty..but I'm going to go back on track.

If by any chance you're in London, come to the meeting in Crystal Palace on Monday night.

I'm the suit near the front.

I guess I could the help in order to get some guidance..Thanks Miflaw !

Good idea.

Be aware, though, that a lot of people attend - and continue to attend - not so much for help stopping drinking as for support and encouragement in managing their life once they've done so.

I'll give it a go if I fail stopping drinking, I'm going well at the moment and didnt suffer too much of withdrawal symptoms.
I want to stop drinking because I endangered my health, because while I'm drinking heavily, it's noway I can be a good mother or a good wife while feeling groggy because of heavy night..I have admitted to myself that I have a problem and I need to sort this problem. I was in denial for a while, not anymore.

Not religious at all. I am an agnostic and have no problems.

It does involve acknowledging a "power greater than yourself" which, for many people, is a god.

However, for me, it means that I acknowledge God is not me and that there are certain things in my life that are not in my immediate control and that I cannot "beat" so I will just have to work round them instead. My alcoholism is obviously one of those things ...

A lot of people also use AA itself as a higher power - after all, before they came, they couldn't beat their drinking; then they came to AA and, hey presto, they could; conclusion = AA is stronger than just me so I can have faith in AA.

The word God is used a lot, because AA was initially set up by two Americans at a time (1935) when it was extremely unusual not to go to church over there, but it is now widely accepted that the word "God" is just a shorthand for an admission that you can't do this alone and need help.

Note also that AA is now international and huge numbers of Hindus, Muslims, Jews, pagans and plain old atheists and agnostics (like me) have made it work for them.

Why not give it a go until you have a better idea?

Well I have to lay off the roast potatoes, cheese and mayonnaise my main weaknesses, atm, my apetite is not too big but I bet it's going to come back with a vengeance smile

I didn't! I've only put on about 2.5 stone in the past 9 months since having my third, and that's all down to eating too much and not moving much. Need to break out the stepper again and stop eating the kids' leftovers, noshing on junk in the evenings, full fat milk in coffee, etc.

Well, that's another thread! wink

That is a good idea expat, Bet you didnt put on weight with this regime !!! I know 360 pounds is a lot, I have almost collapsed when I saw this figure for the first time, and I spend 180 pounds in fags, 540 pounds to indulge myself and just myself, dh doesnt drink or smoke..It has got to stop.

A trick I used when I was quitting smoking and a craving would strike in the evening.

I bought one of those steppers you put risers under like you see in aerobics classes.

When the craving would strike, I'd get up, put the headphones on, and step up and down on that sucker for an entire song.

£360/month! Wow! You know, IUTDTM, put it in a fund, save it up, and then take your family on a wonderful holiday!

Yes I have look at aa meeting and located the nearest by me ! I have also looked at the 12 weeks programm (it's quite religious no ?), tonight I'm going to say that I'm taking some antibiotics (which is almost true)....

I think I'm really determined this time, when the guilt was unbearable, I used to think, I'm going to die and the dcs are going to be without mother, I'm stupid drunk, my life is a mess, no control over my life etc...

I want to be my own boss again, and as I say once the drinking is definitely under control, I'm going to stop smoking.

IUTDTM

Well done! Insomnia is normal, won't kill you and will soon pass.

Are you in AA? If so, locate a meeting near where you are going. You probably won't go to it but it's nice to know that, if things get hectic, there is a safe place nearby.

Re what to drink, some people find it helpful to choose something that looks like it may contain alcohol, to stop nosey buggers questioning/pressuring them about why they're not drinking. For example, ginger ale looks like it might have scotch in it; a tonic with the ice and slice looks loaded with gin; and so on. Works for some people ...

And if anyone asks why you're not drinking, keep it fairly simple and honest, but vague. "Doctor's orders" is always a goody - bet at least once in your life the doctor's told you to knock it off. You've just waited a while before following the advice ...

Thank you for the tip, I was looking for something to bring so I'll buy it !!

Well done - and great name change!

I would say that for tonight, decide what you're going to drink in advance. For me, I would drink slimline tonic. Grapefruit juice and tonic is also nice - sharp and refreshing, with a bite to it, not too sweet/cloying.

I find that the problem with not drinking when you're out is what you substitute it with, as most soft drinks are just too sweet.

Good luck!

You are right, I have changed my name (hopefully it will stay)...Today I feel really tired, couldnt sleep before 1o'clock and did some bad dreams !! I have a mild headache, I took some berroca so it did help a lot ! The spirits are still high ! I'm a little bit nervous because I'm going out tonight so I guess it's going to be the real test !

Go IDTMACS! Looks like, just for today, you could consider changing your name ...

good for you! Hope tomorrow arrives with no headache!!

Another day without the evil drink !!!xx

i was at the drs last week about my bloody god damned teeth and when she asked me how much i drank i said to her 'this is the actual amount,so don't double it or think i am erring on the side of abstinence' and she was still 'don't you think that's too much' so that was also one of the pointers i was referring to.
I think after i get back from ikea i will discuss this rationally with dp,over a nice glass of erm sparkling water...

I worry about my drinking too. Something I try to do at least 3 nights a week is, when the kids are in bed instead a having wine, sit down with a nice non alcoholic beverage and relax. This usually knocks the craving on the head.

Sorry - not suggesting you're not being honest - saying that, if you are, then congrats, because it's easy to lie to oneself about this.

Apparently doctors routinely double whatever you tell them to be on the safe side - they don't expect honesty either ...

Only you can do the count - and, in a sense, it's only you that it affects.

Very hard to be honest with yourself on this one, though - well done if you can!

half a bottle of wine 3 times a week is 15 units,sometimes the half will be a full so that takes me to erm,20.
I have a couple of bottles of beer (don't know how many units and that might be erm a few more)
if i drink pints i can only drink a few and it's bitter and not the 'strong' lager-i certainly drink no more than 4pints(and that would be instead of wine) and would replace the bottle of wine (is this making sense) i don't drink spirits at home at all(and if i do i drink them when i am out it's only ever after i am drunk-i seldom drink spirits actually thinking about it)

I know we drink too much but i reckon i do around or about the top limit of drinking.I know i would drink less if i didn't live with dp.I think it might be him that's the problem (and now in this post we have both 'denial' and 'projection'

Sleepless - I may have missed something but, based on your own description of your drinking, I'd say you must be drinking at least double the 21 units (which itself is the govt definition of heavy drinking.) How you are drinking less is beyond me.

Rule of thumb - 1 bottle of wine - 10 units (unless 10% ABV or less, in which case, 7 units.)

1 440ml can of beer - 2-3units, depending on strength (slightly under if less than 4%).

1 pint - 2 units if it's Carling or 4% bitter, more like 3 if it's Stella, Kro, San mig, Guinness ...

Pub measure of spirits or liqueur - 1 unit (home measure, probably 2 or even 3 units.)

thanks for your honesty miflaw- what i do think,and i said this to the gp on friday-is that i drink probably less than the units over a week,i have days where we don't drink and i don't want to.
I don't get drunk (well maybe once a month if i go out and we have a boozy meal,drinks or whatever) and now i am starting to read this post and feel like i am in denial,and i don't think i am-i think tonight i need to discuss my fears about 'our' drinking (me and dp) and see what we can do together to cut down.
no doubt i'll be back on this thread at some point, thanks for not making me feel like a loop de loop.
I do wonder though if the campaigns (and the amount of time i've spent in drs surgeries lately) is what's put this to the fore though?

Plonk

"I think that there is a lot of government pressure to drink less, and there have been huge advertising campaigns. It could be partly why you are wondering, why now?" Fair point, but I think most people who end up on threads like this are quite literally off the scale with regards to Government guidelines. It is very clear that either the government does not understand or does not want to tackle problem drinking and alcoholism and prefers instead to preach to the converted and keep normal drinkers in line. If, as a woman, you (or any other woman) is drinking less than 21 units a week (units as defined by govt) then those guidelines are for you. If you are drinking more, then you are in the right place, but probably haven't taken much notice of govt guidelines for some time ...

"For what it's worth, my life was bloody awful when I was 11, and long before that." I can, I am sorry to say, well believe it. A lot of people have shockingly bad childhoods. But we both know that wasn't my point. My point was that you probably didn't address that awfulness with alcohol at that age, so you don't need to now - and, what's more, you now have access to other strategies that probably weren't open to you then.

I think that there is a lot of government pressure to drink less, and there have been huge advertising campaigns. It could be partly why you are wondering, why now?

it is very difficult when on the one hand the government says that anything over 2 glasses of wine is a binge, then complaining about people falling around in the street.

As for me, I haven't smoked for about a week, and nor have I been stuffing myself full of nicotine pills (1st time in about 2 years for having no nicotine in my mouth!). I have failed so far to have an alcoholic bender, which I am very pleased about, and really haven't been drinking all that much.

Dh doesn't drink much any more which is a great help, and heaven forbid, I have started listening to him, whether or not to open another botttle of wine.

For what it's worth, my life was bloody awful when I was 11, and long before that. I really have no safe place to go back to. It's hard trying to find a way to live instead of a way to die.

sleepless

No, it's not normal. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but most people really don't think like that.

As for what one does when one doesn't drink - one does exactly the same things, but without drinking.

Presumably you managed to dance, talk, laugh, play and generally socially interact without a drink when you were a child - why should it be any different now? Most things in life get easier as you get older, not harder - why would you assume that this would be any different? If you could do it aged 11, you can do it now!

I hope I'm over the worst now, I have printed out a list of benefits in stopping drinking alcohol to keep me motivated ! Also, I have calculated how much I'll save if I stay tee-total for 1 month, 360 pounds. All the things I could do with 360 pounds...

Although my children are older, DH and I have got out of the habit of going out! (I never thought it would be like this!)

I've reached a stage where I'm teetotal for half of the week, usually Mon-Weds, sometimes Thursday as well - unless I go out, like last night. But I'm trying to moderate what I drink when I'm out as well, which is sometimes easier sometimes harder - depends who I'm out with and how much of a drinker they are.

I think if you're thinking about the booze as much as you are, SIS, it's a reflection of how much a part of your life it had become/was becoming - and I know exactly where you're at because I went/am going through exactly the same thing. However, you're also older now, with more responsibilities - not surprising you're considering your lifestyle a bit more than when you were 'footloose and fancy free'.

But it's also important not to demonise alcohol - it is enjoyable and socially acceptable, as long as it's consumed in a balanced way.

On this thread it seems to me that it's about determining if you have an alcohol problem, or if it's something that you can moderate. (I'm sure there's probably a grey area between the two!)

IDRINK - sounds like you're doing very well and surely must be over the worst now? Good luck!

i had no problems not drinking when pregnant/feeding-i think i probably drink less than i did before dd2 (had very 'boozy' job with loads of corporate hospitality/16 hour lunches) but it never made me think before.i wonder why now?

IDrink - that was kind of my trigger, people basically saying/implying blackduck=wine...
sleepless - sounds like me! I think about it, and think that thinking about it too much is probably a BAD sign! You don't struggle for a social life, mine hasn't changed overly, (I am not tee-total, but will go without) but you do get a bit bored of the same drunken conversations grin

ernest-this is going to sound insane but erm what do you do now? I think i'd struggle to have any kind of decent social life without drinks-two of my group of close friends are pregnant now and i am going to ttc after Xmas but i am sort of looking at it now as i told the gp on friday- a year pregnant/ttc and a year breastfeeding so two years off the booze and then i am going to drink again.
We don't go into debt to drink,i am not affected the next day by it, i can go days without a drink but am finding my days sort of in the back of mind feeling slightly pre-occupied about alcohol-not as in 'i want a drink' but thinking about how much we drink/why we drink/what my life would be like without drink...
I wonder if this is normal?

Hi Everyone !I do feel a bit crap but at least I dont feel guilty and it worth everything I think ! I dont sleep very well but at least its not the guilt keeping me awake (sorry for repeating myself)..Do you know what was the trigger for me to stop ? I want to off license and the shop keeper told me straight away, sorry we do not have jacob creeks anymore, blush

and then in the same evening I went to another shop, and the shopkeeper asked me, no drinks tonight ???? I mean come on...that was really bad, I have cried of shame !!

Hi IDrink.... How are you feeling? Good luck. I stopped drinking ages ago. I seem to remember feeling seriously crappy for about 3 or 4 days, then low level crapy for quite a while really, low level, in that I didn't really realise until I suddenly didn't anymore. I used to share a bottle or wine with dh and have 1 or 2 beers aas well, most nights. I'm so glad I stopped.

Have you tried the book "How to cut down on your alcohol" or something like that by Allen Carr - I found it long winmded but fab. It's thanks to that book I was able to easily give up.

Hi, IDrink - I suffered from the headache (and was a miserable cow!) for a couple of days when I stopped..pita, but its just part of the detox, get some fresh air (and rain grin

) and be nice to yourself......The day you wake up with no headace and with clarity is worth it...

god it seems like it's not just me!
I have been contemplating our alcohol intake and know it's too much.
Lately there have been 'signs' (i am taking the discovery of this thread as another)
I would say that me and dp share a bottle of wine at least 3 nights a week,maybe that bottle turns into 2 twice a week,add beers onto that (we probably do a box of 24 beers in a fortnight) and then what we drink if/when we go out...
I actually can take it or leave it more than he can-so i seldom open a bottle of wine whereas he'd have one every night and then some.He'll sit up drinking on his own (not bottles of wine but if we open a bottle i'll have a glass and he'll stay up late on his own to drink it)
he's unwilling to discuss his intake with me as he says i am a hypocrite *because i drink and when i go out with the girls can really put it away)
i don't know what point i am trying to make here but i think i will tell him that he is not to open any more bottles of wine this week and see how that goes...

Thank you Miflaw, I'm really touched byt the fact you took the time to answer me ! Third day and I woke up with a mild headache but I keep reapeating myself, I'm going to make it this time, I'm going to make it this time and next I stop smoking !!! Thank you very much !!

No bother at all.

I would be amazed if you had any problems with cold turkey, especially after 2 days clear, but don't be afraid to consult your doctor if you're worried.

It depends on your body weight and general health but 2 bottles a night, while a massive amount of alcohol, is not off the scale among those of us with what is known as "a problem." I would be surprised if you didn't feel you had turned a corner in a day or two. THIS DOES NOT MEAN GO BACK TO DRINKING - it means you should start feeling well again, but properly well this time. Still, everyone's different, so don't be disheartened if it takes you a little longer.

A lot of people find stopping much easier than cutting down.

bump, need reinsurance, sorry for the bother

I drink 2 bottle of wine mixed with 2 bottles of sparkling water, no spirits, I dont want to cut down I want to stop. I feel like I'm nauseas, the shake, headache, tiredness...) Thanks Miflaw for your kindness

As long as you let them ...

What symptoms have you currently got? In my experience, for a heavy (and i mean heavy) drinker, the physical symptoms should begin to taper off after 3-5 days.

It is important to note that, unless you were on seriously large amounts of drink a day, most people find it safe to go cold turkey. However, if you feel seriously unwell or get any "unexpected" symptoms (fitting, loss of balance, hallucinations, palpitations, anything that's not like a really bad hangover, basically) trust your instincts, DO NOT DRINK and call a doctor/NHS direct/casualty and then do exactly what they tell you.

How long the mental craving lasts is largely up to you and will be considerably less if you take some action to start putting your life back together. Many people find AA helpful, including me.

Hi ladies !
It has been a while I didnt post on here, I have given for 2 days now and I wanted to ask how long the withdrawal symptoms are going to last ??

Been a funny week here - had the odd half glass and usually left a quarter of that! I feel much better and clearer headed. I need to face up to a lot of career related stuff and the booze was getting in the way (deliberately as well of course!). Anyway not holding hard and fast to the never here, just working on moderation now....

Blackduck - having packed them both in I can promise you that the really bad urges, the ones it's nigh on impossible to reason with, leave you alone in a matter of days.

As long as you let them ...

