ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
Britain NOT a “Christian county” – since when??(203 Posts)
Generally speaking, when taking a snapshot of any country there are several nation traits most people just know about us that is made up of from a rich history and traditions, and Britain is no exception.
We have a monarchy, we speak English, our currency is the English Pound Sterling (lol), we still eat fish and chips out of a newspaper - and if you asked what our religion is, whether they knew about Henry VIII’s spat with the Pope or not, without the need to be specific they’d say we were ‘Christian’ – ask anyone.
Well not everyone, and certainly not the 55 ‘public figures’ that have accused Cameron for daring to point out the bleedin’ obvious, after nearly 1,000 years of international and domestic wars/conflicts, fought in the name of a ‘Christian’ religion – who accuse him of “mischaracterising” Britain, “fostering alienation” and argue that members of an elected government have no right to “actively prioritise” religion or any particular faith. Wh-at????
They argued that, apart from a “narrow constitutional sense”, there is no evidence to justify describing Britain as Christian, mainly because the 2011 Census saw a dramatic fall in those tick boxing ‘Christian’, wh-at???
Forgetting God for a moment, after several years now most citizens still won’t acknowledge that we have a honking great budget deficit and national debt - and that there has been the greatest recession since the 1930’s, yet there is far more historical and current evidence out there that it all exists - so don’t use dumb statistics of a Census that included those ticking ‘Jedi’ as a religion, to diss 1,000 years of our history.
Now I have no cares for looking into (and then trying to label) their political motives, but it seems rather ‘Leftie’ to me – and far too similar to this little bit of ‘social engineering’, designed to QUOTE “rub the Right’s nose in diversity”, by the last government.
“Labour wanted mass immigration to make UK more multicultural, says former adviser”
“Labour threw open Britain's borders to mass immigration to help socially engineer a "truly multicultural" country, a former Government adviser has revealed.”
So is this YET MORE ‘nose rubbing’ by Lefties into Righties in the name of ‘diversity’, as Cameron was not ‘doing down’ the other religions, who themselves would resist any notion that their OWN countries were secular, so rightly acknowledge that the UK is a ‘Christian’ country.
“David Cameron Christianity claim backed by religious groups”
Religious groups have backed Prime Minister David Cameron's assertion Britain is "a Christian country".
Hindu Council UK said it was "very comfortable" with the description. The Muslim Council of Britain said the UK was a largely Christian country.
So based on our proud history as an ethnic religiously TOLERENT nation and the role that ‘The Protestant Work Ethic’ had on our prosperity, who is to TELL OUR GOVERNMENT that we are NOT a ‘Christian’ country, or indeed that Christianity still has a role in today’s society - to help solve some of the work ethic problems that have grown within our society, now all the money has gone?
“Niall Ferguson - Killer 'apps': the ideas that propelled the west to world domination (see list at bottom of this link)”
6. Work ethic: As Max Weber noted a century ago, Protestantism was a form of Christianity that encouraged hard work (and just as importantly, Ferguson adds, reading and saving). It isn't a coincidence, he says, that the decline of religion in Europe has led to Europeans becoming the "idlers of the world" (while the more religious US has remained hard-working). Interestingly, Ferguson also argues that China's embrace of hard work is partly because of the spread there of Protestantism.
We had 13-years of ‘Lefties’ running our government, their Quangocracy, most of our media, our education system, the police etc etc etc.
So (from a lapsed CoE ‘weddings and funerals only’ citizen) god help us as a monarchy, an individual State with proud traditions/rights and our prosperity, when they get back in and finish off the destructive job to the British way of life they started in 1997, and left as a work in progress, in 2010.
Sorry cannot work out what you are positing.
Too much blah de blah rhetoric.
Some might say, qualified home truths, but frankly I don't care, whatsyaname?
Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.
funny that it was all discussed over the Publice "Easter" holidays.
I wouldn't suddenly be Muslim if I moved to a largely Muslim country but I would accept that many of the country traditions, holidays & customs are founded in the religious history of the country.
Just the same here in the UK!
No big deal really, anyone can chose to practice a religion or not, we cant really change history.
Sorry, what? Got two thirds of the way through and couldn't make hear or tail.
Can you perhaps tell us where you are copying and pasting from and we'll read the original and get back to you?
mymatemax...I'm not sure how many Muslim countries that you may have visited in the Middle East, away from the holiday centres, but they are strictly Muslim and even then, you have the Shia and Sunni split.
Furthermore, one may badly handle or criticize the contents of a bible here, not so with the Koran.
My point being we are Christian, we are more tolerant than any other religion I can think of, even ''Jedi', so what is the agenda of those who say we are not.
Go back to your Daily Mirror's, they've got pictures.
Daily Mirror's what?
(Lights blue touch paper)
D.S,T.P....If you had trouble with a one liner, you had no hope with the opening post.
Anyhoo...if I see any sensible debate/points I'll try and get back sometime later, if not, no worries here.
I can just about divine the topic you're posting about. I think most would accept that Britain is culturally Christian, but there is no place in government for superstition and bigotry, which is all religion has to offer anymore.
Likewise, if you have trouble placing an apostrophe, I am guessing the blurb in your posts isn't your original work.
Hence my requesting a source.
Britain is a nation with a Christian heritage and tradition, our laws have roots in Christian teaching and our monarch carries the ancient title of Fidei defensor... but that's not at all the same thing as it being a Christian country.
We do have a state religion though whereas the majority of countries don't so I suppose we are technically a Christian country. Unfortunately.
The 'public figures' were not suggesting this is a muslim/whatever country, they were pointing out that most of our residual christianity is of the weddings-and-funerals type as you say.
And hence all this religious privilege with the faith schools and the lords etc is a bit out of date.
Also, fish and chips come in polystyrene trays nowadays. Hell, I'm not even 40 yet and I've never seen it in newspaper.
Interestingly, since you have segued into 'mass immigration' for some random reason, and since we're copying and pasting....
"When the 2011 census was taken, 59 per cent of those in England and Wales described themselves as Christian. But the 2001 census found 72 per cent were nominally Christian.
The net loss of 4.1 million Christians would have been significantly worse had it not been for an influx of 1.2 million foreign-born believers – many from more strongly religious countries such as Poland and Nigeria – coming to Britain."
cause I wouldn't want to C&P without attribution, now, would I.
Last time I looked we had 26 un-elected bishops sitting in the House of Lords so yes, I think that does make us a Christian country. Whether that is anything to be proud of is another matter entirely.
Is that what you were trying to say, op?
D.S.I.P….original work/anger, with links/quotes you can read, if I missed anything it was my rubbish education, do your best para by para or leave it, I’ve got it off my chest - I'm now a happy bunny.
Boulevard…the “mass immigration” quote was re the Labour Party’s intent to change our society, clearly no matter what the consequences were.
The fact that throughout the early 2000’s onwards the immigration inflow figures show TWICE as many NON EU citizens coming in that presumably needed visas/permission, than the mainly Christian EU citizens - again asks more questions of the intent – based on our unemployment and housing shortages over those years.
Floiseme....I never mention the Bishop's, so no, try harder.
'Try harder' to do what? I don't understand you.
Slug....we are a Christian country, it is good to hear that will remain so with Cameron.
Blair was Christian, but was told by his fav spin doctor Campbell, that 'we don't do god' as a policy, well ours anyway.
Join the discussion
Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.Register now
Already registered with Mumsnet? Log in to leave your comment or alternatively, sign in with Facebook or Google.
Please login first.