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Mental health

long-term depression - is there any "cure" or am i stuck with it for life? It feels like a personality trait from which I can't escape

35 replies

MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:23

currently feeling rather desperate tbh. Have had lots of v kind, helpful messages on here but am now confronting the fact that I've had depression on and off since I was a teenager, 2 decades ago. I tend towards it easily and at times rapidly. I'm trying to sort myself out at the moment rather than taking ADs and am dosing myself up with SJW and high EPA fish oil. I've also recenytly started CBT but am not wholly convinced so far. I honestly don't see how decades of belieft can be turnbed aorund in a few sessions. I don't feel this is possible. I feel without hope, currently and feel only extremely rare fleeting moments of enjoyment., Overall though atm I just can't see my way through, not in any permanent long=-term way, anyway. It's affecting all our lives hugely (as dh put it, he nrly lost his job last time I was like this), thwe dcs see me crying and shouting several times a day and I can scarcely sleep at night. I feel hopeless. I realise how self-indulgent this all sounds but I feel myself sinking and don't know how to stop it.

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BBBee · 23/09/2007 20:26

don;t take SJW and ADs at the same time. Couhnteracrive effect.

If you have decided CBT won;t work it won;t. Sit down get the stuff out and do the homework.

Go see the doctor again for a review of ADs. Yes you have depression but you can be treated you need to find the right treatment.

Is this time of year harder for you?

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PodPast · 23/09/2007 20:27

i know it's been said time and again, but if you had a heart condition, you'd take a daily tablet to treat it. And if you have a chemical imbalance affecting your emotional health, and there is a tablet to treat it, why ever wouldn't you take it? I was told I needed to be well before I could effectively learn the CBT techniques, so I was (eventually) persuaded to take the ADs at the same time. It certainly seemed to work in combination. I promise i said exactly the same things as you 2 years ago, and had ALWAYS been like it, and now I'm not.

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vacua · 23/09/2007 20:28

I really think that medication has to be worth a try, it's very difficult to 'sort yourself out' when your moods are so labile. I'm not particularly pro- or anti- meds but this is a long term problem. Are there treatments that have helped in the past?

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willexercisesoon · 23/09/2007 20:28

I am sending you a virtual hug. x

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jangly · 23/09/2007 20:31

I would suggest taking anti-d's again. St Johns wort might be helpful with mild depression but yours sounds worse than that. This time of the year can make you feel worse. I would definitely go back to the doctor. CBT may help with time, but the tablets might help you get more out of the therapy.

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:31

i know rationally that's true but it IS different, isn't it? For one thing there's a stigma attached, for another if you've been told by family members to buck up and ge ton with it as if you;re merely lazy/a bit sad then that attitude sticks with you, don't you find? I'm trying to think postiively and will continue to do so, for my family's sake mainly.
By the way, BBB, I'm not taking ADs currently, nor I am being monitored by my GP. As for "homework" for CBT, I havne't been given any! Wish I had!

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:33

that was to pod, by the way.

Thanks, everyone esp for the virtual hug!
I may take anti ds but want to give it the full 6 weeks on SJW first

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BBBee · 23/09/2007 20:35

god sorry misschief - was rushing to get something out the oven and posted in a rush and read it back and it was so harsh - I am really sorry last thing you need.

I apologies.

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evenhope · 23/09/2007 20:38

misschief I was referred for group therapy 6 years ago. I fought it because my big problem is talking to people, and didn't speak for several sessions. After 2 years I suddenly was better. I had never ever felt normal before then- it was incredible.

Sadly the Rage has crept back over the last few months. but I've had 4 years of feeling like a human being. It can work, even if you can't see it now, and when it does the difference is really worthwhile.

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:38

don't worry bbbb but thanks for your message!

maybe you were right, I know i need something to kick me up the arse, but that should be something chemical i guess to reboot my system. AQm trying the weed 1st and will look again at ADs if I don't feel better soon. In the meantime htough, it's so blooming hard. I feel like i'm acting all the time through the day and fall apart as soon as I close my front door. Anyone else feel this way? I@m sure many must do.

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BBBee · 23/09/2007 20:39

is the CBT any good? When I had it I had lots of exercises to do tht really helped.

Would you like me to type some in for you?

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BBBee · 23/09/2007 20:40

I don;t feel like that at the moment but I really have done in the past - gone through the day 'acting; normal and all the time thinking 'underneath no-one knows I am so close to the edge' whilst smiling and talking about the weather.