I've had that advice too. I'm on the no-smoking wagon, and hoping that I don't start drinking myself to death instead. For now, I have to make do without fags or alcohol. Bugger

Hi everyone, nothing this weekend and feeling good. Went out sat and was out til gone one an, oh the joy of beening able to get up on Sunday and feel clear headed if just a little bit tired. Yesterday had friends round for lunch, one who is an alcholic, so he and I were trying various soft drinks (Rocks ginger beer anyone?). Again it was really good.
Jazzygirl good luck with it, and whilst I am not a smoker M's advise seems sensible!
Cistus and others hope you had a good weekend.

Hello all.

Cistus, am glad to hear I haven't offended you. Stick at it and life will get better.

Jazzygirl, I don't know if I have an opinion on smoking but I can tell you what happened to me - when I drank, I ended up on 40 Marlboro reds a day (I had only started smoking seven years before; I was not one to pussyfoot around with these things smile

) and I stopped completely about a year after I stopped drinking because, at last, I was able to do so, with a clear(ish) head and what felt like real convictions for the first time in a long while. I used Alan Carr and, because I was not drunk, I didn't go back on my decision the morning after. I have never smoked since.

I can also tell you the advice I was given. When I first came into AA and started taking it seriously, I wanted to solve all my problems at once. I drank too much, obviously - but I also smoked too much, drank too much coffee, and spent a bit more than I could afford on fruit machines. What should I stop first? Or should I stop them all at once? The advice I was given was stark but incredibly helpful. "Stop them in the order they're killing you." I stopped drinking first; then smoking; because I was rarely in a pub and was sober when I was in one, the fruit machines sort of stopped themselves; and I still drink too much coffee, but not quite as much as I did.

Any use?

Hi just wanted to check in and say my bit.
I'm currently in hospital doing an alcohol detox = I've been here for 2 weeks and thus haven't drunk for the longest time in years, yay!

Anyway MIFLAW I wanted to ask your opinion about smoking. Now I'm off the booze my smoking has gone through the roof - from c5 a day to 20-25 a day. Will this calm down? THe doctors here are trying to persuade me to stop, and part of me wants to but I feel it's a lot to take on. But I don't want to just swap one addiction for another. What does everyone think?
Agreed with a comment that someone made earlier - just think about all the BAD things that alcohol has done in your life, write them down and stick them somewhere visible. It's an evil evil thing and I'm not having it ruining my life any more.
Also there is usually a reason that people are drinking - I have been doing a lot of soul searching this past week and have realised that I have a lot of problems and I was just using the booze to block them out. They are all still there but now I've got the strength to get out there and face them.
Good luck everyone whatever path you choose.

MIFLAW you will certainly not get flamed by me! You are correct in that I missed some words out of my last post ; what I meant to say was
"I recognise that cutting down may not be possible for me"

Because of course If I am asking, there is already at least the germ of a problem

we will see.

your advice is always good, and honest, and very much appreciated by me anyway.

Blackduck - well DONE !!! thats really fantastic... you check in every day if it helps, and count each day you have been sober too

Well thats my week concluded! Out last night and no drink, just a gallon of water - felt a bit 'out of it' as everyone got more and more drunk, but think that is partly because I actually don't feel too good this morning (H1N1 or just a summer cold -not sure?!) Also out tonight and have already warned friends I am NOT drinking.....Have decided to try to continue with the completely dry for a while longer (no limit set this time, so I won't be annoying you all by checking in everyday grin

). Has been a funny week, but for me the crux was a couple of things said that basically came down to blackduck=wine and I just didn't want to be defined by the demon booze. So I am selling it to people as a detox at the moment, but who knows where it will go......
Good luck everyone, hope you all have a good week, will catch up next week and thanks for letting me use the thread as a spur/place I could be accountable - it helped me.

Just checking in. Another dry night here and feeling a lot better for it as I need to make some serious decisions and need a clear head.
IDrink - how are you, are you okay?
Cistus - how you doing? Feeling better about things?
Have a good friday.

I agree - if cutting down is what you want to do, and if it works, go for it. From what I can see among the "civilians" I know, some people like drinking and find it fun. To those people, I say, "fill your boots!"

However, alcoholism is the illness that tells you you haven't got it. Lots of people come to threads like this - and similar people come to AA - and say that drink is making their lives a misery and they need to stop. They know, instinctively, that they cannot moderate their drinking. They have tried and failed in every imaginable way.

When the practical implications of stopping drinking sink in - ie you don't drink any more - some of these people (initially, me included) panic. They didn't mean stop. They meant cut down. Or drink on alternate days. Or stick to white wine. Or anything, in fact, that doesn't involve actually stopping. To these people, I would say - again, based on my own experience - remember what brought you here. Remember the desperation you felt. Remember why you said you wanted to stop - not cut down, stop - be brave, and go for it.

The difference between these two groups is as real and unchanging as the difference between women and men in frocks. And the most accurate part of that comparison is that the last people to be fooled are the frock-wearers themselves.

Hope this makes sense to the people who need it. I am aware I might get "flamed" - I did once before for having the temerity to remind a desperate woman of the fact she had been, erm, desperate. So apologies if anyone feels I've been a poor sport.

I think MIFLAW is right - it is horses for courses. I needed to do this dry week (that is the limit I have currently set and I may or may not extend it) to prove to myself that I could. This is for me, and works for me (and I have just had another dry evening - thou ds's meltdown would have driven me to the bottle if dp and friends hadn't finished it all!). I am less good (cr*p frankly) at the cutting down approach - I am more all or nothing, so I have gone this route. If the cutting down works for you go for it!

You are doing very very well, Cistus. If you are drinking sensibly, and you are comfortable about it, you're doing well. Last night I drank nothing because I thought well, I have too much to think about today. You really sound as though you are changing a habit. That's such good news! if drinking is something you enjoy, it's good to try to be sensible about it. Saying that, nobody is sensible all the time about the things they should be sensible about!

I have to stop smoking again, which is a bugger, and I guess I will have to stop drinking too. MIFLAW, you mentioned earlier about when you first stopped that nicotine and caffeine intake went up. It's the same with not smoking. It's not very nice. It's not a good place to be at all. Oh come here, Allen Carr!!

Cistus

How you go about it has to be what's right for you.

I too manage my drinking one day at a time. However, I think I mean something very different to you by that.

I don't drink. At all. Period. Drink ruins my life, destroys my relationships, creates practical and emotional problems for me and puts me in real danger. That's never going to change.

So I have a choice. My choice is, today, do I want madness and misery or a chance of sanity and happiness?

And I revisit that choice each day and I make my choice for that day only knowing that, if ever my life gets too easy, too fun, or just too pleasant, I can always choose the opposite tomorrow.

For quite a while now, I have made what strikes me as the right choice every single day - but I am helped in that by knowing that the alternative is always there if I want it. I haven't signed anything, I haven't taken a pledge, I haven't said, "I'm not drinking for a month or a year or a decade" - I've simply recognised within myself that drinking for me will never do what I want it to and I act on that knowledge, one day at a time.

Incidentally, "I recognise this may not be possible for me" - not sure what this means, I think you've missed a few words, but if you mean stopping drinking may not be possible then what on earth do you mean? It's not food or air! What do you honestly think will happen to you if you stop drinking? How do you think Muslims and Methodists survive and live happy, profitable and contented lives if drink is so essential? Okay, you might not want to live their lives, but you have to admit they are not actually suffering for want of a drink. When you are ready to stop, you can stop - I promise you.

MIFLAW no, am taking it one day at a time. I would prefer to be able But I recignise this may not be possible for me, so one day at a time, and watching my intake.

at the moment if I drink less than 14 U spread over the week, I am happy enough..

I may be in denial. I dont know....

Cistus

Have you changed your mind about stopping then?

I'm ok, much more in control, thanks Blackduck... drank a bit over the weekend, but not excessive. ATM a bottle is lasting me 3 nights (and there are dry nights in between those three) I have found that asking myself a question "Do I REALLY want this' before pouring another glass works quite well. Often I am just as happy with a glass of fizzy water - I think sometimes its just having 'something' to drink..... I'm much happier with my intake....

Not sure how the future looks, just going day to day. I have certainly given myself a scare

IDrink - take MIFLAW's advice. don't feel guilty, take the first step to getting your life back...

Cistus - how are you doing? another dry night here - did pilates and everything creaked and ached!! Came back and ate tea with dp who didn't even offer me a drink (wise man) Feeling much clearer and now focusing on stuff (which isn't easy, but needs doing)
Good luck everyone, hope all is well in your worlds - feel like I have this thread t myself at the moment!

Why are you waiting? Get yourself along now!

If you don't want your family to know, tell them you're going somewhere else - even to the pub!

Hi everyone ! I'm doing really badly at the moment sad

..I'm waiting for my family to go on holidays to go to AA..I didn't sleep last night, the guilt wouldn't let me sad

"he went for a few sessions"

He did work out that AA is no more or less than a group of ex-drunks who help each other, didn't he? "Sessions" sounds a bit like the (common and understandable) misconception that there are professionals or therapists "leading" the meetings, which puts some people off, but it's just not so.

I'm sure you and he did know that, but I thought I'd spell it out just in case.

When i was pregnant with DD1 i never drank a drop. With DD2 i had a strong desire for beer (think i was missing some B vitamins) but at the time did not think of it.
I used to eat loads of Marmite and also got myself some low alcohol beers and would have one at least twice a week.
Even craved those small tins of guiness type beer.
But the main thing is wanted was the taste.
That was my pregnancy craving.

Thanks MIFLAW, I did make him laugh the other day by saying, 'look why don't you take things one day at a time' not realising that's sort of what they say!! Think he went for a few sessions when he gave up before for a year (but was a different age/lifestyle).

Oops, never done a link before...

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/793279-My-friend-drinks-too-much-how-do-i-tell-her

This is it

Umlellala

If he changes his mind, the offer stands.

Glad something is working for him.

Cistus how are you doing? Nothng again last night so three days in a row, which considering that includes a weekend is good.... I will probably damn myself saying this, but I am finding it easy at the moment, that may be because I am in the middle of some major re-assessment and I just don't need my head clouded. I am re-evaluating everything, and perhaps it is time for this thing to go?

Jem

Where is it?

Saw it once and now can't find it ...

Umlellala - I agree, for me it is some much a 'habit' that a night out seems plain wrong without booze. But I had absolutley no problem giving it up when pg and dp and I have given it up for long periods when dp wanted to lose weight and feel better about himself. I know I can have a good time without it, but it has been my emotional crutch for a long time and throwing that away means I have to be 'me' all the time and can't hide (scary stuff...).

(PS We both hope there is a time when giving up alcohol does not feel like a sacrifice but a freedom)

Well done Blackduck - dh has gone mad for ginger beer too grin

Dh has been to a meeting of AA and learnt a few bits but doesn't think it's for him. He has quite impressive willpower - I think once the decision has been made, that's it (has just taken a while to Make The Decision - he has been telling himself he could only drink in the week etc). He is very excited/intrigued about it and talks a lot to me about his new life without alcohol... Think he might have found an internet forum to help.

Jeminthepark, I don't really drink at all. I can take it or leave it and only really do it because of social convention. Hate being drunk and am quite unusual in that I am quite anti-alcohol and usually would rather have a cup of tea. I have said I am happy to stop drinking at all though when around him, as I know he is sacrificing so much (though he wants to of course) for me and the kids. I think it helps he can see me having a great time and (hopefully) people enjoying my company despite being sober. Don't want to sound sanctimonious but to see there is a point to life/you can enjoy yourself without alcohol (this is from early discussions with dh). I can definitely see how it is hard though, alcohol and drinking as an activity is so ingrained in our culture - takes a lot to step outside that I think.

I love dh to bits drunk or sober but definitely prefer the person he is (not that he is nasty or violent or anything) when sober. I think he finds that a bit hard to believe...

Anyway, the best of luck and well done to you all so far. Will try to find the other thread - or start one!

Went out to local Mela and got absolutely soaked! Then went to a tapas place with some friends which normally would have resulted in several bottles being consummed...I contented myself with a ginger beer and had a great time grin

Hi Unlella- sorry to igm=nore your post- there was a quite active thread for the partners of addicts- don't know if it's still going. However, if he has a problem,, perhaps Al-Anon may be support for you?

I'm a recovering (female) alcoholic, but I know when I was trying to stop, my partner was quite unhelpful, although he was an enabler too, so I'm guessing it is different for you?

MIFLAW- there is a thread on the go called'my friend drinks too much'.... wanna go on? I've already posted, but , and am NOT bigging you up, but you do have a certain style of writng that gets a good point across.

Umlellala

What are his views on AA? Works for me.

Happy to discuss.

S

Hello, am I allowed to join thisw thread in support for my husband?

He has recently stopped drinking (one week and one day!) after realising he can't cut down and is excited/terrified about the prospect of a life without booze.

Cistus - nothng last night, but didn't want it as absolutely knacckered! See how today goes - will check in grin

Off to Mela today and they don't do drink so that should make it easier!!

good for you Blackduck... how are you doing ? I have been very moderate with my alcohol intake in the last 10 days. I have has 2 glasses tonight, (less than 1/2 a bottle) and am now drinking fizzy water...In the last 7 days I have not drunk at all on 4 of them

feel much more in control, but still very mush going day to day.... and considering the abstinence option.....

okay I am saying this here in the hope that putting it in black and white will act as an added spur. I don't want to drink at all this week - starting today.....

Thank you - if only it had come naturally!

MIFLAW you talk a lot of sense

"see I think that is why some of us find it hard to cut down/cut it out because of friends expecting you to do it(drink that is), and when you don't the spanish inquisition just makes you want to open a bottle and put a straw in...."

Your friends expect you to drink because you drink.

If you stop drinking they will soon expect you not to drink.

This is within your power and they can't make you do anything you don't want to do.

Oh Blackduck sad

You know that you can always vent here!

Harrogate - I know what you mean! Sure if I stopped they'd all think I was expecting....see I think that is why some of us find it hard to cut down/cut it out because of friends expecting you to do it(drink that is), and when you don't the spanish inquisition just makes you want to open a bottle and put a straw in....

The lonely thing - oh all sorts of reasons really - I am at a very weird point in my life where there is an awful lot of introspection going on and I just feel there is no-one there for me IYKWIM.

oh no Blackduck - whats up? Why do you feel lonely?

I can totally relate to the fact that people think of you and wine in the same sentence. People usually think I'm pregnant if I'm not drinking...

okay - been up and down here...A lot on friday, none sat, shared a bottle with dp sun and had a beer yesterday. I was sad

when on sun at a picnic a friend asked if we'd bought some wine and I said 'no' and she said 'That's not like you'......see I don't WANT to have everyone think that of me....
Anyway loads of life rubbish here which also doesn't help - shall we move, shall we not? Shall I take a job with a 2 hour each way commute? What the HELL do I want to do with my life...On top of which I feel VERY lonely...

I had the weekend off - but managed to be fairly circumspect on Friday/Sunday. The party on Saturday was another matter, but it wasn't too bad!

Back on the wagon now.

Welcome, sofatuber - love the name!

Tell us what your situation is.

Good for you HarrogateMum.

Well I managed only 1 glass on Sunday lunchtime and nothing in the evening (thats an achievement for me). Last night had two thirds of a bottle. It might sound mad but thats slightly less than usual.

Tell us more, sofa - it might help us to give you some advice and support but it may also help you to "type it out loud," IYSWIM.

ok I should join. Getting to the point where its much too much.

South-East London is very strong on home-made cakes. Peckham Friday night used to be practically a weekly picnic supper.

Hey MIFLAW- loved the biscuit talk!!

Sometimes people make cakes too....mmmm....

Good going, Cistus!

You contacted AA yet? they really can help.

Hi all

no alcohol since thursday. feel much much better ....

and none today either.....

keep going guys x

Pickyvic - there's no such thing as too much except the definition you give yourself - ie if it makes you feel bad about yourself, it's too much.

FWIW I have NEVER met anyone who drinks "standard measures" when they're not in a pub - and remember even standard measures apply to really quite low-alcohol varieties (4% ABV for beer, 10% ABV for wine ...) I really wouldn't kid yourself. If it's too much for you, it's too much.

IDTMACS - if you do plan to stop drinking or even cut down significantly, sooner or later people will notice. Save yourself some grief and start being open with them now. Tell them you're not drinking and, if you're worried about seeming a wimp (though you really needn't) just tell them it's doctor's orders (which, in a sense, it is.) If they still won't take no for an answer, you may rest assured that they do not care about your well-being and are not your friends at all.

