To think in certain cases Csa should be taken into account

(120 Posts)
ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 13:41:11

This is mainly in regards to two people I know but it got me thinking about why Csa is not included as income when claiming benefits. Now I'm not dense, I realise that the main reason is for absent fathers who disappear or try and get out of paying. In these cases fair enough. But when there is doubt about whether or not the individuals involved are a still a couple then I think something needs to be done, and that they deduct the Csa off of the mother's/father's benefits.

A person who I classed as a friend (she no longer is) is, in my opinion cheating the system but she's played it clever. The father of her children who she's been in a relationship with for years now technically lives at his father's house. I say technically because whilst he may be registered on the electoral roll and leaves his belongings there he still sleeps at her house almost every night, they spend time together as a couple, and it's pretty much business as before.

Another person I know (dh cousin) has five children, refuses to work and keeps finding loopholes not to work ie claiming carer's allowance even though she doesn't do much carIng, spacing her kids out purposely so she can stay on income support. Now that she has split up with the father of her kids (genuinely split as far as I know) she still refuses to get a job because the amount in benefits she receives plus the very generous amount of Csa from the father of her kids means that she lives a very cushy lifestyle.

Aibu to think that in cases like these were it's questionable whether the individuals are still a couple, or were the person refuses to work even though they could, the Csa should count as income and be deducted from benefits directly or payments reduced over time.

ElsaAintAsColdAsMe Sun 18-Sep-16 13:43:39

Yabu, how would they possibly police who is worthy of csa on top of their benefits and who has to be deducted.

Csa is for the kids not the adult anyway.

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 13:46:57

From what I've heard single parents (genuine and not genuine) are scrutinised a lot more than couples when it comes to things like tax credits, income support etc. Any information that doesn't add up, or maybe if there's a report of fraud could be looked into further and decide what the actual facts are.

Mycatsabastard Sun 18-Sep-16 13:47:20

I am waiting for the op to update with something about having to work full time and pay for childcare and it's not fair that because she has a husband and they haven't split up that she can't stay home and live off benefits.

Also waiting for 'multiple holidays' 'lots of free weekends with nights out' 'new nails' and 'flat screen tv'.

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 13:48:08

It might be for the kids but why should some kids receive more than others when their parents aren't technically entitled to it.

JenLindleyShitMom Sun 18-Sep-16 13:49:18

Have you any idea how much that would cost to police?

ElsaAintAsColdAsMe Sun 18-Sep-16 13:52:28

Technically they are entitled to it.

As for why should some have more than others? The answer to that isn't to send those with extra money into poverty as punishment for having fathers willing to pay csa. I'd much rather see money spent on making those who don't pay for their kids chased up and prosecuted.

ShirleyKnotReboot Sun 18-Sep-16 13:54:24

WHAT THE FUCK is with all this child maintenance bashing this weekend?

Less than half (38%) of RP receive ANY maintenance at all.

Safety net benefits provide less than 60 per cent of the minimum income needed for a decent standard of living for a single parent with one child

23 per cent of single parent households were in persistent poverty in 2008-2013, compared with 5 per cent of couple households

Why isn't there a fucking revolution going on about this fucking atrocious record of children suffering in poverty because of a lack of input from NRP?

Have we been fucking invaded again by F4J or some other bunch of inadequate cunts?

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 13:54:52

Well you couldn't be more wrong there actually. I work but only two days a week (school hours so no childcare) so it's perfect and my dh brings in a full time wage. My friend doesn't have multiple holidays, huge tv's or things like that but what she does do is brag about all the designer clothes, expensive trainers, and gadgets she buys her kids. Which before you ask doesn't make me jealous as I can afford to do the same but my kids are still little so I don't need to worry about all of that. But none the less it's bloody annoying. My dh's cousin again doesn't have expensive holidays or massive tv's.

ghostyslovesheep Sun 18-Sep-16 13:55:19

some kids receive more than others when their parents aren't technically entitled to it not sure what you even mean by this OP

but yabu

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 13:56:53

I agree that father's who refuse to pay or disappear should be chased for Csa. I'm talking about the ones who take the absolute piss and who either milk the system by manipulating their circumstances.

MarcelineTheVampire Sun 18-Sep-16 13:58:10

biscuit YABU

DustyMaiden Sun 18-Sep-16 13:58:36

I think it is absurd that NRP get away without paying and the state picks up the tab. The maintenance should be collected through the tax system with as equally harsh penalties for non Payment.

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 13:58:58

I mean in terms of benefits when mothers like my friend claim to be single to get extra money.

ShirleyKnotReboot Sun 18-Sep-16 14:00:44

can't even be bothered to respond to this illiterate bullshit.

CannotEvenDeal Sun 18-Sep-16 14:01:20

Fwiw it's not just fathers who disappear... usually yes but not always.

My dh's exw disappeared years ago. She refuses to pay cm and lives abroad now. Her argument is that dh and I both earn well and she doesn't want to see or know anything about my dss so why should she. hmm

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 14:01:39

I agree that in those cases were the nrp refuses to pay there should be harsh punishments but I also think that when doubt is cast over whether or not individuals are still together or were the resident parent refuses to work because she's got cushy claiming benefits on top of an extremely generous amount of Csa, there should be something to address this.

ShirleyKnotReboot Sun 18-Sep-16 14:02:55

The proportion of single parents who were fathers has stayed at 9 per cent for over ten years

ShirleyKnotReboot Sun 18-Sep-16 14:03:42

Fuck these facts getting in the way of a bit of single mother benefit bashing eh?

JenLindleyShitMom Sun 18-Sep-16 14:06:52

I also think that when doubt is cast

As far as the benefits people are concerned there is no doubt cast. It's just another claim like all the rest. Unless you (or someone else) have reported them?

PigletWasPoohsFriend Sun 18-Sep-16 14:07:22

Fwiw it's not just fathers who disappear... usually yes but not always.

Exactly.

bloodyteenagers Sun 18-Sep-16 14:08:12

You do realise that the first person you should actually report for fraud.

Other than that, the amount of time it would take to check against CSA and benefits would be ridiculous.
A simple name check has so far taken over a month. That's a month without tax credits. I am lucky in a way as I do have a wage. But imagine your second scenario, for the checks to be done, she would have no money.

Then what happens when the ex changes job and the csa payments stop? The person will be getting a reduced amount based on the non-existent payments. You really think dwp will say oh ok, lets up your cash? No, they will pass back to csa to chase, and in the meantime, another family starve.

And as for carers, its so little its an absolute joke. And the amount of paperwork needed to get it. Regardless of what you think, if she wasn't eligible she would not be getting it.

ChelleU Sun 18-Sep-16 14:08:15

Shirley I'm not single parent bashing. I was one myself for three years before meeting my now dh.

titchy Sun 18-Sep-16 14:08:51

Gosh so your cousin has faked her kids' SN by doping them - that's dreadful. What did SS say when you contacted them?
You have contacted them haven't you?
Oh you haven't - why is that?
<tilts head>

PortiaCastis Sun 18-Sep-16 14:10:26

My ex hasn't bothered to see or pay any money for dd for 5 years.
The CSA money is for the child and it would be very costly to police who's living with who. Going through the electoral roll would be very time consuming.
You know an awful lot of detail about your friend don't you?
I wish I had a cushty life style but as ex has skipped the Country (I think) I'm supporting my child alone and yes I do work.WIsh ex could be found and be made to pay for a child he fathered then perhaps Id be able to buy dd the things she needs He's probably dipping his wick and fathering more children then moving again
Think on !

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