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:41

hi evenhope, glad it finally worked out for you. I'm sorry to hear you'[re feeling wobbly now though. What's brought it back after 4 yrs or don't you want to say?

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:43

thanks for the offer,bbb. If you remember any short ones, would be great (but don't want to be the cause of a burnt dinner!)
Only had 2x CBT so far and as I said not whollyt impressed. It's rather woolly but maybr that's normal in the 1st few while the therapist gets to know you? I do want tasks to do as I thought that was what cbt was all about - being practical and proactive.

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JiminyCricket · 23/09/2007 20:46

The thing with CBt - don't expect it to turn everything around,..the thing is to discover that you can turn one small belief around and the rest can go from there, not quickly, not overnight, but once you start to feel different it sort of snowballs.

In the interests of your efforts to help yourself though, have you put in place other things that are proven to make a difference - a good diet {there's advice available on 'food and mood'}, regular exercise, social contact, a good daily routine. I'm sure you have, and it prob sounds simplistic or patronising, its just sometimes easy to put off the simple things which can really help if you do them over time. Good luck with things.

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 20:55

i know, sure you're right but it's just keeping that faith that things will snowball after so long of thinking this way! How can that be? It seems so unrealistic to me.

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JiminyCricket · 23/09/2007 21:24

The feeling/thought/hopelessness feels like the truth because its so long held, but spend some time holding it out and looking at it, tell yourself that it is a faulty thought that has been holding you back (I can't be happy/hopeful/worthwhile because I have never felt that way). Decide on small changes (I am going to do x,y, z because I want change, I deserve to be happy and I want something different for myself.
Step outside your usual routine - go differnet places, read different books, listen to different radio stations. Anything that reminds you that you are on a journey towards making changes. You sound nice . Make the most of the CBT - grab it by the throat and don't wuss out by relying on the one thing that is holding you back - the belief that things can't change.Good luck - go for it xx

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Bluestocking · 23/09/2007 21:30

You sound just like me ten years ago, determined not to take ADs, and limping along living half a life. I finally agreed with the GP that I would give ADs a try, and she prescribed paroxetine. Three weeks later, I felt a bit better, and six weeks later I felt as though I had been given my life back. Please, please stop messing about and give the ADs a chance.

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MissChief · 23/09/2007 22:16

thanks, JC, for your lovely post (i'm a sucker for being called nice, albeit virtually!)

Bluestocking, limping along is about it. That's my life and has been with the occasional rollercoaster upwards to years now. But I have functioned - held down responsible job, had 2 kids, rarely been off sick etc etc. I just can't see how ADs would be so much better than sJW - several studies I've read put them on a par and SJW has few side effects if you're not on the pill, unlike ADs. I may be wrong, but I want to try this way first.

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Nightynight · 23/09/2007 22:32

I suffered from depression for around 10 years. It just went away in the end.
I think you have to fix any physical reasons, but also, being depressed becomes itself a habit after a while, which is very hard to break.
You can get over depression, I have now had around 12 years without it.

Try any treatments that have a good track record of working, even if you mistrust them yourself. I think mistrusting possible cures, is sometimes one of the symptoms of depression!
wishing you the best of luck to get rid of this illness xx

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harrisey · 23/09/2007 23:54

Misscheif

I've suffered from depression since I was a teenager, accordng to the psychiatrist, probably since I was 14. I've had ECT, hospitalisation, various drugs, CBT, psychothereapy. I was convinced I was a lifelong depressive.

I had a bad episode in June 2 years ago when I developed a side effect of the tablets and had to stop them abruptly. Surprisingly I have now been AD free and well, oh WELL, for 27 months, and cant see it going back. When I got better I had been ill on and off for 20 years.

It can happen. I'm not sure how it happened for me, but it did, when I thought I would be taking the tablets for he rest of my life. I'm not saying it will happen for you, just that it can

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resigned · 24/09/2007 00:38

Hi MissChief
I'm a namechanger, been doing a lot of namechanging lately because I'm not happy with myself.

I am trying SJW, etc., at the moment. I am resisting taking ads and keep mulling it over in my mind, shall I, shan't I? Of course, as you can't take SJW and ads at the same time, that means I always have to wait until the next day at least which gives my mood a chance to change a little.

Like you, I feel in retrospect that depression is integral to my personality. Something that has been part of me for as long as I can remember, not just a temporary thing caused by circumstances. You may not feel this but, for me, my way of thinking seems to be out of synch with the rest of the world and I suffer because of it.