You are not loser too much.
At least you have had the guts to go the doctors - I wouldnt be able to do that.
Maybe you should explaint to your friends that you are cutting out alcohol - thye may be more supportive.
DH and I got through 3 bottles of wine lst night so feel really down on myself.

Hi all ! I have been meaning to post for a while but couldn't login for some reason. I went to the doctor on thursday and she refered me to a alcohol commnity desintox (not sure it was what the doctor said words for words). I told her everything. I'm going to get help on a one on one basis. I'm quite hopefule. After the appointment, I had to go to a girly night (didnt want to go but the host wouldn't take no for an answer sad

). Anyway I promised myself I wouldnt drink too much. When I came out of the doctor's appointment, one of my friend called and asked me to buy 3 BOTTLES OF WINE, said ok. On my way back from the off license, I met the gp with whom I had the appointment, I was mortified..She obviously saw the bottles sad

..Then afterwards went to th my friends house, get proposed a glass of wine, said no, ask for a cup of tea instead and she was on my back, saying oh my god you are pregnant, yes you are...was fed up saying no and have to justify myself, ended up having some wine but not too much..just ended up staying late because they wanted us to leave all together..went to bed at midnight and was exhausted the day after and not able to fonction normaly..I feel like a loser sad

pickyvic, I wish I could stick at 2 glasses! If you mean standard sized glasses that is. Last night I had 2 gin and tonics and three quarters of a bottle of white. Not good. I feel fine today but guilty.

I don't really think, in the great scheme of things, that 2 glasses a night is a problem, pickyvic, although obviously it depends on the size of the glasses!

How many units do you think you're drinking? You could still be within the government guidelines of 14 per week, depending on the amount.

That said, if it's worrying you, then maybe there is a problem. Why not just try and have as many dry nights as you can, but not worry about those that aren't?

think i should join this thread - am very like the OP. i drink daily. a couple of glasses, never drink and drive, it never effects my work etc, but id love to stop. i dont know why i cant - i did it with smoking.

i looked at this thread cos of the title - how do you know when your drinking too much. i think when you think "oh god thats me"!

i can do a few days without but i always cave in. its like its my "me time" when i have a glass and i love it. a little too much.

is 2 glasses a night too much? i feel guilty about it so i guess it is.

Hi all
Havent posted for a while as have been a bit rubbish
Drank a lot last weekend
but have been so so all week
Not drinking tonight as have to work tomorrow
but finding it OK
am drinking soda and lime cordial instead and it is not so bad
WEll done to those who are doing well and
stick with it to those - like me - who arent.

Harrogate

Welcome and good luck!

Hello - think I need to join you all. I have drunk since the age of 18 fairly heavily and am now 36 so realise that is half my life....my parents enjoy drinking and I guess thats where my love of wine has come from. I probably started drinking more heavily about 10 years ago when I used ot haev a bottle of wine a night, I dont have that much now as gave up (obviously) during two pregnancies and now that I have 3 kids under 5 that seems impossible. HOwever I still manage to get through 4-5 bottles a week.

Like a few others I have had a pain under my right rib, but had a scan on my gall bladder which showed nothing, and thye checked my liver as well and said it was ok...however this doesnt stop me worrying about what coudl be going on inside my body.

I didnt drink last night as I had to pick my husband up from the hospital and made myself a big cafetiere of decaf coffee instead. It wasnt the same....but I did wake up feeling very proud of myself this morning. I hope to give and gain support on this thread - everyone's experiences sound so familiar to me.

Cistus, anyone who's given up booze has been exactly where you are, I promise you those of us who now don't drink have been to every depth imagineable before we decided we just couldn't take anymore pain, physical, emotional and spiritual pain, I've been in bloody agony in all those areas, there's no will power involved, believe me, it was my "will" that got me into so much trouble, if I'm left to my own devices I can screw up spectacularly, I know the Higher Power concept can seem alien/religious/cultish, all I can say is it's none of those. If you decided to give an AA meeting a go, you would find support and hear stuff that makes you realise you're not alone and it's a comforting feeling. You don't have to say anything, open up, it's up to you how much you want to participate, what I can tell you is just by being there and absorbing the truth I guarantee you will feel better coming out of a meeting than you did going in. Thinking of you

Welcome Newme and good luck!

"but I allways go back to it"

Why not be nice to yourself and just pack it in?

But again, good luck to you however you decide to tackle this.

Hello, new to this thread but been avidly following it from the beginning. I have been drinking 1-2 bottles a night for 10-15 years. I have had a year off twice due to pregnancy and have the odd week off, sometimes the odd 2 weeks or even a month but I allways go back to it, I think because instead of adopting a long term lifestyle change I stop altogether for a few weeks and then just return to normal. I am hoping this time I can change that, we shall see....

For the last 26 days I have not drunk for 14 days and for the 12 days that I have had a drink I have had a third/half of what I would have normally drunk and I am feeling like I could manage this long term, although time will tell.... I was drinking about 9-11 bottles of wine a week and in the last (nearly 4 weeks) I have had 2-3 bottles a week which is still by no means perfect but is far better than it was. I have lost 9lbs as a result but I am not really looking at it as a diet just keep up the mantra of changing my lifestyle for a healthier one. I got a huge fright a few weeks ago when I read in the paper about the woman who died from liver failure at the age of 32 due to social drinking and thought enough is enough! Luckily DH doesn't really drink - he has done in the past but tends to because I do, however in the last couple of years he has stopped apart from social drinking so I feel quite embarrassed hurling wine down my neck of an evening on my own.

Will keep you posted how I get on.... good luck to everyone else!

Morning all!

Cistus, I'm sorry that you're feeling so low. But it's very early days, and if you've been drinking so much for so long what you're trying to do (at the very least) is change a habit. It takes a long time to swap one habit for another. And given that alcohol is involved, it will be even harder.

It does sound to me as if you're being a bit harsh to yourself, and that you need to let up a bit and be a bit more realistic! I think you have to look on it - at least for the moment before you decide if you're going to take things any further - that any day without having a drink can only be a good thing.

What's in your head at the moment? What are your thoughts/worries/fears - and what are your positive thoughts?

(sorry to sound like a cod psychologist ...)

"The idea of giving up your power to a higher authority" - I can fully understand the fear this engenders in some people because I was one of them but the irony is that, if someone has a drink problem, he or she is already doing just that! I used to have a higher power who could make me do things I wouldn't have done alone - sometimes I called her Stella and sometimes Johnnie Walker (and sometimes, when money was tight, just "K"). If you're in a similar situation, why not just replace it with a higher power that isn't trying to kill you? It doesn't have to be God, or even a god - as my sponsor at the time used to say, "MIFLAW, the only thing you need to know about God is it's not you!"

And AA are very good. The idea of giving up your power to a higher authority - I've never been in that situation but have seen people engage with it and it really works.

Go talk to your GP. You will be suprised at how many people are like you and have asked for help. They will give you all the advice you need. Just tell them the truth. You can do it.

I'm sorry you're feeling crap, Cistus. So far, you've been doing well. You've been doing something you possibly didn't think very much about before. I've been chatting to a friend who stopped drinking for about a month and she said that she notices the effects of alcohol far more now she is drinking less. Even a small amount of it has quite profound effects. Please don't be too hard on yourself. You are chipping away at an ingrained habit and possibly a bit of dependency. Keep chipping and you will find out what is the best way forward for you.

You need to keep on and on forgiving yourself, as you might a friend in the same situation.

Cistus

No willpower here. My sobriety - and resultant happiness - are entirely to the credit of AA.

Why not give it a go yourself? You sound a bit short of better ideas ...

I am very low. am realising that I cannot seem to moderate my drinking. Its all, or nothing. and nothing is easy enough - in the short term....

feel utterly crap

well done everyone else with more willpower than i

How's everyone doing? How are you Cistus?

I have a dilemma - I'm going to a big party on Saturday; close friends celebrating not only their 50th birthdays but also their 25th wedding anniversary.

Will be a big do. I haven't decided if I'm going to have a drink or not. Part of me doesn't want to, as I'm doing so well (and I am supposed to be dry for a month!), part of me wants to drink Champagne!

"Interesting characters" ... It's only since I got sober that people have been that polite ...

Day time meetings are the way to go then!

Where do you live (in a general sense - not after your address, part of London is fine) and do you have a travel card?

Hello everyone !! I have a genuine fear of going to far from where I live ! It started long before I had my problem..I'm not scared of the actual meeting and the actual people..it's afterwards I'm scared about..when I have to go home..fear of the dark but expat gave me a good tip, I'll get a cab to go there..no more excuses smile

Thoses last few posts made me laught, you seem all to be quite interesting caracters !!!

And you can get 'miniatures' to take on planes!

Ah, tabasco - the alcoholic's friend! Makes even unbuttered, sliced white bread a meal fit for a king, and so filling! Maximises the budget for the important things in life ...

Expat, you're right, I am a lightweight. I only carry tabasco.

Now, IDTMBCS, doesn't this all sound like way more fun than 2 bottles of wine/night?

Totally agree MIFLAW, legends!!!

Sometimes the nicknames say it all ... Not just the oldtimers like Ironing Board Arthur and Mick the Tick but people I've known myself like Chequebook Gerry, Bill the Shed and Scaffold John - you hear names like that and you already can't wait to meet them because you KNOW they're going to have a few interesting tales to tell!

Used to live in London and travelled all over to meetings, in the good old smoky days! The inspiration I found was so nourishing and often those in the 'more dodgy' areas were the most inspiring, real people in real situations doing what is done in every AA room around world, helping each other to get better and stay sober themselves. I love the meetings with more colourful characters, I've often laughed till I've cried at some stuff. Alcoholism has been called cancer of the soul and last week at a meeting I heard a saying I hadn't heard before, there's alot of talk of functioning alcoholics, those of us who still have jobs, haven't been imprisoned, not lost their house/relationship/children, however you want to describe it, and someone said the best description of a functioning alcoholic is someone who may still have their job but has lost their soul, that rings very true for me. I love the meetings with more colourful characters

I'm a person who carries a small Ziploc bag containing sachets of salt, ketchup, pepper, milks, granola bars, etc. in her handbag.

You never know when low blood sugar, or stingy fastfood workers will strike!

I'm a BYOB (bring your own biscuits) type of gal.

You should have been at Birchington Thursdays or Herne Bay Sundays in my first year, when I was tea boy.

Those were glory days for AA biscuits.

'at MIFLAW and herbal teas. Very true though - the quality of biscuits is always an influence on me, I find.'

C'mon, Fairytale, what kind of lightweight addict are you? I always bring my own (biscuits) to these sorts of things. Who wants to get caught out?

Expat - you are right, there are several all-women meetings on both sides of the river. There are even one or two with creches!

And, of course, if you phone the telephone number and ask for someone to come and see you, they ALWAYS send someone of the apporpriate gender.

at MIFLAW and herbal teas. Very true though - the quality of biscuits is always an influence on me, I find. And I'll never forget a friend once saying, when I was comparing London meetings and Herts ones, 'well, sweetie, you get a better class of drunk in Kensington ...'

Seriously, I live in Hertfordshire and would LOVE to have all those meetings available. Lunchtime ones, women-only ones, newcomers' ones, every day and in every area. There is a huge range and I suspect, IDTMACS, that you are understandably hesitant about taking the step of going. I was lucky - I was taken to my first meeting by a friend whose life in sobriety was a shining example to me of how AA works. Even then, I was still terrified. I don't really know what of, probably all the perceived fears about it being a cult, about 'forever' and generally about making a big life change. I really was inspired by the people I saw there and wanted what they had. And I'm still leading a happy, booze-free life one year on, not missing it or feeling that I'm being deprived.

The best suggestion anyone can give someone contemplating AA is just to go to one meeting and listen. There's no commitment, you don't have to sign up, and nobody will make you go back if you don't want to, but you might find that sitting listening to other people in a similar situation might just make the whole thing less scary.

One other thing - lots and lots of people talk about being put off AA because they don't see themselves as 'drunks', ie they're not sleeping on park benches, drinking meths. They still have jobs, houses, and are vaguely functional. They think that if they could just control the 'one' unmanageable thing in their lives - their drinking - everything would be ok. But the fact is that they can't control it - to whatever level. I was mainly a binge drinker, I never drank in the morning, I never hid bottles, in a lot of ways I didn't behave like the 'classic alcoholic'. But I had no control over my drinking once it started, and once I began looking back over my life I could see how much it had influenced me - jobs I'd lost, relationships that went wrong, bad choices made etc. They were all down to drinking. So I stopped. And now my life is getting better. It seems simple in black and white like that, but it took me years to see it.

That's enough beating of the drum. I surprise myself sometimes, I just can't stop (alcoholic mind!) Sorry to bang on, but hope it might be useful in some way.

in a large city like London, there are probably also all-female meetings. or the possibility of being accompanied by a female member or met at the door by a female member.

Plonketyplonk

I used to attend meetings at Homerton Hospital while I lived up there. I personally don't give a monkey's - if it is a good meeting I will go there and I do not feel threatened because I am sober, and therefore more alert, and also the locals don't take any notice of me because I do not appear to be vulnerable, aggressive or obnoxious. So it's not for me to say whether or not you are a pedant but you are definitely preaching to the converted.

IDTMACS, on the other hand, apparently does have a problem with areas perceived to be rough and this might just be an excuse to not go to meetings or it might be genuine fear, but either way I was attempting to show her that this need not be an obstacle.

The roughest meetings I have ever been at, for the record, were Nunhead (regular stand up rows, window put through one week) and Plumstead (meeting finished early as drunk threw a chair). I'd still go back to either of them if they were the only ones around, but that's just me. For more delicate souls, I believe Stoke Newington has herbal teas ...

There are also daytime meetings in large cities so you might feel a bit safer on the streets.

Sorry to be a pedant, but Stoke Newington IS in Hackney, and frankly the streets are no safer than they are in other parts of the borough. I guess it's about feeling safer!

IDTMACS

There are over 600 meetings every week in London. I cannot believe that there is only one near you.

I used to go to meetings in Hackney and (more recently) in Peckham, which are pretty grim areas (though the AA meetings are just as good, positive and helpful as the ones in Chelsea and Hampstead ...) But, if I didn't like those areas, I'd go to Stoke Newington instead of Hackney and Dulwich rather than Peckham IYSWIM. Have another look at the meetings listing and look properly this time. Look at it like you actually mean to go to one. I think you'll be surprised.

As for rehab, The Priory and Promiss are both AA-based. So you can pay 20k a month to go to AA or you can just put a quid or so in the voluntary collection at the end of the meeting - the help you'll get will be identical. Entirely your choice!

Just had an idea, IDRINKTOOMUCH! All that wine can't come cheap. How about take teh money and use it instead for a taxi to get to an AA in a better area? Would that be more feasible - certainly healthier!

I used Solgar Vit B complex when I was pregnant and it was FAB. You can get it at most independent health shops.

It may help to stock up with vit B complex while you're trying to stop drinking. You can get industrial vit B horse pills from the doctor, but I don't think they hand them out that easily. My friend was given them because she was shaking so much.

Rehab is a nice idea, but it is in some ways trying to defer responsibility. AA seems to offer a lot of people a great deal of support. My friend was in rehab for a while. They dried her out (Basically getting her off the booze so she didn't die) and started her off doing other things. Sadly it wasn't for long and the drive to self-destruct was too strong.

I think it is good to start seeing how we relate to alcohol. For some people it may mean drinking less, for others the end result may be total abstention. These things take time. Keep looking and the mud will settle!

don't think gingerbeer has aspertame in it.... the one I drink is a cordial that you make up yourself with fizzy water.....
I also want dp to cut it out for a bit because he is having the odd drag of a fag when he's had a few and he gave up 2.5 years ago and I don't want him starting again!!

You know, I've never tried this ginger beer stuff. Has it got aspartame? I can't take aspartame, it makes me sick.

My husband is very nearly teetotal. He just doesn't care for alcohol and has it maybe twice a year, a max of 3 pints or bottles.

Now cigarettes, on the other hand, he's well addicted to . . .

