ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
Speedboat accident in Padstow(243 Posts)
I don't know if the mother was a MNer, but I am hoping she pulls through with her other DCs and so sorry to hear she lost her husband and daughter, Emily. I know words are useless, but I am thinking of them. It's all so sad and awful.
Saw today an incredibly brave article by Victoria Milligan in the Sunday Times. The inquest is opening tomorrow into the death of her DH and DD.
Feel so sad for her, and hope she gets plenty of support from her friends and family.
what an amazing inspiring woman. I wish her and her children all the best for their futures.
I also saw this article, cannot imagine what Victoria Milligan has gone through, and take my hat off to her for her efforts and successes since.
For info, the full report is on the Marine Accident Investigation Board site, issued since this thread was last active.
I saw that too,what an amazing woman.
Yes, I heard her speaking on R4, with great sadness and articulacy but entirely without self-pity. To have lost everything she has in such an arbitrary way but to come out the other side is humbling.
Only resurrecting this because I saw today that Victoria Milligan has done enormous amounts to raise money for charities, in what must have been the most unbelievably awful year for her. While grieving for her husband and child she has nevertheless been tireless in her efforts to help others. I am in awe of her courage and dignity.
What a great post, but then you have been the voice of sanity throughout. I have tried to post similar points but the howls of rage that go up are really offputting. Nothing I have said has been in any way offensive, rather I am entirely sympathetic to the family involved. However, this is an accident which should never have happened and it is right and proper that it be discussed. I had thought that this forum would be full of articulate people willing and able to do that in a thoughtful manner - how wrong I was. What has been most enlightening is that those posters complaining about those of us willing to discuss hard facts is the way they resort to name calling (moron is only the lates) all in the name of posting nicely!
Maybe Amanda Holden was right about Mumsnet after all. It looks after its own.
I can hardly believe reading the last page or so, the direction this thread has taken
However I work in boats and in boating and I know as sure as I know anything that there needs to be far more awareness of boat safety. From what I have seen this week, the message is still not getting through. I have no comment about the tragedy in Padstow except to say it has given me nightmares, so God knows what the family is going through.
To state the obvious, boats are great fun but they can be very dangerous. Lifejackets (not buoyancy aids) are a must for all on board, whether or not they think they can swim. Speed limits must be adhered to, especially in dynamic harbour environments, where vessels may be going on and off moorings, there may be children dinghy sailing, there may be kayakers and there may be swimmers, as well as vessels being launched and recovered on slipways. Certain wind directions are far more likely to make it rough/choppy than others, especially at certain states of tide. Going over someone's wake at top speed can result in spinal injury, even if the everyone on board is safely in their seats (two years ago I witnessed this exact thing - the guy is still unable to walk). It takes a surprisingly small amount of water to sink a small speedboat (not a RIB) - again, I saw this three weeks ago, and those on board were not wearing lifejackets. Three days ago I saw a young guy driving a beaten up old speedboat through the harbour gaps and round the corner of the harbour wall at at least 20 knots - it was only incredible luck that he didn't drive straight into something/someone and kill people.
People need to think. Statistically, you are less likely to be in a boating accident than a car accident, but those that happen often have terrible consequences.
So how come we aren't doing this level of picking over and analysing and trying to assign blame every time there is a car accident resulting in several deaths? Why aren't we calling for laws making it illegal to drive when there is ice on the road or the visibility is poor?
"^^^^^^^I fucking give up. NorthernLurker is correct. A thread like this does bring out the morons"
Always amuses me that the most offended are often the most offensive.
I can only assume there are some people who still believe all things are fate or the will of God etc and never think about how to make it better next time.
This afternoon on the river at Richmond I saw a large motorboat - think - cabin etc - with one man at the helm, safely in the cockpit , another one also safely at the back. At the front, and hanging over the rail were several children, maybe aged from about 7/8 upwards. None wearing lifebelts - doubtless they were/are good swimmers and did not think it necessary on a warm sunny day on a well-populated river. Looked like a fun outing, dads and kids, (saw no women)but what they were doing was very dangerous, if one of the children had slipped and fallen, they would have been run over by their own boat before it could stop.
I presume they were all lucky, and hope no accident occurred, but those people clearly had no idea what they were doing - so clearly safety messages need to hollered loud and clear, so that Mumsnetters at least will know to use commonsense when on the water, even if it does seem like spoilsporting...
I disagree: it's not just a case of if that particular family had read about it. The point is, it's an issue which deserves to be highlighted and discussed. A legal framework is all very well for the technicalities of the investigation, but important safety messages dont work their way into the public consciousness through coroners reports; they are absorbed through the media. The issue about bouyancy aids and lifejackets discussed earlier was a prime example. Many people who didn't realise these are different to each other and that one may save a life where the other wont, learned about it from sites such as this one.