Why don't I want to take the ads?. Several reasons I think. In no particular order:

1.I read somewhere that depressed people are paranoid about taking ads as they see these as chemicals and prefer to try and find a 'natural' remedy. I read books by people like Patrick Holford so this fits me to a tee.

2. Side effects. I know not everyone gets them but most people seem to get them at least to start with and some people's descriptions of these makes the cure sound worse than the disease. I think I have an (irrational?) fear of permanently changing my brain chemistry. If the results are not good, will there be a way back?

3. Withdrawal effects. Similar to above. I know people who have found it impossible to come off them because of withdrawal symptoms.
OR
4. If I take the ads, and they 'work', won't I then have to take them forever?

5. I have been feeling very weak physically recently with aching bones and muscles, respiratory problems, permanent fatigue, etc.. I have been to the doctor, the tests for anaemia and hyperthyroidism came back negative but I still feel that I might have some kind of endocrinological problem because of other symptoms such as hair loss and I may end up going private for more extensive tests in order to get to the bottom of this. My GP prescribed the ads but I am concerned that if I take them it might just camouflage a physical problem.

6. I seem to have been told all my life by my family, in any number of ways, subtle or not subtle, that I am useless, pathetic, lazy, etc.. I am angry about this and still fighting a losing battle to be respected and accepted by these people. I feel angry a lot of the time but I have been treated badly. Is my anger out of proportion ? even though sometimes it feels like the only thing keeping me going. I suppose I don't want to take the ads, find I lose my anger and irritation, and have them believe that they were right all along, that I was the problem and just needed to be medicated.

When I think about this, I get flashes of scenes from 'one flew over the cuckoos nest when they labotomise the Jack Nicholson character in order to control him, Star Trek Borg: 'resistance is futile, you will be assimilated', Brave New World Soma, the Body Snatchers film, 'come on in the waters lovely...., etc., etc.. In other words, I feel quite paranoid that I am an awkward nuisance and need to be medicated in order to fit into society.

I'm not happy but I would rather that the world change than that my personality has to.

7. I don't subscribe to the chemical imbalance theory. From what I've read, no-one really knows exactly how ads work or why they work and it's a blunt instrument to solve a more complex problem. I mean I know about the receptors and reuptake and whatever but that is just a simplified model. The chemists try different ways of putting the molecules together to create new ads, not just because the patent runs out but because they know that they haven't cracked it yet. Some people seem to benefit from ads enormously, some people seem to solve some problems with them but end up with other ones, some people seem no better on them than without them, and a few people seem to be really messed up by them. People have only been taking these drugs since the 80s so who's to say that they won't all end up with dementia in their old age or Parkinsons or whatever. No offence.

8. What if I do feel better on the meds? Will I feel really awful that I have spent the last 20 years struggling when it could be fixed so easily. What was all that pain for, then? What a waste. Am I addicted to my mental pain? Who am I without that pain? I suppose I won't be thinking about this because I will be feeling better?

9. Is it a biochemical thing that can be fixed by meds or is it a psychological problem caused by things in my childhood or the time when I was two and fell over a banister and hit my head (frontal lobe damage?)

I sound like a paranoid crackpot and someone who is very self-indulgent and self-absorbed. Please tell me - is all of the above really the depression talking? Am I deluded? Is my negativity and paranoia precisely why I should take the ads?

I really want the SJW, omega oils, etc. to work. I'm trying a combination of everything at the moment and like you I haven't been taking them long enough to be able to tell yet. I know I can keep struggling on because, after all, that's what I've been doing all along. I've got a few CBT self-help books but (typical) I haven't applied myself to the homework yet.

One of these days, I expect I am going to give in to curiosity and take the ads and just hope that, if I don't like the results, I can get off them again without any negative effects. (BTW I am aware that you have to take them for several weeks before the side effects settle down and also that you really need to take them for at least 6 months.)

Sorry to go on so much but I was thinking about starting a thread tonight and your OP said something of what I was feeling. I just feel hopeless and resigned to a miserable life, not suicidal, just nothing ever really getting any better but probably getting worse.

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resigned · 24/09/2007 00:40

mistake - I meant hypothyroidism

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resigned · 24/09/2007 00:48

Also, like you I have read scientific studies that say that SJW works as well as ads if not better.

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jeangenie · 24/09/2007 20:41

how about trying that feeling good handbook with the CHEESY cover - I've just bought it and it is full of CBT exercises, I've heard it referenced very positively on here a couple of times

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