I have dropped in and out of this thread - but back as had a bad week/end. Not hammered, but just the constant drinking...... Dp and I have decided a serious detox is in order (always easier if we both do it!). I want to feel more myself if that makes sense? Also want to feel less tired! So nothing for me today..... instead I will try to cook some nice interesting food for us and chill with a ginger beer!

I'm glad you are finding support here!

BIWI - I have asked for his help but he doesn't know how to help me, what can he do ?
Giving up one by one day is what I plan to do, cant imgine giving up for good sad

, when I gave up for 3 days, it's what I have done but the tiredness was unbearable..I know it's going to happen, now I have a clue. Now I habe to be strong !

Expat : Thank you for sharing your cousin's experience, funny I find you in this thread..You were there for me last year when I was having a tought time (not related to alcohol)

'MIFLAW - how I wish I could afford rehab..and coming back a better person '

I know rehab has its appeal because it can be a more controlled environment (although my cousin's been in some where she was fairly easily able to get the illicit drugs she was addicted to) but sometimes it isn't a quick fix option. Although I've not been in rehab myself, the long-term support you need afterwards is just as important (only going by my cousin's struggles with meth amphetimine addiction. She's now been in Narcotics Anonymous for 3 years after the court made it a choice between 3 months in rehab and 5 years drug-free probation or 5 years in prison). Can't be stressed enough. So please don't feel bad, Icantstop!

Well it sounds to me like you need to have a long conversation with your DH and ask him for help - not just with the drinking, but with the general level of stress you're obviously under at the moment. I'm not surprised you're not feeling well!

You need to ask him to help you and support you. And a supporting and loving DH (get him off the sofa!) will really help you.

If you're so tired, you really do need to try to give up the alcohol as this interferes with your sleep massively. Try doing it one day at a time, as others have said here. Don't just say to yourself 'I'm giving up', as that will be way too big a challenge. Just tell yourself that today, Monday, you're not having a drink.

You can buy Berocca, a vitamin B complex supplement, over the counter. It will help to a degree. Also, drink more water (not with wine in it!) and take a bit of exercise if you can - even if it's just a 20 minute walk round the block.

Thank you BIWI, I'm going to have another look at it..As I said when I first looked, the nearest aa was a bit far from me as not in a very nice part of the borough (I live in London) so a bit of fright there, I don't drive ! Well I stocked the fridge, with Shloer, alcohol free beers...so that's a first step. Yes DH knows about my problem but I think he doesn't realise the full extent tbh, he just thinks I'm extremely stressed...we argue a lot at the moment and he does sleep a lot in the sofa unfortunately. Everything is in the top of me atm. I'm not feeling well and myself. There is noboby apart from you lot, who knows in what situation I am in atm. By visiting the gp, I was hoping he'll give me some strong vitamins (be ? B6 ?) so I could be less tired..I can't afford being tired, I can't afford to take a break if I dont work I lose money. And if I lose money, we are going to be in troubles.
MIFLAW - how I wish I could afford rehab..and coming back a better person sad

IDTMACS

Here is a link to help you find your nearest AA meetings

If this is what you decide is most appropriate for you.

Have you talked to your DH about the drinking?

IDTMACS

Great news that you are going to see your GP - but don't be surprised if (s)he suggests you go to AA. The main alternatives are "why don't you cut down?" (which you've tried and failed already, or presumably you wouldn't be on this thread); drugs like Antabuse (induce nausea if you drink on them, so the temptation is simply not to take them when you want a drink); or rehab which, as well as being much scarier and more expensive than going to AA, will often be based on AA principles and compulsory attendance at AA meetings anyway.

If you live in Britain (with the possible experience of the Highlands and islands) I would be amazed if AA was "too far." At least, how I define too far ... I think to myself, I'm going to these meetings to avoid my problem with drink killing me. If I was still drinking, if I wanted a drink and had none in the house, how far would I travel to get some? Then, if the meeting's no further than that, I know it's not too far.

Based on that thinking, it's never been too far yet ...

Imagine what you can do with that dosh, BIWI!

Have fun, or pay down your mortgage or a debt, save for a rainy day, etc.

I sure do wish I had all the money I wasted on booze back!

I don't even want to think about how much I blew.

well done BIWI!
I should add that I replaced alcohol with chocolate - amazingly it hasn't yet affected me as much as it could have (but then I have been bf'ing for 19m) but it is starting to and I must stop it.

My drinking only started to bother me when I noticed that I was getting through 1-1.5 bottles of wine by myself a night. Some nights I would stop before I finished the bottle, thinking "oh I'll have the other half (usually less than half if I'm honest) tomorrow night". Trouble was, the "half" bottle the next night wouldn't be enough, so I'd open another and before you know it, that would be empty as well.

What really started to scare me was that I didn't even really feel drunk - a wee bit tipsy, but not drunk. And I was drinking about 10 bottles of wine a week, by myself. This is Not Good. My figure started to suffer too, muffin top here we come - and a friend of mine (who I frequently went drinking with) ended up going to the GP because her own drinking was getting out of hand - her GP told her she wasn't an alcoholic yet but if she carried on the same way, she soon would be. That helped me too - so I came off it by switching to lookalikes (blueberry juice and grape shloer, as I mentioned previously). I also started to do some exercises, and it took 4 weeks before I noticed any difference at all. I kept it up for 3 months and lost a bit of weight and a few inches here and there (2 off my waist alone!) but then my DP came back from Australia and it all went a bit tits up again, until I got pg.

Now, as I said at the top of this post, my prob is chocolate <sigh>

You're right, expat. £50 a week, roughly, is a great amount of money to be saving! Over £2500 a year of my taxed income.

BIWI, another good motivator: take all that money you'd have spent on booze and put it in a savings account. You may wind up with a nice slush fund

Have completed week one alcohol free.

Tomorrow, the diet starts in earnest.

this is a thread for EVERYONE who has, has had, or thinks they may have a problem with alcohol.

its definitely NOT MY thread, its OUR thread....

i am like you plonk, drinking a lot less and very pleased with that. Contemplating whats next....

You have made a start, IDRINKTOOMUCH by admitting that there may be a problem.

I drink too much too, but haven't got into using it as an escape. It's very easy to find that the next day will be the same as today, so it doesn't really matter. It's a sort of groundhog day kind of thing.

I think sometimes it's easy to drink when you have young children - the end of the day and the start of 'grown up' time.

I'm having a wretched time with smoking at the moment. When I first stopped, I filled the gap with alcohol. I don't want to do that again.

It's not always straightforward, but I've found posting here helpful, and although it sometimes doesn't seem like it, I have cut down quite a lot, and now regularly have 3-4 nights a week without booze. Of course it doesn't always work, especially in holidays.

Thank you BecauseImworthit, I'm really touch by your post and you sharing your experience with me ! I think I have started the same way as you, the only difference is that alcohol in my place (when I was living with my parents) was a taboo and is still is, I mean when I go home they still watch the amount I drink and make comments if they think it's too much ! I didn't start drinking hard beofre the age of 20 (I'm 30), when I came to London. It was party every night, big socialising....etc..As you I always enjoyed a drink, when I started drinking it was before going to parties, dinner etc to feel more confident (my english was shit !). Then I have met DH, we went to have 2 children and as you, we were having wine just to make us feel better or maybe making a difference between the week and the week end ? Like you, just because we were stuck at home. DH almost doesnt drink at all now (I think it's because I drink everything before he has the opportunity!). I had a very shit year, last year, from january, which I found out I was pg but couldn't keep going with the pregnancy for various reasons (financial mainly, was a bout to start a new job)...Then it was shit after shit, dh and I were having a rought patch, the job was really hard and still is (who is not having a tought time at work)...so yes last summer, I have started to drink heavily, plus going out with friends who drinks quite a lot, I have trapped myself and I'm trying to get out of it but I think I need help now because it's not going well at all.
I try let's say to put a bit of wine for a lots of sparkling water but the result is still the same, I empty the bottles sad

IDTMACS - no-one on this thread will judge you. I don't think any of us has the right. We're all on here because of our concerns about what we're drinking, so you are with friends.

What started it for me? I've always enjoyed drinking. I started drinking very (too) young, at around 14. My parents always enjoyed a drink - although not especially heavy drinkers, alcohol was very much part of their lives. I remember coming home from school (they were both teachers at my school) and we would sit down and all chat about the day. I would drink coffee and my parents would drink sherry or wine, so I suppose that's where the link between work/end of the day and alcohol was established in my mind.

My teen years and friends were spent going out to parties and the pub and eating out - my social circle were all around 4/5 years older than me.

Then university, where drinking/partying was the norm.

Then I started work in advertising, where heavy drinking/client lunches were really the norm, in the mid 80s. Interestingly it changed pretty quickly around '84/85 - whereas once it was a faux pas not to order wine at lunch, suddenly it was a big, big faux pas so to do - and bottled water became the norm. Thank goodness for that, otherwise I would definitely have more of a problem now than I do!

So although lunchtime drinking stopped around then (and I still rarely do it - only if I'm out with a client for a particularly special/important lunch, or if it's Christmas), evening drinking continued.

DH and I when we first met, were usually out every night. When the children came along, wine was our way of enjoying being 'stuck' at home, not able to go out.

Initially it was one bottle, then a g+t each, followed by a bottle, then 2 bottles - gradually over the years it has crept up, so that 2 bottles per evening (more at the weekend) seems normal. Yet I know, from listening to other people, that this is definitely not normal - but I think that also my social circle seem to share the same view on alcohol as we do, which does make it harder to pull back and stop/cut down.

When I told my DH I was stopping - just for the month - his first reaction was about him - i.e. I would make his life boring - which I thought was very telling.

I have surprised myself by how easy it has been to stop - although the fact that I'm aware I'm counting the days is indicative of how much a part of my life it has become. But I have no desire to go back to drinking so much.

I think it's brilliant that you have made an appointment with your GP - I don't think I'm that brave yet! - but I have no idea what he/she will suggest. I would think that the first thing, if you can't just stop, is to at least cut down. Have you tried this yet? If you're drinking wine with sparkling water, can you reduce the amount of wine/increase the amount of sparkling water per drink, so it's weaker and weaker?

Good luck and please let us know how you get on - if you're on this thread you're part of 'us'! (I know it's Cistus's thread, but I'm sure she will agree!)

Hi ! I have posted earlier, thank you Miflaw, biwi and serajen for your posts...well done to all of you who managed to be in control !! I want to beat it too, I have a late appointment next week with my gp and I'm going to spill the bean as I can't carry on like this, I'm unhappy. Why did I let this get out of control ??? This terrible habit started last year when I started a new job, I can't tell you which job I'm doing, I dont want you to judge me even if it doesn't affect my job. I know most of you, dont drink as much as I do...but what made you start in the first place ?? I used to have 2-3 bottles of wine a week and it was shared with DH not all by myself..I can't believe I have ended up like this..Dh knows I have a problem but he doesn't know the full extent..It's the first time I really admit I have a problem..I have been looking at going to AA meetings but it's too far from me..What am I going to do ?? Will I get better ? What is the gp going to suggest me to do ? I'm so pissed off with myself for being like this, I'm the only one to blame for what I am. Please forgive me, I don't mean to hijack (sp?), on a good note, for thoses who are not as bad as me or who are now in control of their drinking, you can think well I'm not as bas as her ! xxxx

I'm with you on that BIWI - I could happily forego the effect of the alcohol if I could retain the taste. I did try the alcohol-free wines - I think Golden Oktober used to be one - but the ones I tried weren't that great (a while ago).

Now, (excited) - I have just tried looking that up to see if I was right, and in doing so have found this website for alcohol-free wines - it's on the white wine page. Maybe an avenue to explore? They sound as though things have progressed with the taste front, so it could be the answer!

Sorry - pressed post too soon! The reason I'm posting about the taste is that I have sat this morning and read through the thread from start to finish, and I was struck by the number of posts that referred to the effect of the alcohol - the buzz, the nice warm feeling, coping with nerves/shyness, etc. And it isn't about that for me. In fact in many ways I don't like the heady feeling that alcohol creates. I'm not sure where I'm going with this, it just struck me as something interesting.

alcohol does that to the brain, doesn't it?!

I'm impressed with both him and you, as well as interested that you're both doing different things. I guess the key is to find what works for you.

My 'self-fooling' (good phrase!) is slimline tonic. Although I'm not really trying to fool myself I'm drinking, just trying to find something that's not too sweet. I couldn't go to the pub/out all evening and drink coke/juice as it's just too sweet/claggy.

The other thing that interests me is that if I'm drinking I don't crave alcohol, just white wine. OK, I know that's alcohol, but it's the taste of the wine I seem to want. It's probably all bound up with the taste of alcohol, I recognise, but red wine, or gin and tonic just isn't the same. I wonder if you could ever truly separate the taste of the alcohol from the taste of the wine?

birthday in May blush

- my brain.<shakes head sadly>

BIWI - my DH gave up drinking entirely last September after a stupendously embarrassing works night out. He hasn't touched a drop since, because he still doesn't feel confident that he could just have the one and stop at it. He didn't originally set himself any major milestones, just started with 1 week, then a month, then til Christmas, then til New Year, then til Easter, then til his birthday in March; now he's looking to go the full year but in the back of his mind is the thought that he may never go back to it.

He drinks coke or juices at the pub, squash or ginger ale at home. Unlike me (see my post just prior to yours) he didn't need a "self-fooling" alternative to get him off it. He just was soooo embarrassed it had to be done.

How are you feeling now, Cistus?

BIWI I think thats my fear too. Its easy enough not to drink at all for a 'while' but when one reintroduces alcohol where will we end up ? It was easier for me last night NOT to drink more than it has been in the past; I think because i have ben so focussed on alcohol for the last month or so, its no longer a thoughtless automatic reflex to reach for the bottle....

I dreamt last night that I'd given in and had a drink. It was so realistic!

What I'm wondering about at the moment is how to re-introduce alcohol without just reverting back to previous habits. I know it's barely less than a week, so it may be a bit presumptuous to think about drinking again, but I think, for me, that's where the danger is going to lie. And I think at that point it will be where I discover just how much of an issue alcohol really is.

I'm hoping that a month off will really reduce my tolerance, which will then help me to say 'no'.

Those of you who have successfully cut down, how did you manage it?

At this stage, I'm clearly not envisaging being a non-drinker. But neither do I want to end up back where I have been in terms of quantity.

In a way, the giving up has been easy! It's where next that looks hard.

Feel like I'm a bit late to this thread but just wanted to say that when I needed to cut down drastically on my drinking, I did so by finding something else to drink that looked right and tasted good but had no alcohol.

As I mostly (but not exclusively) drank red wine, the best sub for me was blueberry juice (Waitrose brand was the nicest). The right colour, spritzed nicely with sparkling water to take off the sickly edge - fooled my eyes and therefore I didn't really miss the bottle+ that I had been drinking nightly.

For white wine, I chose White Grape Schloer - although a relatively expensive soft drink, it's still less than half the price of a bottle of wine.

Anyway, just thought I'd offer that up. I now have only one spritzer most nights, or juice.

Well done again. I'm a bit up and down and trying to substitute alcohol for fags. It's bloody awful. Anyway, last night I drank 2 tins of beer over a couple of hours then said to dh that I didn't really feel like having anything else. Victory! Me saying I don't want any more! Watched Hotel Babylon instead and read my book.

had a G&T last night and then a glass of wine. Then considered having more wine BUT DID NOT.. instead I had a glass of fizzy water....Feel v pleased.

Cheers to you BIWI. And envy

at being at Wimbledon.

I can honestly say that Mumsnet, or rather one particular poster on MN, got me started on my 6 weeks off alcohol last year. She very simply said "you'll be absolutely fine if you can get past your trigger point in the day" and, for me, she was right. I do 90% of my drinking between 6pm and 9pm, so not pouring a drink at 6pm was all I needed to do for 6 weeks to be fairly easily sober.

Well, passed my first 'social test' today! Was at Wimbledon, and it would have been very easy to indulge in the Pimms and/or champagne. But I didn't.

Am now settled at home with another large glass of slimline tonic.

I know it's only 5 days, but I haven't gone this long without drinking for a very long time.