I am totally against offensive posts which are simply trying to attack the family and quite rightly they are deleted, but it's not for anyone else to police the thread just because they don't like the facts being highlighted.
If it had happened and if we had talked about and if they had seen it By that logic you can justify as much grousing as you want.
I think picking over the bones of somebody's tragedy in the name of 'learning lessons' is a necessary task that our society has a legal framework to achieve. Doing it over and above that - as some of you are so keen to do is distasteful. There is no justifucation for it and on this thread and all the others like it you run the risk of really, really hurting bereaved people. Not really worth the kick of super smugness is it?
Mumbles - I think you've missed stuff from earlier in the thread that was incredibly offensive and has since been deleted by MNHQ. I don't want to repeat it but it was enough to offend and upset me and totally unjustified and abhorrent.
Not sure that comparing him (who I have met incidentally) to a drunken driver is helpful either tbh. That is illegal, what they did wasn't (whether it should be is another matter I understand).
indeed janey and Royalmailer - if a similar accident had happened a few weeks before, and we had discussed it here, and the people in the Padstow incident had seen it & taken heed, it could have prevented their own sad loss. It is vitally important the facts are widely known, and surely the family concerned would be first to want to avoid anyone else suffering the same situation??? No-one on here is suggesting or condoning any personal attacks on the bereaved family - obviously not. If other forums are, that is shocking - so go and berate them - not this one.
It was a tragic accident, yes- but a highly preventable tragic accident. Every motorised water vehicle has a safety feature designed to prevent this exact incident.
I don't think that pointing this out is wrong. I hope it prevents future accidents.
Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.
Rational and sensitive posts, specialsubject and Catherineofmumbles.
I also don't see the need to bring up a murder victim on this thread. This is an entirely different circumstance.
Obviously the death of any child whether through illness, accident or crime is a tragedy, but it doesn't mean you can make a blanket comparison.
What has shocked so many people about this case is that a)it was easily avoidable and b) it potentially endangered the lives of many more people.
I also think if this was some yob driving around on a Friday night, having had a couple of drinks, not paying due care and attention and not driving with due regard for his own passengers or other road users, there would actually be far less sympathy shown than there has on here. Which does make me a bit at whether different rules apply when it's a well off middle class family involved
Ultimately, even though its not actually illegal to drive a power boat without using the kill cord, it is obviously a very risky thing to do and shows a disregard for other people. It's vitally important that this fact is highlighted: as others say, the power boats are out in force this time of year, as are bathers and sailors.
Telling it straight does not in any way detract from the awfulness for the family involved; it's terrible for them
specialsubject I agree - there is no earthly reason to try to make any link with April Jones , or indeed to invoke other forums - obviously elsewhere on the net there will be forums where invidious this are said about all sorts of subjects - this place is not one of them.
I have seen nothing on this thread other than sympathy for the innocent victims, (including the brave men who risked their own lives to help) and a desire for lessons to be learned to avoid similar or worse incidents in the future. This is the beginning of summer, and numerous people will be out in powercraft, and need to be aware of the horrific consequences of not using the kill cords, and not insisting that lifejackets are worn. the people involved in that incident already know those, the point is top get the message across to those who don't.
I don't see any connection between this and the April Jones case.
She was deliberately murdered by a man determined to find a victim.
the people who died in this ACCIDENT were not. When there are ACCIDENTS or illness, sometimes something done differently might have resulted in a different outcome. That's why there is an investigation.
Perhaps that investigation could reduce the number of future tragedies. As a powerboat user I will want to see the result of the investigation to see if there is anything I could do differently. (This is why marine accident investigations have to be read by those involved in similar activities)
none of this makes the event any less sad or horrific.
I know that lady.
TBH when something hits the news I will go on to NM and see what vile crap they are spewing.
It happens every time.
And they are allowed to get away with it. However if I or anyone else pulls someone up on a post we are likely to get deleted.
Because of our meanness.
I coulcn't believe the one I saw Mrsdv. It was about that child who drowned in Egypt and a mum who had lost her child to a carbon monoxide tent incident came on and said that she'd read a similar slagging off of her and how awful it was - and people still kept on. Morons.
There are ones like this on NMs on a regular basis. EVERY time a child dies in fact.
I know because I have been a member since very shortly after my DD's death.
If a child dies in an accident or is murdered or even if they die from illness someone will start a 'I am not being funny but.....' thread.
Its a fucking disgrace.
Because, Catherine, I've posted on two threads recently with exactly the same tone. Both concern parents who have lost a child. I saw another like this on netmums too - though that was pulled eventually. There is no connection except in the behaviour of the posters.
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