Hi there drinkers and non-drinkers! I have been up to a bottle of wine a night, and habitual drinking every night, but now I only drink weekends. I now find I am so drunk on 3 units I just stop. I was very unhappy when I was drinking, using it as a crutch. I don't spend much time with friends who want to drink to get drunk anymore. All this has been helped by a new partner who avoids getting drunk when drinking and laughs at me if I do it. If it wasn't for him, I would probably still be drinking nightly.
I am much healthier now, physically and mentally. Good luck drinkers.

IDTMACS, my quota was 2 bottles of wine nightly as well, spent many years drunk every evening, sobering up during work time, with promises to myself that I wouldn't drink again that evening, then by 4pm once my body had processed all the toxins, working overtime to flush it all out, with the sweating and all the rest, I'd think 'oh I don't feel so bad now' and be back at the off licence by 6pm for another 2 bottles. Needless to say, off licence owner used to know me very well and even used to call me at 10pm for last orders, as he knew I'd often be up there after they'd shut banging on the door for more supplies. I drank to cope with life, to me addiction was the answer, life was the problem, emotions, responsibilities, just ordinary everyday life that seemed so easy to others, on the surface I'm capable, sociable, responsible, da, da, da, no-one can see I'm screaming inside, so I medicated. Am now back at AA and know that's where I must stay. Just my two penny worth. Wishing you strength.

Well done BIWI and Mintyy!

I have had one small beer since Sunday (last year my tally would have been 3 bottles of wine since Sunday). Am finding it very easy to moderate my drinking at the moment. Very best of luck to the rest of you smile

IDTMACS - welcome to the thread! Admitting it here could be the first step to making important changes in your life.

2 bottles of wine a night is way too much - but you know that, I'm sure.

And I'm not surprised that you felt awful if you were 3 days dry, as you must have been having horrible withdrawal.

I can't advise you what to do, because I think you have to decide for yourself what's most appropriate.

What are you doing/trying to do at the moment? Do you have a DP who can help you?

Cistus - sorry you feel so down. What's going on in your life now?

Another alcohol free day for me today since I started. Only day 4, but after having made my declaration to DH that I wasn't going to drink, it's much easier to stick with it. I wasn't actually bothered about it at all today. Let's hope it's the same over the weekend. We're going out to lunch on Sunday, so I'm going to drive, to make sure that I'm not tempted.

IDTMACS

Go to AA. Simple as that. Then keep going until you have a better idea.

You probably don't want to go or to say you are an alcoholic. But it works. It may well be time to start being pragmatic in life.

I speak from experience ...

Hi all !!

I have been looking at this thread from the beginning but didnt have the courage to post until now. I have a drink problem, I drink in average 2 bottles of wine per evening mixed with sparkling water..It all started because I was stressed, under pressure (still am)..when I go out, I dont even drink that much but when I'm in, I do drink a lot. No hangover in the morning but a massive guilt feeling. I have tried to stop a month a go, managed to be 3 days dry but I was feeling tired and not very well. I know I have got to see a gp but I'm scared, very scared. Don't know why, maybe admitting it to someone in real life ?

Thank you cistus for starting this thread and please carry on, you are stronger than I am.xxx

Cistus, well done.

Two things to bear in mind ... One, if you are coming off drink, you are enduring a massive and protracted hangover, ie withdrawal symptoms. It's not going to kill you (unless you've been drinking a lot more than you're letting on) and it won't last forever, but it will hurt for a bit and your life will be out of kilter for a couple of days. Be ready for that, be kind to yourself, and you'll be fine.

Two, if you were abusing alcohol, pound to a penny there were reasons for that. Those reasons haven't gone away and, now you're not drinking, they're not getting blotted out. You will need to find alternative strategies to deal with them. Again, they won't kill you, nothing is ever as bad as it looks with a hangover and you can get through this - but, again, you need to be ready for this and you need to remember they won't go away on their own.

Stay off the drink and your life will get better. Fact. Make it happen.

No alcohol last night. I feel atrocious today Flat, depressed ,apathetic, demotivated and weepy

okayish.....as in haven't totally cut it out, but not hammering it either. dp and I shared a bottle last night and that was it. I don't feel too bad at the moment (apart from sleeping badly because of the heat. Still trying to make career decisions which are driving me batty....

Well you can join me in a 'let's stop drinking and lose some weight in the next 5 weeks' challenge!

Glad you're feeling better. I definitely sleep better when I'm not drinking.

feel better today. slept better, and have more energy.

Have decided to do something about the Xtra stone I am carrying before my summer hols (19 Aug) ... so drinking less can only help. Will not drink today.

thanks for your support ladies - I hope everyone else is doing ok x

Well, the minute I pledged to give up for July, I have been invited to a ridiculous number of social events! So it's going to be a real challenge.

However, it's about losing weight too, so I'm hoping that will keep me focused.

Cistus - I think you're definitely right about alcohol making you feel worse, and well done for not having a drink tonight. Being in a bad mood can be one of the greatest triggers for me.

did not drink yesterday and will not today. in a v v v bad mood today - work stuff ... quite certain though that alcohol will make me feel worse!

tbh we rarely go out anywhere we have to drive too - most friends are walking distance.... If I DO go out where driving is required then I usually do drive, as I NEVER drink anything and drive.

hows everyone else ?

That's happened to me Cistus - the falling over, and to dh. In both cases, it made us much more wary of drink being "fun" - falling over doesn't feel fun at all.

I always stop at one glass now. The less I drink the more effect that one glass has anyway, so I don't really want any more. And I'm only having one glass every 3-4 days, if that.
You will get there.

Hi Cistus, that must have been embarrasing for you, but like the others say, just forgive yourself and get back on the waggon, otherwise you feel worse and then you will want to drink again to feel better and so on,

I have a new challenge, a barbque picnic on Friday night. I shall drive, I find it helps,then you know you won't drink.

Would this work for you Cistus??

Fully agree re forgiving yourself.

Either you've got a drink problem or you haven't.

If you have, this is literally beyond your control. You drink, you can't control it, bad things happen, you nevertheless drink again - definition of a drinking problem. So don't beat yourself up over it. It won't go away until you make it go away but that doesn't mean you're a bad person, just a person who's currently not in control.

If you haven't got a drink problem, well, you did something foolish, you suffered the consequences, but presumably no one was hurt or killed, other people were drunk too - though maybe not as much as you - so move on, don't drink so much again (if you haven't got a problem, that should be easy) and chalk it up to experience.

Either way, the only wrong thing you can do is to do it again - so don't. Just let it go and move forward.

Mumto - congrats....
I had a reasonable weekend - wasn't dry, but not drunk either. With family on Sat, couple of glasses and a beer and last night two beers and that was it - think this is going to be my tactic if drinking at all as I simply can't do the volume!. I am having major issues re career and what I do next so need to lay of the drink so that I can focus on what I need to do!

C - sorry to hear about your weekend - but you are drinking less so that is good. Falling over - yeap, been there, done that, forgive yourself...

You are doing well, Cistus. It can take time to feel better from drinking. It's a bloody depressant! It's so strange, but I used to feel as though the world was closing in on me ALL the time, untill the gloom was treated, so having a hangover made absolutely no difference to my mood.

When you spend more time not drinking, you may well find you don't miss it very much. It will then become a clearer decision as to whether you want to stop drinking for longer. I guess it changes if you are driven on to have the next drink after the first. I do think that some of these problems are more psychological than physical, or at least they can be. With food, there are really not many things that are physically addictive but that bulimics and binge eaters binge on. The shame of falling over is horrible. Please take yourself in hand and forgive yourself.

Congrats, Mumto!

Sorry not to say it earlier, had a computer-free weekend by and large ... But well done, I'm pleased for you.

Cistus - all sounds depressingly familiar.

I'm sorry to say, too, that, if you DO have a problem, in all probability it will get worse unless and until you intervene. Even if you are convinced that it couldn't possibly get any worse, chances are it will.

Pretty sure that's not what you want to hear but I wouldn't want to lie to you.

Well - pick yourself up and dust yourself down and just get back on the wagon.

You are drinking less, so that's good.

feeling pretty crap actually. Dry Mon/Tues/Weds last week - then unexpected visitors threw me off track Thursday; adn Fridayis Friday..... then Sat went out to some firends for a BBQ. Got steaming drunk - fell over on the way home. In front of the kids. Everyone ( apart from dh ) was very drunk so it wasnt just ,e, but i feel like total crap. everytime I do that ( and its only ecery 6 months or so) I feel worse. Just feel I lost all sense f what `i was drinking/didnt care.....

still dry yesterday, and today... so overall Im drinonging much less than I was a month ago (when there were NO dry days) just feeling less optimistic about my ability to control it

Well done!

I start a 5 week diet today, and have pledged to give up alcohol for that period as well. I have also said it out loud, and told DH - so now I have to stick to it!

It's driven primarily by my need to lose some weight before we go away on 6 August, but a month+ off can only be a good thing.

I suspect I will need to check in here regularly to keep me on the straight and narrow. grin

Cistus - how are things going with you?

Well I shall celebrate alone then, sad

with diet coke ......

Cistus, have you gone ??

I did it !! Almost . just half a lager shandy and that was it.

Had a nasty moment when we went home between the day time and the night time do, where dh stood his ground and argued that I did say I would drive when i insisted I wanted to get a taxi.

I am v. pleased with myself. Tomorrow will be okay and I am sure I will be okay through the week, til I get to Thursday or Friday again.

Thanks for your support MIFLAW, just having the car and having to look after the dcs was enough.

Good luck at the wedding - am sure you will be fine.

Ideas to consider:

discreetly tell the person in charge of drinks and/or the waiter that you are not drinking today - that should minimise the number of offers you get
beat them to it - try to always have a full glass (of something soft!)
stay out of rounds if there's a paying bar
tell someone else present that you're not drinking so you can turn to them for support if it gets too much
depends whose wedding it is, but you are not a prisoner there - if it all gets too much, you can go for a walk or even just leave. Unless you do so during the speeches or push past the bride coming down the aisle, few people will notice and still fewer will comment on it

I sense you're not in AA or anything similar but, if you were, I would add to that that you should take a few people's phone numbers with you and also know where the nearest meeting is, just in case.

Above all, remember that, wedding or not, this is just another day. You can do it.

Let us know on Sunday how it went.

MIFLAW you are very honest, and you make a lot of sense - thank you.

I didn't drink last night and I don't intend to tonight. I was thinking about sitting down with my dh tonight and doing some planning (we are doing some work on the house) and I thought we will sit down with a nice bottle of wine.

Then i stopped myself and thought, why do we need wine, its just a habit.

I am not drinking tomorrow at the wedding so if I get through that, I shall be very proud of myself.

I shall post again on Sunday ! smile

I know what you mean, Jem.

Though I always wonder what sort of person would WANT to be a heavy drinker if they weren't an alcoholic? Certainly once you're past the age of 25 - drinking like that really is a young person's game ... Those hangovers start to HURT, dammit!

I recognise it, I did all sorts of things to legitimise my drinking, to make it seem normal- a lot of energy went into that actaully, was exhausting, how I hid and kept it secret to enable me to perpetuate it.
Until I couldn't stop, then I just drank.

I know lots of heavy drinkers who AREN'T alcoholics. Addiction is a weird crazy place.

Now THERE'S something people didn't say to me very often when I drank ... smile

miflaw you are so honest!

<back atcha, Fairytale>

Quite understand, Mumto.

I have to say, though, that whenever I took that sort of test, I sort of knew the answer (for me) in advance and so would answer it with the aim of producing a different answer ... So counting my home measures as single units, for example, or taking a "good" night as a typical one.

Doing this meant that I would come in the mid-range (you're not drinking too much yet, but you may have problems if you continue ...) rather than the top range (stop now) where I belonged. This meant all I had to do was cut down in the near future. But not today. Never today. Today I could just get right back on it. By the end of the week, it would be a matter of, "quiz? What quiz?"

I wonder if any other contributors recognise themselves in this?

Fairytale my dp could have written that.I don't think I know anyone happier and something I have noriced about him is that he deals with difficult situations with real calm and grace in comparison to before.He is definitely of the 1 drink is too may and 10 is never enough type and so the only way he could have a full life was to leave it altogether.He says when we met and he saw me and my friends sometimes drink 3 glasses sometimes none and most shocking of all leave half a glass and go home he couldn't believe it!He always knew one would lead to ? and the guilt he felt the next day nearly destroyed him.He always thought he had been out of order or unpleasant in some way even when he hadn't. sad

Hi all, sorry - have been lurking but feel compelled to chuck my twopenn'orth in ... because I did 'controlled drinking' for years, told myself I was in charge, it was a habit I could break easily etc etc. It didn't stop me going back to drinking, and didn't stop me making the mistakes I always made when drunk.

I just couldn't see that the only time I was really happy was when not drinking at all. It stopped being my friend and comfort, and although I tried kidding myself that I drank because I liked the taste, it was a relaxant etc, the fact is that once I started I didn't want to stop. Many people on this thread have referred to 'all or nothing' attitudes to drinking - well, I was like that. And because I could do 'nothing' for extended periods, I thought that was ok. But I always went back to the 'all' in the end.

I am so happy not drinking now. Life isn't boring. I wish I could get that across. But I didn't believe it was possible, either.

<waves at MIFLAW>

I was, but adding some additional information for people who want to be informed by wider source of information other than the opinion of people who frequent Mumsnet.

Sort of - I haven't consulted the site because, as I say, such things are irrelevant to people like me - drink is bad, bad, bad for me and those around me because I seem unable to have one glass of anything, and that's not going to change - but I thought you were asking a question about it -

"apparently drink in moderation is okay ?

Or is it, there is a big drink debate going on in my region at the moment and the poster for it says is red wine good for the heart of bad for the liver - or both ??"

rather than just thinking aloud.

Ah, you mean the link to the drink debate website MIFLAW, I posted it on there because there is a questionnaire to complete about how much you drink, sorry perhaps I should have explained it better.

last night, dh and I shared a small bottle of beer. After that, there wasn't any more. I felt quite drunk after really very little, and didn't feel like drinking any more after a break. It's extraordinary how sometimes, very little is quite enough.

I guess the reason I am writing this is because so much of the time, we don't take a break between the first drink and the next one. We often don't really get to feel the effects of booze until we are actually quite drunk (self included).

I have found it helpful to sometimes feel how alcohol effects me. Sometimes I want more, and sometimes I don't. Perhaps I should bow out of this thread and come back when things are bad.

Well said miflaw wisw wise words.If you are even discussing drinking in terms of temptation reward and 'only on a sunday'I think there is only one way really.Have lived through teh AA experience with dp any people who had spent years moderating but never met one who sustained it

Yes - all or nothing here too!

Mintyy - I think that's what I want to find out... Can I drink less than i have been doing ? Can I drink in moderation or not...

MIFLAW - your advice is very good, and your experiences are very useful.

I have seen what addiction does. I know its an illness, I also know only the addict can take control of it. I am not there yet - far from it, but I am afraid that if I do not take control of it now, I COULD be there. And if I cannot take control then I have an answer..

Mumto - I think what miflaw means is that if you have alcohol dependence the one, small, glass of red wine a day which may or may not be good for your health is an unrealistic target,... I certainly find it easier to not drink anything than to stop after 125 mls!

I mean, I should not imagine that most people posting on a thread called "how do you know when you are drinking too much?" are drinking a single glass of red wine (or a half of real ale or stout, or any of the other "health-giving" uses of alcohol that appear in the press on slow news days from time to time) a day. I should imagine that they are drinking more than that, in many cases vastly more than that. Or, in my case, they used to drink vastly more than that and no longer do so because of the problems they encountered.

As such, these stories are not really applicable to them.

The stories about what alcohol does to livers, brains, minds, relationships and lives may be.

Hello all, quick lunchtime dip in

MIFLAW - what do you mean - "I should not imagine most people bothering to post on this thread see any relevance to their lives in that, so it can be safely discounted as pointless. "

Some very sobering advice here
Thanks

Noddyholder

I tried it all.

Nearly ruined my life.

Am so much happier now that I don't drink it's hard to believe that that was me.

But it was, and I make sure I don't forget it.

That's the point i've been trying to make. If you are like me then you work your way round these obstacles, conveniently forgetting that you put them there for your own good.

Only wine/beer - sure, but no one's saying how much - clever old me!

Only drink on Thursdays - yes, but don't you understand, THIS Friday/Saturday/Sunday/ Monday have been such hard work and I've got guests so that rule doesn't count - clever old me!

Drive so you can't drink - I'll take the bus then - clever old me! OR I'll count my units so that, by the time I have to drive, I'll only have two units in my system - clever old me! (This one allowed me to see the inside of a police cell and a magistrate's court - clever old me!)

"If anyone, drinking heavily at present, can do the about face and drink like a gentleman, our hats are off to him. Heaven knows, we have tried often enough!"

Miflaw haven't read the whole thread but have you ever tried 'rationing' and 'planning' your drinking before finally giving up?I mean stuff like only wine or never on a thursday?x

Mumtocharlieand lola.....

I had this last year..but no pain under ribs..I was drinking about 3/4 bottle of red wine a day for about 2years after my daughter was born.
I went to dr's for anxiety and had some blood tests and liver came back abnormal..told him what I drank so he said come back in a month then the second test was still bit raised. Frightened the crap out of me!!!
Dr didn't say stop drinking..just cut down..wasn't unduly worried....but i was!
I now never drink over 14 units a week and have a week of here and now and had month of xmas.
I have 2 kids very nice life and honestly thought oh my god...i'm gonna die!
But after all this time of cutting down..i now get an ache under my right ribs. Similar to what people describe as gallstones. Never stops me from doing anything..eat, sleep, go running..not feeling ill..tired.
However..I have been too scared too go back (it has created huge health anxiety) for 3rd test.. which Dr said wait another 2mths...that should have been last Sept!!! That Dr retired and I was embarassed and scared to go through it all again with another dr.
So I know how you feel.
How much are you drinking now? What did your doctor advise you?
CAT me if you like.

Exactly, Mintyy. That really is excellent advice.

But not everyone will be able to follow it.

I remember in my mid 20s I would sometimes wake up and say to myself, "I'm not going to drink today." That was it - one day's abstention.

And I wouldn't drink.

At about 10 o'clock, passing the student union or graduate bar, I would think to myself, "haven't I done well? A whole day without a drink!

"I think I'll have a pint to celebrate."

And I successfully kidded myself that there was no contradiction there. I hadn't failed - I had redefined what a day meant.

There will be people on this thread who work their own version of this logic. I want them to know that they are not alone.

But also that, if they keep flogging that particular horse, it gets a lot, lot worse in the most wide-ranging and unpredictable ways. The biggest favour they can do themselves is to address that now.

Good luck to anyone who recognises her- or himself in my story. I'm here for you.

I guess what I'm really trying to say to the other worried posters is you could try what I did and just be done with alcohol altogether it for a good long while. Do not drink at all. So then you have no worries with having to count how many dry days you've had or how many units you've had or if you can drink a bit more because its a special occasion.

Cut it out completely (I did 6 weeks). Don't fret - this doesn't mean you are giving up alcohol forever - and see if that gives you a new perspective?

I understand the "fear" that you might have to give up alcohol altogether one day and I never want to reach that point, which is why I decided to try and find out once and for all if I was dependent or heading towards dependence. I love the taste of wine, and I adore a glass of sherry when Christmas lunch is cooking, and a Pimms at a summer party, etc.

too right, noddy, and i can always buy gaviscon advance and Zantac.

Ooh, acid reflux, nasty!

Hi Mintyy, I just write using my own experience that's all, loads of people are heavy drinkers, cut down or stop etc...it's different to being an alcoholic. You don't contradict me at all! Good on ya, anyway.

Like your (wo)manful comment MIFLAW.

Ah expat but it won't kill you just burn like hell!

No way am I giving up spicy foods, tomato-based sauces, curries, chillies, caffeinated drinks, chocolate or citrus because of this acid reflux!

Mintyy

Fantastic! And don't worry - you haven't contradicted my advice in the slightest.

What I have said is that someone attempting to emulate you AND FAILING TO DO SO may be well advised to cut his or her losses at that point rather than struggling (wo)manfully on for months or years.

MumtoCandL - the health thing is a bit of a red herring, to be honest. It relates to moderate drinkers. A glass of red wine a day is good for you, or so I am told.

A glass.

One.

A day.

Probably a pub measure or standard unit, too, give or take.

And then stop.

I should not imagine most people bothering to post on this thread see any relevance to their lives in that, so it can be safely discounted as pointless.

If it is only about the taste and not the getting drunk then it would be easy.i realise that sounded harsh not what I meant.many people have to stop things that taste nice for various reasons.It is harder with alcohol because it changes how you feel.So if it was simply something which you liked the taste of which was harming you you would stop it fairly easily.I had to do a very restricted diet before my transplant but it was fairly easy as it was all delicious stuff but i had to do it.Alcohol is different I was acknowledging that

Can I post my experience here, even though it contradicts MIFLAW, Jem and Noddy's advice?

The last thing I want to do is enable an alcoholic to carry on drinking BUT

About 8 months ago I decided to stop drinking altogether for a good long stretch. It was a test to see how bad my drinking problem was. I was worried about myself as I drank every single night without fail. About 5 bottles of wine a week. And had done for at least 5 years.

So I stopped for six weeks. I didn't find it hard ... but I didn't find it liberating or life transforming in any way. I didn't look better, I didn't feel better and I didn't lose any weight.

After the six weeks was up I did decide to drink alcohol again. But my consumption has reduced dramatically since then. I drink less wine but sometimes have a gin and tonic or a beer instead. I can drink just the one of those, with wine I always want at least half a bottle. I don't drink Monday - Wednesday. And have other spontaneous dry days too. I remind myself that I didn't drink at all for 42 days without too much effort, so its really no problem not to drink today, or tomorrow, or the next day. I guess I could go on and on and not drink for 10 days or 30 days or 90 days or 30 years.

But now I believe I am not addicted to it alcohol is not a spectre and I am far more at ease with it. Less wound up - infact, less in need of a drink to relax me!

I think the key for me, though, was the longish period of complete abstinence.

noddyholder

If it were that easy there would be no people with alcohol problems.

What do you mean? I like the taste and I enjoy drinking wine,

I suppose there is the social side and drinking with the girls or our friends, but thats just a habit that I never really tried to break, apart from when I was pregnant.

If its not about the feeling why don't you just stop?

Oh dear how blush

for the first sentence ! Must read my sentences before I post. blush

[blush}

Of course cracking open a beer on a warm thing is probably v. nice (for the bloke) but I meant a warm evening !!

Hello all, thanks for your messages. Its not about getting pissed for me, I just really like the taste of red wine and cracking open a cold beer on a warm thing is just a social habit I have with my dh.

Its more about the health effect it is having on me. I am not sure how long it will take for my liver readings to go back to normal. The Dr said as long as they are not increasing they are not unduly concerned.

I don't know if I am at at the point where I could give up completely, or need to, apparently dink in moderation is okay ?

Or is it, there is a big drink debate going on in my region at the moment and the poster for it says is red wine good for the heart of bad for the liver - or both ?? www.nwph.net/alcohol/bigdrinkdebate/index.aspx

That's really well done to cut down to a bottle of wine a week. How long does it take for your liver tests to make a difference?

I'm sorry I didn't explain that I didn't mean that drinking got easier! I meant that when the decision to stop and do something about it clicks in, the stopped tends to last longer with practice.

miflaw and jem are both spo ton Listen to them!All this practcing and 'being good'is sadly just delaying the inevitable.If you are having such a struggle and are disecting and discussing drinking at length then surely it is worth a try to cut it out and see how you feel.My dp definitely found it harder the more he tried moderation and the repeated guilt at 'failing' was soul destroying hop eyou all get the support you need x

So what are your plans, to reduce or cut out completely? Do you need to go back to your GP to go over the results again? Must be a difficult time, especially if you have what happened with your Dad in your thoughts.

If you are struggling, as you mentioned you were, you may have some sort of dependency- I'm not saying you are an alcoholic mind!
but, I can help give advice for what helped me when I was struggling to not drink, for days when you decide to be alcohol free?
I'm sure others will too!

I do find it funny when people equate getting pissed with having a good time, but then so did I.
Difference with me was that in the end, I needed a drink just to actually talk to people. Still I suppose I am coming from the more severe end of the spectrum so to speak.

Still, I understand how difficult it can be to cut down or stop.

Hi Jem, I think so

(sorry brief post, am now off lunch and officially not supposed to be on here ) smile

mum to Charlie and Lola - welcome

Poor you - that must have been a horrible shock... I have been drinking much more than you and have normal liver function ( at the moment) but well done for cutting down.

its really interesting to me that ALL the ex drinkers on here feel happier now about their teetotal status than they did when they were drinking/trying to cut down etc.

I am intending not to drink today.

I do find it hard at the witching hour 8-9 ish - once the kids are in bed and I can relax.. once I get past about 9.30 I am ok...

one day at a time. I'm not sure where I am hoping to end up... I'm not 'that' bad - a drinker; I rarely get drunk, I dont get agressive when I drink, nor do I lose all sense, I dont drink in front of the kids, or at work, or miss work, or if I am driving, but nevertheless I feel uneasy about it, and would feel happier if I could /did drink less....

ok I failed miserably last might - knew I would, but that doesn't help. I think I just need to stop totally for a while and I will either have to avoid situations where I drink, or just be very strong - I totally understand about being in a crowd of people drinking and thinking 'I want one' and also the fact bars serve shite soft drinks (and I don't do fizzy stuff either!).
WOn't be tempted now until Sat as DP away and I am not going out, but Sat have family BBQ so we'll see!

Sorry I ignored your post Mumto...

Are your LFT results related to your alcohol consumption then?

MIFLAW- yes I was in the city, but as it was only a brief trip out, it seemed a bit daft. My youngest helped with the names, hence my name is a bit crap, although I do feel sometimes like I'm a bit lost, as in can't see the way...!

Any suggestions?

Hello all , especially Cistus, I would like to join your thread.

I went to the drs a couple of months ago with pains under my right rib, and a feeling of something stretching there all the time. I am an paranoid about my liver as my dad has had a transplant, though his was due to cancer and not cirohhsis.

I had some blood test done which showed abornmal levels in my liver (ALTs and Gammas for those in the know) and the DR told me to cut down. I drink from a Thursday with a bottle of red over two days, a new bottle on a Saturday and finish it on a Sunday. Then sometimes I drink a bottle of lager or two on a Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday (so all week really)

I've cut down to one bottle of red a week, then I had another blood test but the levels are still high (though lower than before).

Recently i am beating myself up with the thought of dying and leaving my kids behind if I don't cut down. I know its dramatic but Ive found I just don't enjoy drinking any more, I'm scared.

I really want to give up, but I am struggling. Im not an alcoholic, or at least I don't think I am.

Its hard when it sunny and there is cold lager in the fridge (I don't expect my dh to cut down, he doesn't drink much at all). Its hard when you've had a busy week and you want to relax, and mentally, you are telling yourself you need a large glass of red to do so. Its hard when you go to a friends house and they are all sitting round having a glass of wine, and you really, really want one.

I am going to a wedding this weekend and I know that on Sunday, I will look at myself in the mirror, look at my jowelly face (because I have put so much weight on) and my grey skin and undo all the happiness that I accumulated the day before. I am going to drive, so that will stop me!

So I will join you, Sorry for the essay, I just know where you are coming from

Everytime I 'cut down' I ended up drinking more. Because if I had managed to cut down, then I didn't really have a problem, did I, so I could RELAX and drink more.

Also, each period of cutting down exposed me to anxiety, feeling crap and empty. But never for long enough for me to face up to it, confront it and move on. So I needed to drink more to drown out that shouting.

I don't need to do it anymore. No more obsessing, counting, excusing, feeling guilty.

Good luck to you all, I hope you all find the level you feel comfortable with.

Jem

did you used to be in the city? Why now in the dark?

Sorry, forgot to add some sort of positive, supportive comment there!

Good luck everyone! Just try to be honest with yourselves, those of you who feel you may be developing a problem.

I found this easier said than done.

I'm a recovering alcoholic, and I can only write from my own experience, but I agrree with MIFLAW- every time I stated drinking again, it was HARDER to stop, to put the drink down, not easier.
I made up all sorts of excuses, or 'reasons' as I used to call them, to not stop drinking.

"I guess what I mean, MIFLAW is that if you have succeeded in doing something once, for however short a time, the next time you try it, it will be easier."

Once again, this is not my experience.

Because I could not face stopping drinking for ever, I regularly tried to cut down or stop for the odd day here and there. I can assure you that it got more and more difficult to even contemplate stopping.

Then I joined AA but did not take it as seriously as I might have. I stopped several times for a matter of days or weeks. Each time I picked up a drink it seemed unthinkable that I would stop again. I had to drag myself back each time because I had no better ideas. Stopping each time took several days just to build up to.

Only when I decided, one day at a time, to give it my best shot, and then kept that in mind on a daily basis, did it get in any sense "easy".

if I drank again now I cannot begin to imagine how I would stop again afterwards.

My experiences with smoking are quite similar, actually, even though that is proven to be physically addictive (unlike alcohol).

I fully agree that it may take someone a few attempts, because it did me - what I am disputing is that anyone thinking of giving up on such an attempt should give in lightly with the thought, "oh well, it'll be easier next time" because, in my case at least, the opposite proved true.

I guess what I mean, MIFLAW is that if you have succeeded in doing something once, for however short a time, the next time you try it, it will be easier. So... for example, if you have managed to stop smoking, but then fallen off the wagon, the next time you stop, your chemistry will be more accepting, and you will probably stay stopped for longer, then if you start again, then stop....

So, if you have managed to stop successfully the first time, that is very good news. For other people it may take a few attempts.

For problem drinkers, it is really important to sort something out, as dependency is a very real, though not inevitable outcome.

Plonk

"All the same, we get better at giving things up with practice."

I'd just like to distance myself, very explicitly, from that "we". I NEVER got better at giving drink up. Indeed, as time went on, I got very much worse. The only solution for me was to stop altogether and then give my all to staying stopped. "Practising" was killing me - I had to do it for real.

Hi all

Haven't had a drink since Sunday. I was so tempted last night, coming home at the end of the day, sun shining and I was thinking it would be lovely to sit outside in the garden with a glass of wine .......

I didn't though. Instead had some slimline tonic with lots of ice.

End of the day/work is easily the hardest time of day for me. Once I've got through that usually it's fine.

DH not drinking either, which also helps.

Respect for you Plonkety - I find it impossible very difficult not drink when I'm out!

I was out last night, socialising and meeting new people. It felt completely normal not to drink, but hell, it's quite boring at the bar! Hey, what's going to tingle my taste buds and do nothing at all apart from make me want to go to the loo? Bars and pubs are pretty crap on the soft drink front.

I drank a bottle of beer when I got home which was nice. I would like to say I'm learning, but probably not for long! All the same, we get better at giving things up with practice.

HAd 2 glasses last night,
but was glad to have left half a bottle in the fridge - that is an achievement for me!

off to bed now. I am very pleased that I have not drunk today

how is everyone else doing ?

cistus x

Maybe thats another tip then Cistus, if you drive often you CANNOT drink.

NO blackduck, doesn't sound awful I know just how you feel. I am in the pub tonight, briefly, and am drinking lime and soda. This however is partly because I am driving!

I had a couple of glasses on Sunday with a friend, nothing last night, but tonight will be a test - off for tea with a mate and we usually sink a bottle, just not sure how to say 'no' at the minute (does that sound pathetic?) I also understand the 'disappear' thing. I definately drank to feel more at ease in my own body in the past, but do think now that I really ought to just grow up! I drink when I feel under social stress and thats not good....

Aw thanks MIFLAW! Well done, Cistus. Sometimes it feels as though having children drives you to drink! There's often little time to think about anything else, and it's an escape from the tedium.

At the moment, I am finding solace in books. I can't read when I'm pissed, so it's quite a good deterrent. I also can't drink when I have work to do. Some people seem to thrive on some sort of chemical in order to do anything creative. I find the opposite.

None-the-less, I am still a problem drinker. I would like to find a way so that I can't abdicate responsibility. It is a sense of self. I drink to disappear. In the greater scheme of things, I am getting better at not trying to disappear, but I still do it.

Hi, no alcohol last night. Feel psychologically better already, and decided not to drink today...

Beonit - my H was teetotal for years, and I agree I think he tolerated my drinking in a way that others might not. Although I have always been a drinker I have never really been concerned about it before. subtly I think I have tipped into a different space in the last 6 months.

Fraggletits - do you have small children ? I can understand the need to drink to face bath/bed etc... But I have reallyd ecided that I should not drink in front of my kids ( they are prob older than yours) so I wait until they are in bed usually ( not at weekends) because I don't want them t think its normal to drink every night

Cistus

A lot of us drank for those reasons. Some of us stopped drinking and got out of damaging dead-end relationships as a result. Probably far more of us realised that, when we weren't half-cut, our relationships weren't half as bad as we'd thought, and we managed to salvage something from what had previously looked like a train wreck. So basically we're talking win-win here.

Plonkety plonk's advice is good but does NOT apply to everyone (any more than mine does.) I would heartily encourage anyone struggling with drinking to try absolute abstention - ie no drinking no matter what - for a length of time that they know will be slightly testing for them. Then to go the same length of time drinking moderately. Then to abstain for the same length of time again. If you have any problems doing something like this, then maybe take the hint.

This might turn out to be excessive for many people - but you really don't want to be wrong in the other direction IYSWIM.

Feel free to ignore me, though - I'm no doctor. Just an ex-drunk.

Cistus. Sorry you are sounding low. I empathise with what you're saying - I also feel unsure about my relationship, though I hope it is salvageable. We're trying to sort out some problems at the moment.

Interested to know whether you think you got into the relationship in the first place for any reason related to drinking. In my case I think my confidence was low and I had a history of short and unsuccessful relationships, in part due to regularly drinking too much and messing things up. My DH has many great qualities but I sometimes wonder if I clung to him after we got together because I felt unsure of myself and he seemed willing to put up with my boozing.

I think he would be horrified if he knew about these thoughts and I'll probably never tell him... so drinking somehow helps me to deal with (or rather avoid dealing with) them.

Anyway, I had about half a bottle each night for the past 3 days, which doesn't sound too great, but is pretty good for me. Aiming to stay off during the week generally, though I have various family dos coming up this week which may make this tricky.Hope others are feeling a bit more positive.

sound advice, Noddy, thanks.

Btw my dp stopped drinking 18 yrs ago with the help of AA after 10 years of 'cutting down'.For some people stopping is the only way it certainly was for him and we still have a great life and a lot of fun

Agree 100% with miflaw.If you are asking the question and talking about moderating you need to look at it.Most people moderate naturally and don't need to discuss it.When it is in charge and you are powerless when it is in you you need to think hard.Good luck if you can cut down do but if the urge for 'just one more' kicks in and it is a real struggle to fight it you probably will find that eventually abstaining is the only way.

I drank half abottle of white on Fri
and last night a whole bottle of red - but that as over the course of 6 hrs with friends so I wont beat myself up about it.
Wil not have anyting tonight and really want to last until Thurs now.
Good luck everyone

I know what you mean - I really am not a one glass and thats it person... I have found drinking beer is better (simply cannot do the volume and so drink less - but also up all night peeing....) For me it is also a social thing - I use it for dutch courage and talk a load of shite as a result. It has just become too much of a habit. This week should be better because dp is away and I don't drink on my own, so if I can get a good week in hopefully I can follow it through.

I'd like to join in this thread too - I drink too much and I can't remember who described it as the 'witching hour' the time between ending work and dinner but that's my problem time- I probably only really drink for a couple of hours a day but it's too much and I look forward to it. What I have to admit also is that i can't drink the way normal social drinkers can. Once I've had a glass of wine at a party I just have to keep going - one of the reasons that I'm great for not drinking at lunchtime (at weekends or whenever) is because I'd be pissed by tea time. Can't really handle it.

I'm having a bad weekend, but did have 3 alcohol free days last week, which is a first in a long while so a step in the right direction.

I am not too bad this wekend, I had 2 glasses of red on Friday and one last night (that I didn't really want) There is always a reason if t=you need one though tired/stressed/sociable/happy. Stupid me drinking when i don't even feel like it. At least I stopped at one last night. the rest of the bottle is still there in the kitchen and I am intending not to driink that tonight.

Okay, can I join? I am having too many weekends when I wake up feeling cr** and have to grit my teeth to get throught the day. Dp and I drank too much on Friday adn again last night. I need (and want) to stop this for a bit (if not totally). So where do I sign the pledge grin

I'm really glad i joined this thread. Your words are very wise Miflaw and Plonk.

Cistus - we're in the same boat. Drinking to forget the realities.

my skin looks terrible and I'm fat (well, i've got a stone and a half to lose) and I freaked myself out reading up on liver disease the other day.

I'm getting psyched up for a long period of going alcohol free - it's just I have to get next weekend out of the way (friends coming to stay) and then I'm going on holiday for a month with my heavy drinking family.....and then DH and me are having a week off from the kids where we've got a few dinners planned and going to a concert with pals.....christ it's just endless! I'm surrounded by boozers.

I guess there's never a 'right' time to stop drinking though.

Sounds like a bit of a habit, Cistus. Why are you thinking you have to be sober all the time? I think that unless your relationship with alcohol is sooo dysfunctional and destructive, that you can always meet up for a bit of a piss up. Yes, it'll feel crap the next day, but sometimes it's a way.

I'm going to get hammered for saying that, aren't I? I think it is very important to try to take responsibility. A relationship with alcohol isn't going to sort out anything in RL. It could lead to dependency, which is going to be far worse than anything.

YOu don't need to face everything, all at once. Are you getting any extra support for yourself?

D'you know what. I think I am afraid of sobriety. I am afraid of all the things I don't have to face at the moment because I am half pissed every night.

I have an ok marriage But that's all. I don't really love my partner any more; I don't really respect him and at times I actively dislike him. But we have 3 kids, and I feel I must make the best of it for them...

I'm not stupid enough to say I drink because of that; but i certainly think I drink to forget it.

I'm afraid if I was relentlessly sober I would have to face it and trash everything. And even as I write that I know its pelt

That's true, MIFLAW - there's always a reason to drink!

.... things went well today, let's celebrate
.... things went badly today, let's commiserate
.... I'm a bit stressed, I need to wind down
.... I'm feeling really good, I'd love a glass of wine

Fraggletits - "I just can't." Yes, you can. No one needs alcohol - do you think Muslims never have parties? You mean, perhaps, "I just won't" or "I just don't want to." Absolutely nothing wrong with that, but don't mix them up - that way heartache lies.

Cistus - there is an expression which goes something like, "I drank when I was happy; I drank when I was sad; I drank when my cat died.

"And I didn't even have a cat."

I thnk this thread is the one to stick with.
Cistus, and anyone else, I know loads of people who don't drink, are extremely sociable, and have a great tme and are very funny. Just to echo what Miflaw said, it is not necessary for a good time. You just see thngs as they are a bit more clearly without drnk and that can sometimes be dispiriting. It takes a while to build something to take the place of the drink.

Hi all

Agree that joining the threads would be a good idea.. I didnt see that one when I started mine....

Ive had a crap week. Having not drunk for a week, Sat night I did - for no other reason than that I could. Like someone (fraggletits?) said - once Ive started there is no reason to abstain the next night... so Sun and Mon drinking too... then Tues get some bad news - not directly realted to me, but very sad. and am out that night... so manage several glasses and top up at home. Weds and Thurs night was away from home - drinking is a reflex. I hate being away, find it so hard to relax, cant sleep etc etc...this was unavoidable however, so I drink a bottle to help me relax. now tonight Im home. and drinking.again. Not a bottle . but well over 1/2

so so much of what you have written, all of you resonates with me. I'm too tired to think, but tomorrow its just me and dc3 at home, as my dh is taking dc 1&2 camping. I will try to think a bit - ts utterly ridiculous to be drinking when it clearly makes me anxious and unhappy BUT it also helps me, and I like it so much... in one way.....

<<waves at plonk>> nice to see you dear

hey
3 parts ot the wind currently but connect to what you are saying (and not typing at 35wpm!) Honest gov, haven;t been drinking....

There seem to be a couple of threads that are in the same vein but need joining up. And if I was compus mentis, I could tell you....however....maybe someone can join all the threasds up, twood be great, need some support, the wreck that I am.............

like i said before - i have abstained from alcohol before for a few weeks at a time and after the first 2 or 3 days I start absolutely loving it. I get almost euphoric. I'm quite happy living alcohol free as long as I remain a hermit. But then a social situation arises - not parties necessarily but a friend will come round or arrange to meet - or we'll have friends stay over, even the odd play-date with some mums round here who 'nudge nudge, cheeky wink.....glass of wine???' and that's it, there's just no way at the moment I can sit there with a coke while everyone else "enjoys" a drink. I just can't.

In moments of clarity I have realised that I would need to cut myself off from people for a long time before I could be comfortable in a social setting like that not drinking. And that's something I can't do yet.

I know what you mean about thinking that everyone else is having a great time. They're not. They're just getting a bit pissed. Do you envy people who are getting stoned at a party?

If you are enjoying drinking, it's fine. It's a bit what I mean about booze being like a really crap friend who's great in small doses.

Fraggletits

I recognise so much of what you're saying but the only bit that's actually a reason why stopping drinking is a negative thing(rather than reasons why you don't really need to stop) is that "I can't imagine always having a soft drink while everyone else has a great time........"

I couldn't imagine that either. Now I don't have to imagine it and it's great.

Of course some parties are boring without a drink. That's because the people at them are boring. Why would i want to be at a party with boring people?

wine is mummy's little helper for me! and like rhubarb says - wine is my only vice. I don't smoke or do drugs and eat fairly healthy dinners most nights.

My pattern is first glass at 4pm - last around 7pm - to get me through dinner, bath and bed routine. DH doesn't drink during the week so I don't normally drink alone in front of him. I can however disguise being quite drunk...scarily easily.

I will always drink. It is a huge part of my life. I share bottles of wine with my husband, my mum, all my friends. I'm looking forward to sharing bottles with my daughters when they are grown up.

I can't imagine always having a soft drink while everyone else has a great time........ and people who drink really do have a great time, but the ones, like me, who lose control of it end up having a horrible time.

I just need to get control back in my life because I don't want to be a tee-totaller. My drinking has been a bit problematic since being a SAHM to small children. It fills a void. But I know it will get better.

My plan for my future is to only ever drink socially and never again at home for no reason.

I think that drinking can be fun! I think alcohol is a bit like a friend who you don't want to see all the time, who if you get stuck with, is not a friend at all, but someone you can have fun with from time to time. Leaving it out altogether is a bit like leaving a very destructive relationship, when you find yourself in bed with someone who really doesn't like you and is doing horrible things to you.

I think that a lot of parties are quite boring when you're not drinking, because unless you are surrounded by close friends (of the human kind), there's often not much to talk about. (or am I just a grumpy old woman? grin

I am really missing smoking at the moment. How crap is that?

Hi still here. at work so cant post much .CRAP week. will update later
x

I know MIFLAW, but I just had to have my say anyway! wink

MIFLAW - it is hard for me to rationalise whay I can't face the idea of giving up completely. I guess it's because on the days I do manage moderation I love the way a few glasses of wine make me feel. I associate it with relaxation, sociability, the end of a hard day etc etc.

I think I would find socialising without booze particularly hard (I have done it, when pregnant, but tended to end up going home early for obvious reasons). I used alcohol to give me more social confidence from early on - started drinking quite a lot in my teens, throughout university, and never really stopped. Now it's a crutch that I don't want to be taken away.

Lordy, I sound like a right old soak.

Thanks for that, rhubarb - though it was more addressed to the people who DO ""dread" or "hate" or "can't face" the idea of not drinking and say so in their posts.

That's a bottle each, not between us.

I don't dread not having a drink. Over Easter dh and I gave up completely for 20 days - our new record having previously managed 17!

For me personally, I don't smoke, I don't have any other vices, no sweet tooth, nothing. It's a relaxant. People have suggested exercise instead, but I don't enjoy exercise.

I like the social aspect of drinking. The way the conversation flows easier. Or just to unwind with dh, watch a DVD and then talk crap to each other.

I seldom drink during the week, so I look forward to it at the weekend when I might have a bottle of wine. I wouldn't die if it was taken away, but neither would I be particularly happy. Because it's my only relaxant.

I am going to ask a question which I know is naive but it is still a serious one.

People who "dread" or "hate" or "can't face" the idea of not drinking - why, exactly? Especially if drink makes you unhappy?

I know this is naive because i used to drink shedloads and the idea of going even a day without a drink horrified me - but now I don't drink at all and really can't remember why I used to feel this way. (I mean, I know WHY I felt it - it was because I had a drink problem. But I don't remember how I rationalised it, what I feared would happen if I went without, or why a sober life sounded such a dreadful thing.)

Can anyone remind me, please?

Just been reading this thread with interest. I don't drink (anymore) but my ex h has a drink problem and I was probably on the cusp of full blown addiction a few years ago.

I used to drink heavily when I first met him and it was definitely a massive part of our relationship. I stopped when I became pregnant with ds, started again after he was born then stopped again when pregnant with dd. After she was born over 2 years ago I never really began again. The reason I am telling you all this is that it REALLY does get easier the longer you go without a drink. You actually start to become "addicted" to feeling good and not hungover all the time. These days I often fancy a drink then I think about how crap I will feel the next day, how rough and bloated I will feel for days after that and it really just doesn't seem worth it.

If you can just go for a few days, then a few weeks then a few months, I really believe you could get to this stage of appreciating how great you feel sober and want to maintain it.

I was and am surrounded by drinkers, my exh, my family do and always have drunk heavily and so do my in laws so its not like I don't have that influence, yet still I don't drink. It really is possible to do. Good luck to you all.

Hi guys!
I am just taking one day at a time.
I know I will drink over the weekend but hoping it will be less than usual.
I keep thinking of how good I feel on the days after I have had nothing to spur me on.
I do a bit of fitness and It makes such a difference when I have had nothing the night before

Have also been reading with interest......sitting here hungover. I drank 2 bottles of wine last night. One before DH got in that he didn't know about - and then opened one in front of him and drank that - which seemed acceptable to him.

Haven't drunk that much in a while - with me it's either 1 bottle of wine a night or nothing at all.

It's true about having voids in your life and filling them with booze. My parents are also heavy drinkers.

I have gone alcohol free a few times and absolutely LOVED it. You almost get on a high with the clarity you get and from feeling healthy and full of energy - so I'm going to start another alcohol free period as of today.

My biggest let down is social drinking. I can go alcohol free very easily on my own at home. I have lovely baths, nice dinners, go to bed at a reasonable hour and get a good sleep - but as soon as I see friends, I drink til I'm drunk and then the seed is sown and I fall back into bad habits.

Have been reading this with interest and have now taken a deep breath and decided to join you. I had a bottle-of-wine-a-day (at least) habit for several years and only managed to get it under control when I got pregnant (I stopped for the first few months and then limited myself to 2 or 3 glasses a week). Recently however(DD is now 1) my consumption has been creeping up again and I've decided I need to have another go at sorting it out.

I hate the idea of stopping altogether (and yes, I know that probably means I need to), so DH and I have agreed not to drink Mon-Thurs. I haven't succeeded every day, but I have managed quite a few dry days. Feeling crap today though as I went to a friend's party last night and made the most of a rare night out. Hope this will motivate me to moderation over the weekend...

Cistus

Still around? How's it going?

Unfortunately I am waking up with a bad head even when I haven't been drinking as my head is currently vacationing in migraine land. It will be nice to feel the benefits of not drinking when the headaches clear off though.

I suppose at least i can rule out the red wine for causing the migraine smile

I had a drink (or 2!) last night, which was OK. But this morning I can really tell that I did - just goes to show how quickly you get used to not drinking.

just had the one when I finally sat down at 10pm.
Which for me aint half bad.
We are spendint the weekend with friends who are very light drinkers.
Wont drink much as will feel embarrassed in comparison. blush

Can you busy yourself for a bit Mrs M? And maybe have one later (if you absolutely have to). If yoyu work through the ironing pile/crossword book/tax return/whatever for a couple of hours and then allow yourself a beer later you will be able to clock the amount of beers you haven't drank simply because you started later.

I also didn't drink last night, I am intending not to drink tonight either. Tomorrow I will have some wine, as it is Friday night and dh is off work. Then I will be dry till next weekend if I can manage it.

DH went and bought beer - which is now chilling in the fridge.
Not sure I can resist

Ah, you see, it's the going out that worries me more!

I don't seem to be able to go out without drinking. 'Out' = 'having a good time' = 'having a drink'.

I'd really like to crack that one. I went out last week for dinner. There 8 of us and 3 stated right at the beginning that they weren't drinking (for various reasons). That would have been a great opportunity for me to declare myself also as an abstainer. But did I? No.

one day at a time, I think. I had nothing last night, and will probably be ok tonight. But am out with some friends tomorrow and will have a drink. That doesn't concern me, it's the being at home and finishing a bottle of wine before I know it that's worrying.

Didn't drink last night either.

<polishes halo>

And it does seem to be getting easier. Will I regret saying that?! blush

Didnt drink last night but that was prob because felt hungover.
Will prob manage to get through tonight withouta drink as the kids have loads of activities.
ANd then tomorrow...well it is Friday..
will limit myself.

Ah. You've been taking lessons from the BIWI house ........

definitely
but when we are bad we are very baad together.
We can go a good couple of days with no booze and then we both have a 'oh well' night where we drink a bottle each.

It's a lot easier when you're both alcohol free, isn't it?!

DH has started drinking soda water and lime in the evenings, so am going to do the same.
Good luck everyone.

I'm doing fine, Cistus, thank you!

Didn't have anything to drink last night, and it's definitely getting easier. I'm hoping that I can replace the habit of drinking during the week with the habit of not drinking during the week.

I'm drinking slimline tonic, which is helping - it has that bitterness which I find more satisfying than if I was just drinking a soft drink.

But I had a horrible experience this morning when I woke up - I think I must have been partly dreaming - because I felt hungover! It took me a while to remember that I hadn't had anything to drink last night! It didn't last for long, but it was a lovely feeling when I realised that I wasn't hungover and that I had been alcohol-free last night.

There are a lot if red herrings around drinking, aren't there? Mainly because, unlike cocaine, for example, it's legal and even encouraged in polite society.

Very important to note, for example, that, though regular or heavy drinking (whoever defines what heavy means) do not in themselves define a "drink problem", nor does their absence in itself define a lack of a drinking problem.

It's much more about how good you are at stopping when you do drink and how effective the potential consequences are at stopping you.

For example, a lot of educated middle class alcoholics only find out for sure that they are alcoholics when they leave university - when they were there, it seemed that everyone drank to excess but, now that real life starts to encroach, they become rarer and rarer among their peers in not knuckling down and saving their drinking for exceptional or special occasions.

i am a student so am in the middle of my long holiday atthe moment. in term time i don't drink so much as I am often studying well into the evening. i always have Friday wine (and look forward to it), maybe drinking a bottle over 2/3 nights. WE have been going out more lately and i have been really good at limiting myself, maybe 2 bottles of lager (I drink them slower) and a glass of wine with a couple of soft drinks over the course of the night. However, now uni is out, my evenings are less taken up, I am really not enjoying this SAHm role, shopping , cleaning, ironing, blah. I think I am maybe drinking more because I am bored and I am usually so busy and knackered doing all of the above and a demanding degree that I fall into bed at 10 o'clock.

My dh drinks too, and thank god, he works nights so is only home 2 nights to have a drink. if there is lager in the fridge he might have one with dinner or when he gets in from work, but on his nights off he will drink whatever is there. I have always worried about him , not with the quantity of alcohol but the fact that he never chooses not to.

i can feel this creeping in with me now. I totally understand what other posters have said about partners encouraging each others addictions. lately i think I have been drinking more because it has always been available. Normally, we buy what we want, drink it, and then its gone. A few weeks ago, wehad a big party and there was loads of wine left over, so we have been working our way through it.

Now the wine is nearly finished, I am just not going to buy any when i go shopping. I will buy maybe 4 cans for DH for Friday night, and then I won't be able to drink when he is at work as i won't just be able to open that conveniently placed bottle.

I am really glad to have stumbled upon this thread. i am such a healthy person in general, I don't have any other vices and I hate to see the alchol creeping into my life. My grandma was an alcoholic and died in her early 50s. My dsis also has problems with alcohol and I worry that the tendency to excess may run in the family.

Like Mrs McCluskey, I am glad to know I'm not alone too!

This thread caught my eye as I am here feeling a little hungover and annoyed with mysself for drinking almost a whole bottle of white last night.
I promised my self i would only have 2 glasses but as always an open bottle is an empty bottle.
Really need to cut down.
I love feeling great on the mornings after I havent had a drink - try not to Mon to Thurs but go mad at weekends.
Started to realise I had a prob when a friend said ' You do make me laugh your facebook status always involves wine' blush

Glad to know I am not alone.

I will hold my hands up and say I hada terrible problem with alchohol a few years ago. Heavy and regular drinking was a habit, and as someone further up said, it starts as a habit, like biscuits with tea, but then it has the potential to take over your life, unlike biscuits smile

. I have said at other times my best friend, a beautiful man, managed t odrink himself to death - through not controlling the habit. We all cut down or stopped, but he didn't.

We have an emotional attachment to substances we use like alchohol, and it is soo important to ask yourself what is it that this substance is replacing, or what void are we feeling that leads us to 'compensate' for it.

I find that I can go without a drink - but once I've had one, find it hard to stop. So if I open a bottle of wine, I drink it til it's gone. I think I do have a problem, so welcome the opportunity to be able to discuss this with people on this thread, I think I'd find it hard to discuss in RL. Thanks.

Fully agree with plonketyplonk - "It IS possible to cut down" - with the caveat that I would say the difference is not between alcoholic and problem drinker, but between alcoholic and heavy or regular drinker. The definition of a problem drinker for most people who choose to use the term is pretty much that it is NOT possible for you to cut down and stay cut down. A heavy or regular drinker, meanwhile, is someone who drinks a lot (or very frequently) and could, in theory, stop or cut down if they wanted to.

In other words, the rest of her advice is fantastic - as long as you get that initial self-diagnosis right and make sure you do have that choice. That is probably why a lot of people on threads such as these (and in RL) periodically stop or cut down for long-ish periods of time - they want to satisfy themselves that they do indeed have that control.

I'm probably splitting hairs in terms of semantics here but the core underlying distinction is very important - if you have a problem with drink you need to know about it and act on it, however unpleasant such action at first appears.

It IS possible to cut down and there is a difference between being an alcoholic and being a problem drinker. I am a problem drinker, and have found I have triggers. I really hope I can defuse them since not all situations are avoidable! It's nice to have a glass or 2 of wine and feel the buzz. It's nice to be able to say no, and sometimes it's ok to get pissed. Finding a balance is the hard bit!

Cistus, thanks for starting this thread. I feel I have been drinking far too much and for far too long. Can I join you in trying to get it under control? I've not had a drink today but dread to think how many units I've had over this week. I've not had a drink tonight tho. I don't want to stop completely, but am beginning to realise that if I can't get it under control, I might have to stop completely. Was going to namechange, but decided that would be hiding, not that anyone knows me on here apart from one person who I know would be supportive.

Cistus, the hangover and anxiousness the next day, the arguements I would have with my dp, the fact that my skin was dehydrated and I was aging rapidly since I had began drinking heavily.
I feel younger and more in control and definetly less stressed and anxious, its like a weight has been lifted.

Hi all,

so I drank Sat, and Sun ( a bit) and last night - at a long planned social with friends.
I will not drink today. Feel a bit better about my ability to NOT drink when I choose. Somehow I think there is someway to go yet...

what made you decide to stop lilacclaire ? how are you BIWI??

Hi, just found this thread and am pretty much in the same boat as the op.
I decided about 3 weeks ago to quit drinking and about 2 weeks ago noticed my skin etc was looking much better and I was a lot less stressed and anxious about things in general.
I wouldn't class myself as an alcoholic, but certainly was drinking far too much and it was increasing in the number of nights during the week as well as at the weekend.
I drank/drink vodka and if I wasn't working the next day I would have a drink.
Im going to a concert on wednesday night and planning on not drinking, i've never ever been out before without getting absolutely blotto, so will be interesting!!

Most people who feel they are drinking too much and can't help it (as opposed to, say, students, who often drink too much because they have no compelling reason not to) find cutting down far harder and more unpleasant than stopping altogether.

Sad but true.

I agree with everyone
But, had two drinks last night at a big party, and feel dreadful this morning.
Really don't want to feel like this, so will be cutting back to one glass a week which is what I've managed for last month.
I beginning to realise that alcohol actually disagrees with me. And the few good feelings I get from it, are completely outweighed by drawbacks, feeling woozy, badtempered, waiting for next drink etc.

I was worried that I was drinking too much. I knew full well I was. I would have 2 or more glasses of white wine while cooking/chatting to DH, then we would have a bottle of red with dinner, he might then have a whiskey and I would open some more red and have another glass or 2.

In January I decided that this was all ridiculous. We both wanted to cut down drastically. So now I have white wine with soda. Long glass - about half a glass of wine, top up with lots of soda and a few icecubes. This weekend I opened a bottle of white on Friday night and had 2 drinks, last night I had 3 drinks. The bottle is still half full.

I enjoyed the whole social aspect of cooking and chatting to DH and didn't want to lose that. I figured if I couldn't cut down like this then I def had a HUGE problem. I still enjoy the social aspect, LOVE waking up fresh and not seedy but am in control.

Hi Cistus

OK here - I'm not trying to give up at the weekends quite yet, although a bit more noderation is pobably required blush

I'm pleased with what I'm managing so far, i.e. a minimum of 3 nights during the week without drinking. Will be aiming to make that 4 next week, as I don't have any social engagements/arrangements for Thursday.

And you have done very well - only the one night! Look at your achievement positively rather than the negative.

Here's to next week!

ok, did not drink last night.

but I have tonight, firstly with work colleagues to celebrate a good day and then with friends at home.

Have drunk a lot of water also

feel moderately drunk.

and a bit sad

but ok. i have not completely overdone it, and will be off to bed now

bit sad I did not abstain...

cistus xx

BIWI - and everyone - how's you ????

Cistus, I felt really tired flat and sort of bored when I first gave up - you do just feel nostalgia for that mood enhancing buzz that alcohol gives. Even the sound of the bottle opening, the clink of glass, the smell of wine, is all part of the nostalgia.

But alcohol is a bit of a cul de sac, it's as if you have to reinvent yourself without it. It's not even that I feel brilliantly better without it, it's more that is just not necessary. My happiness or sadness is not dependent on it since I abstained. I'm having to find other ways to truly relax, and perk myself up.

not drinking tonight but feel completely flat, exhausted and fed up.

not really tempted to drink, would almost say I don't WANT to drink, but thinking about the decision quite a lot.

think I might take a book and go to bed!

Cistus

Good going!

One day at a time means exactly that.

Worry about tonight tonight and the weekend at the weekend.

Sounds like a con, perhaps, but it really works and makes all the difference.

Interesting swan - I think you're right - but also, after the one glass, your judgement also starts to be impaired, and therefore it becomes easier to justify the next glass, and then the next one ...

So it's not just the addictive nature of the alcohol, which makes it doubly difficult!

All those in doubt about the effects of alcohol, just try keeping it to one glass a night.
When you realise it is very difficult to keep it to one glass, that is when you see how addictive a substance alcohol is. It requires considerable willpower to stick at one glass, much less to have none at all.
That is my experience.

If you have the willpower, that is great, enjoy your one glass, but if you find the inexorable pull towards several, you know you have a problem.

There is an abstaining thread which I will bring up again. (can't do links)

Hi Cistus

I knew I was drinking too much when I could not cut down. Social drinking wasn't a problem for me. I hardly drank anything when I went out. No one would have known. It's just that I would then go home and top myself up to the usual amount. Always. Every evening.

I remember going on holiday with friends and being constantly preoccupied with how much alcohol was left in the fridge. Would there be enough for tonight? What if someone had an extra bottle. Perhaps I had better buy some more just in case.

I stopped as an experiment. Three months I told myself, then I could drink as much as I liked. Luckily by that time I could not see the point in drinking again, why pay money to feel seasick, what a rip off.

I went out, and managed to stick to a few drinks, didn't want another. Was I 'cured'?

No. I don't see myself as an alcoholic. I don't even see myself as having a problem with alcohol. Alcohol is the problem, not me. It's not that I have an addictive personality, it's that alcohol is addictive. It's a con. I can feel great for free. I can certainly feel like shit for free.

Sorry this has turned out to be an essay, and I am aware it might seem a bit full on when all you have decided is that you are drinking a bit too much at the moment. I'm not saying you must never drink again. I'm not saying that I will never drink again.

But, honestly, most mornings one of my first thoughts is that I am glad that I don't have to drink any more. I actively enjoy being teatotal these days.

See how today goes. Then tommorow.

Good luck

I think one of the best things about not drinking is how well I sleep - and I feel that it's been real quality sleep.

Well done for going the whole week! We can so do this ... !

hi BIWI

I did not drink last night. feel pretty tired today despite sleeping well.

am not sure about tonight or the weekend... have not drunk since ast Sunday and feel pleased about that; but not sure if I want to have aglass of wine tonight.

ballet sounds nice !

cistus x

How are you doing, Cistus?

I didn't drink anything Mon-Weds, and last night DH and I shared a bottle of wine, as opposed to one each.

I'm out at the ballet tonight, so it makes it much harder anyway to have a drink (and at Royal Opera House prices, cuts down the inclination as well!).

Just have Saturday and Sunday to contend with, which are harder.

That might well be the right decision, Cistus. smile

Well done for yesterday.

Incidentally, "Physically I feel no different" - don't be surprised if you actually feel quite shit for a couple of days. It's not fun but it is normal (depending on how much you drink and how long it's been going on) and it will pass. If you're worried, don't drink, and call a doctor or NHS direct, but I'd be surprised if it came to that. Don't doubt your decision or you'll just put yourself back to square one.

Remember, it's always just for today.

I did not drink yesterday.

Physically I feel no different , but mentally i feel stronger, more confident, proud and pleased.

I have decided not to drink today

TBH, when I was initially confronted (by a car crash that was entirely my fault) with the fact that my drinking was causing me problems, the last thing I thought was that life would be better if I stopped. I can remember thinking, if this is how dreadful my life is WITH drink, what's it going to be like WITHOUT?

At every AA meeting you will be told that "the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking." I did not even have that. I did, however, have a desire to stop drinking the way I drank. I was, to use another AA cliche, sick and tired of feeling sick and tired. I tried AA because i did not have any better ideas. 7 years on, I still don't have any better ideas.

I can now confirm, though, that my life without drink is incomparably better than my life with drink.

Actually, I don't think it's scary. I'm just pleased to be doing something, to feel that I'm in control a bit more.

I'll hold your hand, Cistus! Perhaps we could be mutual support.

MIFLAW, so, somewhere you knew it would be 'better' if you stopped. Sorry if I am asking too many questions, I am really trying to get my head around this. I cant look beyond today, or even know if I could / want to stop drinking... I know I want to feel in control of it - and it may be that the only way that can happen is if I don't drink at all.

I do not want my children t suffer because of my drinking - they had enough with my husbands drug habit.

At the moment its an experiment. a trial. and we will see.

quite sacry tho'

Cistus

Haven't had a drink for over 6 years but, like you, it was a day at a time. For a year before that I was attending AA but trying - and failing - to moderate my drinking.

I have still not in any way made a pledge that I will never drink again, though. Each day, I decide that today I don't want to drink and, after each successful day (as I say, every day for over 6 yrs now) I try to feel gratitude for another sober (and therefore worthwhile) day.

I wasn't like your husband initially, either. And then, without even realising it, I was. It's harder to spot with drink, too - it's legal and so socially acceptable, sometimes even expected, that you can multi-task and it's only the really bad times when you realise quite how much it's interfering with your life.

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